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Post by snatch on Feb 24, 2009 11:52:57 GMT -5
Is there any info on exactly how much people are getting and when were going to receive them?
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Post by slappy on Feb 24, 2009 12:31:55 GMT -5
Not a check.
I believe it's $13 on every check until Mid-2010 and then it's like $7.50 every check.
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Post by Bubba Ray DJ on Feb 24, 2009 13:40:57 GMT -5
Which will do absolutely nothing. Great plan.
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Post by T R W on Feb 24, 2009 13:45:30 GMT -5
Most Americans won't even notice the difference.
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Post by slappy on Feb 24, 2009 13:47:24 GMT -5
Which will do absolutely nothing. Great plan. Why do I have the feeling that if they just gave everyone a check with the full amount you'd still complain about it not going to work?
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Post by Kliquid on Feb 24, 2009 13:58:48 GMT -5
Which will do absolutely nothing. Great plan. Why do I have the feeling that if they just gave everyone a check with the full amount you'd still complain about it not going to work? Probably because it wouldn't work. Keep decreasing the value of the dollar. Brilliant.
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Post by slappy on Feb 24, 2009 14:06:09 GMT -5
Why do I have the feeling that if they just gave everyone a check with the full amount you'd still complain about it not going to work? Probably because it wouldn't work. Keep decreasing the value of the dollar. Brilliant. But if nothing was done, he'd probably complain that Obama was just ignoring it and should be doing something. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.
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Post by spawnsyxx9 on Feb 24, 2009 15:14:54 GMT -5
Americans for the most part are still not going to do anything they should with the money. Even if they gave everyone $700 in one check, it wouldn't do very much because everyone just keeps complaining to begin with.
It's truly going to be up to the people with clout to start realizing that being cheap in the long run is a bad idea.
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Post by Quanthor on Feb 24, 2009 15:42:46 GMT -5
Conservatives astound me, they bitch and bitch about HIGH TAXES and yet, they're essentially getting your taxes decreased. Nobody seemed to have a problem with Bush's stimulus plan, but OH NO, THAT ING DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENT!! HIS PLAN IS A JOKE!!! Political bias is going to kill this nation, they could probably secretly flip the two parties policies around and the majority of the people would still vote same party they were previously voting for. I honestly don't know how much more of this hypocrisy and idiocy I can take, it's going to destroy this country because we can't check our stupid party affiliation at the door and turn off those deliberately dividing pundits who shape our opinions for us. Forget about Obama's "change", we need to unite under a brand new party, a party that recognizes both the middle class and the upper class as equals. Forget about the trickle down effect which has never proven to be a great long term success and likewise for the trickle up effect. If we want to keep our capitalism afloat, we need both to function as a unit because one doesn't work without the other. Economically I think a "moderate" party would work, because the majority of the people don't give s **** about economic structure as long as it's working(as evident in elections). Socially on the other hand, it probably wouldn't succeed because to some gay marriage and abortions are more important than the county's success.
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Reasoning through Questioning
Main Eventer
Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something. -Plato
Joined on: Oct 8, 2005 23:36:54 GMT -5
Posts: 3,598
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Post by Reasoning through Questioning on Feb 24, 2009 15:48:03 GMT -5
^^^ and this why Plato wins with his arguments against Democracy. They always find a way to gracefully fall apart. I completely agree with where your coming from. People will always argue about things that have no real effect(abortion,gay marriage) on our country as whole. heads don't give a damn about actual policies as they are more concerned with flag pins and illegitimate children. Read some Nietzsche. I think you may like him.
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Post by slappy on Feb 24, 2009 15:50:30 GMT -5
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Post by Bubba Ray DJ on Feb 24, 2009 17:07:01 GMT -5
Probably because it wouldn't work. Keep decreasing the value of the dollar. Brilliant. But if nothing was done, he'd probably complain that Obama was just ignoring it and should be doing something. Damned if you do, damned if you don't. I sat back and listened to every body bitch about Bush...so shut up and take it. It's still a poor plan. I'm going to repeat this once again: FIX THE HOUSING INDUSTRY. STOP GIVING AWAY MONEY. IT DOESN'T ING WORK.
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Post by Bubba Ray DJ on Feb 24, 2009 17:08:57 GMT -5
Yeah, that would probably work. If you hadn't used an article from 2004. Nice try. Show me something with 2009 estimations and then we'll talk.
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Johnny Lawrence - Cobra Kai
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Post by Johnny Lawrence - Cobra Kai on Feb 24, 2009 17:22:02 GMT -5
I sat back and listened to every body bitch about Bush...so shut up and take it. Well, Bush is the reason you have a Democratic president to bitch about today, so I guess we owe this all to him. And "Shut up and take it?" So let me get this straight... conservatives get to bitch incessantly, and in exchange, democrats get to rule the country for four years? I'll take it.
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Post by Bubba Ray DJ on Feb 24, 2009 17:24:16 GMT -5
I sat back and listened to every body bitch about Bush...so shut up and take it. Well, Bush is the reason you have a Democratic president to bitch about today, so I guess we owe this all to him. And "Shut up and take it?" So let me get this straight... conservatives get to bitch incessantly, and in exchange, democrats get to rule the country for four years? I'll take it. We took 8 years of it. ...and no, Bush is not the reason. Your democratic lead house and senate is. I can post the video again if need be.
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Johnny Lawrence - Cobra Kai
Main Eventer
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Post by Johnny Lawrence - Cobra Kai on Feb 24, 2009 17:29:05 GMT -5
Well, Bush is the reason you have a Democratic president to bitch about today, so I guess we owe this all to him. And "Shut up and take it?" So let me get this straight... conservatives get to bitch incessantly, and in exchange, democrats get to rule the country for four years? I'll take it. We took 8 years of it. ...and no, Bush is not the reason. Your democratic lead house and senate is. I can post the video again if need be. So eight years of George Bush had nothing to do with people voting a democrat into office in 2008... fair enough. Agree to disagree. Anyway, it's good to know you'll be bitching for four straight years non-stop, just out of pure spite, simply because "it's payback time." I'm sure that'll be great for the country's recovery. I hope you enjoy yourself, and remember to take some "me time" every now and then to avoid bitterness burnout. The cost of meds for that type of thing is rising, you know.
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Post by Bubba Ray DJ on Feb 24, 2009 17:35:20 GMT -5
We took 8 years of it. ...and no, Bush is not the reason. Your democratic lead house and senate is. I can post the video again if need be. So eight years of George Bush had nothing to do with people voting a democrat into office in 2008... fair enough. Agree to disagree. Anyway, it's good to know you'll be bitching for four straight years non-stop, just out of pure spite, simply because "it's payback time." I'm sure that'll be great for the country's recovery. I hope you enjoy yourself, and remember to take some "me time" every now and then to avoid bitterness burnout. The cost of meds for that type of thing is rising, you know. I'm not bitter. I'm just sick of ill-informed people acting as though the current economic status we have is George Bush's fault. It's not. I'm also quite sick of people acting as though the entire 8 year term was the worst time in American history. We had some really fantastic growth in those 8 years. It wasn't until the Democrats got into power and completely ignored what the banks were doing that everything went to hell. ...and how did the American people fix it? By giving another Democrat power. Keep in mind, I like Obama. I think that as a person he truly wants what's best for this country. I also think that what he's done to get to where he is is nothing short of miraculous. In fact, I wish him the best! Our country needs him to do well and not up. He's our president. However, I don't think that his current plan is a good idea and I don't trust either the house or senate at this point. There is no system of checks and balances left and this country is going to do a nosedive until they wake up and fix what the actual problem is.
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Post by Quanthor on Feb 24, 2009 18:14:32 GMT -5
Bubba, I agree with you that it is idiotic to solely blame the Bush administration of the economic collapse, but so is what you're doing by solely blaming the democratic congress. I hat to say it man, but they are equivalently idiotic.
Do you know what lead to the housing boom in the early 2000's? The dropping of the interest rates by the Bush administration. People were buying houses that couldn't afford it hoping to make a quick profit in return and banks just couldn't refuse. That lead to all the subprime lending and housing prices reaching an all time high and the rest is history.
Bush, throughout his presidency was widely considered the "rubber stamp" president. If he introduced a bill, he wanted it passed with no questions asked and zero filibustering, it was going be his way or no way at all. Sometimes it was effective but mostly just dividing, but on the particular issue that would define is legacy just as much as the war on terror he was vacant.
There was one bill introduced that wanted to replace existing regulation with new regulation on Fannie Mae & Freddie Mac. This bill was introduced before the democratic congress took over the house...and you are right, they did fight it at first, but they weren't the only ones. Bush never made any stump speeches or campaigned(that's what you do when you're president) for his own goddamn bill.
Eventually both parties agreed that they should re-regulate Fannie & Freddie, but neither one of them could agree what to do with the all the assets for they were both being influenced by different lobbying interest, thus the bill was a failure.
I'm still not convinced that that particular bill would have solved the problem, it might have clogged the bleeding, but a ton of blood was already lost. Either way it was piss poor leadership and lobbyists that caused the bill to fail.
It was essentially greed that lead to the collapse, on behalf of the banks, congress and even the American people.
I'm so sick of the pointing fingers at only 1/3 of the problem when there is much more blame to throw around.
What's even more ridiculous is that we're still cutting each others throats open over something that happened in the past and we're still continuing the same trend of failed policies and by failed policies I mean this ultra-dividing culture that makes us more regressive each and every day.
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Post by Bubba Ray DJ on Feb 24, 2009 18:41:09 GMT -5
Bubba, I agree with you that it is idiotic to solely blame the Bush administration of the economic collapse, but so is what you're doing by solely blaming the democratic congress. I hat to say it man, but they are equivalently idiotic. Do you know what lead to the housing boom in the early 2000's? The dropping of the interest rates by the Bush administration. People were buying houses that couldn't afford it hoping to make a quick profit in return and banks just couldn't refuse. That lead to all the subprime lending and housing prices reaching an all time high and the rest is history. Bush, throughout his presidency was widely considered the "rubber stamp" president. If he introduced a bill, he wanted it passed with no questions asked and zero filibustering, it was going be his way or no way at all. Sometimes it was effective but mostly just dividing, but on the particular issue that would define is legacy just as much as the war on terror he was vacant. There was one bill introduced that wanted to replace existing regulation with new regulation on Fannie Mae & Freddie Mac. This bill was introduced before the democratic congress took over the house...and you are right, they did fight it at first, but they weren't the only ones. Bush never made any stump speeches or campaigned(that's what you do when you're president) for his own goddamn bill. Eventually both parties agreed that they should re-regulate Fannie & Freddie, but neither one of them could agree what to do with the all the assets for they were both being influenced by different lobbying interest, thus the bill was a failure. I'm still not convinced that that particular bill would have solved the problem, it might have clogged the bleeding, but a ton of blood was already lost. Either way it was piss poor leadership and lobbyists that caused the bill to fail. It was essentially greed that lead to the collapse, on behalf of the banks, congress and even the American people. I'm so sick of the pointing fingers at only 1/3 of the problem when there is much more blame to throw around. What's even more ridiculous is that we're still cutting each others throats open over something that happened in the past and we're still continuing the same trend of failed policies and by failed policies I mean this ultra-dividing culture that makes us more regressive each and every day. While I agree with about 99% of what you said, the lowering of interest rates had very little to do with the Adjustable Rate Mortgages and zero regulation that was imposed to rectify the problem. All I know is that I watched the democrats state that there was zero evidence that there was something wrong with Fannie and Freddie (which was a lie) and that the Republican's who showed them the evidence were basically liars who were taking up too much of the Democrats time by even bringing it to the forefront. Interest rates WERE lowered to make it easier for people to buy homes. That was a good thing. The problem was the lack of regulation. People didn't even have to show pay slips to prove how much they were making in order to prove they could afford the house. They could just say "Yeah, I make $80,000 a year, i need a loan". How do I know? I was in the housing industry. I saw it happen almost every day.
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Post by Kurt Burton: Script Doctor! on Feb 24, 2009 19:15:53 GMT -5
Well, Bush is the reason you have a Democratic president to bitch about today, so I guess we owe this all to him. And "Shut up and take it?" So let me get this straight... conservatives get to bitch incessantly, and in exchange, democrats get to rule the country for four years? I'll take it. We took 8 years of it. ...and no, Bush is not the reason. Your democratic lead house and senate is. I can post the video again if need be. They were in power for less than two years. Other than that, it was a REPUBLICAN congress for Bush's reign. Why do you think everyone started flipping out on the Rep's and voted them out this year in an overwhelming majority.
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