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Post by Mr.GT on Dec 24, 2010 16:23:07 GMT -5
lol, I guess this movie was right after all. Was funny, Was actually thinking the other day.... about how that may be one of the worst movies ever made.
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Post by extreme on Dec 24, 2010 18:04:50 GMT -5
Not surprising. Paramore was always, for the most part, 'Hayley and those three guys.'
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Post by Jean-Ralphio on Dec 24, 2010 18:32:07 GMT -5
So Hayley doesnt have talent? I dont get what that one poster was trying to say?
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Post by katphishjake on Dec 24, 2010 18:45:35 GMT -5
holy poop, the ignorance of most of you honestly baffles me. first off...OF COURSE they were an illegitimate band. look at their press photos. look at their formula: get spunky young vixen bitch to act like a punk while she's got metrosexual band members that behave in a 'chill' attitude...if you can't see through that, you're ing blind. and i honestly cannot stand this forum's obsession with if someone has 'talent' or not. talent doesn't mean all. i could be talented at making my poop coil in a perfect circle when i take one, but that doesn't mean i deserve acclaim and publicity. so she's got talent, so ing what! do you know how many others have that exact amount, probably more, but weren't willing to be absolute whores and have no dignity just to get the stardom? ing millions. get your heads outta the sand. of course she was a sell out. jesus ing christ. if she's a sell out and the group/her are nothing more than the product of a record label, in not so many words, "cleverly putting together a band that appeals to mindless drones," then the other band members are as well. the group has put out 3 studio albums... why was none of this brought up before? why didn't the guys leave before it got to this point if they weren't happy? OH, RIGHT. they were getting paid, touring and in the band and taking it in the direction that they now suddenly completly despise? get real. and who says she whored herself out and had no dignity? the woman is an amazing song writer and performer, and they don't have a huge fan base just because of some chic front lady. the record label pushed them with tons and tons and tons of publicity and marketing. sounds like a good PR job to me, so instead of pointing fingers and drawing conclusions about people we don't know and using heresay from two warring sides as fact when discussing this, stop and think before speaking, or in this case, typing. what the ever. why i seldom post here anymore.
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Post by k5 on Dec 24, 2010 19:16:28 GMT -5
So Hayley doesnt have talent? I dont get what that one poster was trying to say? i'm saying that talent isn't an aspect that the music industry even overly considers in the mainstream, so who ing cares if she has talent or not? if that was really relevant, i'm sure someone else would be in her place. so the whole 'has talent' crap...all in all, she has nothing compared to the endless musicians who never get any attention. if you were interested in talented musicians, you wouldn't be considering paramore in the top fields to begin with.
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Post by Jean-Ralphio on Dec 24, 2010 19:20:17 GMT -5
So Hayley doesnt have talent? I dont get what that one poster was trying to say? i'm saying that talent isn't an aspect that the music industry even overly considers in the mainstream, so who ing cares if she has talent or not? if that was really relevant, i'm sure someone else would be in her place. so the whole 'has talent' crap...all in all, she has nothing compared to the endless musicians who never get any attention. if you were interested in talented musicians, you wouldn't be considering paramore in the top fields to begin with. I like musicians that make good music that I like. Paramore fits the bill, especially when clowns like you are telling others what they should and shouldnt like, and who does and doesnt have talent.
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Post by k5 on Dec 24, 2010 19:24:57 GMT -5
if she's a sell out and the group/her are nothing more than the product of a record label, in not so many words, "cleverly putting together a band that appeals to mindless drones," then the other band members are as well. the group has put out 3 studio albums... why was none of this brought up before? why didn't the guys leave before it got to this point if they weren't happy? OH, RIGHT. they were getting paid, touring and in the band and taking it in the direction that they now suddenly completly despise? get real. and who says she whored herself out and had no dignity? the woman is an amazing song writer and performer, and they don't have a huge fan base just because of some chic front lady. the record label pushed them with tons and tons and tons of publicity and marketing. sounds like a good PR job to me, so instead of pointing fingers and drawing conclusions about people we don't know and using heresay from two warring sides as fact when discussing this, stop and think before speaking, or in this case, typing. what the ever. why i seldom post here anymore. uuhh...read the post directly following that one by me. in it i clearly note and specify that those other twats are obviously sell out bitches that are using paramore's illegitimacy as a way of propelling their own personal fame and careers. so before you get attitude, check your poop. and...those guys clearly state that she whored it out and had no dignity. she was willing to do whatever the labels required: no band, have band, and i'm sure her personality too. and amazing songwriter? i'm not even gonna bother with that. it makes me laugh, but also appalls me how far people are willing to go to defend their favourite little band, even when the truth is full circle. they're sellouts - it was obvious to anyone who didn't have a hard on for them. what really baffles me is, if this is all true, it basically means her artistic integrity is null and void...which makes me wonder why the anyone would wanna listen to her? she is a fake artist. once again....get your heads outta the sand. and this is why you seldom post? really? cause i rarely see arguments/debates/points like this, i'd love it if there were more..
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Post by k5 on Dec 24, 2010 19:26:57 GMT -5
i'm saying that talent isn't an aspect that the music industry even overly considers in the mainstream, so who ing cares if she has talent or not? if that was really relevant, i'm sure someone else would be in her place. so the whole 'has talent' crap...all in all, she has nothing compared to the endless musicians who never get any attention. if you were interested in talented musicians, you wouldn't be considering paramore in the top fields to begin with. I like musicians that make good music that I like. Paramore fits the bill, especially when clowns like you are telling others what they should and shouldnt like, and who does and doesnt have talent. oh christ, please. you can like paramore, i could give a less, but that doesn't legitimize them...or your musical tastes. people can like what they want, but lying about a band's worth and being essentially brainwashed is a no no.
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Deleted
Joined on: May 7, 2024 21:47:59 GMT -5
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Dec 24, 2010 23:41:01 GMT -5
I read about this the other day when the "news broke". I'm really sad about it all, as I was a really big Paramore fan. Thinking the band was just a fabrication the whole time and was constructed around Haley by the label is a bummer. I don't know what to believe? This.
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Dexter Morgan
Main Eventer
Joined on: Jul 8, 2008 15:30:18 GMT -5
Posts: 3,130
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Post by Dexter Morgan on Dec 25, 2010 6:02:46 GMT -5
I like musicians that make good music that I like. Paramore fits the bill, especially when clowns like you are telling others what they should and shouldnt like, and who does and doesnt have talent. oh christ, please. you can like paramore, i could give a less, but that doesn't legitimize them...or your musical tastes. people can like what they want, but lying about a band's worth and being essentially brainwashed is a no no. Really? Listen I'm the last person you would find listening to "mainstream" music but to say that Paramore wasn't worth anything is ing intellectually- disabled. They sold how many albums and made how much on tour? No one is brainwashed people like what they like, if it's different then what you like suck it up. Don't try and degrade what they like by rambling on about bullcrap. Another thing that irks me is the term "sell-out" Shut the up already. If you are in that person/band's situation and have the opportunity to make more money with a bigger label you ing take it because in certain industries you do what you can while you're relevant. I am guessing you're into the whole indie/alternative scene right? yeah shut up and let it be sell-out is such a waste of a word anymore. Metallica sold out, Paramore sold out, Linkin Park sold out. No the only thing these bands did were take the best option given to them. It's like leaving a job that pays 40k a year for a job that pays 80k. Is it selling out, or doing what's best for you? One more thing k5 just because you don't think Haley Williams is good doesn't mean others don't consider her the best singer of all time, etc, etc. Hell all the music you listen to I can almost guarantee you I think is complete garbage and no one in your favorite bands have any talents, that doesn't make it true it just mean I have an opinion that differs from yours now get over yourself and go back to your whole "I hate mainstream" scene.
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Post by k5 on Dec 25, 2010 12:28:56 GMT -5
Really? Listen I'm the last person you would find listening to "mainstream" music but to say that Paramore wasn't worth anything is ing intellectually- disabled. They sold how many albums and made how much on tour? No one is brainwashed people like what they like, if it's different then what you like suck it up. Don't try and degrade what they like by rambling on about bullpoop. no one is brainwashed? k. album sales by no means has anything to do with quality or overall value. so nope. and yea, i can say they're not worth anything - they are a corporately produced bunch of sell outs who can no longer be defined as artists. i guess actors would be more the word. so nice try. i actually like quite a few mainstream bands that ensure that they retain their legitimacy and freedom as artists before they sign on to a major label. yes, the artist matters to me and their morals/values, as it is their art i like...so if it's not legit...it's a fabrication. and yea, it's selling out....rather you like the term or not. and no, not everyone does that - true artists only desire the means to express themselves and to be able to survive off it - not become rich and all over everyone's bedroom walls. look at elliott smith and kurt cobain, both signed onto major contract deals (i like them both, but they definitely sold out) and look what happened to them when they realized what scrape of dignity and artistic rights they had left. i'm sorry, but that's not how it works. you can think hayley is the best singer in the world, no one is stopping you. you can have your opinion, but as soon as you try to state it as a fact: 'paramore is the best band without a doubt!"...you CAN disbunk such claims. there is ways to critique an overall band's worth. i just don't think you like the idea of that. the truth is paramore doesn't hold that much true value to music, their songs and ideas are overall not original and are riding the wave that someone else made. you could easily switch her songs with other bands and it would hardly be noticeable....say, avril lavigne's crap. nice try at lumping me in with the 'anti-mainstream indie' crowd. sorry, i'm not one of those kids. you're the one who claimed you don't listen to mainstream, not me. you guys reaaaaally need to formulate better opinions. look for actual VALUE. decide for yourselves. i'm not trying to attack paramore's music...this has degraded into that....but if we're going to, i'll be bluntly honest. call me egotistical, sure, i don't care - my point remains.. so head back to the drawing board.
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Post by Yeezy's Mullet: Team X Blades on Dec 25, 2010 12:37:08 GMT -5
Lol, I saw the post count and just knew k5 was in here taking aim at the major lables again. I gotta agree with him. When it comes down to it, he's not bashing the music you listen to. It's the decisions that the "artists" make and the integrity that they maintain while pursuing their musical aspirations. I LOVE My Chemical Romance. But alot k5 has said here even applies to them. There are opinions on who you like and why you like them. But there are also absolute truths when it comes to the music industry.
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Dexter Morgan
Main Eventer
Joined on: Jul 8, 2008 15:30:18 GMT -5
Posts: 3,130
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Post by Dexter Morgan on Dec 25, 2010 12:41:04 GMT -5
k5 what exactly is your point? 1. You don't like Paramore 2. Paramore was made by a label for Haley Williams 3.? No one is saying the band wasn't made by the label but for you to say that because album sales don't equal quality that's fine but if a band sales an album to platinum status they are doing something right and someone must like it. Another thing most bands show their true colors and build their reputation by touring and their live show I'm sure you would probably agree with that. So why does it matter what label they are on? Besides that I would say 95% of musicians today are riding someone else's wave. I mean you know it's kinda hard to be completely original when music has been around for basically forever. To make that a knock on a band is ing stupid. Even older bands borrow from influences. No one in here is trying to say Paramore is the best ever, and no one pushed their opinions as fact. Hell to me you could swap out 99% of today's music with one another, it sounds the same to me but you don't see me dissing all the bands I think sound the same. The main point is just because you think they are manufactured (which no one is debating) and you don't like them doesn't mean they have no value or that they suck. It just means your opinion varies from other people, that's all.
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Post by k5 on Dec 25, 2010 12:56:27 GMT -5
k5 what exactly is your point? 1. You don't like Paramore 2. Paramore was made by a label for Haley Williams 3.? you really need to stop with the assumptions pal. i don't dislike paramore, i'm just not oblivious nor ignorant to the actual value of the band and it's members. and to rephrase your number 2, 'haley williams was made by a label for paramore' is a much more accurate statement. that doesn't mean a damn thing. those platinum sales are a result of extreme marketing, not specific talents or accomplishments on the artist's part. and what they're doing 'right' is following the formula as i stated earlier. that doesn't mean success by any means...if anything, i consider that failure as an artist. because many mainstream labels try to control, reform, deform, completely change, keep the same, or whatever else the band needed to progress kept in a box. the live shows your seeing of most mainstream artists are just as contrived as the videos they appear in on your tv. label obviously matters hugely. that is a matter of opinion, and i agree with you to a degree. however, artistry by definition is a way of expressing yourself in an individual manner. an artist should be trying to BE THEMSELVES, not follow the same old formulas that the labels have been pulling over our heads for years. once again...i don't overly dislike paramore. she has a fine voice. it's that they aren't ANYTHING special in the long run, and that's not really debatable. they can be special to you, special to a group of people, but overall in the scheme of things they hold no goddam value to music and will be remembered overall as another marketed contrived band. this is indisputable. her songwriting is not breaking ground, their song structures are the same old pop-punky-rock 4 chorders, their genre, their look; nothing about it is original nor notably them.
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Post by k5 on Dec 25, 2010 12:57:13 GMT -5
and thank you bad newz, i appreciate that.
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Dexter Morgan
Main Eventer
Joined on: Jul 8, 2008 15:30:18 GMT -5
Posts: 3,130
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Post by Dexter Morgan on Dec 25, 2010 13:10:17 GMT -5
The problem is you say if a band is on a major label they are a sell-out and everything about them are contrived by the label and that is complete and utter bullcrap. While some are not all are. Metallica who are on a major label, their live show is by far some of the best shows I have ever been too. Just because they are on a major label their show is contrived by the label right? WRONG. Get off it already man. ALL artists borrow things from artists they enjoy from The Beatles to Radiohead to Cannibal Corpse. All have borrowed things from bands that influenced them. Now granted they incorporated things of their own into but so has most other bands. Isn't that where the argument lies right now. Yeah Paramore won't have any affect on the music industry but you know what, I don't think Lady Gaga, Katy Perry, Taylor Swift, or basically any of the massively popular artists today will either. You might disagree but that's my opinion. They don't add anything besides some songs that sound like other songs by different artists to me. It's all opinion based which is fine for debating but don't act like all bands on major labels are manufactured by the label cause you and I and everyone else both know that that is bullcrap.
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Symmetry
Superstar
Joined on: Oct 15, 2010 22:58:13 GMT -5
Posts: 928
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Post by Symmetry on Dec 25, 2010 13:11:24 GMT -5
They are puppets to record labels, just like every other band these days. That my friend, is an incredibly broad statement. Fine, MOST bands. Particularly the mainstream ones.
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Post by Mr. McCluer on Dec 25, 2010 13:15:52 GMT -5
Josh and Zac are awesome! i believe what they posted to be true
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Post by Yeezy's Mullet: Team X Blades on Dec 25, 2010 13:32:06 GMT -5
That they were formed to pretty much vault Hayley's career and the other guys, all of them, were interchangeable parts, all sucky parts mind you. Even if its true, Hayley has a TON of talent, and those guys probably are replaceable. As long as they continue to make music, I dont care if its Hayley, Bert, Ernie and Elmo in the friggin group this. hayley IS paramore... plain and simple. she's the reason i fell in love with them as a band anyways, because her song writing, particularly most recently (Brand New Eyes) is usually pretty great as well as her vocal talent. I don't know man. I can't consider a band "great" if parts of the band are interchangable. To me, that just doesn't fly with bands that are truely great. Take Queen for example. Brian May as thier guitarist was NOT interchangable. Neither was their drummer. Everyone know Freddie's voice when they heard it, but you could that May was playing his guitar through anything. If anything, Hayley should have just performed as herself, with random instrumentals in the background. I can't respect a band who's members aren't noticable.
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Post by k5 on Dec 25, 2010 13:33:43 GMT -5
The problem is you say if a band is on a major label they are a sell-out and everything about them are contrived by the label and that is complete and utter bullpoop. While some are not all are. Metallica who are on a major label, their live show is by far some of the best shows I have ever been too. Just because they are on a major label their show is contrived by the label right? WRONG. Get off it already man. k, by this point you're getting annoying. i already stated that: so enough. i never said every band is like that on major labels, in fact, i made sure to specify that they're not all like that for this exact ing purpose. i don't disagree at all...in fact, that's the exact thing i've been saying all along. all three of those artists you named are fakes, formulated for success. there is no question. one took the madonna route, one took the bubblegum pop everybody wants to me route, and the other took the wholesome, poor girl just trying to make it in a harsh world route. all contrived. once again, i never said that. i actually like some newer metallica myself, for the record.
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