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Post by Deleted on Nov 3, 2012 15:02:18 GMT -5
No. It's not as if they couldn't have a rematch at the next PPV. Billy Gunn is still in phenomenal shape, it's fairly likely that he'll be having a match at some point. So why not against Ziggler at WM. ....because Billy Gunn was only "decent" in his prime? A 48 year old never-was should not be going over the future of the WWE, let alone at WrestleMania. Even Billy himself would agree with that.
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Post by y2yay on Nov 3, 2012 15:03:59 GMT -5
....because Billy Gunn was only "decent" in his prime? A 48 year old never-was should not be going over the future of the WWE, let alone at WrestleMania. Even Billy himself would agree with that. Oh sorry, he was better than Ric Flair.
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Post by k5 on Nov 3, 2012 15:14:45 GMT -5
WWE ChampionshipCM Punk vs The Rock vs John Cena Street FightBrock Lesnar vs Triple H World Heavyweight ChampionshipSheamus vs Wade Barrett Undertaker vs Ryback Randy Orton vs Daniel Bryan Rey Mysterio vs Sin Cara I'm sure Big Show, Kane, Ziggler, Alberto Del Rio, The Miz and Charlie Sheen will all somehow be involed too. this is by far the best yet. i like the idea of the triple threat and street fight.
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Post by k5 on Nov 3, 2012 15:16:59 GMT -5
anvil, pure curiousity, but why have gunn go over ziggler? i know you said that they could rematch, but that doesn't explain or justify billy gunn coming out of retirement to defeat a younger wrestler for no real gain for anyone but himself.
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Post by y2yay on Nov 3, 2012 15:22:53 GMT -5
anvil, pure curiousity, but why have gunn go over ziggler? i know you said that they could rematch, but that doesn't explain or justify billy gunn coming out of retirement to defeat a younger wrestler for no real gain for anyone but himself. Anvil Fan loves him. He doesn't care about making sense or being fair. Hence why he also had Cesaro/Tensai despite the fact both men would likely make terrible faces and hence why he claims Ric Flair has no talent despite all of his accolades and all the praise he gets.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 3, 2012 15:32:03 GMT -5
Oh sorry, he was better than Ric Flair. There's not a single way that Flair is better than Billy Gunn.
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Post by y2yay on Nov 3, 2012 15:37:33 GMT -5
Oh sorry, he was better than Ric Flair. There's not a single way that Flair is better than Billy Gunn. Ric Flair is better than Billy Gunn in every way. Every way. In-ring, charisma, mic skills, merchandise sales, overness, the list could go on and on, any way you measure it....and I have stuff to back it up so my point isn't ludicrous. Which is more than I can say for you. PLEASE for the love of God, give me a list of great Billy Gunn matches, or post a good Billy Gunn promo.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 3, 2012 15:57:46 GMT -5
There's not a single way that Flair is better than Billy Gunn. Ric Flair is better than Billy Gunn in every way. Every way. In-ring, charisma, mic skills, merchandise sales, overness, the list could go on and on, any way you measure it....and I have stuff to back it up so my point isn't ludicrous. Which is more than I can say for you. PLEASE for the love of God, give me a list of great Billy Gunn matches, or post a good Billy Gunn promo. LOL, The Outlaws sold the second most amount of merch throughout the AE, the peak of wrestling's popularity. Not to mention how over they were at the time. Flair wasn't even an athlete, he looked like crap and didn't even try to base his wrestling act on being an athlete. Stu Hart said it best when he called Flair a "routine man". Vince actually had to have him re-do a taped match because of his lackluster in ring skills and the fact he didn't have the ability to wrestle a different match, even then he didn't do what Vince wanted him to. Vince kept Billy Gunn around (a guy with a bad attitude and drug problem) for nearly 12 years because he knew how talented he was; he gave him the KOTR, 10 world tag team Title runs, 2 hardcore Title runs and an IC Title run. Flair had come and gone within 18 months because he couldn't work, it's as simple as that. The fact is that Billy had a great match with everyone he ever wrestled, and they were different matches. Not the same match every single time like Flair. Billy had a better look, a better presence, better in ring-psychology, WAY more Charisma, a moveset that consisted of more than 3 moves (unlike Flair) and the ability to actually have more than one type of match. Flair brought nothing more to the ring with him than a stolen gimmick and "woo".
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Post by hatersgonnahate on Nov 3, 2012 16:24:57 GMT -5
I don't know the whole card, but I can see either Ryback vs. Brock Lesnar or Ryback v. Undertaker. Ryback vs Undertaker (if ryback wins) HELLO RISE AND FALL OF THE WWE !
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Post by y2yay on Nov 3, 2012 16:38:32 GMT -5
Ric Flair is better than Billy Gunn in every way. Every way. In-ring, charisma, mic skills, merchandise sales, overness, the list could go on and on, any way you measure it....and I have stuff to back it up so my point isn't ludicrous. Which is more than I can say for you. PLEASE for the love of God, give me a list of great Billy Gunn matches, or post a good Billy Gunn promo. LOL, The Outlaws sold the second most amount of merch throughout the AE, the peak of wrestling's popularity. Not to mention how over they were at the time. Flair wasn't even an athlete, he looked like crap and didn't even try to base his wrestling act on being an athlete. Stu Hart said it best when he called Flair a "routine man". Vince actually had to have him re-do a taped match because of his lackluster in ring skills and the fact he didn't have the ability to wrestle a different match, even then he didn't do what Vince wanted him to. Vince kept Billy Gunn around (a guy with a bad attitude and drug problem) for nearly 12 years because he knew how talented he was; he gave him the KOTR, 10 world tag team Title runs, 2 hardcore Title runs and an IC Title run. Flair had come and gone within 18 months because he couldn't work, it's as simple as that. The fact is that Billy had a great match with everyone he ever wrestled, and they were different matches. Not the same match every single time like Flair. Billy had a better look, a better presence, better in ring-psychology, WAY more Charisma, a moveset that consisted of more than 3 moves (unlike Flair) and the ability to actually have more than one type of match. Flair brought nothing more to the ring with him than a stolen gimmick and "woo". Oh my god.... If Vince thought he sucked so bad, why did he give him the WWF title TWICE in less than a year? Please, explain that to me. It's not like he didn't have other options. Ric Flair jumped back to WCW, Vince didn't get rid of him. And if Billy Gunn was so great, why didn't Vince ever give him a world title? Why didn't he come anywhere near it? Billy Gunn's only real push in 1999 failed big time. That's why he went from feuding with The Rock to having Road Dogg carry him AGAIN. I like how you can't name a great Billy Gunn match so you say "every match" he had was great. That's so stupid I don't even know where to begin. Even Billy ing Gunn himself would admit he's had bad matches. Billy might have had a better physique but he didn't have a better look. It was generic as hell. Ooh, tall guy with long blonde hair. Wow, really unique. Trying to claim Billy Gunn had more charisma than Ric Flair is laughable, anybody who knows anything about wrestling would agree with me. Just answer me one question.... If Ric Flair was such ing garbage, why is considered to be one of the greatest of all time? Why are his matches considered so great? Why is Ric Flair the only two-time inductee into Vince McMahon's (you know, the guy who supposedly thought he sucked) WWE Hall of Fame while Billy Gunn would be lucky to headline at a bingo hall? Please, I'm begging you to answer me with some logic.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 3, 2012 16:47:29 GMT -5
LOL, The Outlaws sold the second most amount of merch throughout the AE, the peak of wrestling's popularity. Not to mention how over they were at the time. Flair wasn't even an athlete, he looked like crap and didn't even try to base his wrestling act on being an athlete. Stu Hart said it best when he called Flair a "routine man". Vince actually had to have him re-do a taped match because of his lackluster in ring skills and the fact he didn't have the ability to wrestle a different match, even then he didn't do what Vince wanted him to. Vince kept Billy Gunn around (a guy with a bad attitude and drug problem) for nearly 12 years because he knew how talented he was; he gave him the KOTR, 10 world tag team Title runs, 2 hardcore Title runs and an IC Title run. Flair had come and gone within 18 months because he couldn't work, it's as simple as that. The fact is that Billy had a great match with everyone he ever wrestled, and they were different matches. Not the same match every single time like Flair. Billy had a better look, a better presence, better in ring-psychology, WAY more Charisma, a moveset that consisted of more than 3 moves (unlike Flair) and the ability to actually have more than one type of match. Flair brought nothing more to the ring with him than a stolen gimmick and "woo". Oh my god.... If Vince thought he sucked so bad, why did he give him the WWF title TWICE in less than a year? Please, explain that to me. It's not like he didn't have other options. Ric Flair jumped back to WCW, Vince didn't get rid of him. And if Billy Gunn was so great, why didn't Vince ever give him a world title? Why didn't he come anywhere near it? Billy Gunn's only real push in 1999 failed big time. That's why he went from feuding with The Rock to having Road Dogg carry him AGAIN. I like how you can't name a great Billy Gunn match so you say "every match" he had was great. That's so stupid I don't even know where to begin. Even Billy ing Gunn himself would admit he's had bad matches. Billy might have had a better physique but he didn't have a better look. It was generic as hell. Ooh, tall guy with long blonde hair. Wow, really unique. Trying to claim Billy Gunn had more charisma than Ric Flair is laughable, anybody who knows anything about wrestling would agree with me. Just answer me one question.... If Ric Flair was such ing garbage, why is considered to be one of the greatest of all time? Why are his matches considered so great? Why is Ric Flair the only two-time inductee into Vince McMahon's (you know, the guy who supposedly thought he sucked) WWE Hall of Fame while Billy Gunn would be lucky to headline at a bingo hall? Please, I'm begging you to answer me with some logic. I think Bret Hart knows more than "CG12" about the wrestling business. I'll answer your final question, the rest of your post is gibberish since you basically took what I just said and reworded it to your opposite opinion.
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Post by k5 on Nov 3, 2012 16:51:12 GMT -5
you never did answer me, anvil.
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Post by y2yay on Nov 3, 2012 17:05:16 GMT -5
Oh my god.... If Vince thought he sucked so bad, why did he give him the WWF title TWICE in less than a year? Please, explain that to me. It's not like he didn't have other options. Ric Flair jumped back to WCW, Vince didn't get rid of him. And if Billy Gunn was so great, why didn't Vince ever give him a world title? Why didn't he come anywhere near it? Billy Gunn's only real push in 1999 failed big time. That's why he went from feuding with The Rock to having Road Dogg carry him AGAIN. I like how you can't name a great Billy Gunn match so you say "every match" he had was great. That's so stupid I don't even know where to begin. Even Billy ing Gunn himself would admit he's had bad matches. Billy might have had a better physique but he didn't have a better look. It was generic as hell. Ooh, tall guy with long blonde hair. Wow, really unique. Trying to claim Billy Gunn had more charisma than Ric Flair is laughable, anybody who knows anything about wrestling would agree with me. Just answer me one question.... If Ric Flair was such ing garbage, why is considered to be one of the greatest of all time? Why are his matches considered so great? Why is Ric Flair the only two-time inductee into Vince McMahon's (you know, the guy who supposedly thought he sucked) WWE Hall of Fame while Billy Gunn would be lucky to headline at a bingo hall? Please, I'm begging you to answer me with some logic. I think Bret Hart knows more than "CG12" about the wrestling business. I'll answer your final question, the rest of your post is gibberish since you basically took what I just said and reworded it to your opposite opinion. www.southparkstudios.com/clips/155282/911-all-over-againIf you go to 0:24 in this video, you have your answer as to why Flair is popular. And I think Vince McMahon and pretty much every other wrestler/wrestling fan collectively know a bit more about talent than "Anvil Fan". I'm sure even Bret Hart knows Ric Flair is better than Billy Gunn. Basically, you couldn't respond to what I said so you had to dance around the questions. No surprise there. If you ever feel like trying to respond to me with a coherent argument, please go ahead and try.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 3, 2012 17:36:10 GMT -5
I'm pretty sure Bret Hart would rate Billy Gunn higher, he knows what makes a good wrestler, and obviously doesn't rate Flair. He knows what he's talking about. anvil, pure curiousity, but why have gunn go over ziggler? i know you said that they could rematch, but that doesn't explain or justify billy gunn coming out of retirement to defeat a younger wrestler for no real gain for anyone but himself. Because I'd love to see them have a series of matches, if Ziggler won the first match then there'd be no where to go from there.
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Post by Codesters on Nov 3, 2012 17:40:01 GMT -5
Blue Meanie > Billy Gunn and Ric Flair
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Post by y2yay on Nov 3, 2012 19:03:35 GMT -5
I'm pretty sure Bret Hart would rate Billy Gunn higher, he knows what makes a good wrestler, and obviously doesn't rate Flair. He knows what he's talking about. And say if he did. Would that make you and Bret right, and EVERYONE else including Vince McMahon himself wrong?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 4, 2012 5:13:47 GMT -5
I'm pretty sure Bret Hart would rate Billy Gunn higher, he knows what makes a good wrestler, and obviously doesn't rate Flair. He knows what he's talking about. And say if he did. Would that make you and Bret right, and EVERYONE else including Vince McMahon himself wrong? McMahon is well renown for putting his personal feelings for a wrestler behind to make a little bit of money; see Bischoff, Warrior and LOD.
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Post by y2yay on Nov 4, 2012 7:21:10 GMT -5
And say if he did. Would that make you and Bret right, and EVERYONE else including Vince McMahon himself wrong? McMahon is well renown for putting his personal feelings for a wrestler behind to make a little bit of money; see Bischoff, Warrior and LOD. So giving Ric Flair a retirement ceremony on Raw and Flair being the only active wrestler in WWE to be inducted into the HOF, and the only man to be inducted twice, and being presented with an expensive gold watch.....that was all just business?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 4, 2012 7:30:33 GMT -5
McMahon is well renown for putting his personal feelings for a wrestler behind to make a little bit of money; see Bischoff, Warrior and LOD. So giving Ric Flair a retirement ceremony on Raw and Flair being the only active wrestler in WWE to be inducted into the HOF, and the only man to be inducted twice, and being presented with an expensive gold watch.....that was all just business? You just answered your own question.
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Post by y2yay on Nov 4, 2012 7:39:37 GMT -5
So giving Ric Flair a retirement ceremony on Raw and Flair being the only active wrestler in WWE to be inducted into the HOF, and the only man to be inducted twice, and being presented with an expensive gold watch.....that was all just business? You just answered your own question. That's pretty poor business then considering most of what I just listed doesn't even benefit the WWE. How does giving Ric Flair an expensive gold watch as a gift mean good business for WWE?
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