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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2014 17:09:27 GMT -5
**Some Breaking Bad spoilers below. I recently started watching Breaking Bad (great show so far, it's no Angel but then again what is ), and am in the first few episodes of Season 3. Now, I love Bryan Cranston, and have since I saw him on Malcolm in the Middle, but the character Walter has become extremely unlikeable over the course of the show so far. I've kind of gone from feeling sorry for him, to thinking he's just a piece of trash. He's constantly abusive to Jesse, making him feel like nothing, and basically killed his girlfriend (doesn't help that Krysten Ritter is all kinds of awesome). It was kind of inadvertent, yes, but he still caused her death and stood there watching instead of helping her. I kind of feel like I should be liking him (like, even Dexter was likeable), but I just simply don't right now...
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Post by Ace Bennett on Dec 2, 2014 17:27:57 GMT -5
I always felt like that was kind of the point of the show. Watching through the show, most of the characters do something that could make them unlikable to someone else. That was part of the show that I always liked, they didn't really make anyone the "good guy." Even the DEA Agent Hank is an intolerable d-bag through most of the show (though he definitely has his moments too).
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2014 17:36:15 GMT -5
I always felt like that was kind of the point of the show. Watching through the show, most of the characters do something that could make them unlikable to someone else. That was part of the show that I always liked, they didn't really make anyone the "good guy." Even the DEA Agent Hank is an intolerable d-bag through most of the show (though he definitely has his moments too). I know the character is supposed to change throughout the course of the show, but I'd think they try to maintain that he'd be likeable and that he's doing what he's doing for a reason. I like Hank lol. He's an ass, but not a nasty ass, at least so far.
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Post by SE4NY on Dec 2, 2014 17:44:26 GMT -5
**Some Breaking Bad spoilers below. I recently started watching Breaking Bad (great show so far, it's no Angel but then again what is ), and am in the first few episodes of Season 3. Now, I love Bryan Cranston, and have since I saw him on Malcolm in the Middle, but the character Walter has become extremely unlikeable over the course of the show so far. I've kind of gone from feeling sorry for him, to thinking he's just a piece of trash. He's constantly abusive to Jesse, making him feel like nothing, and basically killed his girlfriend (doesn't help that Krysten Ritter is all kinds of awesome). It was kind of inadvertent, yes, but he still caused her death and stood there watching instead of helping her. I kind of feel like I should be liking him (like, even Dexter was likeable), but I just simply don't right now... I don't agree with the part where he accidentally kills his girlfriend, as I feel it was completely out of his control.. I believe he is an bunghole to Jessie for 2 reasons. 1. He wants Jessie to do better in life than just using drugs. Jessie took no responsibility when he taught him in school and he still doesn't as an adult 2. He wants somebody to be able to be responsible enough to look after his family financially in case he dies, and since Jessie isn't very mature he is trying to make him grow up, so he lets him have half the business in hopes he can also rehabilitate him in some weird way. This is a theory now mind you. I consider walt to be a great guy for one reason alone.. everything he does, everything he puts himself through, is not for himself but his family, and there's no way you can't respect it.
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Post by el torro on Dec 2, 2014 17:46:00 GMT -5
I don't like how he demands this and that and everything needs to be his way.
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Post by SE4NY on Dec 2, 2014 17:47:28 GMT -5
I don't like how he demands this and that and everything needs to be his way. It's cooking meth though, it kind of does have to be perfect, as far as it having to always be his way, it sort of has to because Walter knows alot more than Jesse and is merely using him for a market at the beginning and an assistant.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2014 17:51:04 GMT -5
I won't give a way much, but if you are in season 3 and you're hating him, just wait. You will hate him so much more. And that was the point. To take this likable dying loser of a man, and twist him and "break" him until his real character came shining through. You will despise Walt.
As far as Jane goes, bitch deserved to die. She was in the way, she was controlling, and she was blackmailing Walter. Not to mention she was no good for Jessie, helping him down a dark path. Granted he got her back on it, but still.
If I found a Genie's lamp and had three wishes, one wish would honestly be to be able to start Breaking Bad from the beginning anytime I wanted to, and watch it all the way through forgetting my previous viewings(as well as Fight Club). I loved the feeling I got watching it all for the first time.
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Post by el torro on Dec 2, 2014 17:55:49 GMT -5
I don't like how he demands this and that and everything needs to be his way. It's cooking meth though, it kind of does have to be perfect, as far as it having to always be his way, it sort of has to because Walter knows alot more than Jesse and is merely using him for a market at the beginning and an assistant. I wasn't talking about mainly the meth formula, just how he HAS to have control over people. Managing Jesse's money near the end, forcing him to stay in the business, telling Saul how it doesn't end until he says it's over.
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Post by SE4NY on Dec 2, 2014 17:57:16 GMT -5
It's cooking meth though, it kind of does have to be perfect, as far as it having to always be his way, it sort of has to because Walter knows alot more than Jesse and is merely using him for a market at the beginning and an assistant. I wasn't talking about mainly the meth formula, just how he HAS to have control over people. Managing Jesse's money near the end, forcing him to stay in the business, telling Saul how it doesn't end until he says it's over. Yeah I get what you mean, I guess it's just his character, if people don't like him.. i guess he's doing a good job!
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2014 18:03:32 GMT -5
**Some Breaking Bad spoilers below. I recently started watching Breaking Bad (great show so far, it's no Angel but then again what is ), and am in the first few episodes of Season 3. Now, I love Bryan Cranston, and have since I saw him on Malcolm in the Middle, but the character Walter has become extremely unlikeable over the course of the show so far. I've kind of gone from feeling sorry for him, to thinking he's just a piece of trash. He's constantly abusive to Jesse, making him feel like nothing, and basically killed his girlfriend (doesn't help that Krysten Ritter is all kinds of awesome). It was kind of inadvertent, yes, but he still caused her death and stood there watching instead of helping her. I kind of feel like I should be liking him (like, even Dexter was likeable), but I just simply don't right now... I don't agree with the part where he accidentally kills his girlfriend, as I feel it was completely out of his control.. I believe he is an bunghole to Jessie for 2 reasons. 1. He wants Jessie to do better in life than just using drugs. Jessie took no responsibility when he taught him in school and he still doesn't as an adult 2. He wants somebody to be able to be responsible enough to look after his family financially in case he dies, and since Jessie isn't very mature he is trying to make him grow up, so he lets him have half the business in hopes he can also rehabilitate him in some weird way. This is a theory now mind you. I consider walt to be a great guy for one reason alone.. everything he does, everything he puts himself through, is not for himself but his family, and there's no way you can't respect it. When trying to wake up Jessie, he knocks Jane onto her back, which causes her to choke on her vomit, instead of moving her and/or helping her by getting her to a hospital. He just watched her as she died. I won't give a way much, but if you are in season 3 and you're hating him, just wait. You will hate him so much more. And that was the point. To take this likable dying loser of a man, and twist him and "break" him until his real character came shining through. You will despise Walt. As far as Jane goes, bitch deserved to die. She was in the way, she was controlling, and she was blackmailing Walter. Not to mention she was no good for Jessie, helping him down a dark path. Granted he got her back on it, but still. If I found a Genie's lamp and had three wishes, one wish would honestly be to be able to start Breaking Bad from the beginning anytime I wanted to, and watch it all the way through forgetting my previous viewings(as well as Fight Club). I loved the feeling I got watching it all for the first time. I think she genuinely cared about Jessie. She wanted him to have what was his, and like you said, she only started using drugs again because she was consoling him. She never would have gone to the cops (and said as much to Jessie).
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2014 18:04:15 GMT -5
It's cooking meth though, it kind of does have to be perfect, as far as it having to always be his way, it sort of has to because Walter knows alot more than Jesse and is merely using him for a market at the beginning and an assistant. I wasn't talking about mainly the meth formula, just how he HAS to have control over people. Managing Jesse's money near the end, forcing him to stay in the business, telling Saul how it doesn't end until he says it's over. The power got to him. Before the cancer he had no control in his life. He let people walk over him all the time. He let his idea and million dollar company slip through his hands. He finally got that power and as time went on, he abused that power as much as possible. It had to be his way and he wasn't going to let anyone else have any say over that.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2014 18:06:52 GMT -5
I don't agree with the part where he accidentally kills his girlfriend, as I feel it was completely out of his control.. I believe he is an bunghole to Jessie for 2 reasons. 1. He wants Jessie to do better in life than just using drugs. Jessie took no responsibility when he taught him in school and he still doesn't as an adult 2. He wants somebody to be able to be responsible enough to look after his family financially in case he dies, and since Jessie isn't very mature he is trying to make him grow up, so he lets him have half the business in hopes he can also rehabilitate him in some weird way. This is a theory now mind you. I consider walt to be a great guy for one reason alone.. everything he does, everything he puts himself through, is not for himself but his family, and there's no way you can't respect it. When trying to wake up Jessie, he knocks Jane onto her back, which causes her to choke on her vomit, instead of moving her and/or helping her by getting her to a hospital. He just watched her died. I won't give a way much, but if you are in season 3 and you're hating him, just wait. You will hate him so much more. And that was the point. To take this likable dying loser of a man, and twist him and "break" him until his real character came shining through. You will despise Walt. As far as Jane goes, bitch deserved to die. She was in the way, she was controlling, and she was blackmailing Walter. Not to mention she was no good for Jessie, helping him down a dark path. Granted he got her back on it, but still. If I found a Genie's lamp and had three wishes, one wish would honestly be to be able to start Breaking Bad from the beginning anytime I wanted to, and watch it all the way through forgetting my previous viewings(as well as Fight Club). I loved the feeling I got watching it all for the first time. I think she genuinely cared about Jessie. She wanted him to have what was his, and like you said, she only started using drugs again because she was consoling him. She never would have gone to the cops (and said as much to Jessie). Once she got hooked again and became an addict, her word didn't really mean much to anyone. Her intentions may have started good, but she lost it. And even if she wouldn't have, Walter didn't know that. All he could think of was she was going to bring him down. He saw her dying and made the choice to let it happen to save his ass. And to regain control of Jessie.
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Post by Robert69 on Dec 2, 2014 18:07:01 GMT -5
The thing is -- the character goes through an arc. It's very similar to the transition from Anakin to Vader someone made me before I started watching it. The character becomes a monster, but when he first does (around S3) he's a monster you can't stand...as S3 gives way to the 4/5...he becomes a monster you want to like, and want to see succeed. There is ONE thing that happens in the later seasons that is absolutely deplorable.
He was irredeemable for me, as a character, after that instance. BUT -- that doesn't change the fact you want to see him succeed from there on out.
As for Jesse -- there's a couple seasons there in the middle where he needs to be treated like crap. He needs to be pushed. And the thing is, Walter views him as a son. So when he screws up, Walter feels like he lets him down, and thus does his best to watch out for him.
Watching Walter become Heisenberg over the course of the show is just stellar storytelling, and great to watch. No other show does it quite as well.
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Post by Robert69 on Dec 2, 2014 18:08:02 GMT -5
I wasn't talking about mainly the meth formula, just how he HAS to have control over people. Managing Jesse's money near the end, forcing him to stay in the business, telling Saul how it doesn't end until he says it's over. The power got to him. Before the cancer he had no control in his life. He let people walk over him all the time. He let his idea and multi-BILLION dollar company slip through his hands. He finally got that power and as time went on, he abused that power as much as possible. It had to be his way and he wasn't going to let anyone else have any say over that. Fixed for ya
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2014 18:09:04 GMT -5
The power got to him. Before the cancer he had no control in his life. He let people walk over him all the time. He let his idea and multi-BILLION dollar company slip through his hands. He finally got that power and as time went on, he abused that power as much as possible. It had to be his way and he wasn't going to let anyone else have any say over that. Fixed for ya Of course. Thank you. Feel like Dr. Evil.
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Post by Robert69 on Dec 2, 2014 18:11:19 GMT -5
Fixed for ya Of course. Thank you. Feel like Dr. Evil. ANVIL, don't read below this...spoilers for you... When he and Jesse have that chat in his living room there at the end, the whole "Empire Business" conversation...honestly, even after what he did to Brock, I couldn't help but think "I'd f***ing break, too". He gave away his part for what was it? 5k?
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Post by Robert69 on Dec 2, 2014 18:14:22 GMT -5
I'll also say -- I'm not huge on Walter.
I'm a big fan of Heisenberg.
They're two very different characters. Let no one tell you different.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2014 18:21:22 GMT -5
Of course. Thank you. Feel like Dr. Evil. ANVIL, don't read below this...spoilers for you... When he and Jesse have that chat in his living room there at the end, the whole "Empire Business" conversation...honestly, even after what he did to Brock, I couldn't help but think "I'd f***ing break, too". He gave away his part for what was it? 5k? Something so small when you look back. He ruined his own life and then seemed to give up. It's crazy how terminal cancer usually would make a person give up, but it gave him a second chance. He just went the wrong way with it. And it was apparent that his past mistakes and simple nothing life drove him even more with anger.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2014 18:24:48 GMT -5
I always felt like that was kind of the point of the show. Watching through the show, most of the characters do something that could make them unlikable to someone else. That was part of the show that I always liked, they didn't really make anyone the "good guy." Even the DEA Agent Hank is an intolerable d-bag through most of the show (though he definitely has his moments too). I know the character is supposed to change throughout the course of the show, but I'd think they try to maintain that he'd be likeable and that he's doing what he's doing for a reason. I like Hank lol. He's an ass, but not a nasty ass, at least so far. Also, Hank was my favorite character in the show. I rooted for him. And just like Walter, he goes through his on evolution in the show.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2014 18:25:47 GMT -5
When trying to wake up Jessie, he knocks Jane onto her back, which causes her to choke on her vomit, instead of moving her and/or helping her by getting her to a hospital. He just watched her died. I think she genuinely cared about Jessie. She wanted him to have what was his, and like you said, she only started using drugs again because she was consoling him. She never would have gone to the cops (and said as much to Jessie). Once she got hooked again and became an addict, her word didn't really mean much to anyone. Her intentions may have started good, but she lost it. And even if she wouldn't have, Walter didn't know that. All he could think of was she was going to bring him down. He saw her dying and made the choice to let it happen to save his ass. And to regain control of Jessie. Her intention was to leave though, she wasn't going to call the cops on him and risk Jessie get in trouble. I can understand him killing Crazy 8, because it was a "him or me" type deal, and even then he really didn't want to. Jane was a completely different kettle of fish.
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