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Post by Deleted on Mar 12, 2018 7:17:56 GMT -5
Such a shame with this line, series 1 & 2 we’re perfect, 6 figures at £8.99 each, a good mix of guys too. Then they done ****** it up with series 3 with only 4 figures, a higher price and the execution wasn’t as good. Don’t think we’ve even seen series 3 in the UK and 4 seems light years away. Distribution seemed a bit off as well with lines 1&2.
Think they’ve half committed to it and dropped the ball. I think like the above poster mentioned: 5 lines a year, 6 guys in each series and a mix of current and classic, £9.99 each and a selection of rings etc... it shouldn’t be this hard to sell this line. Make enough, get them distributed properly and stop messing around with prices and gimmicks (apps/stands) and it will sell itself.
Give me a job Mattel and I’ll get this line flying.
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Post by SteveHulk on Mar 12, 2018 8:54:49 GMT -5
Such a shame with this line, series 1 & 2 we’re perfect, 6 figures at £8.99 each, a good mix of guys too. Then they done ****** it up with series 3 with only 4 figures, a higher price and the execution wasn’t as good. Exactly. Check your local Smyths - they've had them in since before Christmas...
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perfectplex
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Post by perfectplex on Mar 12, 2018 13:53:38 GMT -5
Another Mattel retro complaint thread...
Imagine actually living and collecting through the original Hasbro era.
Tons of reused parts (check) Sporadic releases without concrete dates (check) Sketchy distribution (check) Strange to downright bad sculpts with inaccurate gear and unpainted details (check) Repaints and re-releaes throughout the line (check)
I could go on, but you get the point.
The thing is, it’s so easy to look at the past with nostalgic rose-tinted glasses. We’ve become super spoiled in this era with instant access to information and the ability to communicate with one another in the blink of an eye.
The element of surprise from a collecting standpoint is essentially obsolete.
There would be months that went by in the past where you’d have absolutely zero clue as to what was releasing and where to obtain it. I remember calling up dozens of stores on a weekly basis as a kid trying to figure out when the next shipment was coming and which wrestlers would be in it. I searched for months for a Mega Maniacs Brutus before realizing that it was never actually released. The color carded series near the end of the line were all over the place, with many retailers not even getting a sniff of the green cards.
What I’m trying to say is that the collecting world has come a long way since the early 90s.
This line is fighting an uphill battle while trying to appease Hasbro purists and the modern day collector at the same time. You have people on one side screaming for accuracy and better head “scans” (even though the original line was produced entirely by sculpting and took many creative liberties regarding ring-gear and overall appearance). You have another group of people screaming for super obscure characters that would never move off the pegs in today’s market (sorry to disappoint the 3 people clamoring for a Waylon Mercy figure).
I don’t think people are thinking realistically when it comes to the budgetary, licensing, and time related constraints that are associated with producing a figure line of this nature.
It’s honestly a miracle that this line exists and has persisted through what would most likely have been a 1-2 series off-shoot had there not been so much love for it.
Enjoy these figures for what they are - and try to take yourself back 25+ years to a simpler time of collecting. It still warms my heart every time I walk into a store and see wrestling figures in this scale and style on the pegs. Before you know it, this Mattel retro line will also be a thing of the past.
It’s essentially your choice if you want to ruin it by looking at it with the impatience, angst, and insatiable demand of the modern day collector.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 12, 2018 14:03:20 GMT -5
Another Mattel retro complaint thread... Imagine actually living and collecting through the original Hasbro era. Tons of reused parts (check) Sporadic releases without concrete dates (check) Sketchy distribution (check) Strange to downright bad sculpts with inaccurate gear and unpainted details (check) Repaints and re-releaes throughout the line (check) I could go on, but you get the point. The thing is, it’s so easy to look at the past with nostalgic rose-tinted glasses. We’ve become super spoiled in this era with instant access to information and the ability to communicate with one another in the blink of an eye. The element of surprise from a collecting standpoint is essentially obsolete. There would be months that went by in the past where you’d have absolutely zero clue as to what was releasing and where to obtain it. I remember calling up dozens of stores on a weekly basis as a kid trying to figure out when the next shipment was coming and which wrestlers would be in it. I searched for months for a Mega Maniacs Brutus before realizing that it was never actually released. The color carded series near the end of the line were all over the place, with many retailers not even getting a sniff of the green cards. What I’m trying to say is that the collecting world has come a long way since the early 90s. This line is fighting an uphill battle while trying to appease Hasbro purists and the modern day collector at the same time. You have people on one side screaming for accuracy and better head “scans” (even though the original line was produced entirely by sculpting and took many creative liberties regarding ring-gear and overall appearance). You have another group of people screaming for super obscure characters that would never move off the pegs in today’s market (sorry to disappoint the 3 people clamoring for a Waylon Mercy figure). I don’t think people are thinking realistically when it comes to the budgetary, licensing, and time related constraints that are associated with producing a figure line of this nature. It’s honestly a miracle that this line exists and has persisted through what would most likely have been a 1-2 series off-shoot had there not been so much love for it. Enjoy these figures for what they are - and try to take yourself back 25+ years to a simpler time of collecting. It still warms my heart every time I walk into a store and see wrestling figures in this scale and style on the pegs. Before you know it, this Mattel retro line will also be a thing of the past. It’s essentially your choice if you want to ruin it by looking at it with the impatience, angst, and insatiable demand of the modern day collector. I think you’ve completely missed what a lot of us have actually said in this thread.
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perfectplex
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Post by perfectplex on Mar 12, 2018 14:50:43 GMT -5
Another Mattel retro complaint thread... Imagine actually living and collecting through the original Hasbro era. Tons of reused parts (check) Sporadic releases without concrete dates (check) Sketchy distribution (check) Strange to downright bad sculpts with inaccurate gear and unpainted details (check) Repaints and re-releaes throughout the line (check) I could go on, but you get the point. The thing is, it’s so easy to look at the past with nostalgic rose-tinted glasses. We’ve become super spoiled in this era with instant access to information and the ability to communicate with one another in the blink of an eye. The element of surprise from a collecting standpoint is essentially obsolete. There would be months that went by in the past where you’d have absolutely zero clue as to what was releasing and where to obtain it. I remember calling up dozens of stores on a weekly basis as a kid trying to figure out when the next shipment was coming and which wrestlers would be in it. I searched for months for a Mega Maniacs Brutus before realizing that it was never actually released. The color carded series near the end of the line were all over the place, with many retailers not even getting a sniff of the green cards. What I’m trying to say is that the collecting world has come a long way since the early 90s. This line is fighting an uphill battle while trying to appease Hasbro purists and the modern day collector at the same time. You have people on one side screaming for accuracy and better head “scans” (even though the original line was produced entirely by sculpting and took many creative liberties regarding ring-gear and overall appearance). You have another group of people screaming for super obscure characters that would never move off the pegs in today’s market (sorry to disappoint the 3 people clamoring for a Waylon Mercy figure). I don’t think people are thinking realistically when it comes to the budgetary, licensing, and time related constraints that are associated with producing a figure line of this nature. It’s honestly a miracle that this line exists and has persisted through what would most likely have been a 1-2 series off-shoot had there not been so much love for it. Enjoy these figures for what they are - and try to take yourself back 25+ years to a simpler time of collecting. It still warms my heart every time I walk into a store and see wrestling figures in this scale and style on the pegs. Before you know it, this Mattel retro line will also be a thing of the past. It’s essentially your choice if you want to ruin it by looking at it with the impatience, angst, and insatiable demand of the modern day collector. I think you’ve completely missed what a lot of us have actually said in this thread. I completely understand what was said in this thread and the other half dozen complaint/when will these hit stores threads. I was more so pointing to the juxtaposition of what collectors from the past had to deal with as compared to the trivial complaints and annoyances of the modern day collector. For whatever reason I think that this line in particular is a great contrarian tale of how people are clamoring for things from the past, but would have most likely hated what actually went down from a production and release standpoint back in the day.
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drnickriviera995
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Post by drnickriviera995 on Mar 12, 2018 15:37:39 GMT -5
Hasbro did reuse parts, but didn't start until half way through. Not right from the start.
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perfectplex
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Post by perfectplex on Mar 12, 2018 16:04:04 GMT -5
Hasbro did reuse parts, but didn't start until half way through. Not right from the start. If you want to get technical, they reused Hogan's leg mold for the first 3 series – so there was never really a point where they could claim no parts were reused. Series 3 also featured a duplicate body mold for Earthquake and Typhoon, as well as a cheap repaint of Macho King into Macho Man. It only got worse from there as the line progressed and budgets receded. Keep in mind that this was a flagship toyline for Hasbro at the time. The current Mattel iteration is merely a supplementary off-shoot of their main focus, which most likely has a less than adequate budget. New molds are EXPENSIVE and time consuming. I can see why they would try to get the most bang for the buck out of the tooling that was already created. Obviously I would love if every Mattel retro figure that came out had exclusive and diverse sculpts, but that's just not realistic considering the budgetary restrictions of this line.
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drnickriviera995
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Post by drnickriviera995 on Mar 12, 2018 17:33:37 GMT -5
Well if they're being budgetary in production, that should be reflected in price too. $13 is nuts for the level of quality being put out.
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Post by MKSavage on Mar 12, 2018 17:58:17 GMT -5
Hasbro did reuse parts, but didn't start until half way through. Not right from the start. If you want to get technical, they reused Hogan's leg mold for the first 3 series – so there was never really a point where they could claim no parts were reused. Series 3 also featured a duplicate body mold for Earthquake and Typhoon, as well as a cheap repaint of Macho King into Macho Man. It only got worse from there as the line progressed and budgets receded. Keep in mind that this was a flagship toyline for Hasbro at the time. The current Mattel iteration is merely a supplementary off-shoot of their main focus, which most likely has a less than adequate budget. New molds are EXPENSIVE and time consuming. I can see why they would try to get the most bang for the buck out of the tooling that was already created. Obviously I would love if every Mattel retro figure that came out had exclusive and diverse sculpts, but that's just not realistic considering the budgetary restrictions of this line. True about Typhoon and Macho Man/Macho king, but those were last minute replacements and Hasbro didn't have enough time to design new molds. Typhoon was supposed to be Tugboat (which had his own distinct mold) but by the time the line was ready to go out Tugboat had already became Typhoon so they scrapped the Tugboat body and just put his head on the Earthquake body since they wore the same type gear. I can't remember who Macho replaced but I believe they threw him in there because he was still very popular and it was an easy repaint. For the rest, they didn't start reusing molds until Series 5/6, but by that time Wrestling in general was not as popular as before and everything was suffering because of it (movies, pay-per views, magazines, and toys). And yes, they may have used the same legs for the first three Hogans, but Mattel has used entire molds for multiple figures which Hasbro didn't do until Series 5 (minus Typhoon and Macho).
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drnickriviera995
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Post by drnickriviera995 on Mar 12, 2018 18:39:46 GMT -5
Very true, I forgot about Earthquake and Typhoon, but that made sense with the change of Ottman's gimmick. And I believe Macho Man was probably just going to be another repack of Macho King from S2, but since he dropped the King gimmick, they just made the easy change. Like how Piper was repacked into S3 cases and maybe Duggan if I remember right.
Sorry if I missed a few parts reuse in the early series, but the ones that were done blended in and didn't really stand out much. Not like when they release someone with a singlet that's just painted onto a torso or reuse an entire mold for another wrestler or do a cheap repaint instead of a new mold.
Hasbro did start to cheap out, but yeah, wasn't really until 93' with series 5 and on.
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Post by MKSavage on Mar 12, 2018 20:21:01 GMT -5
Very true, I forgot about Earthquake and Typhoon, but that made sense with the change of Ottman's gimmick. And I believe Macho Man was probably just going to be another repack of Macho King from S2, but since he dropped the King gimmick, they just made the easy change. Like how Piper was repacked into S3 cases and maybe Duggan if I remember right. Sorry if I missed a few parts reuse in the early series, but the ones that were done blended in and didn't really stand out much. Not like when they release someone with a singlet that's just painted onto a torso or reuse an entire mold for another wrestler or do a cheap repaint instead of a new mold. Hasbro did start to cheap out, but yeah, wasn't really until 93' with series 5 and on. Yeah, too bad they couldn't just do a quick paint job for the Savage figure and give him long tights like the Hasbro Royal Rumble Mini-Figures. But I guess they were too close to release that they needed a quick fix and just changed the back of the tights to Macho Man. Yes series 5 they did start reusing complete molds but they still had some new molds, Hogan 5, Mountie, Warlord, Skinner, Virgil, and Anvil. Macho Man and IRS were updates of previous figures. Only Sid and the Model completely reused parts. After series 5, only a few figures had new molds made, Papa Shango, Yokozuna, Doink the Clown, and Giant Gonzalez (well his was kind-of the same as Skinner but on a larger scale).
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drnickriviera995
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Post by drnickriviera995 on Mar 12, 2018 21:08:35 GMT -5
Very true, I forgot about Earthquake and Typhoon, but that made sense with the change of Ottman's gimmick. And I believe Macho Man was probably just going to be another repack of Macho King from S2, but since he dropped the King gimmick, they just made the easy change. Like how Piper was repacked into S3 cases and maybe Duggan if I remember right. Sorry if I missed a few parts reuse in the early series, but the ones that were done blended in and didn't really stand out much. Not like when they release someone with a singlet that's just painted onto a torso or reuse an entire mold for another wrestler or do a cheap repaint instead of a new mold. Hasbro did start to cheap out, but yeah, wasn't really until 93' with series 5 and on. Yeah, too bad they couldn't just do a quick paint job for the Savage figure and give him long tights like the Hasbro Royal Rumble Mini-Figures. But I guess they were too close to release that they needed a quick fix and just changed the back of the tights to Macho Man. Yes series 5 they did start reusing complete molds but they still had some new molds, Hogan 5, Mountie, Warlord, Skinner, Virgil, and Anvil. Macho Man and IRS were updates of previous figures. Only Sid and the Model completely reused parts. After series 5, only a few figures had new molds made, Papa Shango, Yokozuna, Doink the Clown, and Giant Gonzalez (well his was kind-of the same as Skinner but on a larger scale). Yeah, always wished the Macho Man #3 had been the same as the mini. I even had a custom made of that a few years ago.
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perfectplex
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Post by perfectplex on Mar 13, 2018 11:20:28 GMT -5
At this point I'm pretty much playing devil's advocate, as I love the original Hasbro line and it was a large part of my childhood (and adulthood) since series 1.
However, the fact remains that they were by no means perfect and fell prey to the same production woes that plague most toy lines. The reason they didn't paint the wrist/finger tape on Series 1 Macho Man, is probably the same reason that Series 10 Marty Jannetty has flesh colored teeth…money.
But as much as we like to speculate, none of us actually know why certain decisions were made. Was there a Tugboat figured planned in the early pre-production stages? Sure, we have tangible proof. Was Typhoon a last minute throw-in? Only those that worked on the line would actually know. Judging by the fairly intricate (and pricey) paint apps, they would have needed references to work off of well in advance.
While they have been producing a fairly decent amount of jumpers in this series, it’s not a deal breaker for me.
Yes, there has been a lot of part re-use, but they’ve done a decent job at including character specific elements on each figure. From what I can tell, Rollins and Sting are a 1-for-1 sculpt duplicate from the neck down. Aside from those two, all of the jumpers feature custom rubber boot sculpts that are character specific.
To stop myself from rambling any further, I think they are doing a pretty good job with this line when you look at it from a REALISTIC scope.
In a perfect world every single figure would have custom sculpts, new action moves, and detailed paint apps. Hopefully as the lines continues to press on and gain momentum, we’ll see things continue to improve.
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TheRockers
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Post by TheRockers on Mar 13, 2018 16:02:49 GMT -5
Yes the Hasbro line was flawed but being a kid it was easily overlooked. I honestly don't care about what molds they use or head scans, that doesn't matter to me. I guess I'm just being greedy and I want as many retros as possible. You never know with Mattel, they could just shut this line down at any moment. I really just wish we would get at least 6 figures in each set with more legends. Its so unfortunate we don't have Diesel yet. And the price jump was ridiculous, $9.99 was perfect.
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Post by SteveHulk on Mar 13, 2018 17:43:49 GMT -5
Yes the Hasbro line was flawed but being a kid it was easily overlooked. I honestly don't care about what molds they use or head scans, that doesn't matter to me. I guess I'm just being greedy and I want as many retros as possible. You never know with Mattel, they could just shut this line down at any moment. I really just wish we would get at least 6 figures in each set with more legends. Its so unfortunate we don't have Diesel yet. And the price jump was ridiculous, $9.99 was perfect. That's exactly the same boat I'm in: I'm not bothered about the molds and scans they use (I don't really think it's important for this line). I'm more bothered by the price-hike and the line quickly becoming very current-roster based...
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Don't Go Down
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Post by Don't Go Down on Mar 13, 2018 18:22:23 GMT -5
They dropped the ball but it isn't completely lost. That ring and the box art front and back is virtually perfect besides might be a tad small, repackage the entire line like that ring box and start doing a mix of current and classic. Give us the guys we never got. Listen if I wanna replay Ocarina of Time I do it on 3DS. Why? Because that is how my rose colored goggles remember experiencing that game, not the blocky ugly actual original release. I want this line to take what was great about it and fix the mistakes of old, not make a whole new set of new botches. I remember how frustrating the last years of Hasbro line were, and I understand the need to infuse the current roster to attract a new audience. I just don't think you need to alienate the nostalgia crowd that came out to make this line a sleeper hit that they clearly weren't ready to commit to.
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mrassbillygunn
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Post by mrassbillygunn on Mar 13, 2018 18:34:43 GMT -5
Why are Smyths jacking the prices up? The first two waves at £8.99 were fine...still a bit steep though and then they increase in price again to £10.99, wtf? these are worth like £5 max.
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drnickriviera995
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Post by drnickriviera995 on Mar 13, 2018 18:38:13 GMT -5
They dropped the ball but it isn't completely lost. That ring and the box art front and back is virtually perfect besides might be a tad small, repackage the entire line like that ring box and start doing a mix of current and classic. Give us the guys we never got. Listen if I wanna replay Ocarina of Time I do it on 3DS. Why? Because that is how my rose colored goggles remember experiencing that game, not the blocky ugly actual original release. I want this line to take what was great about it and fix the mistakes of old, not make a whole new set of new botches. I remember how frustrating the last years of Hasbro line were, and I understand the need to infuse the current roster to attract a new audience. I just don't think you need to alienate the nostalgia crowd that came out to make this line a sleeper hit that they clearly weren't ready to commit to. Perfectly put, I really believe it's the nostalgia crowd that makes the line possible, and I feel they are alienating us by barely doing any classic stars we really want.
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RedDevil
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Post by RedDevil on Mar 13, 2018 18:52:00 GMT -5
Why are Smyths jacking the prices up? The first two waves at £8.99 were fine...still a bit steep though and then they increase in price again to £10.99, wtf? these are worth like £5 max. Because of the App feature, which raised the price in the US as well. I questioned Smyths on Twitter about the price-hike some time back, and the answer I got back was basically that the increase was down to Mattel. And I completely agree, this line is now being priced-out under the guise of a feature that I doubt anyone of the obvious target market is even remotely interested in. If the price increase isn’t being matched by a noticeable increase in the quality of the actual product then it should be avoided at the risk of killing whatever momentum the line has at this stage.
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nywild3
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Post by nywild3 on Mar 13, 2018 18:52:08 GMT -5
They dropped the ball but it isn't completely lost. That ring and the box art front and back is virtually perfect besides might be a tad small, repackage the entire line like that ring box and start doing a mix of current and classic. Give us the guys we never got. Listen if I wanna replay Ocarina of Time I do it on 3DS. Why? Because that is how my rose colored goggles remember experiencing that game, not the blocky ugly actual original release. I want this line to take what was great about it and fix the mistakes of old, not make a whole new set of new botches. I remember how frustrating the last years of Hasbro line were, and I understand the need to infuse the current roster to attract a new audience. I just don't think you need to alienate the nostalgia crowd that came out to make this line a sleeper hit that they clearly weren't ready to commit to. Perfectly put, I really believe it's the nostalgia crowd that makes the line possible, and I feel they are alienating us by barely doing any classic stars we really want. I only collect Hasbro and Retros so getting the Retro wrestlers I want is huge for me. With that being said, if someone asked me before the line started which Hasbro wrestlers I’d want that I didn’t get would have included all of series 2, Cena and Lesnar because, while still current, are all time stars in the business. I’d also want a new Flair and a Jericho. Randy Orton and Angle are rumored and I’d want both of them too since he’s in the same boat as Cena and Lesnar. Goldberg would definitely be on my want list. His Retro could of been one of the lines shining moments to many collectors but ended but being its biggest black eye to date. Overall I can’t completely complain about the wrestler selections. I’m sure more attitude era wrestlers are on the way and hopefully some golden era as well
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