Mclovin
Superstar
This Forum's Resident Future WWE Champion, Not Changing This Until It Happens.
Joined on: Nov 12, 2018 4:12:19 GMT -5
Posts: 826
|
Post by Mclovin on Feb 10, 2021 18:25:41 GMT -5
That's a gray area from hell. Pro wrestling isnt meant to be competition wrestling. So you dont have to like competition wrestling to like pro wrestling. I know this going to be a lot to take in, but wrestling was meant to be believed as a competition and a large chunk of the actions of the business that managed to make money have been wrong and should not have ever been done because they damaged the credibility of wrestling and made it harder for wrestling as it was intended to exist. Yeah, but we got Hell In A Cell out of it so that's something.
|
|
|
Post by kennyw86v2 on Feb 10, 2021 18:52:45 GMT -5
That's a gray area from hell. Pro wrestling isnt meant to be competition wrestling. So you dont have to like competition wrestling to like pro wrestling. I know this going to be a lot to take in, but wrestling was meant to be believed as a competition and a large chunk of the actions of the business that managed to make money have been wrong and should not have ever been done because they damaged the credibility of wrestling and made it harder for wrestling as it was intended to exist. Sure, at one point. But my whole life (I'm 34) it's been pretty obvious how fake it all is. I can only judge what I know. But I'd argue if it made so much money, it was the right move.
|
|
|
Post by Turnbuckle Zealot(Phil) on Feb 10, 2021 18:59:25 GMT -5
I know this going to be a lot to take in, but wrestling was meant to be believed as a competition and a large chunk of the actions of the business that managed to make money have been wrong and should not have ever been done because they damaged the credibility of wrestling and made it harder for wrestling as it was intended to exist. Sure, at one point. But my whole life (I'm 34) it's been pretty obvious how fake it all is. I can only judge what I know. But I'd argue if it made so much money, it was the right move. Do you not believe that history books are real? Because you can research the past
|
|
|
Post by TheSystem 1.5 on Feb 10, 2021 19:25:31 GMT -5
“ It's also the one wrestling attire that isn't a costume or outlaw/backyard goof outfit that you can get service in a store/burger joint in.”
If I’m working at a McDonalds and someone walks in wearing a singlet I’m not serving them until they put pants on. Like there’s children here sir please cover your dick print
|
|
|
Post by kennyw86v2 on Feb 10, 2021 20:16:28 GMT -5
Sure, at one point. But my whole life (I'm 34) it's been pretty obvious how fake it all is. I can only judge what I know. But I'd argue if it made so much money, it was the right move. Do you not believe that history books are real? Because you can research the past I'm not sure the point of that? Lots of things used to be. The world progresses. Wwe would not be the billion dollar empire it is if they sold "real" wrestling. Sometimes it really is as simple as it is what it is. This has taken quite a left turn from why I think singlets are lame though.
|
|
|
Post by Kill Em' All on Feb 11, 2021 14:28:46 GMT -5
They’re boring; but it looked pretty cool on some guys
|
|
|
Post by Stuart? on Feb 12, 2021 18:25:27 GMT -5
I'd wear a singlet if I were a wrestler. Always been a fan of em.
|
|
|
Post by Rated [R] NinJa on Feb 12, 2021 19:37:07 GMT -5
They’re boring; but it looked pretty cool on some guys This.
|
|
|
Post by shanieomaniac on Feb 13, 2021 2:40:58 GMT -5
Ok, here's my take.
1. Wrestling has evolved. It has it's roots, and it will always have it's roots. Nobody is looking at the WWE today and saying it didn't come from the carny days. The McMahon family alone just loves to talk about the longevity of their family legacy, so it isn't like anyone is hiding or denying history. But you also can't deny that the old early 20th Century stuff is nothing like what's put on today, and whether that's good or bad is an opinion, not an objective fact.
2. Singlets these days mostly are associated with the amateur side of things. As such, if you see a guy in a singlet, there's a chance it reflects his fighting style or his strengths as a wrestler. Kurt Angle is a great example of this, the singlet was part of his story. Mark Henry also wore one, reflecting his weightlifter background. Gimmicks are a big part of pro wrestling, and what a guy wears is just as important as how they act. Again, if this is good or bad, that's for you to decide. But it is part of the game.
3. As stated above, certain clothing can mask certain undesirable features. Good gosh, look at what they make Nia and Tamina wear! Unless the goal is for the person to use their looks as comic relief (See Otis) then the company is going to have them wear the most visually appealing attire they can. Don't have abs? you won't be shirtless. Skipped leg day? You get pants or tights. The Singlet works great as a way to hide someone who has a bit of a tummy while still showing off muscular legs.
And finally,
4. Not everyone likes singlets in the Wrestling Industry as well. There's still some degree of personal involvement for what a wrestler wears and some guys just don't like singlets, simple as that. Every one of them has their own reasons from wanting to stand out (Jeff Hardy) to having potential self image issues (points at icon). It isn't our place as fans, or even the other wrestler's place as peers to tell someone they need to wear a certain type of attire or risk being inauthentic. You can respect the business and it's roots in a pair of tights just as easily as you can a singlet.
In conclusion, there are many reasons for choosing whether or not to wear a singlet, and it isn't simply a matter of "nobody likes singlets"
|
|
|
Post by ¡Twist Of Cinnamon! on Feb 13, 2021 6:31:26 GMT -5
They just seem kinda dated, especially in a time where it’s either trunks or jeans.
|
|
|
Post by Affliction: Elite Trader on Feb 13, 2021 14:49:51 GMT -5
“ It's also the one wrestling attire that isn't a costume or outlaw/backyard goof outfit that you can get service in a store/burger joint in.” If I’m working at a McDonalds and someone walks in wearing a singlet I’m not serving them until they put pants on. Like there’s children here sir please cover your dick print Would you serve this guy? Personally, I have nothing against singlets at all but I have little respect for wrestlers ranging from Indie ranks all they may up to major promotions who wear baggy pants,
|
|
|
Post by Turnbuckle Zealot(Phil) on Feb 13, 2021 20:49:08 GMT -5
They just seem kinda dated, especially in a time where it’s either trunks or jeans. No one was ever supposed to wrestle in jeans. It's a bad attire for a typical wrestling match. End of discussion.
|
|
|
Post by Turnbuckle Zealot(Phil) on Feb 13, 2021 20:57:58 GMT -5
Ok, here's my take. 1. Wrestling has evolved. It has it's roots, and it will always have it's roots. Nobody is looking at the WWE today and saying it didn't come from the carny days. The McMahon family alone just loves to talk about the longevity of their family legacy, so it isn't like anyone is hiding or denying history. But you also can't deny that the old early 20th Century stuff is nothing like what's put on today, and whether that's good or bad is an opinion, not an objective fact. 2. Singlets these days mostly are associated with the amateur side of things. As such, if you see a guy in a singlet, there's a chance it reflects his fighting style or his strengths as a wrestler. Kurt Angle is a great example of this, the singlet was part of his story. Mark Henry also wore one, reflecting his weightlifter background. Gimmicks are a big part of pro wrestling, and what a guy wears is just as important as how they act. Again, if this is good or bad, that's for you to decide. But it is part of the game. 3. As stated above, certain clothing can mask certain undesirable features. Good gosh, look at what they make Nia and Tamina wear! Unless the goal is for the person to use their looks as comic relief (See Otis) then the company is going to have them wear the most visually appealing attire they can. Don't have abs? you won't be shirtless. Skipped leg day? You get pants or tights. The Singlet works great as a way to hide someone who has a bit of a tummy while still showing off muscular legs. And finally, 4. Not everyone likes singlets in the Wrestling Industry as well. There's still some degree of personal involvement for what a wrestler wears and some guys just don't like singlets, simple as that. Every one of them has their own reasons from wanting to stand out (Jeff Hardy) to having potential self image issues (points at icon). It isn't our place as fans, or even the other wrestler's place as peers to tell someone they need to wear a certain type of attire or risk being inauthentic. You can respect the business and it's roots in a pair of tights just as easily as you can a singlet. In conclusion, there are many reasons for choosing whether or not to wear a singlet, and it isn't simply a matter of "nobody likes singlets" Wrestling literally cannot evolve to wear singlets don't make sense as an option and still be called "wrestling" it literally does not compute. The most profitable time to work in wrestling was when people believed in what they were watching and could take it seriously. When accounting for inflation, Jim Londos made more money and had more respect among his fans than Austin does. Period. And I'm not even going to get into the inherent body shaming of people's mindsets around singlets. I'm honestly really sick of this mindset that being ripped is equal to being super athletic. The lack of bodyfat is not the causation of the athleticism. People who are super athletic are usually just better at burning body fat and have high metabolisms. Anyway, your points are fair, I'm just frustrated with talking to uneducated fans who are convinced their cynicism makes them deep and that modern wrestling is great when it makes little to no sense and makes everyone who doesn't watch think we are all mentally defective.
|
|
|
Post by Turnbuckle Zealot(Phil) on Feb 13, 2021 21:04:21 GMT -5
Do you not believe that history books are real? Because you can research the past I'm not sure the point of that? Lots of things used to be. The world progresses. Wwe would not be the billion dollar empire it is if they sold "real" wrestling. Sometimes it really is as simple as it is what it is. This has taken quite a left turn from why I think singlets are lame though. I do not give a that they make billions of dollars. Less people make money as wrestlers or working in non wrestler roles in the business now than in any time in history. There is less money for wrestlers than ever before relative to the value of the dollar in any given time period. And no one has "progressed" past singlets. That implies that singlets are no longer practical or safe to use when working a match. They are literally as good now as they have ever been because the fundamentals of grappling with another human has not changed. And the fact that most everyone on this forum can't grasp the idea that a balance of realism with showmanship is needed for wrestling to be good is exhausting and why I stopped coming here in the first place. Your initial statement is not an argument for anything. It means that one family corrupted the public perception of what wrestling is supposed to be so they could hoard all the wealth and make it next to impossible for anyone else to make a living in wrestling. That is demonstrably a business monopoly and would be seen as the death of an industry in any other business. If this happened in the world of toilet paper, our whole country would be going nuts and holding trials and sending CEOs of the hoarding company to prison. Heads would roll. But it happens to wrestling and people just say "wwe make money that mean they good lol"
|
|
|
Post by ¡Twist Of Cinnamon! on Feb 13, 2021 21:49:07 GMT -5
I'm not sure the point of that? Lots of things used to be. The world progresses. Wwe would not be the billion dollar empire it is if they sold "real" wrestling. Sometimes it really is as simple as it is what it is. This has taken quite a left turn from why I think singlets are lame though. I do not give a that they make billions of dollars. Less people make money as wrestlers or working in non wrestler roles in the business now than in any time in history. There is less money for wrestlers than ever before relative to the value of the dollar in any given time period. And no one has "progressed" past singlets. That implies that singlets are no longer practical or safe to use when working a match. They are literally as good now as they have ever been because the fundamentals of grappling with another human has not changed. And the fact that most everyone on this forum can't grasp the idea that a balance of realism with showmanship is needed for wrestling to be good is exhausting and why I stopped coming here in the first place. Your initial statement is not an argument for anything. It means that one family corrupted the public perception of what wrestling is supposed to be so they could hoard all the wealth and make it next to impossible for anyone else to make a living in wrestling. That is demonstrably a business monopoly and would be seen as the death of an industry in any other business. If this happened in the world of toilet paper, our whole country would be going nuts and holding trials and sending CEOs of the hoarding company to prison. Heads would roll. But it happens to wrestling and people just say "wwe make money that mean they good lol" You’ve shotgunned the topic from singlets to some socialist rant about hoarding money. Reel it in a bit there, Bernie.
|
|
|
Post by kennyw86v2 on Feb 13, 2021 21:51:32 GMT -5
I'm not sure the point of that? Lots of things used to be. The world progresses. Wwe would not be the billion dollar empire it is if they sold "real" wrestling. Sometimes it really is as simple as it is what it is. This has taken quite a left turn from why I think singlets are lame though. I do not give a that they make billions of dollars. Less people make money as wrestlers or working in non wrestler roles in the business now than in any time in history. There is less money for wrestlers than ever before relative to the value of the dollar in any given time period. And no one has "progressed" past singlets. That implies that singlets are no longer practical or safe to use when working a match. They are literally as good now as they have ever been because the fundamentals of grappling with another human has not changed. And the fact that most everyone on this forum can't grasp the idea that a balance of realism with showmanship is needed for wrestling to be good is exhausting and why I stopped coming here in the first place. Your initial statement is not an argument for anything. It means that one family corrupted the public perception of what wrestling is supposed to be so they could hoard all the wealth and make it next to impossible for anyone else to make a living in wrestling. That is demonstrably a business monopoly and would be seen as the death of an industry in any other business. If this happened in the world of toilet paper, our whole country would be going nuts and holding trials and sending CEOs of the hoarding company to prison. Heads would roll. But it happens to wrestling and people just say "wwe make money that mean they good lol" Unless you decide to accept that wrestling and pro wrestling arent the same thing nobody can reason with you. And you refuse to acknowledge that. And honestly your responses just seem like that of a very angry person and I'm not about to get banned over this. A lot of people dont like singlets for whatever reason and you do not get to tell them their opinion is invalid. /thread.
|
|
|
Post by Nivro™ on Feb 13, 2021 21:58:46 GMT -5
Ill never understand the point in starting a thread asking for opinions then proceeding to argue with everyone that doesnt have the same opinion as you.... lol
|
|
|
Post by Turnbuckle Zealot(Phil) on Feb 13, 2021 22:44:31 GMT -5
I do not give a that they make billions of dollars. Less people make money as wrestlers or working in non wrestler roles in the business now than in any time in history. There is less money for wrestlers than ever before relative to the value of the dollar in any given time period. And no one has "progressed" past singlets. That implies that singlets are no longer practical or safe to use when working a match. They are literally as good now as they have ever been because the fundamentals of grappling with another human has not changed. And the fact that most everyone on this forum can't grasp the idea that a balance of realism with showmanship is needed for wrestling to be good is exhausting and why I stopped coming here in the first place. Your initial statement is not an argument for anything. It means that one family corrupted the public perception of what wrestling is supposed to be so they could hoard all the wealth and make it next to impossible for anyone else to make a living in wrestling. That is demonstrably a business monopoly and would be seen as the death of an industry in any other business. If this happened in the world of toilet paper, our whole country would be going nuts and holding trials and sending CEOs of the hoarding company to prison. Heads would roll. But it happens to wrestling and people just say "wwe make money that mean they good lol" Unless you decide to accept that wrestling and pro wrestling arent the same thing nobody can reason with you. And you refuse to acknowledge that. And honestly your responses just seem like that of a very angry person and I'm not about to get banned over this. A lot of people dont like singlets for whatever reason and you do not get to tell them their opinion is invalid. /thread. As someone who has done both, I’ve acknowledged that they are different multiple times, but y’all keep making assertions like they are not related. And it’s not about someone’s opinion being invalid, it’s about it not being as well substantiated as well as they think it is. You brought up money, not me.
|
|
|
Post by Turnbuckle Zealot(Phil) on Feb 13, 2021 22:45:49 GMT -5
I do not give a that they make billions of dollars. Less people make money as wrestlers or working in non wrestler roles in the business now than in any time in history. There is less money for wrestlers than ever before relative to the value of the dollar in any given time period. And no one has "progressed" past singlets. That implies that singlets are no longer practical or safe to use when working a match. They are literally as good now as they have ever been because the fundamentals of grappling with another human has not changed. And the fact that most everyone on this forum can't grasp the idea that a balance of realism with showmanship is needed for wrestling to be good is exhausting and why I stopped coming here in the first place. Your initial statement is not an argument for anything. It means that one family corrupted the public perception of what wrestling is supposed to be so they could hoard all the wealth and make it next to impossible for anyone else to make a living in wrestling. That is demonstrably a business monopoly and would be seen as the death of an industry in any other business. If this happened in the world of toilet paper, our whole country would be going nuts and holding trials and sending CEOs of the hoarding company to prison. Heads would roll. But it happens to wrestling and people just say "wwe make money that mean they good lol" You’ve shotgunned the topic from singlets to some socialist rant about hoarding money. Reel it in a bit there, Bernie. No. You child. You do not get to assert that I brought up money first when I didn’t. I didn’t shotgun anything, this Kenny person did. And go lick a boot if you think hoarding money is a good thing.
|
|
|
Post by kennyw86v2 on Feb 13, 2021 22:55:09 GMT -5
Unless you decide to accept that wrestling and pro wrestling arent the same thing nobody can reason with you. And you refuse to acknowledge that. And honestly your responses just seem like that of a very angry person and I'm not about to get banned over this. A lot of people dont like singlets for whatever reason and you do not get to tell them their opinion is invalid. /thread. As someone who has done both, I’ve acknowledged that they are different multiple times, but y’all keep making assertions like they are not related. And it’s not about someone’s opinion being invalid, it’s about it not being as well substantiated as well as they think it is. You brought up money, not me. My opinion could be singlets are more difficult for pooping, and that should be a good enough answer for you. Your question was why. I, and many others, have told you why. And you keep arguing it. Cool thing about asking someone for their opinion is you dont have to share that opinion, but you also dont need to keep pressing and trying to invalidate it. Singlets look stupid. Like grown men wearing onesies. That's an answer to your question and should flat out be the end of this conversation.
|
|