Mirror Images
Main Eventer
fan since '92
Joined on: Jun 7, 2005 4:07:40 GMT -5
Posts: 2,809
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Post by Mirror Images on Jan 8, 2008 12:52:49 GMT -5
Definetly. Finlay and Dave Taylor are past their primes by at least 15 years.
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Post by Lorenzo Alcazar on Jan 8, 2008 13:05:05 GMT -5
In 2 weeks Batista will turn 39.....just food for thought for those of you categorizing him with the "young guys".
And wrestling is not a "real sport", so it's not like in baseball where you get to a certain age and you can no longer produce and they force you out.
I think Hulk Hogan, Ric Flair, Shawn Michaels, Triple H, The Undertaker are prime examples of as long as people will PAY TO SEE YOU....you will always have a job.
Say what you want about Shawn Michaels, but put his name on the Pay-Per View Marqe...people pay to see him. And they will continue to pay to see him for as long as he choses to work....he's just simply a top draw anyway you slice it. He sells. And thats all that matters.
If "young and talented" got you ahead in the wrestling business, Carlito vs Shelton Benjamin would be your Royal Rumble main event for the WWE title.....however, that doesn't sell tickets, which is ALL THAT MATTERS.
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Mirror Images
Main Eventer
fan since '92
Joined on: Jun 7, 2005 4:07:40 GMT -5
Posts: 2,809
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Post by Mirror Images on Jan 8, 2008 13:09:45 GMT -5
In 2 weeks Batista will turn 39.....just food for thought for those of you categorizing him with the "young guys". And wrestling is not a "real sport", so it's not like in baseball where you get to a certain age and you can no longer produce and they force you out. I think Hulk Hogan, Ric Flair, Shawn Michaels, Triple H, The Undertaker are prime examples of as long as people will PAY TO SEE YOU....you will always have a job. Say what you want about Shawn Michaels, but put his name on the Pay-Per View Marqe...people pay to see him. And they will continue to pay to see him for as long as he choses to work....he's just simply a top draw anyway you slice it. He sells. And thats all that matters. If "young and talented" got you ahead in the wrestling business, Carlito vs Shelton Benjamin would be your Royal Rumble main event for the WWE title.....however, that doesn't sell tickets, which is ALL THAT MATTERS. But that in itself is the problem. Having guys like Flair and HBk hanging around is a hindrence to these young guys. Shelton Benjamin vs Carlito will never been seen as the main event and wont sell any tickets because HBK and Flair are not giving up those spots on the card and letting younger talent evolve in the way they should. As long as HBk and Undertaker are with the WWE they will still be main eventers. So really I could tell you now that in August 2009 or july 2010 that they will be featured in main event storylines on WWE TV. That is the big problem. What chance does a young guy coming in have of getting to the main event when its almost set in concrete that HBk and Undertaker will always have those spots. HBK and Undertaker are now what Roddy Piper and Randy Savage etc where to WCW in the late 1990's
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Post by Lorenzo Alcazar on Jan 8, 2008 13:18:38 GMT -5
In 2 weeks Batista will turn 39.....just food for thought for those of you categorizing him with the "young guys". And wrestling is not a "real sport", so it's not like in baseball where you get to a certain age and you can no longer produce and they force you out. I think Hulk Hogan, Ric Flair, Shawn Michaels, Triple H, The Undertaker are prime examples of as long as people will PAY TO SEE YOU....you will always have a job. Say what you want about Shawn Michaels, but put his name on the Pay-Per View Marqe...people pay to see him. And they will continue to pay to see him for as long as he choses to work....he's just simply a top draw anyway you slice it. He sells. And thats all that matters. If "young and talented" got you ahead in the wrestling business, Carlito vs Shelton Benjamin would be your Royal Rumble main event for the WWE title.....however, that doesn't sell tickets, which is ALL THAT MATTERS. But that in itself is the problem. Having guys like Flair and HBk hanging around is a hindrence to these young guys. Shelton Benjamin vs Carlito will never been seen as the main event and wont sell any tickets because HBK and Flair are not giving up those spots on the card and letting younger talent evolve in the way they should. Ok but if I'm Vince McMahon....a business man.....am I really supposed to throw away my cash cow and take a chance on something that MIGHT not work? It's simple business.....Vince McMahon has certain guys who are GUARENTEED to draw and make money. When you have a formula like that, you milk it until it doesn't work anymore...then you try and change it. And really, I don't see what people complain about. Ric Flair and Shawn Michaels have been doing nothing but put guys over left right and center for the last 4 years. Shawn Michaels jobbed to Carlito, Benjamin, Orton, Cena....he's giving Kennedy a major rub now too. And with Flair, I can't REMEMBER the last time he won a match before they started this "if you lose, you're done" angle. And BOTH wins so far over Orton and Triple H came with HEAVY outside interference, it's not like he's won clean. Plus he put over Carlito and Edge last year. And Undertaker, in the last 10 years, he's been WWE Champion 2 times for a total of like 20 days each, until he jobbed to Hogan and then until he got hurt. He's put over Edge, Orton, Batista, Finlay, Kennedy. If you actually WATCH the shows, rather than just READ people complain on the internet, it's really hard for me to understand how anybody can say these guys don't put other people over. If Shawn Michaels keeps putting over Kennedy like he's been doing, and the fans don't buy it and keep giving Kennedy a dead crowd response, its not Shawn Michaels fault if Kennedy's push gets killed. They are giving him a chance just like they give EVERYBODY a chance.....but if it doesn't sell and the people don't buy Kennedy, there is only so much they can do.
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*Xx:DAN:xX*
Main Eventer
Joined on: Jul 18, 2007 0:26:08 GMT -5
Posts: 1,003
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Post by *Xx:DAN:xX* on Jan 8, 2008 13:20:20 GMT -5
i have been saying this too. hes gonna retire real soon
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Mirror Images
Main Eventer
fan since '92
Joined on: Jun 7, 2005 4:07:40 GMT -5
Posts: 2,809
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Post by Mirror Images on Jan 8, 2008 13:30:08 GMT -5
But that in itself is the problem. Having guys like Flair and HBk hanging around is a hindrence to these young guys. Shelton Benjamin vs Carlito will never been seen as the main event and wont sell any tickets because HBK and Flair are not giving up those spots on the card and letting younger talent evolve in the way they should. Ok but if I'm Vince McMahon....a business man.....am I really supposed to throw away my cash cow and take a chance on something that MIGHT not work? It's simple business.....Vince McMahon has certain guys who are GUARENTEED to draw and make money. When you have a formula like that, you milk it until it doesn't work anymore...then you try and change it. And really, I don't see what people complain about. Ric Flair and Shawn Michaels have been doing nothing but put guys over left right and center for the last 4 years. Shawn Michaels jobbed to Carlito, Benjamin, Orton, Cena....he's giving Kennedy a major rub now too. And with Flair, I can't REMEMBER the last time he won a match before they started this "if you lose, you're done" angle. And BOTH wins so far over Orton and Triple H came with HEAVY outside interference, it's not like he's won clean. Plus he put over Carlito and Edge last year. And Undertaker, in the last 10 years, he's been WWE Champion 2 times for a total of like 20 days each, until he jobbed to Hogan and then until he got hurt. He's put over Edge, Orton, Batista, Finlay, Kennedy. If you actually WATCH the shows, rather than just READ people complain on the internet, it's really hard for me to understand how anybody can say these guys don't put other people over. If Shawn Michaels keeps putting over Kennedy like he's been doing, and the fans don't buy it and keep giving Kennedy a dead crowd response, its not Shawn Michaels fault if Kennedy's push gets killed. They are giving him a chance just like they give EVERYBODY a chance.....but if it doesn't sell and the people don't buy Kennedy, there is only so much they can do. Theres a difference between putting someone over in a throw away match on raw that nobody really cares about and putting someone over long term in a feud. I mean as much as I hate Kennedy why did he lose clean to HBk in their first PPV match. Long term thats going to do damage to him. Straight away people lose interest in the feud because they see HBk as the stronger man and think Kennedy is just an upstart loser and that is the impression that will stick. When was the last time that Undertaker or HBK put someone over in a storyline or feud that really meant something and let themselves come across as the weaker or even as the equal of the guy they where facing by the time the feud had ended.?? And no I dont mean equal throughout the feud then at the end triumphing and being presented as stronger .
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COCK & BLAST
Main Eventer
Joined on: Sept 26, 2007 14:00:28 GMT -5
Posts: 1,875
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Post by COCK & BLAST on Jan 8, 2008 14:23:26 GMT -5
Heck Fink, Tista is as old as Taker I think. So.... r u serious Yes, actually. Batista is 38, Taker is 42 I believe.
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Nash
Main Eventer
Joined on: Sept 9, 2006 10:04:30 GMT -5
Posts: 2,699
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Post by Nash on Jan 8, 2008 14:38:33 GMT -5
Yeah he should soon. Not only for his own health and appaearance, but also for stars who are almost in the mani event spot like Kennedy.
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Post by Lorenzo Alcazar on Jan 8, 2008 14:38:39 GMT -5
Batista will be 39 in 10 days. He's as old as Undertaker, Triple H and Shawn Michaels. The only reason he looks younger is because his body is ripped because he's all roided up.
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Reddevilbigevil
Main Eventer
Smite This!!!
Joined on: Aug 7, 2003 20:49:10 GMT -5
Posts: 4,091
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Post by Reddevilbigevil on Jan 8, 2008 15:09:37 GMT -5
Batista will be 39 in 10 days. He's as old as Undertaker, Triple H and Shawn Michaels. The only reason he looks younger is because his body is ripped because he's all roided up. January 8 2008 - January 18 1966= Batista will be 42 in 10 days. Undertaker will be 46 on march 24, 3 years and a bit between them, which isn`t that much when you get to that age!
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Post by Codesters on Jan 8, 2008 16:05:02 GMT -5
Hope not. HBK is my favorite active wrestler, and one of my all time favs...
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Post by fallenhero on Jan 8, 2008 17:06:20 GMT -5
He needs to have the belt one more time. He doesn't NEED to. We want him to, but him, Undertaker and a few others are guys that don't need the belt to be over! HBK and Taker never needed any of the title reigns except maybe the first. Except Taker needs the world title, because he got ed out of his last reign.
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Post by Phantom on Jan 8, 2008 17:57:36 GMT -5
Even if he does retire from wrestling he will always show up to big events or manage someone. Hopefully hes got another year or two.
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Post by WalterF on Jan 8, 2008 19:06:16 GMT -5
For the people who say HBK, Taker, etc. are hindering young talent from going to the top I must disagree. HBK has been jobbing to Cena, orton and Kennedy for most of the year. Taker always put people over when asked. These people are NOT like Hogan and Macho in WCW ... I believe it's a completely different story. The only reason I am bringing up the topic is because I don't want HBK to end up getting to hurt or anything. There is no question he is of marquee value and there is no mention that he is helping to stablish younger talent.
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