Ohtimate Wahriah
Main Eventer
WF 10 Year Member
Joined on: Jul 1, 2008 12:35:07 GMT -5
Posts: 2,527
|
Post by Ohtimate Wahriah on Jul 27, 2021 18:26:31 GMT -5
My AWA kick continues! Rockers vs Bad Company- AWA on ESPN 3-26-88. Little preview of what they would do in the WWF just a few years later. Back when I had cable, me and my brothers would be so happy ESPN was showing wrestling lol. We watched AWA all the time
|
|
|
Post by The Brain on Jul 27, 2021 18:30:29 GMT -5
My AWA kick continues! Rockers vs Bad Company- AWA on ESPN 3-26-88. Little preview of what they would do in the WWF just a few years later. Back when I had cable, me and my brothers would be so happy ESPN was showing wrestling lol. We watched AWA all the time Yeah AWA gets a bad rap(especially the final years.Granted for good reason)but they definitely had great talent go through there. also some very good gems matches wise. I've always been a fan.
|
|
Ohtimate Wahriah
Main Eventer
WF 10 Year Member
Joined on: Jul 1, 2008 12:35:07 GMT -5
Posts: 2,527
|
Post by Ohtimate Wahriah on Jul 27, 2021 18:36:26 GMT -5
Back when I had cable, me and my brothers would be so happy ESPN was showing wrestling lol. We watched AWA all the time Yeah AWA gets a bad rap(especially the final years.Granted for good reason)but they definitely had great talent go through there. also some very good gems matches wise. I've always been a fan. For sure! I had never heard if it before we watched it on ESPN but now iv seen the full playthrough like 4 times haha. Nobody would even know most of those early WWF gimmicks were crafted in the AWA. Had Vince not pulled away so many of their stars, it would have been interesting to see where they could have went
|
|
|
Post by MKSavage on Jul 27, 2021 18:43:00 GMT -5
I always liked the match. But then again, I am a big fan of Bret and Shawn. To me, your not gonna find two many guys who consistently put on great matches PPV after PPV like these guys did. I think the thing that people don't like about the match is that their was only one fall. Usually iron man matches have 3 plus. That usually helps break up the monotony of a long match. I've also heard a lot of people say that they went to the rest holds too much, but I recently watched the Ric Flair/Ricky Steamboat 2 out of 3 falls match that went 55 minutes, and it seemed like they went to the rest holds just as much as Bret and Shawn did. The other thing about this PPV that I don't understand is people really hating the Ultimate Warrior / HHH match. I hear people say it was too short and it hurt Hunter. But, I think it was the best way to bring Warrior back and make him look strong. And, it really didn't hurt HHH that much, if at all (the curtain call probably hurt him more than this match ever could). And why do people get bent out of shape, or act surprised that Warrior no-sold the pedigree? Did they not watch Warrior during his previous runs with the WWF, he, like Hogan, always kicked out of peoples finishes - it kind of was his thing/gimmick. Seems odd. Addressing the whole one fall aspect. To me it fit. The idea being that you couldn’t split them at the time. Also both were difficult to beat. By having 1+ fall apiece, it conveys that both can be beaten if they went the pinball/submission route and it would cheapen the match if you brought in countouts and dq’s. I’m watching WWF 96 just now and in the lead up to the match Bret was saying that he was the mat technician and Shawn was more high flying, Lucia Libre style, implying that Bret’s “superiority” would be the difference maker in the match. Fast forward to the match, they told a fantastic story in that Shawn could hang with the best technician in wrestling at the time (or at least one of the best). A nicely executed, subtle piece of story telling there.My only problem was with the overtime, but I guess how else could you do it? If Shawn couldn’t do it in the hour, it would be unbelievable that he wins the belt in a ten minute raw rematch or at the next PPV (not to mention denying HBK his WM moment). As for Warrior v HHH. I’m thankful it was a short match. If they’d been competitive, Warrior would have to sell and would have taken away from his return. I wonder if the people who complain are the same that complain about Goldberg being in long matches in his first WWF run? I n 96, Hunter was one of a select few that had faced Warrior at the biggest event in the calendar, along with names like Savage and Hogan - not a bad club to be in. If Triple H had lost in that fashion to Duke Drose or Henry Godwinn then it’s career over. The focus was on the Warriors return, not the match. And after, Hunter got in to a scrap with the debuting Mero, so the dust wasn’t settling on him. Don’t think any damage was likely to be done. That is true, I think they did tell a good story of them being equal to each other. They were about the same height and weight, but that Bret had the experience and Shawn had the youth and speed. I really didn't have a big problem with the overtime. I think it helped continue the story that these guys were closely matched. I think the overtime may have been the best way to do the ending with only 1 fall happening. I also agree with your points about HHH/Warrior, the match really was about re-introducing the Warrior to the WWF audience. Hunter wasn't on his level at that time so it wouldn't have helped the Warrior to have a 10-15 minute match with a lower mid-card, it would have lessened Warrior's status that way. Also, I think because HHH became a big time star, people complain about it now. Had Warrior done this to one of the Godwinns or Aldo Montoya, no one would really be complaining because those guys never became main event stars anyway. I also think him yelling at Sable and getting into a brawl with Mero helped alleviate his quick loss. I personally like that match as well as that entire WrestleMania, as a first time watch through I think it’s perfectly fine because you don’t know the results until you watch it…. Where I think the Iron Man match becomes a difficult watch for somebody is when you say, you can sit here for 60 minutes and see no winner, or you can watch the match restart and see a winner in 30 seconds haha. By restarting the match I think it gave you a long version and an abbreviated version of the Iron Man match but I enjoy the art of the match, it’s a great match and an intriguing one as my mind always goes back to, what exactly do they do for 1 hour to fill that time? I’d been watching WWF for 4 years at that point and was a pretty unique match concept - I can’t recall that there had been an iron man match in the promotion before. Especially in the New Generation. I believe this was the first official Iron Man match in WWF history, at least since Vince took over in the 80s. From what I've heard, Vince doesn't like very long matches, he says they bore the audience and don't work well with TV. I think if you go back into the WWF's history, the only really long matches were old WWWF title matches that went an hour because at times those were 2 out of 3 falls but not official Iron Man matches. I always liked the match. But then again, I am a big fan of Bret and Shawn. To me, your not gonna find two many guys who consistently put on great matches PPV after PPV like these guys did. I think the thing that people don't like about the match is that their was only one fall. Usually iron man matches have 3 plus. That usually helps break up the monotony of a long match. I've also heard a lot of people say that they went to the rest holds too much, but I recently watched the Ric Flair/Ricky Steamboat 2 out of 3 falls match that went 55 minutes, and it seemed like they went to the rest holds just as much as Bret and Shawn did. The other thing about this PPV that I don't understand is people really hating the Ultimate Warrior / HHH match. I hear people say it was too short and it hurt Hunter. But, I think it was the best way to bring Warrior back and make him look strong. And, it really didn't hurt HHH that much, if at all (the curtain call probably hurt him more than this match ever could). And why do people get bent out of shape, or act surprised that Warrior no-sold the pedigree? Did they not watch Warrior during his previous runs with the WWF, he, like Hogan, always kicked out of peoples finishes - it kind of was his thing/gimmick. Seems odd. The Warrior stuff is people looking back on something and not experiencing it in its proper time. At that time, Warrior was still regarded as one of the all time great characters in wrestling. We didn’t have many VHS tapes as kids, no internet, the very thought that we can see him again was as intriguing as it gets. I don’t think unless you lived in the internet-less times you can fully understand that a lot of the time, the only way you’d experience something again was to see it new again. You couldn’t just YouTube an old Warrior match, you had to see a new Warrior match. It’s hard to explain. Yes there was VHS tapes but I don’t think all of us as kids had a library of them at our fingertips like we do today. I didn’t even have a VHS player until the mid 90’s. Because of that though, guys like Warrior had almost become mythical in your mind. Wrestling wasn’t anywhere near as popular as it was with guys like Hogan, Savage and Warrior so those guys were held in a legendary regard. Second thing, HHH was nowhere even near Warriors level at that time. Looking back, people think Warrior squashed him, look at what he became. Hunter was a glorified jobber and in no way was built to that point to be able to contest with a current world champion or a former world champion and at that, somebody at the level Warrior had achieved. Whatever it is people feel Warrior should have done for him, I promise you, watching that live, Hunter getting Warrior into the pedigree right off the start achieved whatever that match could have. It presented that momentary doubt that Wow, maybe he doesn’t have it anymore. Like Savage said, Warrior no selling it did nothing to hurt Hunter, Warrior no sold a lot. That spoke to the character he was, not a slight on Hunters character. HHH had a 0% chance of winning that match. Plus, immediately following the match they stuck HHH into a feud with somebody more his speed so it was immediately forgotten. That match came off like John Doe getting into the octagon and challenging Anderson Silva. He got destroyed and went back to his rank. Obviously it didn’t hurt Hunter because he went on to achieve success anyway. Also, WWF was in a war with WCW. It’s not like today where you can afford to build stars so deliberately off the backs of the old stars. Vince needed guys like Warrior at that time to pull in a rating. They didn’t have the luxury of training people how to shoot, they just needed their best shooters and guns up front shooting. That's a good point. I think HHH getting him in his finisher was sort of a small victory of wow, I never thought he could do that kind of moment. Yep, that was part of the Warrior's gimmick, no selling was nothing new. And I agree that putting him with Mero right after the match was the right move. Not my fav iron man(that goes to Rude/Dragon) but I still liked this one. Like others I wasn't thrilled with the OT finish but overall they told a good story in there. I also like the fact how this event was the catalyst for Bret turning heel a year later. True, but that was only a 30-minute match, not a full hour. But it was a great match. I always like Rude and Steamboat, they worked so well together. And I think your right, the fact that Bret only lost once to HBK was a good way for him to come back and say that it was a fluke, really help with his heel turn. My AWA kick continues! Rockers vs Bad Company- AWA on ESPN 3-26-88. Little preview of what they would do in the WWF just a few years later. Still my favorite opening match in Royal Rumble history.
|
|
|
Post by The Brain on Jul 27, 2021 18:47:40 GMT -5
Addressing the whole one fall aspect. To me it fit. The idea being that you couldn’t split them at the time. Also both were difficult to beat. By having 1+ fall apiece, it conveys that both can be beaten if they went the pinball/submission route and it would cheapen the match if you brought in countouts and dq’s. I’m watching WWF 96 just now and in the lead up to the match Bret was saying that he was the mat technician and Shawn was more high flying, Lucia Libre style, implying that Bret’s “superiority” would be the difference maker in the match. Fast forward to the match, they told a fantastic story in that Shawn could hang with the best technician in wrestling at the time (or at least one of the best). A nicely executed, subtle piece of story telling there.My only problem was with the overtime, but I guess how else could you do it? If Shawn couldn’t do it in the hour, it would be unbelievable that he wins the belt in a ten minute raw rematch or at the next PPV (not to mention denying HBK his WM moment). As for Warrior v HHH. I’m thankful it was a short match. If they’d been competitive, Warrior would have to sell and would have taken away from his return. I wonder if the people who complain are the same that complain about Goldberg being in long matches in his first WWF run? I n 96, Hunter was one of a select few that had faced Warrior at the biggest event in the calendar, along with names like Savage and Hogan - not a bad club to be in. If Triple H had lost in that fashion to Duke Drose or Henry Godwinn then it’s career over. The focus was on the Warriors return, not the match. And after, Hunter got in to a scrap with the debuting Mero, so the dust wasn’t settling on him. Don’t think any damage was likely to be done. That is true, I think they did tell a good story of them being equal to each other. They were about the same height and weight, but that Bret had the experience and Shawn had the youth and speed. I really didn't have a big problem with the overtime. I think it helped continue the story that these guys were closely matched. I think the overtime may have been the best way to do the ending with only 1 fall happening. I also agree with your points about HHH/Warrior, the match really was about re-introducing the Warrior to the WWF audience. Hunter wasn't on his level at that time so it wouldn't have helped the Warrior to have a 10-15 minute match with a lower mid-card, it would have lessened Warrior's status that way. Also, I think because HHH became a big time star, people complain about it now. Had Warrior done this to one of the Godwinns or Aldo Montoya, no one would really be complaining because those guys never became main event stars anyway. I also think him yelling at Sable and getting into a brawl with Mero helped alleviate his quick loss. I’d been watching WWF for 4 years at that point and was a pretty unique match concept - I can’t recall that there had been an iron man match in the promotion before. Especially in the New Generation. I believe this was the first official Iron Man match in WWF history, at least since Vince took over in the 80s. From what I've heard, Vince doesn't like very long matches, he says they bore the audience and don't work well with TV. I think if you go back into the WWF's history, the only really long matches were old WWWF title matches that went an hour because at times those were 2 out of 3 falls but not official Iron Man matches. The Warrior stuff is people looking back on something and not experiencing it in its proper time. At that time, Warrior was still regarded as one of the all time great characters in wrestling. We didn’t have many VHS tapes as kids, no internet, the very thought that we can see him again was as intriguing as it gets. I don’t think unless you lived in the internet-less times you can fully understand that a lot of the time, the only way you’d experience something again was to see it new again. You couldn’t just YouTube an old Warrior match, you had to see a new Warrior match. It’s hard to explain. Yes there was VHS tapes but I don’t think all of us as kids had a library of them at our fingertips like we do today. I didn’t even have a VHS player until the mid 90’s. Because of that though, guys like Warrior had almost become mythical in your mind. Wrestling wasn’t anywhere near as popular as it was with guys like Hogan, Savage and Warrior so those guys were held in a legendary regard. Second thing, HHH was nowhere even near Warriors level at that time. Looking back, people think Warrior squashed him, look at what he became. Hunter was a glorified jobber and in no way was built to that point to be able to contest with a current world champion or a former world champion and at that, somebody at the level Warrior had achieved. Whatever it is people feel Warrior should have done for him, I promise you, watching that live, Hunter getting Warrior into the pedigree right off the start achieved whatever that match could have. It presented that momentary doubt that Wow, maybe he doesn’t have it anymore. Like Savage said, Warrior no selling it did nothing to hurt Hunter, Warrior no sold a lot. That spoke to the character he was, not a slight on Hunters character. HHH had a 0% chance of winning that match. Plus, immediately following the match they stuck HHH into a feud with somebody more his speed so it was immediately forgotten. That match came off like John Doe getting into the octagon and challenging Anderson Silva. He got destroyed and went back to his rank. Obviously it didn’t hurt Hunter because he went on to achieve success anyway. Also, WWF was in a war with WCW. It’s not like today where you can afford to build stars so deliberately off the backs of the old stars. Vince needed guys like Warrior at that time to pull in a rating. They didn’t have the luxury of training people how to shoot, they just needed their best shooters and guns up front shooting. That's a good point. I think HHH getting him in his finisher was sort of a small victory of wow, I never thought he could do that kind of moment. Yep, that was part of the Warrior's gimmick, no selling was nothing new. And I agree that putting him with Mero right after the match was the right move. Not my fav iron man(that goes to Rude/Dragon) but I still liked this one. Like others I wasn't thrilled with the OT finish but overall they told a good story in there. I also like the fact how this event was the catalyst for Bret turning heel a year later. True, but that was only a 30-minute match, not a full hour. But it was a great match. I always like Rude and Steamboat, they worked so well together. And I think your right, the fact that Bret only lost once to HBK was a good way for him to come back and say that it was a fluke, really help with his heel turn. My AWA kick continues! Rockers vs Bad Company- AWA on ESPN 3-26-88. Little preview of what they would do in the WWF just a few years later. Still my favorite opening match in Royal Rumble history. I bet on their bodies it felt like a few hours lol
|
|
Ohtimate Wahriah
Main Eventer
WF 10 Year Member
Joined on: Jul 1, 2008 12:35:07 GMT -5
Posts: 2,527
|
Post by Ohtimate Wahriah on Jul 27, 2021 19:09:25 GMT -5
Oh yea, exactly. At that time especially, I remember watching that and thinking WTF is going on? Even the idea of Hunter attacking him during his entrance, nobody ever did that. For a moment there I vividly remember thinking, man, these new guys dont care for all the theatrics and I thought at the very least, victory wasnt going to be as easy as it use to be. All puns intended. It was a new generation.
Gotta remember as well, nobody EVER hit their finish that quickly into a match at that time. That's a big thing now but in 1996, you didnt hit a finisher right out of the gate.
There were a lot of little things Hunter got in that match that I dont think he was straight up buried. Especially on a guy like Warrior who was legendary even then.
|
|
|
Post by MKSavage on Jul 27, 2021 19:19:44 GMT -5
That is true, I think they did tell a good story of them being equal to each other. They were about the same height and weight, but that Bret had the experience and Shawn had the youth and speed. I really didn't have a big problem with the overtime. I think it helped continue the story that these guys were closely matched. I think the overtime may have been the best way to do the ending with only 1 fall happening. I also agree with your points about HHH/Warrior, the match really was about re-introducing the Warrior to the WWF audience. Hunter wasn't on his level at that time so it wouldn't have helped the Warrior to have a 10-15 minute match with a lower mid-card, it would have lessened Warrior's status that way. Also, I think because HHH became a big time star, people complain about it now. Had Warrior done this to one of the Godwinns or Aldo Montoya, no one would really be complaining because those guys never became main event stars anyway. I also think him yelling at Sable and getting into a brawl with Mero helped alleviate his quick loss. I believe this was the first official Iron Man match in WWF history, at least since Vince took over in the 80s. From what I've heard, Vince doesn't like very long matches, he says they bore the audience and don't work well with TV. I think if you go back into the WWF's history, the only really long matches were old WWWF title matches that went an hour because at times those were 2 out of 3 falls but not official Iron Man matches. That's a good point. I think HHH getting him in his finisher was sort of a small victory of wow, I never thought he could do that kind of moment. Yep, that was part of the Warrior's gimmick, no selling was nothing new. And I agree that putting him with Mero right after the match was the right move. True, but that was only a 30-minute match, not a full hour. But it was a great match. I always like Rude and Steamboat, they worked so well together. And I think your right, the fact that Bret only lost once to HBK was a good way for him to come back and say that it was a fluke, really help with his heel turn. Still my favorite opening match in Royal Rumble history. I bet on their bodies it felt like a few hours lol Great match, and great feud. One of the reason I really got into watching WCW in the early 90s.
|
|
|
Post by The Brain on Jul 27, 2021 19:24:53 GMT -5
Absolutely brother. Chemistry out the ass between those 2
|
|
|
Post by MKSavage on Jul 27, 2021 19:25:51 GMT -5
Absolutely brother. Chemistry out the ass between those 2 Is it blasphemous to say I liked Rude vs Steamboat more than Flair vs Steamboat??? Can't tell, is that fair to Flair???
|
|
|
Post by MKSavage on Jul 27, 2021 19:27:29 GMT -5
Oh yea, exactly. At that time especially, I remember watching that and thinking WTF is going on? Even the idea of Hunter attacking him during his entrance, nobody ever did that. For a moment there I vividly remember thinking, man, these new guys dont care for all the theatrics and I thought at the very least, victory wasnt going to be as easy as it use to be. All puns intended. It was a new generation. Gotta remember as well, nobody EVER hit their finish that quickly into a match at that time. That's a big thing now but in 1996, you didnt hit a finisher right out of the gate. There were a lot of little things Hunter got in that match that I dont think he was straight up buried. Especially on a guy like Warrior who was legendary even then. Yep, at that time finishers still meant something. Getting your finisher on that quickly in a match was something that didn't happen a lot.
|
|
|
Post by The Brain on Jul 27, 2021 19:30:17 GMT -5
Absolutely brother. Chemistry out the ass between those 2 Is it blasphemous to say I liked Rude vs Steamboat more than Flair vs Steamboat??? Can't tell, is that fair to Flair??? You know normally I would say that isnt fair to Flair but this does involve Rude who is also in my top 5 of all time so you get a pass here.
|
|
|
Post by MKSavage on Jul 27, 2021 19:36:54 GMT -5
Is it blasphemous to say I liked Rude vs Steamboat more than Flair vs Steamboat??? Can't tell, is that fair to Flair??? You know normally I would say that isnt fair to Flair but this does involve Rude who is also in my top 5 of all time so you get a pass here.
|
|
Ohtimate Wahriah
Main Eventer
WF 10 Year Member
Joined on: Jul 1, 2008 12:35:07 GMT -5
Posts: 2,527
|
Post by Ohtimate Wahriah on Jul 28, 2021 2:45:07 GMT -5
Shawn Michaels vs Marty Jannetty (RAW 7/1/1996)
I haven't seen this match or at least I don't remember it if I did. A great little match, I love Michaels vs Jannetty, they always play up the former tag partner angle, I feel like no matter where each is in their career, they’re is a respect for each other demonstrated in these matches.
I always find myself rooting for Jannetty when the Rockers square off, knowing Michaels was the one that broke up the team, i always find Jannetty to be a ghost of Michaels past that gave him a little bit of a cool edge. Like, yea Michaels went on to be champion and he’s a baby face again, but here’s the guy he had to betray to get there and then there’s Jannetty who is still doing the Rockers gimmick, very visual as to what Michaels left behind…but at what cost?
Good stuff
|
|
nibs92
Main Eventer
Joined on: May 29, 2008 5:47:21 GMT -5
Posts: 2,240
|
Post by nibs92 on Jul 28, 2021 3:29:15 GMT -5
Just finished King of the Ring 96. I think this may be the first time I’ve seen it.
Didn’t realise the final was so short. It’s crazy to think the month previous, Austin had lost to Savio Vega at IYH. It’s like one of those sliding doors situations, if the curtain call hadn’t happened, Triple H would have been crowned and who knows how that would have played out.
Good to see Pullman come in, the next part will be awesome!
And decent main event. I’m kinda glad my fellow Brit never got to win the big one but he’s had some excellent main events as challenger.
|
|
nibs92
Main Eventer
Joined on: May 29, 2008 5:47:21 GMT -5
Posts: 2,240
|
Post by nibs92 on Jul 28, 2021 4:41:49 GMT -5
Shawn Michaels vs Marty Jannetty (RAW 7/1/1996)I haven't seen this match or at least I don't remember it if I did. A great little match, I love Michaels vs Jannetty, they always play up the former tag partner angle, I feel like no matter where each is in their career, they’re is a respect for each other demonstrated in these matches. I always find myself rooting for Jannetty when the Rockers square off, knowing Michaels was the one that broke up the team, i always find Jannetty to be a ghost of Michaels past that gave him a little bit of a cool edge. Like, yea Michaels went on to be champion and he’s a baby face again, but here’s the guy he had to betray to get there and then there’s Jannetty who is still doing the Rockers gimmick, very visual as to what Michaels left behind…but at what cost? Good stuff Just watched this one! An excellent match. Some good near falls. For all that’s been reported about Shawn self serving ways, he really does make his opponents look a million bucks.
|
|
Ohtimate Wahriah
Main Eventer
WF 10 Year Member
Joined on: Jul 1, 2008 12:35:07 GMT -5
Posts: 2,527
|
Post by Ohtimate Wahriah on Jul 28, 2021 7:22:45 GMT -5
Shawn Michaels vs Marty Jannetty (RAW 7/1/1996)I haven't seen this match or at least I don't remember it if I did. A great little match, I love Michaels vs Jannetty, they always play up the former tag partner angle, I feel like no matter where each is in their career, they’re is a respect for each other demonstrated in these matches. I always find myself rooting for Jannetty when the Rockers square off, knowing Michaels was the one that broke up the team, i always find Jannetty to be a ghost of Michaels past that gave him a little bit of a cool edge. Like, yea Michaels went on to be champion and he’s a baby face again, but here’s the guy he had to betray to get there and then there’s Jannetty who is still doing the Rockers gimmick, very visual as to what Michaels left behind…but at what cost? Good stuff Just watched this one! An excellent match. Some good near falls. For all that’s been reported about Shawn self serving ways, he really does make his opponents look a million bucks. Oh yea, and there’s a reason so many people that knock him are quick to turn around and compliment him in the ring. He’s certainly was that good, it’s clear there was a genuine dislike for this man and had it been anybody else in the ring, I think people would have happily disregarded his in ring talent in return for disdain for the human being. IDK, drugs must be wild because you can look at Shawns demeanor in different matches and just see 2 different people, and it doesn’t always go by who he’s wrestling. Watch Summerslam ‘95 against Razor or Summerslam ‘96 against Vader (maybe he just hates Summerslam) but you can see a visible irritation to him where as in matches like the one with Marty, you can tell he’s relaxed and more like the Shawn of today. It’s 2 different people. Just finished King of the Ring 96. I think this may be the first time I’ve seen it. Didn’t realise the final was so short. It’s crazy to think the month previous, Austin had lost to Savio Vega at IYH. It’s like one of those sliding doors situations, if the curtain call hadn’t happened, Triple H would have been crowned and who knows how that would have played out. Good to see Pullman come in, the next part will be awesome! And decent main event. I’m kinda glad my fellow Brit never got to win the big one but he’s had some excellent main events as challenger. I love the final to this KOTR because it felt like a true tournament. It came off like Jake just didn’t have the ability to withstand anything else, he was on E and Austin wasn’t and it was an easy win. I don’t believe wrestling as a whole understand the importance of events like this. I think they’d say the short match was a ripoff because you never got to see the 2 guys truly go at it for the crown. But that’s the fun of it, it’s a 1 night tournament and Stone Cold endured all the way through. It created variables to the outcomes, it’s not always just another match. Stuff like that was great for wrestling. And the Stone Cold stuff, man, if you roll the dice 100 times, I think you get that outcome once. It’s like the Doctor Strange scene in Infinity War haha. If Jake isn’t an alcoholic, cleans himself up, returns to the WWF and uses bible verses in his promos, and Nash & Hall never leave for WCW, creating the curtain call in MSG, costing Hunter the KOTR crown. If Steve never goes to the hospital and gets stitches from the match with Marc Mero, maybe they have a prepared promo for him to rehearse, rather than an off the cuff version that he did…I mean, man. 99 times out of 100 the pieces do not land where they do at the end of this night. Without this series of events, Austin never cuts the 3:16 promo because he probably never would have faced Jake in a high profile situation, therefore maybe WWF a never turns the corner on WCW without Stone Cold being massively over…It’s an amazing culmination of events. There’s an alternate universe where HHH wins the ‘96 KOTR and everybody goes to work for WCW shortly after haha. I love the little interaction between Pillman & Austin on the way down to the ring. I miss when wrestling was one big landscape and they acknowledge the history of the wrestlers even in other promotions.
|
|
nibs92
Main Eventer
Joined on: May 29, 2008 5:47:21 GMT -5
Posts: 2,240
|
Post by nibs92 on Jul 29, 2021 8:32:06 GMT -5
Just finished In Your House: Mind Games.
Shawn Michaels vs Mankind. Oh my…..
|
|
|
Post by rkfastmo on Aug 1, 2021 1:03:59 GMT -5
Watching Over the Edge 99. Yes, that one.
I've never disagreed with JR more, the show 1000% didn't have to go on. And they couldn't even cut out meaningless kayfabe crap of transporting Vince in the back of an ambulance?!
|
|
Ohtimate Wahriah
Main Eventer
WF 10 Year Member
Joined on: Jul 1, 2008 12:35:07 GMT -5
Posts: 2,527
|
Post by Ohtimate Wahriah on Aug 2, 2021 15:32:09 GMT -5
Watching Over the Edge 99. Yes, that one. I've never disagreed with JR more, the show 1000% didn't have to go on. And they couldn't even cut out meaningless kayfabe crap of transporting Vince in the back of an ambulance?! There’s 2 perspectives I try to look at that night from. 1st) Had they known the day before, Owen Hart will die during the PPV, and then decided, ok we knew what would happen and still said, we need to continue the show. That to me is far worse, This is how I think a lot of people see this PPV from the perspective from. We know Owen dies, and yet they still had the show go on. Had they known that going in, and still said, meh…show must go on, to me that’s discounting life and FAR worse. The 2nd) Everything happening in real time. Nobody knew Owen would die that night, I question how long it was until they even knew he was dead. I think in that moment, they were on cruise control and the show was kinda, just still going on autopilot. I really don’t think they continued the show consciously to insult Owen or the fans. At THAT TIME, I can honestly see the fans booing the cancelation of the show due to Owens death, wrestling fans were SAVAGE in the 90’s. But anyway, I can put myself in their shoes to an extent and see how all of this unexpectedly playing out in real time just didn’t allow for them to handle it correctly. They would have had to refund everyone for PPV buys as well as the folks in attendance. IDK, it was a rough situation and I think it was a lot harder of a decision than just, ok stop the show. Honestly, by the time they discussed all the pros and cons, the show would probably be over. As long as everybody was willing to still go out and perform, I think the best thing to do that night was just proceed as normal and handle it going forward, instead of going from 1 problem to 6, which they would have had had they canceled. Morally, it looks messed up but with all the crap WWF was about to face for that night I highly doubt it was a priority of theirs to deal with any more haha.
|
|
nibs92
Main Eventer
Joined on: May 29, 2008 5:47:21 GMT -5
Posts: 2,240
|
Post by nibs92 on Aug 2, 2021 16:59:32 GMT -5
Watching Over the Edge 99. Yes, that one. I've never disagreed with JR more, the show 1000% didn't have to go on. And they couldn't even cut out meaningless kayfabe crap of transporting Vince in the back of an ambulance?! There’s 2 perspectives I try to look at that night from. 1st) Had they known the day before, Owen Hart will die during the PPV, and then decided, ok we knew what would happen and still said, we need to continue the show. That to me is far worse, This is how I think a lot of people see this PPV from the perspective from. We know Owen dies, and yet they still had the show go on. Had they known that going in, and still said, meh…show must go on, to me that’s discounting life and FAR worse. The 2nd) Everything happening in real time. Nobody knew Owen would die that night, I question how long it was until they even knew he was dead. I think in that moment, they were on cruise control and the show was kinda, just still going on autopilot. I really don’t think they continued the show consciously to insult Owen or the fans. At THAT TIME, I can honestly see the fans booing the cancelation of the show due to Owens death, wrestling fans were SAVAGE in the 90’s. But anyway, I can put myself in their shoes to an extent and see how all of this unexpectedly playing out in real time just didn’t allow for them to handle it correctly. They would have had to refund everyone for PPV buys as well as the folks in attendance. IDK, it was a rough situation and I think it was a lot harder of a decision than just, ok stop the show. Honestly, by the time they discussed all the pros and cons, the show would probably be over. As long as everybody was willing to still go out and perform, I think the best thing to do that night was just proceed as normal and handle it going forward, instead of going from 1 problem to 6, which they would have had had they canceled. Morally, it looks messed up but with all the crap WWF was about to face for that night I highly doubt it was a priority of theirs to deal with any more haha. I remember reading an interview with Harley Race that put a different perspective on it. Basically, what he said was that for the WWF to cancel a PPV, it would need to be something serious. And by doing that would convey the message that Owen was dead. At that point, his next of kin, family and friends hadn’t been notified. I agree with that to an extent, but the fact that they announced it on air later in the show, should have been the end of it. I think when it initially happened the WWF were in a bind. Why would they stop the show for a bad “injury” to Owen, but not for when, say, Austin broke his neck, or other serious injuries. A difficult call to make, And I can only imagine what it must have been like for those that had to perform after the event. However the “Owen would have wanted it” line is pretty damn poor.
|
|