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Post by slappy on Feb 3, 2013 0:18:30 GMT -5
1. There are quite a few developing countries in all of those places who are developing under capitalism. 2. Umm, two of those things happen under every single government. And capitalist countries don't routinely murder protests which is unlike communist goverments who systematically murder protesters and imprison those they don't kill. 3. Those numbers were actually from 2008. So they're not terribly out of date. Censhorship in Cuba is very well known and very well documented - en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_in_Cuba. Strangely enough the worst enemy of a communist state seems to be a free press. Care to comment on that? Once again I'll point out that if we were in Cuba or Lenin's Russia we wouldn't even be allowed to discuss this. The things I've said so far just in this thread would be enough to get me a decade of jail time, time in a prison camp or even a firing squad. Just for things I SAID, not for anything I DID. 1. Who? I dont see a single successful capitalist regime in those areas. 2. Oh yes they do, Capitalist regimes always make sure they silence the proletariat before they rise up and overthrow the bourgeoisie. 3. Cuba has the lightest censorship laws. You can say something terrible about Fidel Castro, hell even threaten him, and you can get off scratch free. But here in America, you threaten the president you get a visit from the Secret Service and its possible to be blacklisted from many things. And in 2008, Capitalist regimes worldwide opened up relations with Cuba finally, so they were now able to get those technologies. Well you wouldn't be able to, because you are promoting that it is alright to be racist, homophobic, sexist, greedy, and deceitful. See Cuba does things to prevent these evil attitudes from happening in their society. Jail? No. Prison Camp? No (Also, Prison Camps are the Jails) Firing Squad? No, what type of peaceful harmonious loving society would chose that as a punishment? Cuba doesnt even have the death penalty! But the loving US DOES! You would be fine in Cuba. Trust me, You have been fed bullcrap about Cuba and Fidel Castro ALL of your life just because the United States is pissed off at them for nationalizing all US property in Cuba and the capitalist swine in the US lost all of their potential profit in the area and they decide, LETS LIE ABOUT CUBA! You can say the nastiest things about Fidel and he would come to you and hug you for it. VIVA FIDEL! Cuba doesn't have gay marriage. According to the World Policy Institute in 2003, the Cuban government prohibited LGBT organizations and publications, gay pride marches, and gay clubs. All officially sanctioned clubs and meeting places were required to be heterosexual. The only gay and lesbian civil rights organization, the Cuban Association of Gays and Lesbians, was formed in 1994 but was effectively shut down and its members arrested in 1997. Private gay parties, named for their price of admission, "10 Pesos", exist but are often raided. That damn capitalist World Policy Institute spreading lies about Cuba. I know that Castro said in 1961 that racism was no longer a problem in Cuba. I trust him. No reason why a dictator would lie. Also thought this was interesting. "Black Cubans such as Biscet and Jorge Luis Garcia Perez have been allegedly forcefully separated from their families for criticizing Fidel Castro" Cost of different products in CubaThe average wage in Cuba is nearly $30 American a month. You can work a whole month and still not be able to afford a pair of jeans which costs $50 American. I think I'll move there.
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Post by slappy on Feb 3, 2013 0:19:27 GMT -5
"In 1972, Juche replaced Marxism-Leninism in the revised North Korean constitution as the official state ideology." So, you're wrong. It was at one point Marxist-Leninist. "all reference to Marxism-Leninism was dropped in the revised 1998 constitution." So the earliest that they got rid of Communism was 1998 but they didn't drop all references to Communism until 2009. Just like Stalin, they used the ruse of communism to fool the working class into submission. They are another counter revolutionary. Ah yes, the old "It wasn't true Communism" excuse. You might as well have Che in your sig. Both men are murderers.
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Post by alwayssunny on Feb 3, 2013 1:06:30 GMT -5
1. Who? I dont see a single successful capitalist regime in those areas. 2. Oh yes they do, Capitalist regimes always make sure they silence the proletariat before they rise up and overthrow the bourgeoisie. 3. Cuba has the lightest censorship laws. You can say something terrible about Fidel Castro, hell even threaten him, and you can get off scratch free. But here in America, you threaten the president you get a visit from the Secret Service and its possible to be blacklisted from many things. And in 2008, Capitalist regimes worldwide opened up relations with Cuba finally, so they were now able to get those technologies. Well you wouldn't be able to, because you are promoting that it is alright to be racist, homophobic, sexist, greedy, and deceitful. See Cuba does things to prevent these evil attitudes from happening in their society. Jail? No. Prison Camp? No (Also, Prison Camps are the Jails) Firing Squad? No, what type of peaceful harmonious loving society would chose that as a punishment? Cuba doesnt even have the death penalty! But the loving US DOES! You would be fine in Cuba. Trust me, You have been fed bullcrap about Cuba and Fidel Castro ALL of your life just because the United States is pissed off at them for nationalizing all US property in Cuba and the capitalist swine in the US lost all of their potential profit in the area and they decide, LETS LIE ABOUT CUBA! You can say the nastiest things about Fidel and he would come to you and hug you for it. VIVA FIDEL! Cuba doesn't have gay marriage. According to the World Policy Institute in 2003, the Cuban government prohibited LGBT organizations and publications, gay pride marches, and gay clubs. All officially sanctioned clubs and meeting places were required to be heterosexual. The only gay and lesbian civil rights organization, the Cuban Association of Gays and Lesbians, was formed in 1994 but was effectively shut down and its members arrested in 1997. Private gay parties, named for their price of admission, "10 Pesos", exist but are often raided. That damn capitalist World Policy Institute spreading lies about Cuba. I know that Castro said in 1961 that racism was no longer a problem in Cuba. I trust him. No reason why a dictator would lie. Also thought this was interesting. "Black Cubans such as Biscet and Jorge Luis Garcia Perez have been allegedly forcefully separated from their families for criticizing Fidel Castro" Cost of different products in CubaThe average wage in Cuba is nearly $30 American a month. You can work a whole month and still not be able to afford a pair of jeans which costs $50 American. I think I'll move there. 1. Neither do we 2. LIES LIES LIES: 3. No they haven't, they have only been jailed for counterrevolutionary work. 4. I can tell you straight off the bat that the website is false, Apartments and homes cannot be bought since private property is abolished. Also products are relatively cheap in Cuba: 5. Cheaper products=Less money needed. A Jeans are essential because they are clothes so they would be sold for a 50 cents atleast in Cuba. Man, Don't you just love lying about Cuba? Oh thats right, the main basis of libertarianism is LYING.
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Post by alwayssunny on Feb 3, 2013 1:09:50 GMT -5
Just like Stalin, they used the ruse of communism to fool the working class into submission. They are another counter revolutionary. Ah yes, the old "It wasn't true Communism" excuse. You might as well have Che in your sig. Both men are murderers. Che Guevara is one of the greatest human rights activists known to mankind! He fought for the peasants, workers, and the voiceless. I truly am sorry that you think that way about Che. You obviously have been brought up in a sheltered family that was able to afford everything.
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Post by slappy on Feb 3, 2013 1:15:39 GMT -5
I'm done with you. You've excused murder for too long. Endorsing Che was the straw that broke the camel's back. Che is a murdering piece of shit. He is not to be idolized.
You should get some better sources than "Maoist Rebel News". You don't like when Hulk or I link you to "capitalism apologist" websites so why do you think we'd take Maoist Rebel News at face value? It's obviously propaganda.
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Post by alwayssunny on Feb 3, 2013 1:20:23 GMT -5
I'm done with you. You've excused murder for too long. Endorsing Che was the straw that broke the camel's back. Che is a murdering piece of crap. He is not to be idolized. You should get some better sources than "Maoist Rebel News". You don't like when Hulk or I link you to "capitalism apologist" websites so why do you think we'd take Maoist Rebel News at face value? It's obviously propaganda. Che Guevara is a loving human being! I could sit here typing for hours listing all of the great things Che Guevara did! How can you hate this dashing man? And You should get some better sources then biased capitalist media. So I'm just combating you. Propaganda? No, just educating with Marxist intentions.
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Post by Hulkamaniac on Feb 3, 2013 9:22:37 GMT -5
1. There are quite a few developing countries in all of those places who are developing under capitalism. 2. Umm, two of those things happen under every single government. And capitalist countries don't routinely murder protests which is unlike communist goverments who systematically murder protesters and imprison those they don't kill. 3. Those numbers were actually from 2008. So they're not terribly out of date. Censhorship in Cuba is very well known and very well documented - en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_in_Cuba. Strangely enough the worst enemy of a communist state seems to be a free press. Care to comment on that? Once again I'll point out that if we were in Cuba or Lenin's Russia we wouldn't even be allowed to discuss this. The things I've said so far just in this thread would be enough to get me a decade of jail time, time in a prison camp or even a firing squad. Just for things I SAID, not for anything I DID. 1. Who? I dont see a single successful capitalist regime in those areas. 2. Oh yes they do, Capitalist regimes always make sure they silence the proletariat before they rise up and overthrow the bourgeoisie. 3. Cuba has the lightest censorship laws. You can say something terrible about Fidel Castro, hell even threaten him, and you can get off scratch free. But here in America, you threaten the president you get a visit from the Secret Service and its possible to be blacklisted from many things. And in 2008, Capitalist regimes worldwide opened up relations with Cuba finally, so they were now able to get those technologies. Well you wouldn't be able to, because you are promoting that it is alright to be racist, homophobic, sexist, greedy, and deceitful. See Cuba does things to prevent these evil attitudes from happening in their society. Jail? No. Prison Camp? No (Also, Prison Camps are the Jails) Firing Squad? No, what type of peaceful harmonious loving society would chose that as a punishment? Cuba doesnt even have the death penalty! But the loving US DOES! You would be fine in Cuba. Trust me, You have been fed bullcrap about Cuba and Fidel Castro ALL of your life just because the United States is pissed off at them for nationalizing all US property in Cuba and the capitalist swine in the US lost all of their potential profit in the area and they decide, LETS LIE ABOUT CUBA! You can say the nastiest things about Fidel and he would come to you and hug you for it. VIVA FIDEL! 1. Wikipedia has a nice list of countries that are considered developing countries by the IMF. Pretty much all of them have democratic governments. - en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Developing_countries. 2. The US is, by far, the most successful capitalist country and certainly the one we are all most familiar with. Please cite and example where the US has systematically rounded up and executed and/or imprisoned people for protesting. We've already cited numerous of examples of your great heroes Lenin and Castro doing that as matter of routine. 3. Wow. No idea where you're getting your information, but none of it is accurate. Did you know that in Cuba almost no one has Internet access? Did you know that in order to get Internet access you have to get a permit from the state and they monitor where you go and read all your emails? This is from Reporters without Borders. Their law allows special tribunals to be convened behind closed doors to try those accused of political crimes. Here in the US there's no such thing as a political crime. They have an entire government agency (the Interior Ministry) who's job is to monitor people for signs of dissent. You are simply NOT allowed to disagree with the government. You are not allowed to be promoted at work unless your political fidelity can be proven. That sounds like freedom to me. Cuba was 2nd in imprisoned journalists in 2008. That number dropped significantly because since then they've taken to exiling journalists instead. Cubans are not allowed to watch or listen to non-state sponsored broadcasts. They also are not allowed to read books/newspapers that are not approved by the state. How is this freedom? The things that Slappy and I have said in this thread about the US government being corrupt and jacked up would get us imprisoned or exiled in Cuba. How is that a good thing? In Cuba I would be put in jail for advocating things that are "racist, homophobic, sexist, greedy, and deceitful" (your words, not mine). How is that a crime to simply say those things? How is that a crime? Freedom of Speech is an internationally recognized human right according to the UN. No one in a communist country has Freedom of Speech nor have they ever had Freedom of Speech.
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Post by alwayssunny on Feb 3, 2013 15:53:47 GMT -5
1. Who? I dont see a single successful capitalist regime in those areas. 2. Oh yes they do, Capitalist regimes always make sure they silence the proletariat before they rise up and overthrow the bourgeoisie. 3. Cuba has the lightest censorship laws. You can say something terrible about Fidel Castro, hell even threaten him, and you can get off scratch free. But here in America, you threaten the president you get a visit from the Secret Service and its possible to be blacklisted from many things. And in 2008, Capitalist regimes worldwide opened up relations with Cuba finally, so they were now able to get those technologies. Well you wouldn't be able to, because you are promoting that it is alright to be racist, homophobic, sexist, greedy, and deceitful. See Cuba does things to prevent these evil attitudes from happening in their society. Jail? No. Prison Camp? No (Also, Prison Camps are the Jails) Firing Squad? No, what type of peaceful harmonious loving society would chose that as a punishment? Cuba doesnt even have the death penalty! But the loving US DOES! You would be fine in Cuba. Trust me, You have been fed bullcrap about Cuba and Fidel Castro ALL of your life just because the United States is pissed off at them for nationalizing all US property in Cuba and the capitalist swine in the US lost all of their potential profit in the area and they decide, LETS LIE ABOUT CUBA! You can say the nastiest things about Fidel and he would come to you and hug you for it. VIVA FIDEL! 1. Wikipedia has a nice list of countries that are considered developing countries by the IMF. Pretty much all of them have democratic governments. - en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Developing_countries. 2. The US is, by far, the most successful capitalist country and certainly the one we are all most familiar with. Please cite and example where the US has systematically rounded up and executed and/or imprisoned people for protesting. We've already cited numerous of examples of your great heroes Lenin and Castro doing that as matter of routine. 3. Wow. No idea where you're getting your information, but none of it is accurate. Did you know that in Cuba almost no one has Internet access? Did you know that in order to get Internet access you have to get a permit from the state and they monitor where you go and read all your emails? This is from Reporters without Borders. Their law allows special tribunals to be convened behind closed doors to try those accused of political crimes. Here in the US there's no such thing as a political crime. They have an entire government agency (the Interior Ministry) who's job is to monitor people for signs of dissent. You are simply NOT allowed to disagree with the government. You are not allowed to be promoted at work unless your political fidelity can be proven. That sounds like freedom to me. Cuba was 2nd in imprisoned journalists in 2008. That number dropped significantly because since then they've taken to exiling journalists instead. Cubans are not allowed to watch or listen to non-state sponsored broadcasts. They also are not allowed to read books/newspapers that are not approved by the state. How is this freedom? The things that Slappy and I have said in this thread about the US government being corrupt and jacked up would get us imprisoned or exiled in Cuba. How is that a good thing? In Cuba I would be put in jail for advocating things that are "racist, homophobic, sexist, greedy, and deceitful" (your words, not mine). How is that a crime to simply say those things? How is that a crime? Freedom of Speech is an internationally recognized human right according to the UN. No one in a communist country has Freedom of Speech nor have they ever had Freedom of Speech. 1. Im pretty sure that all of those antions in africa arent developing, Have you seen them? With imperialist powers stationed there they take all of the resources from those nations and use them for their own need. Except Libya, they were the last standing successful country in Africa until NATO sent faux-revolutionaries to Libya to remove Gaddafi before he forced those imperialist powers out of Africa with the African Monetary Fund 2. Successful? Eh. Anti World War 1 protesters where imprisoned, Anti Vietnam War protesters where shot at, Workers unions where shot at during the late 19th and early 20th Century, Japanese, German, and Italians during World War 2 where sent to concentration like camps. Occupy Wall Street Protesters are being round up as we speak! Google all of this and you will see. 3. I am getting my information from various sources including United Nations reports, and they are highly accurate. And? Most Americans DONT HAVE HEALTH CARE! YEAH CAPITALISM! Internet is not needed. But many dissents have internet and its proven as two had an arguement like this one we are having on a social network. And America has the same thing, NDAA. Reporters without Borders are known liars, most reports come back as very biased. We have the same thing, its called the FBI, Department of Homeland Security, and the CIA which monitor us EVERY day. And thats a lie, you dont have to prove your political fidelity to be promoted, you just have to be a good worker or in need of extra cash. You have proven that you have been fed lies about the Cuban government, so just stop before you infect someone else with your lies. 4. No it wouldnt, you would be safe because the government would protect you from the masses. And if you are promoting those things then you should be thrown in jail for hate crimes. If your freedom of speech is infringing on anothers rights then it isnt freedom of speech.
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Post by BCizzle on Feb 3, 2013 16:11:43 GMT -5
Wow, this thread is just all around awful.
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Post by Suckasays on Feb 3, 2013 17:11:03 GMT -5
Wow, this thread is just all around awful. It's kind of hilarious in a sense watching everyone go back and forth and getting nowhere.
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Post by Hulkamaniac on Feb 3, 2013 17:30:54 GMT -5
I'm done with this thread. Clearly I am not going to convince anyone who thinks being greedy is a "hate crime" deserving of imprisonment. Your view of the world is so twisted and perverted it's mindblowing. The entire world has condemned and sanctioned Cuba for it's oppression of freedom of speech. Yet you claim that my saying the Cuban government is corrupt would be protected speech there. Your viewpoint is mindblowing at the least. Furthermore you support the oppression of freedom and you've made that point very clear. Freedom of Speech is the enemy of communism so imprisoning people for critiquing the government is acceptable. You don't respond to any criticisms of any communist regimes. You just say the people who make those accusations are liars. You claim that communism has never killed anyone even though there are mass graves around the world that say otherwise, but it's a great big conspiracy I suppose. There's a black market for Internet access in Cuba and dissidents who access the Internet in Cuba are breaking the law. I know. That's a lie. You deny facts, you deny history and you think basic human rights aren't needed and you excuse the executions of hundreds of thousands of people because criticizing the government is deserving of death. I can't even conceive of where you're coming from.
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