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Post by Hulkamaniac on Sept 7, 2013 19:50:10 GMT -5
But I'm talking about the benefits/risks of vaccinations. You think they are bad so I want the science behind it. Again, it doesn't matter why I think they're good or bad, that's my personal opinion. The topic is about forced vaccinations, not if they are good or bad. My opinion on whether I think they're good or bad is irrelevant, what matters is that I think they should be a choice not forced. End of discussion. So, if I want to expose my kid to a serious health risk that's my right? And if I want to expose the general public to a serious health risk that's my right too?
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Post by Lord Ragnarok on Sept 7, 2013 19:50:39 GMT -5
They work for me just fine. Haven't gotten sick in years and when I do get the occasional cold I take zinc and echinacea with golden seal root and it greatly reduces the length and severity of the cold. Vitamin C is also a very good way to boost your immune system. And if you're not into herbal supplements, there's tons of fruits and vegetables that greatly boost your immune system, provide antioxidants and eliminate free radicals. Except there is no science behind your claims. Anecdotal evidence is not science. Are you serious? There's tons and tons of evidence that fruits and vegetables are great for your health.
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Post by Lord Ragnarok on Sept 7, 2013 19:52:10 GMT -5
When you put it like that, no, so I will retract my statement. But the bottom line is vaccinations should be a choice not mandatory. I don't care what you or Dr. Hulk says. Forcing people to get vaccinated is a major infringement on freedom. That's all I have to say about the issue, it's not interesting enough for me to continue this discussion. So, infringing on freedom even if it protects the health of the public is bad? The government infringes on freedom all the time and with very good reasons. I'm not allowed to drive 75 mph down the city street. There's a legit reason. The streets aren't designed for it and there's a very high chance that I'd kill/injure myself or someone else. There are perfectly legitimate reasons to infringe on people's personal freedoms. Setting a speed limit is not an infringement on freedom. What a stupid comparison.
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Post by slappy on Sept 7, 2013 19:53:38 GMT -5
Except there is no science behind your claims. Anecdotal evidence is not science. Are you serious? There's tons and tons of evidence that fruits and vegetables are great for your health. Maybe I should have left that part out. I'm talking about all those vitamins you take. There is no scientific proof behind them helping you. Vitamin C doesn't help with colds or cancer like the guy peddling the myth claims. For someone who is gung ho on science, you seem to ignore it when it doesn't fit your beliefs.
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Post by Hulkamaniac on Sept 7, 2013 19:57:21 GMT -5
Let's say for the sake of argument that Vitamin C does help with colds (it doesn't). What if there was a vaccine that would prevent you from getting a cold at all. Isn't that a better deal?
And yes, a speed limit does infringe on my freedom.
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Post by Lord Ragnarok on Sept 7, 2013 19:57:30 GMT -5
Again, it doesn't matter why I think they're good or bad, that's my personal opinion. The topic is about forced vaccinations, not if they are good or bad. My opinion on whether I think they're good or bad is irrelevant, what matters is that I think they should be a choice not forced. End of discussion. So, if I want to expose my kid to a serious health risk that's my right? And if I want to expose the general public to a serious health risk that's my right too? You made the thread and asked the question of whether or not vaccines should be forced or not. I do not think they should be mandatory. If you didn't like my answer you shouldn't have asked the question Besides, it's really hard to take you seriously when you called me closed minded because I don't believe in a book about talking snakes, talking bushes, people living hundreds of years, bringing the dead back to life, cockatrices, unicorns, giants, parting an entire sea and all that other nonsense. You have like zero credibility once you said that.
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Post by Hulkamaniac on Sept 7, 2013 19:58:41 GMT -5
So, if I want to expose my kid to a serious health risk that's my right? And if I want to expose the general public to a serious health risk that's my right too? You made the thread and asked the question of whether or not vaccines should be forced or not. I do not think they should be mandatory. If you didn't like my answer you shouldn't have asked the question Besides, it's really hard to take you seriously when you called me closed minded because I don't believe in a book about talking snakes, talking bushes, people living hundreds of years, bringing the dead back to life, cockatrices, unicorns, giants, parting an entire sea and all that other nonsense. You have like zero credibility once you said that. What gives you the right to expose the public to a health risk? That's an honest question. What gives YOU the right to put MY health at risk?
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Post by Lord Ragnarok on Sept 7, 2013 19:59:25 GMT -5
Let's say for the sake of argument that Vitamin C does help with colds (it doesn't). What if there was a vaccine that would prevent you from getting a cold at all. Isn't that a better deal? And yes, a speed limit does infringe on my freedom. No it doesn't. And no, a vaccination for colds is not a better deal, I'd rather eat foods that are rich in zinc and vitamin C.
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Post by Lord Ragnarok on Sept 7, 2013 20:00:02 GMT -5
You made the thread and asked the question of whether or not vaccines should be forced or not. I do not think they should be mandatory. If you didn't like my answer you shouldn't have asked the question Besides, it's really hard to take you seriously when you called me closed minded because I don't believe in a book about talking snakes, talking bushes, people living hundreds of years, bringing the dead back to life, cockatrices, unicorns, giants, parting an entire sea and all that other nonsense. You have like zero credibility once you said that. What gives you the right to expose the public to a health risk? That's an honest question. What gives YOU the right to put MY health at risk? What gives YOU the right to force ME to get a vaccination I don't want.
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Post by slappy on Sept 7, 2013 20:01:13 GMT -5
Let's say for the sake of argument that Vitamin C does help with colds (it doesn't). What if there was a vaccine that would prevent you from getting a cold at all. Isn't that a better deal? And yes, a speed limit does infringe on my freedom. No it doesn't. And no, a vaccination for colds is not a better deal, I'd rather eat foods that are rich in zinc and vitamin C. Vitamin C is bullshit. It does not help with colds in any way.
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Post by Hulkamaniac on Sept 7, 2013 20:01:52 GMT -5
What gives you the right to expose the public to a health risk? That's an honest question. What gives YOU the right to put MY health at risk? What gives YOU the right to force ME to get a vaccination I don't want. Said vaccine makes both of us healthier. Greatest good, greatest number. Pure utilitarianism. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. It's a basic social theory.
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Post by Lord Ragnarok on Sept 7, 2013 20:01:53 GMT -5
Are you serious? There's tons and tons of evidence that fruits and vegetables are great for your health. Maybe I should have left that part out. I'm talking about all those vitamins you take. There is no scientific proof behind them helping you. Vitamin C doesn't help with colds or cancer like the guy peddling the myth claims. For someone who is gung ho on science, you seem to ignore it when it doesn't fit your beliefs. Oh god, just forget the ing supplements already. They help me, I don't know what else to tell you. Again, if you don't believe in supplements just eat the right fruits and vegetables.
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Post by slappy on Sept 7, 2013 20:02:58 GMT -5
Maybe I should have left that part out. I'm talking about all those vitamins you take. There is no scientific proof behind them helping you. Vitamin C doesn't help with colds or cancer like the guy peddling the myth claims. For someone who is gung ho on science, you seem to ignore it when it doesn't fit your beliefs. Oh god, just forget the ing supplements already. They help me, I don't know what else to tell you. Again, if you don't believe in supplements just eat the right fruits and vegetables. Eating the right food isn't going to prevent you from getting deadly diseases.
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Post by Lord Ragnarok on Sept 7, 2013 20:03:11 GMT -5
What gives YOU the right to force ME to get a vaccination I don't want. Said vaccine makes both of us healthier. Greatest good, greatest number. Pure utilitarianism. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. It's a basic social theory. So you pretty much just made this thread to start an argument with members that don't agree with forced vaccinations.
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Y2J13
Mid-Carder
Joined on: Jul 3, 2013 17:02:19 GMT -5
Posts: 248
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Post by Y2J13 on Sept 7, 2013 20:06:53 GMT -5
RAGNAROK, so if I hear you correctly:
- Eating healthily will stop you from getting any and all diseases - You're willing to endanger other people's life because you don't want a couple of injections, which also benefit you
Congratulations on having the most ridiculous argument this year.
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Post by slappy on Sept 7, 2013 20:08:24 GMT -5
Said vaccine makes both of us healthier. Greatest good, greatest number. Pure utilitarianism. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. It's a basic social theory. So you pretty much just made this thread to start an argument with members that don't agree with forced vaccinations. So if you believe the government should never be able to force you to do something then the government should not have the ability to prevent you from doing something. The people should always get to choose what is best for them. Just making sure.
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Post by Lord Ragnarok on Sept 7, 2013 20:11:14 GMT -5
No it doesn't. And no, a vaccination for colds is not a better deal, I'd rather eat foods that are rich in zinc and vitamin C. Vitamin C is bullcrap. It does not help with colds in any way. The Vitamin C you get by eating the right fruits and vegatables boosts your immune system and that's a proven fact. Vitamin C improves your bodie's absorption of iron from plant based foods which boosts your immune system to protect from disease. Again, that's a proven fact.
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Post by Lord Ragnarok on Sept 7, 2013 20:12:37 GMT -5
RAGNAROK, so if I hear you correctly: - Eating healthily will stop you from getting any and all diseases - You're willing to endanger other people's life because you don't want a couple of injections, which also benefit you Congratulations on having the most ridiculous argument this year. I'm not willing to endanger anybody but I'm also not willing to force people into doing something they don't want to. And eating the right fruits and vegetables will help prevent disease. That's a proven fact.
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Post by slappy on Sept 7, 2013 20:14:29 GMT -5
Vitamin C is bullcrap. It does not help with colds in any way. The Vitamin C you get by eating the right fruits and vegatables boosts your immune system and that's a proven fact. Vitamin C improves your bodie's absorption of iron from plant based foods which boosts your immune system to protect from disease. Again, that's a proven fact. But it won't stop you from getting cancer. Or measles or anything that would be prevented from vaccinations.
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Post by Lord Ragnarok on Sept 7, 2013 20:15:42 GMT -5
The Vitamin C you get by eating the right fruits and vegatables boosts your immune system and that's a proven fact. Vitamin C improves your bodie's absorption of iron from plant based foods which boosts your immune system to protect from disease. Again, that's a proven fact. But it won't stop you from getting cancer. Or measles or anything that would be prevented from vaccinations. I never said Vitamin C prevents cancer. But there are fruits and vegetables that do help in preventing cancer.
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