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Post by Mike Giggs' Munchies on May 11, 2014 18:16:01 GMT -5
Season's over now (minus cup finals and La Liga) so I thought we could crack on with this. News today is obviously Cole's retirement, and the squad is being announced tomorrow too. Think Cole not going is the right call. Baines was obviously going to start, might as well give Shaw his first taste of a WC. The fact that Carrick seems likely not to go frustrates me - yeah he hasn't had a great season but last year he was easily the best English midfielder, and I think he was the only English player nominated for POTY. He's still better than Lampard and Milner but Roy has never liked him for some reason which is a real shame. If I did the team this is how I would line up: Hart Johnson Cahill Jagielka Baines Gerrard Carrick Lallana Rooney Welbeck Sturridge
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juaumguterres
Superstar
Joined on: Oct 31, 2013 8:52:24 GMT -5
Posts: 665
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Post by juaumguterres on May 11, 2014 19:31:22 GMT -5
I'm from Rio de Janeiro, but I will not watch any match in Maracanã because the tickets prices.
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Post by Brunt's Left Foot on May 11, 2014 20:26:23 GMT -5
Honestly, I would have picked Cole over Shaw. The World Cup is not the time to give a youngster a chance, that's what friendlies are for. Don't get me wrong, if the younger player is the best option then sure. But for me the only thing he has over Cole is youth. He only has 1 cap, and if Baines gets injured, I'd be a lot more comfortable knowing Cole would be coming into the starting XI rather than an 18-year old with one full season under his belt. Plus Cole has been a very good servant for England over the years and I think he deserved better than to just be cast aside for a kid who's got many tournaments ahead of him. I know Cole hasn't been first choice for Chelsea but he's still world class.
As for the rest of the team, I'm glad Carrick isn't likely to be in the squad. Maybe if Gerrard was unavailable but other than that, no. He doesn't deserve it. He's been poor this season. Not just a run of bad form lately, it's been all year. The WC squad should be based on merit not what you did in the past. And no I don't think I'm being a hypocrite over the Cole situation. Cole didn't play terribly all year, he just got dropped because the manager didn't fancy him. He would have been first choice at any other club. You couldn't say the same about Carrick, he'd struggle to get into any of the top team's starting XI this season.
I'd much rather have Milner or Lampard over Carrick. Neither of those have been great though, and if either were left out, it wouldn't be an injustice.
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juaumguterres
Superstar
Joined on: Oct 31, 2013 8:52:24 GMT -5
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Post by juaumguterres on May 11, 2014 20:37:25 GMT -5
I would like to see Aaron Lennon in the national team, with the #7...
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Post by Brunt's Left Foot on May 12, 2014 8:26:41 GMT -5
Very happy with that. Couldn't have picked a better squad imo.
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Post by Mike Giggs' Munchies on May 12, 2014 9:51:05 GMT -5
I'd swap Frank for Carrick, that's about it really. Maybe a really rogue choice like Walcott in 2006. Wilson or Tom Ince or someone, just for a lauge.
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Post by Hammersmith Hardman on May 12, 2014 10:47:40 GMT -5
I'd swap Frank for Carrick, that's about it really. Maybe a really rogue choice like Walcott in 2006. Wilson or Tom Ince or someone, just for a lauge. You do make me laugh at times
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AV1
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Joined on: Jun 15, 2008 9:04:59 GMT -5
Posts: 2,870
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Post by AV1 on May 12, 2014 11:55:03 GMT -5
I'd have taken Gareth Barry, think he has been excellent this year. Also John Stones instead of Chris Smalling.
Hart Johnson Jagielka Cahill Baines Henderson Gerrard Lallana Sterling Rooney Sturridge
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Post by T on May 12, 2014 12:42:52 GMT -5
Can't believe Wilshere got in. Has done nothing of note to deserve a place. It's got a good youthful look to it though.
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Post by Himmy! on May 12, 2014 13:31:18 GMT -5
Stones should have gone instead of Smalling and yeah possibly the only other one I would have changed is Carrick for Lampard, maybe even Huddlestone.
As for completely crazy out of the blue choices I wouldn't have minded Fabian Delph or Jordan Mutch going instead of Lampard, but obviously I can see why that happened.
Overall it's a decent squad. Can't see them going very far though.
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Post by Mike Giggs' Munchies on May 12, 2014 14:14:53 GMT -5
I'd swap Frank for Carrick, that's about it really. Maybe a really rogue choice like Walcott in 2006. Wilson or Tom Ince or someone, just for a lauge. You do make me laugh at times As I specifically said (with typo) for a laugh I'm glad it made you chuckle
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Post by Hammersmith Hardman on May 12, 2014 14:29:54 GMT -5
You do make me laugh at times As I specifically said (with typo) for a laugh I'm glad it made you chuckle No you were being serious -_-
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Post by Dan on May 12, 2014 17:27:49 GMT -5
I'm massively against Cole not going. Not from a biased point a view at all, but from a tactical view. Shaw and Baines are two similar players, both great going forward but not experienced or as good at defending. Like it or not, we will come up against Spain in the Quarter Finals and stronger opposition onwards from that point, and those will be games where we have to park the buss, contain the opposition and let them have 70% of the ball. In those Games, Baines and Shaw's attacking ability's will be worth nothing, whereas Cole's experience, organisation and tactical awareness is much more important. Therefore, we should of taken Cole and one of Baines/Shaw. The fact Hodgson in his conference today thought that the three left backs all have the same jobs and are similar makes me worry that he's tactically inept. Besides from that, agree with the whole Squad, except maybe Ruddy deserved a spot for his 13 clean sheets in the Premier League and being featured in every England qualifying squad. Interesting to see how he fits Barkley into the side with Rooney. Like it or not Lampard should be in there. He's Vice Captain, has huge experience at the highest level and will be vital in helping the younger players around the camp in preperation etc. He hasn't featured as much for us this year because he obviously hasn't got the legs to be playing 90 minutes three times a week, but he can still play a big part in one off Games, and we would need him in there in a Game where we need to park the bus, for his experience and organisation and leadership. I hope Barkley, Lallana and Rooney show up as those three for me can make something from nothing. If anyone's interested, here's a decent World Cup Predictor I had a go at the other day. I ended up with an Argentina vs France Final, after I tipped the French to knock out Brazil in the Semi's and Argentina beat Spain. www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/world-cup/10501412/World-Cup-2014-Wallchart-Predictor-Game.html
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thespecialone
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Joined on: Apr 8, 2009 17:48:05 GMT -5
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Post by thespecialone on May 12, 2014 17:41:37 GMT -5
I'm massively against Cole not going. Not from a biased point a view at all, but from a tactical view. Shaw and Baines are two similar players, both great going forward but not experienced or as good at defending. Like it or not, we will come up against Spain in the Quarter Finals and stronger opposition onwards from that point, and those will be games where we have to park the buss, contain the opposition and let them have 70% of the ball. In those Games, Baines and Shaw's attacking ability's will be worth nothing, whereas Cole's experience, organisation and tactical awareness is much more important. Therefore, we should of taken Cole and one of Baines/Shaw. The fact Hodgson in his conference today thought that the three left backs all have the same jobs and are similar makes me worry that he's tactically inept. Besides from that, agree with the whole Squad, except maybe Ruddy deserved a spot for his 13 clean sheets in the Premier League and being featured in every England qualifying squad. Interesting to see how he fits Barkley into the side with Rooney. Like it or not Lampard should be in there. He's Vice Captain, has huge experience at the highest level and will be vital in helping the younger players around the camp in preperation etc. He hasn't featured as much for us this year because he obviously hasn't got the legs to be playing 90 minutes three times a week, but he can still play a big part in one off Games, and we would need him in there in a Game where we need to park the bus, for his experience and organisation and leadership. I hope Barkley, Lallana and Rooney show up as those three for me can make something from nothing. If anyone's interested, here's a decent World Cup Predictor I had a go at the other day. I ended up with an Argentina vs France Final, after I tipped the French to knock out Brazil in the Semi's and Argentina beat Spain. www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/world-cup/10501412/World-Cup-2014-Wallchart-Predictor-Game.htmlIn a group with Suarez with Cavani and Italy that's some strong confidence... Dont mean i think you wont go through but still...strong confidence.
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Post by Dan on May 12, 2014 17:45:26 GMT -5
I'm massively against Cole not going. Not from a biased point a view at all, but from a tactical view. Shaw and Baines are two similar players, both great going forward but not experienced or as good at defending. Like it or not, we will come up against Spain in the Quarter Finals and stronger opposition onwards from that point, and those will be games where we have to park the buss, contain the opposition and let them have 70% of the ball. In those Games, Baines and Shaw's attacking ability's will be worth nothing, whereas Cole's experience, organisation and tactical awareness is much more important. Therefore, we should of taken Cole and one of Baines/Shaw. The fact Hodgson in his conference today thought that the three left backs all have the same jobs and are similar makes me worry that he's tactically inept. Besides from that, agree with the whole Squad, except maybe Ruddy deserved a spot for his 13 clean sheets in the Premier League and being featured in every England qualifying squad. Interesting to see how he fits Barkley into the side with Rooney. Like it or not Lampard should be in there. He's Vice Captain, has huge experience at the highest level and will be vital in helping the younger players around the camp in preperation etc. He hasn't featured as much for us this year because he obviously hasn't got the legs to be playing 90 minutes three times a week, but he can still play a big part in one off Games, and we would need him in there in a Game where we need to park the bus, for his experience and organisation and leadership. I hope Barkley, Lallana and Rooney show up as those three for me can make something from nothing. If anyone's interested, here's a decent World Cup Predictor I had a go at the other day. I ended up with an Argentina vs France Final, after I tipped the French to knock out Brazil in the Semi's and Argentina beat Spain. www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/world-cup/10501412/World-Cup-2014-Wallchart-Predictor-Game.htmlIn a group with Suarez with Cavani and Italy that's some strong confidence... Dont mean i think you wont go through but still...strong confidence. That's if we get through. Even against Italy we will likely play a similar way we did against them in the Euros and play a tight, cagey, counter attacking Game, so Cole would definitely be a better choice.
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Post by Red Dragon on May 12, 2014 17:55:59 GMT -5
I would have taken Cole. It's like Dan says, against a side where England need to defend, they could do with someone like him. He is a great defender. Don't see all this hate for Lampard either. Who are the other choices? Carrick, Barry, Cleverly (shudders), he's still got it. He can defend or set up goals. You won't be complaining when he knocks in an equalizer for you against Italy or Uruguay. I can't see England getting out of their group, but fair play to Hodge for picking a fresh team. But he still may trick everyone and pick a boring 11 ie Milner. Rooney really needs a performance, he's gonna be 32 by the next World Cup, so he really needs to perform. Those squad pics do look awful though, it's like a kid cut out and used prit stick to glue on the heads.
I need to have a little look at the groups and such before predicting. I think Brazil have got this in the bag, they killed Spain at the Confederations Cup. I think Ronaldo will carry Portugal further than Messi and Argentina, although I need to check the groups first. Hoping (like I think most people are) for Belgium to do well, got some great talent in there.
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Post by Mike Giggs' Munchies on May 12, 2014 18:34:19 GMT -5
I'm massively against Cole not going. Not from a biased point a view at all, but from a tactical view. Shaw and Baines are two similar players, both great going forward but not experienced or as good at defending. Like it or not, we will come up against Spain in the Quarter Finals and stronger opposition onwards from that point, and those will be games where we have to park the buss, contain the opposition and let them have 70% of the ball. In those Games, Baines and Shaw's attacking ability's will be worth nothing, whereas Cole's experience, organisation and tactical awareness is much more important. Therefore, we should of taken Cole and one of Baines/Shaw. The fact Hodgson in his conference today thought that the three left backs all have the same jobs and are similar makes me worry that he's tactically inept. Besides from that, agree with the whole Squad, except maybe Ruddy deserved a spot for his 13 clean sheets in the Premier League and being featured in every England qualifying squad. Interesting to see how he fits Barkley into the side with Rooney. Like it or not Lampard should be in there. He's Vice Captain, has huge experience at the highest level and will be vital in helping the younger players around the camp in preperation etc. He hasn't featured as much for us this year because he obviously hasn't got the legs to be playing 90 minutes three times a week, but he can still play a big part in one off Games, and we would need him in there in a Game where we need to park the bus, for his experience and organisation and leadership. I hope Barkley, Lallana and Rooney show up as those three for me can make something from nothing. If anyone's interested, here's a decent World Cup Predictor I had a go at the other day. I ended up with an Argentina vs France Final, after I tipped the French to knock out Brazil in the Semi's and Argentina beat Spain. www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/world-cup/10501412/World-Cup-2014-Wallchart-Predictor-Game.htmlIn a group with Suarez with Cavani and Italy that's some strong confidence... Dont mean i think you wont go through but still...strong confidence. I have no doubt we'll go out in the groups. Think Germany will win it but can't discount Argentina because their run to the quarters is an utter joke - they could easily rest half of their best players. Think Brazil will bottle it under the pressure and that teams are slowly figuring Spain/tika-taka out. In terms of who I want to win, I would utterly despise either an Argentina or Spain win. Argentina because they'd do it with possibly the easiest run ever and Messi would then win the Ballon D'Or and be hailed as the greatest ever despite not playing half as well as he can for most of the past 18 months. I'd despise Spain equally because they're so ing boring. Brazil would also frustrate me just cos my flatmate is Brazilian and wouldn't shut up about it, so that leaves Germany who seem quite good to watch, and I like a lot of their players. Outside of the top 4 teams there's a huge drop in quality, but I think Portugal have a slim chance. Ronaldo is unreal atm and could join Maradonna as the only player ever to drag an average team to win the WC, and his achievement would probably outstrip Maradonna's due to the higher amount of quality teams about atm. Have a sneaky feeling France could go far too.
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Post by Brunt's Left Foot on May 12, 2014 19:50:41 GMT -5
Brazil are my pick. After seeing them dismantle Spain in the Confederations Cup last summer, I couldn't back anyone else.
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thespecialone
Main Eventer
Joined on: Apr 8, 2009 17:48:05 GMT -5
Posts: 2,762
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Post by thespecialone on May 13, 2014 2:51:47 GMT -5
In a group with Suarez with Cavani and Italy that's some strong confidence... Dont mean i think you wont go through but still...strong confidence. I have no doubt we'll go out in the groups. Think Germany will win it but can't discount Argentina because their run to the quarters is an utter joke - they could easily rest half of their best players. Think Brazil will bottle it under the pressure and that teams are slowly figuring Spain/tika-taka out. In terms of who I want to win, I would utterly despise either an Argentina or Spain win. Argentina because they'd do it with possibly the easiest run ever and Messi would then win the Ballon D'Or and be hailed as the greatest ever despite not playing half as well as he can for most of the past 18 months. I'd despise Spain equally because they're so ing boring. Brazil would also frustrate me just cos my flatmate is Brazilian and wouldn't shut up about it, so that leaves Germany who seem quite good to watch, and I like a lot of their players. Outside of the top 4 teams there's a huge drop in quality, but I think Portugal have a slim chance. Ronaldo is unreal atm and could join Maradonna as the only player ever to drag an average team to win the WC, and his achievement would probably outstrip Maradonna's due to the higher amount of quality teams about atm. Have a sneaky feeling France could go far too. I dont think we will go past the quarter finals. First of all Ronaldo has a serious injury. Real is just keeping it a secret but its serious... Second we have Germany which means that at best we will do second place in the group. Which mean we will get a big fish on the quarter finals. Not sure i would call our team "average" though. A team with 3 Real Madrid players, 1 Man Utd player, the most promissing defensive midfielder in Europe today (William Carvalho), an underrated world class player (Moutinho) and quality players like Joao Pereira, Quaresma, Patricio...We miss a good striker no doubt about that...but Scolari didnt call up Lima...
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Post by Dan on May 14, 2014 4:31:24 GMT -5
In a group with Suarez with Cavani and Italy that's some strong confidence... Dont mean i think you wont go through but still...strong confidence. I have no doubt we'll go out in the groups. Think Germany will win it but can't discount Argentina because their run to the quarters is an utter joke - they could easily rest half of their best players. Think Brazil will bottle it under the pressure and that teams are slowly figuring Spain/tika-taka out. In terms of who I want to win, I would utterly despise either an Argentina or Spain win. Argentina because they'd do it with possibly the easiest run ever and Messi would then win the Ballon D'Or and be hailed as the greatest ever despite not playing half as well as he can for most of the past 18 months. I'd despise Spain equally because they're so ing boring. Brazil would also frustrate me just cos my flatmate is Brazilian and wouldn't shut up about it, so that leaves Germany who seem quite good to watch, and I like a lot of their players. Outside of the top 4 teams there's a huge drop in quality, but I think Portugal have a slim chance. Ronaldo is unreal atm and could join Maradonna as the only player ever to drag an average team to win the WC, and his achievement would probably outstrip Maradonna's due to the higher amount of quality teams about atm. Have a sneaky feeling France could go far too. From looking at the Tournament Tree, my guess would be that Argentina meet Portugal in the Quarters, as long as Germany win Portugal's Group. Here's a point I think a lot of people are overlooking though. Everyone is expecting the South American Sides to be much better suited to the climate and heat. However, nobody can play a full-on attacking dynamic game in this heat, therefore I think the tempo will be slowed down which could ultimately suit the European Sides (e.g. Spain, Germany) with the possession football. Like Mike, I can see Brazil going out in the Semi's to either Germany or France. Wouldn't put it past Spain to go and knock out Argentina/Portugal either. My Bet for the Golden Boot would be with Messi, Aguero or Benzema. Can't look past their first four fixtures which will all be very easy so can see them netting a few. With England, I can see us drawing Italy, drawing Uruguay and beating Costa Rica to go through. I think we'd then have the standard heroic England knock-out Match against possibly Colombia where we'd nick the win in Extra time or on Penalties. Then we'd have Spain in the Quarters, keep it 0-0 till the 65th minute before going a goal down, having to go for it then getting caught with a late second. Brave from Deschamps to leave both Nasri and Clichy out by the way. Would of thought he would be smart enough to have a stern chat with them both about attitude and internal problems with Arsenal Players and still take them with. However, like it or not, if Messi leads Argentina to beat his biggest Rival of this generation Ronaldo in the Quarters, current World and European Champions Spain in the Semi's, then their greatest Rivals Brazil in their own back yard in the Final, Pele passing him the World Cup to lift would be one of the most symbolic images in football history.
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