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Post by bababooey on Sept 12, 2017 21:21:01 GMT -5
The title is a prop to move a story along and help boost a guy. I don't love Jinder but if everyone who is considered a top guy had the title, everyone would have the title at the same time. Right now, Jinder is basically nothing without the title. Without the title Styles is still a top draw.
The "you deserve it" crap gets annoying. Guys like Piper, Steamboat, and Jake the Snake "deserved it" but they didn't need it.
I think Styles having the title would be great but I'm not offended he doesn't have it.
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Post by WWFAttitudeEraFan on Sept 12, 2017 23:34:04 GMT -5
Batista? Putting on great performances? lol. You have clearly never watched a Batista match based on this post. I've been following his career since his developmental days, before even being called up to the main roster. I was never really impressed, at all, with his in-ring work. "Decent", when he was with the right people? Sure. Great? No. Ring ability aside, I found his work entertaining. His programs with the likes of Triple H, Eddie Guerrero, and Rey Mysterio, are amongst the best of his career.
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Post by WWFAttitudeEraFan on Sept 12, 2017 23:39:44 GMT -5
Batista? Putting on great performances? lol. Let's not drink that haterade here. Batista might not have been AJ Styles in the ring, but with the right opponent he put on great performances. I have fond memories of WM 21 and 23 respectively. I don't hate Batista. Never have. I just don't think he was that great in the ring, and found it funny that someone else thought otherwise. Aside from that, I enjoyed his work. I thought he was very good on the mic, and his on screen character was believable.
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Post by cordless2016 on Sept 12, 2017 23:49:10 GMT -5
Let's not drink that haterade here. Batista might not have been AJ Styles in the ring, but with the right opponent he put on great performances. I have fond memories of WM 21 and 23 respectively. I don't hate Batista. Never have. I just don't think he was that great in the ring, and found it funny that someone else thought otherwise. Aside from that, I enjoyed his work. I thought he was very good on the mic, and his on screen character was believable. Batista learned from two of the best ever (Flair and HHH) on how to construct a story in the ring. He didn't need any flashy moves or have to go over the top rope to get a reaction. Just listening to the guy in old interviews can show someone how much he cared about the business and his matches. You mentioned some of his best matches with HHH, Rey and Eddie, but neglected arguably his best feud with Taker, and another great one with Edge. And to say all the work was due to his opponents isn't fair to Dave. It take two to make magic and Dave knew what he was doing.
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Post by Rob on Sept 13, 2017 1:28:21 GMT -5
I'd rather have a jobber as a champion who shows up every week and helps push the ship along than a champion who shows up once every other month for a paul heyman promo we've heard about 397 times and fights 3-4 times a year.
AJ doesn't need the title right now. He is doing just fine as the "work horse" champion basically doing what Cena did with the US belt. Its kind of clear they may be going with a Nakamura/Styles title match heading into WM
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TheBadGuyChico
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Post by TheBadGuyChico on Sept 13, 2017 1:39:35 GMT -5
The title is a prop to move a story along and help boost a guy. I don't love Jinder but if everyone who is considered a top guy had the title, everyone would have the title at the same time. Right now, Jinder is basically nothing without the title. Without the title Styles is still a top draw. The "you deserve it" crap gets annoying. Guys like Piper, Steamboat, and Jake the Snake "deserved it" but they didn't need it. I think Styles having the title would be great but I'm not offended he doesn't have it. I hate to get old and cranky, but in my day the belt wasn't a prop used to experiment. You could either draw money and were deserving of it, or you were at the very least a credible wrestler. Hogan, Savage, Warrior all massively over babyfaces. Yokozuna, Sheik, Superstar, were all over heels with enough heat to give a baby face a big rub. Jinder, Sheamus, and Swagger don't fit under any prestigious category. Got shot booking didn't exist way back when, neither did tossing titles around. WWE is lazy, they know the brand sells itself, so the need for a truly credible champion is null. The world champ doesn't have to draw the way he did in the past. I'm hardly just a bitter smark, mad that AJ isn't champion. I just think the guy is the total package and can make a title. Shawn Michaels in his book said that the man makes the title, someone tell Vinnie Mac that.
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Post by theoutlaw1999 on Sept 13, 2017 3:19:26 GMT -5
Batista? Putting on great performances? lol. You have clearly never watched a Batista match based on this post. I have and I will say Batista sucked.
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TheBadGuyChico
POSSIBLE BAD TRADER
Joined on: Dec 3, 2012 10:34:41 GMT -5
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Post by TheBadGuyChico on Sept 13, 2017 5:26:12 GMT -5
I'd rather have a jobber as a champion who shows up every week and helps push the ship along than a champion who shows up once every other month for a paul heyman promo we've heard about 397 times and fights 3-4 times a year. AJ doesn't need the title right now. He is doing just fine as the "work horse" champion basically doing what Cena did with the US belt. Its kind of clear they may be going with a Nakamura/Styles title match heading into WM In a world where the titles are less valuable than ever, and the product is over saturated, I'll take Brock Lesnar. He's not my favorite guy ever, but he's good for the title. Whoever beats him will get a great rub. Beating Kinder isn't worth much, who hasn't done it?
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TheBadGuyChico
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Joined on: Dec 3, 2012 10:34:41 GMT -5
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Post by TheBadGuyChico on Sept 13, 2017 5:30:40 GMT -5
You have clearly never watched a Batista match based on this post. I have and I will say Batista sucked. Batista vs the Undertaker was awesome every time. The guy could work in a way few guys on the current roster can. Plenty of great wrestlers today, few who can work a crowd.
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Post by tg11 on Sept 13, 2017 7:47:33 GMT -5
Then why not put the belt on KO...Owens is more of a heel than Jinder
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Post by TurboEddie on Sept 13, 2017 15:29:00 GMT -5
Because he is the Modern Day Maharaja!
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Post by marino13 on Sept 13, 2017 15:41:07 GMT -5
How did this turn into a thread about Batista? Then why not put the belt on KO...Owens is more of a heel than Jinder Because KO is not from Indian decent. And while Owens is a great heel, I'm pretty sure he's not going to help add 1.3 billion new viewers.
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Post by Bandalero on Sept 14, 2017 5:27:43 GMT -5
But let's be realistic here, yes the population is 1.3 billion but 1.3 billion are not watching/buying the product. Don't get me wrong, i'm of Indian decent and I think Jinder is doing the best he can as the foreign heel champion and I'm genuinely happy for the guy. This reign goes a long way when he ends up in convention halls signing autographs in the twilight of his years. We know it's a smart business move by WWE, just like hey are capitalizing on the female market with all this attention on women's wrestling, they can't survive on just us smarks.
I still think people are more butt hurt over the fact that Jinder was jobbing one week, injured an internet darling with a stiff elbow and was rewarded with a world championship he next week. Wwe could have done a better job telling his story, but isn't that always the case with them?
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Post by bababooey on Sept 14, 2017 8:04:28 GMT -5
But let's be realistic here, yes the population is 1.3 billion but 1.3 billion are not watching/buying the product. Don't get me wrong, i'm of Indian decent and I think Jinder is doing the best he can as the foreign heel champion and I'm genuinely happy for the guy. This reign goes a long way when he ends up in convention halls signing autographs in the twilight of his years. We know it's a smart business move by WWE, just like hey are capitalizing on the female market with all this attention on women's wrestling, they can't survive on just us smarks. I still think people are more butt hurt over the fact that Jinder was jobbing one week, injured an internet darling with a stiff elbow and was rewarded with a world championship he next week. Wwe could have done a better job telling his story, but isn't that always the case with them? I started to be on the fence on Jinder once his title reign got going but I've fallen off on him again. I don't think he's bad in the ring and he's got a good look. He's gotta get rid of the dad hair though. His promos are bad mainly because he keeps losing his voice 5 seconds in. I don't like the "You people don't like me because I'm Indian" gimmick but he's stated that was Vince's call. I don't hate so so much that he was a jobber for so long, but I do hate that he was getting squashed by Mojo the week before. I could buy it if he went to Smackdown and started winning and they explained that he saw it as a clean slate and took advantage in the land of opportunity.
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Post by Bandalero on Sept 14, 2017 10:28:37 GMT -5
I started to be on the fence on Jinder once his title reign got going but I've fallen off on him again. I don't think he's bad in the ring and he's got a good look. He's gotta get rid of the dad hair though. His promos are bad mainly because he keeps losing his voice 5 seconds in. I don't like the "You people don't like me because I'm Indian" gimmick but he's stated that was Vince's call. I don't hate so so much that he was a jobber for so long, but I do hate that he was getting squashed by Mojo the week before. I could buy it if he went to Smackdown and started winning and they explained that he saw it as a clean slate and took advantage in the land of opportunity. And I can definitely agree with that. The whole "you hate me because I'm Indian" is Vince's old school mentality and Jinder is just towing the company line. His build should have been a slow burn on SDL instead of being hot-shotted which he wasn't ready for. It's unfortunate that he loses his voice like he does because he's got everything else going on. He's got the best stage graphics the way it animates as he walks out. We've already established in another thread, that to be a star it's more than just performing 5-star matches. Everyone is quick to jump on Jinder and say he's the worst world champion, but really that title belongs to Dalip Singh as the worst world champion. I'm not Jinder's biggest fan and even I admit that his reign is sucking (3 PPVS with Randy Orton didn't help either). But we all know this is culminating to AJ vs Nakamura which is what everyone wants in the end. So I'm willing to cut Jinder some slack.
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Dr. Mantis Toboggan MD
Main Eventer
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Post by Dr. Mantis Toboggan MD on Sept 14, 2017 10:54:40 GMT -5
Because he is of Indian heritage and gives Vince a hard-on.
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Post by bababooey on Sept 14, 2017 11:07:36 GMT -5
I started to be on the fence on Jinder once his title reign got going but I've fallen off on him again. I don't think he's bad in the ring and he's got a good look. He's gotta get rid of the dad hair though. His promos are bad mainly because he keeps losing his voice 5 seconds in. I don't like the "You people don't like me because I'm Indian" gimmick but he's stated that was Vince's call. I don't hate so so much that he was a jobber for so long, but I do hate that he was getting squashed by Mojo the week before. I could buy it if he went to Smackdown and started winning and they explained that he saw it as a clean slate and took advantage in the land of opportunity. And I can definitely agree with that. The whole "you hate me because I'm Indian" is Vince's old school mentality and Jinder is just towing the company line. His build should have been a slow burn on SDL instead of being hot-shotted which he wasn't ready for. It's unfortunate that he loses his voice like he does because he's got everything else going on. He's got the best stage graphics the way it animates as he walks out. We've already established in another thread, that to be a star it's more than just performing 5-star matches. Everyone is quick to jump on Jinder and say he's the worst world champion, but really that title belongs to Dalip Singh as the worst world champion. I'm not Jinder's biggest fan and even I admit that his reign is sucking (3 PPVS with Randy Orton didn't help either). But we all know this is culminating to AJ vs Nakamura which is what everyone wants in the end. So I'm willing to cut Jinder some slack. I was in the crowd at Summerslam and it was my first time seeing him live since coming back. When he came out I was like "Hmm. I'm kinda getting caught up in the heat. Maybe there's more to this than comes across on TV." The match wasn't booked well and he botched his own finisher but whatever. My biggest concern with Jinder is that once he drops the title he'll likely drop into obscurity. One route I can see working would be that the Singh Brothers accidentally cost him the title. Then the story becomes them begging for his forgiveness and constantly trying to gain his approval. He just abuses them and used them as like human shields to get over in the midcard. Kinda like how he uses them now but really tell the story that he doesn't appreciate them and he treats them as tools at his disposal.
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Post by K5 on Sept 14, 2017 17:10:25 GMT -5
if the wwe was really pandering to the indian market, shouldn't jinder be a face?
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Cameron Stone
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Post by Cameron Stone on Sept 15, 2017 0:22:21 GMT -5
I feel it's also a throwback to the older days. The world title is the more "character focused" title. The midcard belt is the more workrate title.
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Post by alanpartridge on Sept 15, 2017 9:15:08 GMT -5
Hopefully Nakamura will beat Mahal for the title and then Nakamura and Styles can have more epic matches feuding over the WWE Championship.
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