alexxx
Superstar
Joined on: Dec 27, 2008 15:54:38 GMT -5
Posts: 790
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Post by alexxx on Jan 17, 2019 19:03:08 GMT -5
How does anyone feel about 1994?
Worst Summer Slam 94 Survivor Series 94
Best Royal Rumble 94 Wrestlemania 94 King Of The Ring 94 but it would been better if Art Donovan was Commentating
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Post by hbkbigdaddycool on Jan 17, 2019 20:33:00 GMT -5
WWF
Best
Marty Jannetty & 123 Kid upset win over the Quebecers on Raw for the Tag Titles
Owen Hart heel turn
Owen vs. Bret feud
Razor Ramon vs. HBK at Wrestlemania X in the ladder match for the IC Title
Bret Hart winning back the WWF Title from Yokozuna at Wrestlemania X
The slow rise of Diesel with winning the IC Title from Ramon
Baby face turn for the Headshrinkers and their Tag Title win
The formation of the Million Dollar Corporation
The Ramon vs. Diesel SummerSlam 94 match for the IC Title
Diesel & HBK winning the Tag Titles
The Teamsters vs. The Bad Guys at Survivor Series
Diesel winning the WWE Title from Bob Backlund
The Bad
The Royal Rumble match at the PPV
Never getting an ending - or a real start - to the Earthquake vs. Yokozuna feud
Lex Luger not being any type of champion
Randy Savage leaving the WWF
Jerry Lawler vs. Roddy Piper feud/match
WCW
Best
Ric Flair vs. Vader feud
Ric Flair vs. Ricky Steamboat matches for the WCW Title
Steve Austin vs. Ricky Steamboat matches for the US Title
Cactus Jack & Kevin Sullivan vs. Nasty Boys for the Tag Titles at Slamboree 94 (everyone needs to watch that tag match! Hardcore wrestling done right!)
Arn Anderson heel turn on Dustin Rhodes
Bad
Hulk Hogan's arrival
That's about it. I felt that WCW was on a role at that time, but having Hogan come in, everyone knew he would be WCW Champion and all his ex WWF friends would join, and that's what happened.
ECW
Best
Shane Douglas vs. Terry Funk vs. Sabu for the ECW Title at the Night The Line Was Crossed
Arn Anderson and Bobby Eaton making an impact, setting up for Arn/Funk vs. Sabu/Eaton at When World's Collide
The Public Enemy vs. Mikey Whipwreck & Cactus Jack feud for the Tag Titles
The working relationship with WCW so Cactus, Arn, Eaton, Scorpio, Pillman and Simmons could come to ECW
Shane Douglas winning the NWA Title to throw it down and holding up the ECW Title high
The debut of Chris Benoit and Dean Malenko
Tommy Dreamer vs. The Sandman feud
The usage of real music videos/song for their own music videos
Bad
Honestly, I can't think of anything back that ECW did in 1994. They were just doing things right and getting a lot of press and it wasn't anything negative yet, since the real hardcore stuff for ECW didn't begin until 1995.
Though, if the rumours are true, the talk of Ric Flair being on loan to ECW to wrestle Shane Douglas in the Spectrum would have been nice to have seen, and that's bad that it never happened.
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Post by The Brain on Jan 17, 2019 21:30:02 GMT -5
WWF to me that year was still solid even though they were going off the rails by years end. The 3 Bret vs Owen matches that year were excellent and a big reason why I look back in fondness for that year in the companies history. Savage leaving at the end of the year was like Heenan leaving a year prior for me. I hated to see both those guys leave just a year apart. PPV wise Mania and KOTR were my favs from that year. I'll also say this...I actually didn't mind Arn Donovan on commentary at KOTR. It's like watching wrestling with your Grandpa who has never watched wrestling in his life.
WCW was great during the early months that year but yeah when Hogan came in you know it was going to be all about him and his friends and that's what happened. Both Spring Stampede and Slamboree were great events that year.
ECW was also solid that year. I marked out huge when Bobby Eaton and Arn Anderson showed up for a brief stint.
All 3 companies had my attention that year for sure.
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Post by LA Times on Jan 17, 2019 21:56:18 GMT -5
Hulk Hogan going to WCW was a good thing. The whole business was down in the dumpster during that time and WCW had to do something to get ratings.
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Post by The Brain on Jan 17, 2019 22:15:13 GMT -5
Hulk Hogan going to WCW was a good thing. The whole business was down in the dumpster during that time and WCW had to do something to get ratings. No doubt about it. Hogan made em turn the corner for sure but you can definitely see the in ring work take a hit when Hogan and his friends came in.
That Hogan/Butcher match from Starrcade that year still leaves a bad taste in my mouth. All it did was stroke Hogan's ego. We go from a great match between Flair/Vader the previous year to that mess just terrible.
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Post by LA Times on Jan 17, 2019 22:32:07 GMT -5
I also liked the Stars & Stripes vs Pretty Wonderful feud back in 1994. They are still 2 of my all time favorite tag teams even though both were only together for a few months.
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Post by MKSavage on Jan 17, 2019 23:31:09 GMT -5
I liked 1994, biggest problem with both WCW and WWF was roster depth, the top stars were good but after about 10 or so in each company the drop off was significant. For WWF, the bright spot was definitely Bret vs. Owen, great feud and great matches. Also, the Razor/Shawn/Diesel feud and matches were also great. Yokozuna vs Undertaker at Royal Rumble and the Survivor Series that year were good matches, too. The rise of Diesel was done well, though winning the title at a house show was disappointing, might have been better to give Diesel a win on Raw (which didn't happen that often back then). The Rumble match was good but the ending not so much, I think it would have been better to have a winner that night (either Bret or Lex) so the fans could go home happy and not boo the end of the PPV and the next night on raw say that the Refs talked about it and neither could decide who won so Jack Tunney would declare the same matches we had for Mania that year (Owen v. Bret, Lex v. Yoko, and Yoko v. Bret). The matches at the Rumble PPV were also good, Bret/Owen v. Quebecers, Tatanka v. Bam Bam, and IRS v. Razor, as well as the Yoko v. Taker match mentioned above. Mania was good as well, Bret gaining the title back, the Owen/Bret and Razor/Shawn matches are two of the best in Mania history. Sadly, this was Macho Man's last mania and PPV match in the WWF/E. King of the Ring was decent as well, the Bret/Diesel match was very good (always liked their chemistry in the ring together - I liked all 4 of their PPV matches). The rise of Owen Hart was great as well. Summer Slam was kind of boring with the exception of the Owen/Bret match and the Razor/Diesel match, the Undertaker/Underfaker match was terrible - can't believe that main evented the PPV over the Owen/Bret match. The other thing I liked about the PPV was the return of the British Bulldog. The worst PPV of the year was the Survivor Series, none of the traditional survivor series matches were great or even good. To me the match that could have been great was Diesel's team vs. Razor's team, but instead they used it to set up the Diesel/Shawn feud for early 1995. Jerry Lawler was probably the best thing/part of the whole PPV. The Bret/Backlund match was good but not great, Bob didn't look to good here. However, the Yoko/Taker match was pretty good. Worst thing about WWF in 1994 was we never got that feud/program that Savage wanted against Shawn Michaels, I think these two could have put together something really great. Another bad thing about the year was the lack of use of the Steiner Brothers, especially when the WWF needed top tag teams.
For WCW, they had some really good feuds and matches, most notably the Flair/Steamboat and Sting/Rude ones. Steamboat and Austin also had a nice run this year. If I remember correctly, they were starting up a feud between Rude and Vader but then Rude broke his neck in Japan and the feud was ended. I was a huge Sting fan, so I did not like that he had to take a back seat to Hogan (who I was never really a fan of), though, I understand why they did it. Although, I hated Savage leaving the WWF, at least he got to wrestle in WCW. Another good thing about the year was the return of Bobby the Brain Heenan, though, I would have preferred him in the WWF it was great to see him out there again.
I did not even know that ECW existed so I cannot comment on ECW for this year.
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Post by The Brain on Jan 18, 2019 13:40:20 GMT -5
I liked 1994, biggest problem with both WCW and WWF was roster depth, the top stars were good but after about 10 or so in each company the drop off was significant. For WWF, the bright spot was definitely Bret vs. Owen, great feud and great matches. Also, the Razor/Shawn/Diesel feud and matches were also great. Yokozuna vs Undertaker at Royal Rumble and the Survivor Series that year were good matches, too. The rise of Diesel was done well, though winning the title at a house show was disappointing, might have been better to give Diesel a win on Raw (which didn't happen that often back then). The Rumble match was good but the ending not so much, I think it would have been better to have a winner that night (either Bret or Lex) so the fans could go home happy and not boo the end of the PPV and the next night on raw say that the Refs talked about it and neither could decide who won so Jack Tunney would declare the same matches we had for Mania that year (Owen v. Bret, Lex v. Yoko, and Yoko v. Bret). The matches at the Rumble PPV were also good, Bret/Owen v. Quebecers, Tatanka v. Bam Bam, and IRS v. Razor, as well as the Yoko v. Taker match mentioned above. Mania was good as well, Bret gaining the title back, the Owen/Bret and Razor/Shawn matches are two of the best in Mania history. Sadly, this was Macho Man's last mania and PPV match in the WWF/E. King of the Ring was decent as well, the Bret/Diesel match was very good (always liked their chemistry in the ring together - I liked all 4 of their PPV matches). The rise of Owen Hart was great as well. Summer Slam was kind of boring with the exception of the Owen/Bret match and the Razor/Diesel match, the Undertaker/Underfaker match was terrible - can't believe that main evented the PPV over the Owen/Bret match. The other thing I liked about the PPV was the return of the British Bulldog. The worst PPV of the year was the Survivor Series, none of the traditional survivor series matches were great or even good. To me the match that could have been great was Diesel's team vs. Razor's team, but instead they used it to set up the Diesel/Shawn feud for early 1995. Jerry Lawler was probably the best thing/part of the whole PPV. The Bret/Backlund match was good but not great, Bob didn't look to good here. However, the Yoko/Taker match was pretty good. Worst thing about WWF in 1994 was we never got that feud/program that Savage wanted against Shawn Michaels, I think these two could have put together something really great. Another bad thing about the year was the lack of use of the Steiner Brothers, especially when the WWF needed top tag teams.Vince wanted em to feud with each other as evident with them entering 1 and 3 respectively in the Rumble but when they both declined that storyline that was pretty much the end of em. Their whole WWF run felt very underwhelming which is a shame as they should've been a top team for years.
Edit- Samu was 2 my bad lol
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Post by MKSavage on Jan 18, 2019 13:44:27 GMT -5
I liked 1994, biggest problem with both WCW and WWF was roster depth, the top stars were good but after about 10 or so in each company the drop off was significant. For WWF, the bright spot was definitely Bret vs. Owen, great feud and great matches. Also, the Razor/Shawn/Diesel feud and matches were also great. Yokozuna vs Undertaker at Royal Rumble and the Survivor Series that year were good matches, too. The rise of Diesel was done well, though winning the title at a house show was disappointing, might have been better to give Diesel a win on Raw (which didn't happen that often back then). The Rumble match was good but the ending not so much, I think it would have been better to have a winner that night (either Bret or Lex) so the fans could go home happy and not boo the end of the PPV and the next night on raw say that the Refs talked about it and neither could decide who won so Jack Tunney would declare the same matches we had for Mania that year (Owen v. Bret, Lex v. Yoko, and Yoko v. Bret). The matches at the Rumble PPV were also good, Bret/Owen v. Quebecers, Tatanka v. Bam Bam, and IRS v. Razor, as well as the Yoko v. Taker match mentioned above. Mania was good as well, Bret gaining the title back, the Owen/Bret and Razor/Shawn matches are two of the best in Mania history. Sadly, this was Macho Man's last mania and PPV match in the WWF/E. King of the Ring was decent as well, the Bret/Diesel match was very good (always liked their chemistry in the ring together - I liked all 4 of their PPV matches). The rise of Owen Hart was great as well. Summer Slam was kind of boring with the exception of the Owen/Bret match and the Razor/Diesel match, the Undertaker/Underfaker match was terrible - can't believe that main evented the PPV over the Owen/Bret match. The other thing I liked about the PPV was the return of the British Bulldog. The worst PPV of the year was the Survivor Series, none of the traditional survivor series matches were great or even good. To me the match that could have been great was Diesel's team vs. Razor's team, but instead they used it to set up the Diesel/Shawn feud for early 1995. Jerry Lawler was probably the best thing/part of the whole PPV. The Bret/Backlund match was good but not great, Bob didn't look to good here. However, the Yoko/Taker match was pretty good. Worst thing about WWF in 1994 was we never got that feud/program that Savage wanted against Shawn Michaels, I think these two could have put together something really great. Another bad thing about the year was the lack of use of the Steiner Brothers, especially when the WWF needed top tag teams.Vince wanted em to feud with each other as evident with them entering 1 and 2 in the Rumble but when they both declined that storyline that was pretty much the end of em. Their whole WWF run felt very underwhelming which is a shame as they should've been a top team for years. Agreed, especially with the lack of talent in the tag team division that year and the next two, the stainers should have dominated the competition. Wonder why he wanted them to feud with each other when they were only in the company for a year and were still the most popular tag team in the company. Seems like you have a tag team feud with each other when the team has pretty much run its course and is becoming dull.
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Post by The Brain on Jan 18, 2019 13:49:46 GMT -5
Vince wanted em to feud with each other as evident with them entering 1 and 2 in the Rumble but when they both declined that storyline that was pretty much the end of em. Their whole WWF run felt very underwhelming which is a shame as they should've been a top team for years. Agreed, especially with the lack of talent in the tag team division that year and the next two, the stainers should have dominated the competition. Wonder why he wanted them to feud with each other when they were only in the company for a year and were still the most popular tag team in the company. Seems like you have a tag team feud with each other when the team has pretty much run its course and is becoming dull. I recall reading they had attitude backstage which didn't help matters either for em. More so Scott than Rick but I guess that was Vince saying ''ok you wanna have an attitude then I'm gonna split you guys up damnit!!''
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Post by hbkbigdaddycool on Jan 18, 2019 14:34:21 GMT -5
Agreed, especially with the lack of talent in the tag team division that year and the next two, the stainers should have dominated the competition. Wonder why he wanted them to feud with each other when they were only in the company for a year and were still the most popular tag team in the company. Seems like you have a tag team feud with each other when the team has pretty much run its course and is becoming dull. I recall reading they had attitude backstage which didn't help matters either for em. More so Scott than Rick but I guess that was Vince saying ''ok you wanna have an attitude then I'm gonna split you guys up damnit!!''
Honestly though, I don't blame the Steiners in this. It makes zero sense to have had them split up in 1994 and feud with each other, especially when Bret and Owen were doing that!
Steiners probably were mad too at Vince, but I am guessing Vince promised them a long title reign as champion and they got two very short title reigns in the summer of 1993.
Also, I remember the last Raw appearance they had in April of 94, and Vince was saying, "looks like they aren't getting along" and such, even though both Rick and Scott were tagging just fine and acting as a unit haha
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Post by MKSavage on Jan 18, 2019 15:33:58 GMT -5
Agreed, especially with the lack of talent in the tag team division that year and the next two, the stainers should have dominated the competition. Wonder why he wanted them to feud with each other when they were only in the company for a year and were still the most popular tag team in the company. Seems like you have a tag team feud with each other when the team has pretty much run its course and is becoming dull. I recall reading they had attitude backstage which didn't help matters either for em. More so Scott than Rick but I guess that was Vince saying ''ok you wanna have an attitude then I'm gonna split you guys up damnit!!'' Yeah, there has always been reports that Scott was trouble in the locker room, still think it is odd that he would split up his best tag team at that time.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2019 19:32:49 GMT -5
I recall reading they had attitude backstage which didn't help matters either for em. More so Scott than Rick but I guess that was Vince saying ''ok you wanna have an attitude then I'm gonna split you guys up damnit!!'' Honestly though, I don't blame the Steiners in this. It makes zero sense to have had them split up in 1994 and feud with each other, especially when Bret and Owen were doing that! Steiners probably were mad too at Vince, but I am guessing Vince promised them a long title reign as champion and they got two very short title reigns in the summer of 1993. Also, I remember the last Raw appearance they had in April of 94, and Vince was saying, "looks like they aren't getting along" and such, even though both Rick and Scott were tagging just fine and acting as a unit haha shoulda did a big bro vs little bro tag fued (bret/rick vs owen/scott)
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jason1980s
Main Eventer
Joined on: Sept 30, 2009 14:58:56 GMT -5
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Post by jason1980s on Jan 19, 2019 9:17:38 GMT -5
I'll also say this...I actually didn't mind Arn Donovan on commentary at KOTR. It's like watching wrestling with your Grandpa who has never watched wrestling in his life. Art Donovan was such a legend in the Baltimore area and so personable and funny that he would be hired to show up at so many different events like grand openings or bars, restaurants, stores and even business luncheons/dinner events so to him, I'm sure the WWF pay per view was just another special event he was paid to attend. He had so much on his plate back in those days he probably didn't even know what he was signing up for until he got to the show and even then, probably not even until the show started. In the mid 2000s I wound up going to Art Donovan's house, which is a very small home on the grounds of this mansion he owned that was a dining hall for weddings and receptions. Anyway, it relates to him not having any clue about the wrestling show because it came about with a friend of my father's taking him to Art's house and then my father arranging for me and him to go back there the next week. Art was of sharp mind his whole life but obviously had no idea what we were doing just dropping by in the kitchen of his house and I'm guessing it didn't happen too often because every time we met him over the next year, at autograph signings and dinners, Art wouldn't know us at first but would then remember and exclaim "your the guys from the kitchen" like he still had no idea what we were doing there. But that's Art, he was so beloved in Baltimore that he had so many people wanting to meet him or know him or host him at their event. A few years after King of the Ring, I asked him if he remembered and again, he really seemed to have no clue what I was referring to. Obviously 1993/1994 was a trying time for WWF and especially with the steroid trail and then some big fueds and storylines not over the last year not really working out so it kind of goes hand in hand with them shuffling Art Donovan into the show and it not turning out so well for WWF.
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Post by warriorlynx on Jan 20, 2019 11:42:15 GMT -5
The Good:
Wrestlemania X: An overall solid card, with memorable moments.
Taker vs. Taker (I actually enjoyed it)
Taker vs. Yokozuna I and II
Diesel winning the title off of Backlund was actually well done that brought shock value (Backlund crawled back to dressing room), too bad crappy booking, protecting Bret first and lack of heels ruined Diesel's run.
The Bad:
1994 (April 1 '94 -March 31 '95) was the company's first net loss under Vince Jr if I recall. A few factors were in play:
1. Hulk joining WCW which boosted their PPV buy vs. WWF and forced Vince to call it the "New Generation" 2. Bret Hart not being a big draw as they hoped domestically, followed by Diesel who was worse 3. Taker was gone for a good part of '94 and he was the most over since late 93 4. Lack of monster heels: Yoko was finally defeated at WMX when Bret did the "impossible", Diesel was marginal. 5. Costs related to Steroid Trial in April
Old school/Underutilized talent:
Many old school wrestlers were still around like Earthquake, Bundy, Lombardi, Backlund, Mountie, etc, it would've been fun watching a clique of old-gen wrestlers form. Savage would be better as a heel working with some of the stars instead of stuck as a commentator. Roddy Piper had a nice return except that the booking and main eventing KOTR with Lawler didn't work, Piper would've been better feuding with anyone else. Mr. Perfect returned, but it was way too short obviously he wasn't happy that he didn't have much of a future left in the WWF, perhaps instead of pushing for a feud with Luger, Perfect stays on as a babyface maybe even feuding with Yokozuna.
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Post by Artie Kendall on Jan 21, 2019 12:09:27 GMT -5
A lot of talk about the Steiners and it's interesting that the WWF had two tag teams in the Steiners and LOD that many would argue as the greatest in the world and both of the teams didn't do much in the WWF. LOD was a combination of themselves and bad booking. When LOD came in they had Demolition, Hart Foundation, Natural Disasters, Nasty Boys, and Money Inc but every time there was what seemed like a build up for something that never came or a random match they would have against a team or a member is suspended. With the Steiners it was more of a depleted roster. They had no one to feud with and I don't see the logic in "Well if we don't have a tag division, let's break them up." No you just build your tag division up, Vince.
Favorite WWF Matches of 1994:
Jan - WWF Royal Rumble - Bret & Owen Hart Vs The Quebecers
WWF Monday Night Raw - 1-2-3 Kid & Marty Jannetty Vs The Quebecers
Mar - WWF Wrestlemania X - Bret Hart Vs Owen Hart
WWF Wrestlemania X - Shawn Michaels Vs Razor Ramon
Jun - WWF King of the Ring - Bret Hart Vs Diesel
WWF King of the Ring - 1-2-3 Kid Vs Owen Hart
Jul - WWF Monday Night Raw - 1-2-3 Kid Vs Bret Hart
Aug - WWF Monday Night Raw - Shawn Michaels Vs Razor Ramon
WWF SummerSlam 94 - Bull Nakano Vs Alundra Blayze
WWF SummerSlam 94 - Owen Hart Vs Bret Hart
WWF Monday Night Raw - Owen Hart Vs 1-2-3 Kid
Sep - WWF Action Zone - Razor Ramon & 1-2-3 Kid Vs Shawn Michaels & Diesel
My favorite pay per view of the year was probably SummerSlam.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2019 15:02:53 GMT -5
1994:
not one of my fav years, but still had shades of old school wrestling and was still part of my fav time of wrestling! Wasnt really a fan of new generations stars bret,shawn,owen,diesel,razor taking over mainly. was still stuck on my old school guys the roster was losing many of them quick.
best: piper & mr perfect as guest referee's at wm10. this was literally the highlight of 1994 for me! 2 of my favs ever and wasnt expecting either one.
monday night raw. show was kickin ass and had many great matches & storylines.
roddy piper came back! even tho it was short lived, he was a fav of mine for sure. piper vs lawler was fun too.
taker vs yoko casket matches!
razor vs shawn ladder match!
bret/owen vs steiner bros (wrestlefest94 vhs tape)
double j, bigelow, tatanka, doink, evil crush, macho man, backlund, bundy, luger, headshrinkers
wrestlemania10 was my fav ppv of the year!
worst: new gen taking over golden era!
lack of old stars, hogan going to wcw!
rumble CO-WINNERS & taker vs taker? stupid!
no high profile bret/owen vs steiner bros match on a ppv!
no bret vs luger at wm10!
owen's push, esp kotr win. was never a big fan tbh.
rumble, kotr, summerslam, survivor series. didnt care for any of them really.
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