The Real Chillary
Main Eventer
Chillary since day one ish
Joined on: Aug 23, 2016 15:32:38 GMT -5
Posts: 1,181
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Post by The Real Chillary on Mar 17, 2019 7:27:33 GMT -5
I agree and disagree.
I watched Wrestlemania 17 yesterday with friends who are only used to modern day WWE. I felt so embarrassed during the Gimmick Battle Royal. While I love all types of wrestling, including gimmicks. Seeing crap like The Goon etc. was hard to deal with.
Also, it's evident most people in this thread don't know what a gimmick is.
Hogan, Macho Man etc. = Characters
Sgt. Slaughter, Repoman, The Mountie, Gangrel = Gimmicks
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Post by marino13 on Mar 17, 2019 9:39:53 GMT -5
I don't need too many gimmicks. Those days have passed. When we do get them, fans usually trash them anyway and the gimmick falls flat within weeks/months.
But I would like to see some more talent get their characters flushed out a bit more. What motivates them? Are they in it for money? Are they in it to avenge a friend? Why does Randy Orton have a problem with AJ? Why does Drew want to end the Shield? Why does Braun hate other people's property? What makes Dean a lunatic?
Give the fans a reason to care and they will. Give them talent coming to the ring for sh*ts and giggles, and don't be surprised if nobody knows how to react.
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Post by snowjorden on Mar 17, 2019 13:52:27 GMT -5
Full disclosure, I'm probably the wrong guy to comment on this. Reason being, I literally do NOT enjoy modern pro wrestling in America.
That said, I'll take a stab.
I looooove gimmicks. Mid-90s WWF gimmicks are what I grew up on. Why they've strayed has been mentioned many times so I won't rehash how WWE has become "reality" based.
What irks me is literally everyone on WWE TV just appears to be "playing" wrestler, as I've heard Jim Cornette actually say. You can see it just looking at them, they were childhood fans, this is all they wanted to do, so now they got trained and their on TV as the character, "childhood fan which became a good wrestler."
Laaaaaame.
Even the people who don't implicitly state the fact, you can still see it "in" them.
I won't even begin to complain about the lack of actual "working" and heat. Another issue all together.
Onto gimmicks!
- The sentiments about The Usos lack of gimmick, easily rectified. Why are they not The Head Shrinkers or Wild Samoans?
- Bray & Bo, Issac & Ian R. Schyster, tax collecting tag team brothers.
- If they're content on Randy Orton being the viper, I want a damn snake in a bag!!
- Curtis Axel, duh..
- Finn Balor should be the demon 24/7, ala a new day Undertaker / Papa Shango macabre gimmick.
Corny, cheesy, campy, whatever you want to call gimmicks, I'm all for them.
I guess what I really want is Pro Wrestling to come back in favor of Sports Entertainment.
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Browser Brody
POSSIBLE BAD TRADER
afka theworm
Joined on: Jan 28, 2015 11:04:52 GMT -5
Posts: 3,083
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Post by Browser Brody on Mar 17, 2019 15:16:48 GMT -5
It's not the lack of gimmicks that get me. It's the 50/50 booking. Tough to get behind someone who lost 2 of the last 3 matches on raw, only to win the US title in his 4th match.
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Post by Next Man’s Knowing Rock on Mar 17, 2019 15:39:13 GMT -5
Full disclosure, I'm probably the wrong guy to comment on this. Reason being, I literally do NOT enjoy modern pro wrestling in America. That said, I'll take a stab. I looooove gimmicks. Mid-90s WWF gimmicks are what I grew up on. Why they've strayed has been mentioned many times so I won't rehash how WWE has become "reality" based. What irks me is literally everyone on WWE TV just appears to be "playing" wrestler, as I've heard Jim Cornette actually say. You can see it just looking at them, they were childhood fans, this is all they wanted to do, so now they got trained and their on TV as the character, "childhood fan which became a good wrestler." Laaaaaame. Even the people who don't implicitly state the fact, you can still see it "in" them. I won't even begin to complain about the lack of actual "working" and heat. Another issue all together. Onto gimmicks!- The sentiments about The Usos lack of gimmick, easily rectified. Why are they not The Head Shrinkers or Wild Samoans? - Bray & Bo, Issac & Ian R. Schyster, tax collecting tag team brothers. - If they're content on Randy Orton being the viper, I want a damn snake in a bag!! - Curtis Axel, duh.. - Finn Balor should be the demon 24/7, ala a new day Undertaker / Papa Shango macabre gimmick. Corny, cheesy, campy, whatever you want to call gimmicks, I'm all for them. I guess what I really want is Pro Wrestling to come back in favor of Sports Entertainment. The WWF was calling itself sports entertainment before the Headshrinkers, IRS, Undertaker and Papa Shango debuted.
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Post by theoutlaw1999 on Mar 17, 2019 16:29:06 GMT -5
The way I see it a bad gimmick is always remembered but generic guys are always forgotten. To this day people still remember Doink the Clown, Repo Man etc but in 20 years time who will remember Alex Riley of Mason Ryan?
There are some gimmicks in todays WWE but booking completely ruins them. Take Dean Ambrose for example he was suppose to be an unhinged lunatic but then they decide to reveal on screen that he's married to Rene Young which basically killed the character.
The lack of character is another issue. I'm looking at the current NXT call ups and instead of fighting random matches they should be giving the audience a reason to care for them. Who is Aleister Black and why does he live in the darkside? Giving guys like him an interesting backstory would help.
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Post by cordless2016 on Mar 17, 2019 17:09:43 GMT -5
There are a lot of problems with wrestling today but this is a big one.
I’ve been saying for a long time that we’ll never see “larger than life characters” like Ric Flair, Randy Savage, Stone Cold, etc... ever again. Hell Batista didn’t have the larger than life character that the other guys had but he still gives off the aura of a star that nobody on the current roster has.
A guy like Johnny Gargano may be one of the best wrestlers in the world but he’ll never be someone who will help make wrestling main stream again.
The WWE is too busy trying to be “cool” and comparing themselves with the UFC. Everybody knows it’s fake but so is everything else on TV. They should embrace this and create over the top characters to make wrestling “fun” again.
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Post by cordless2016 on Mar 17, 2019 17:11:26 GMT -5
I agree and disagree. I watched Wrestlemania 17 yesterday with friends who are only used to modern day WWE. I felt so embarrassed during the Gimmick Battle Royal. While I love all types of wrestling, including gimmicks. Seeing crap like The Goon etc. was hard to deal with. Also, it's evident most people in this thread don't know what a gimmick is. Hogan, Macho Man etc. = Characters Sgt. Slaughter, Repoman, The Mountie, Gangrel = Gimmicks The “Macho Man” was a gimmick. The “Nature Boy” was a gimmick. “Stone Cold” was a gimmick. They transcended the traditional “regular guy” that everyone today plays.
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Deleted
Joined on: Mar 29, 2024 7:47:23 GMT -5
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Mar 17, 2019 18:34:03 GMT -5
Because they're worried Meltzer won't give them 5 stars.
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Post by stc13 on Mar 17, 2019 18:46:49 GMT -5
The most common gimmick seems to be "I'm just happy to be here" babyfaces. There's just no character development, even for the wrestlers that do have a clear gimmick. Similar in ring styles, promos that sound like they could have come from anyone on the roster, and very little depth or development of the motivations of the characters. As someone who didn't watch more than a couple of minutes of wrestling between 2001/2 and 2014/15, I was amazed how cookie cutter everything was when I got back into wrestling.
I came back and read people raving about Ambrose and Rollins. I was expecting the "lunatic fringe" to be some unhinged wildman, something akin to Jake Roberte, SCSA, Bruiser Brody, Terry Funk...someone who seems a little nuts, who you never knew just how far he would go, and struck fear into opponents. Instead I saw a guy who was...a brawler. And he would occasionally say something goofy in promos. Solid wrestler, solid promo. But there was nothing lunatic from what I've seen aside from the Mitch the Plant comedy stuff. Rollins? A great wrestler, but it's 4 years later and I still have no idea what his character is or what that character's motivation is. And that's no knock on either wrestler or the people who are fans, but for me there was just nothing that connected.
We don't need to go back to the days of Big Boss Man or Doink, but wrestlers need to have some character development beyond "wrestles really well" to hold my interest. There are some I like - Alexa Bliss has a decently developed character, the recent Gargano/Ciampa stuff in NXT has been a really well developed character arc, Wyatt at least has (had?) a gimmick and unique promo style. But it's not enough to make it must see tv for me.
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Post by Thought Collector on Mar 17, 2019 19:37:13 GMT -5
The most common gimmick seems to be "I'm just happy to be here" babyfaces. There's just no character development, even for the wrestlers that do have a clear gimmick. Similar in ring styles, promos that sound like they could have come from anyone on the roster, and very little depth or development of the motivations of the characters. As someone who didn't watch more than a couple of minutes of wrestling between 2001/2 and 2014/15, I was amazed how cookie cutter everything was when I got back into wrestling. I came back and read people raving about Ambrose and Rollins. I was expecting the "lunatic fringe" to be some unhinged wildman, something akin to Jake Roberte, SCSA, Bruiser Brody, Terry Funk...someone who seems a little nuts, who you never knew just how far he would go, and struck fear into opponents. Instead I saw a guy who was...a brawler. And he would occasionally say something goofy in promos. Solid wrestler, solid promo. But there was nothing lunatic from what I've seen aside from the Mitch the Plant comedy stuff. Rollins? A great wrestler, but it's 4 years later and I still have no idea what his character is or what that character's motivation is. And that's no knock on either wrestler or the people who are fans, but for me there was just nothing that connected. We don't need to go back to the days of Big Boss Man or Doink, but wrestlers need to have some character development beyond "wrestles really well" to hold my interest. There are some I like - Alexa Bliss has a decently developed character, the recent Gargano/Ciampa stuff in NXT has been a really well developed character arc, Wyatt at least has (had?) a gimmick and unique promo style. But it's not enough to make it must see tv for me. By all means I would love more than anything to be able to go back to Evil Doink if we could~R.I.P. Even a type of reboot if they could even find anyone that could come close to matching the talent and charisma of Matt Bourne and what he created with the role.
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Post by k5 on Mar 18, 2019 1:10:47 GMT -5
character development is what I see missing, not gimmicks themselves.
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Post by snowjorden on Mar 18, 2019 12:06:12 GMT -5
The most common gimmick seems to be "I'm just happy to be here" babyfaces. There's just no character development, even for the wrestlers that do have a clear gimmick. Similar in ring styles, promos that sound like they could have come from anyone on the roster, and very little depth or development of the motivations of the characters. As someone who didn't watch more than a couple of minutes of wrestling between 2001/2 and 2014/15, I was amazed how cookie cutter everything was when I got back into wrestling. I came back and read people raving about Ambrose and Rollins. I was expecting the "lunatic fringe" to be some unhinged wildman, something akin to Jake Roberte, SCSA, Bruiser Brody, Terry Funk...someone who seems a little nuts, who you never knew just how far he would go, and struck fear into opponents. Instead I saw a guy who was...a brawler. And he would occasionally say something goofy in promos. Solid wrestler, solid promo. But there was nothing lunatic from what I've seen aside from the Mitch the Plant comedy stuff. Rollins? A great wrestler, but it's 4 years later and I still have no idea what his character is or what that character's motivation is. And that's no knock on either wrestler or the people who are fans, but for me there was just nothing that connected. We don't need to go back to the days of Big Boss Man or Doink, but wrestlers need to have some character development beyond "wrestles really well" to hold my interest. There are some I like - Alexa Bliss has a decently developed character, the recent Gargano/Ciampa stuff in NXT has been a really well developed character arc, Wyatt at least has (had?) a gimmick and unique promo style. But it's not enough to make it must see tv for me. By all means I would love more than anything to be able to go back to Evil Doink if we could~R.I.P. Even a type of reboot if they could even find anyone that could come close to matching the talent and charisma of Matt Bourne and what he created with the role. Slater Gator Baby... That or he could be the reboot of Stang (right @vintagefigs1?) I'd love a repackage of WWE to be more gimmick based. I agree, Seth has no gimmick. Imagine Hawkins & Ryder as the new Killer Bees!
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Deleted
Joined on: Mar 29, 2024 7:47:24 GMT -5
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Mar 23, 2019 16:01:32 GMT -5
I don't need too many gimmicks. Those days have passed. When we do get them, fans usually trash them anyway and the gimmick falls flat within weeks/months. But I would like to see some more talent get their characters flushed out a bit more. What motivates them? Are they in it for money? Are they in it to avenge a friend? Why does Randy Orton have a problem with AJ? Why does Drew want to end the Shield? Why does Braun hate other people's property? What makes Dean a lunatic? Give the fans a reason to care and they will. Give them talent coming to the ring for sh*ts and giggles, and don't be surprised if nobody knows how to react. Yes on this. As an avid fan that only got back into Wrestling a few years ago (after not watching really at all since 2002) -- I see some wrestlers with pretty good characters and loose gimmicks that are subtle but they are never ever really given anything creative to sell it, like a vignette or a steady storyline. Here's a few examples: The Shield ... What are they motivated by? They apparently used to be a big deal but I wasn't around to see it. I'd have liked to be filled in on what makes them the Shield. The Usos ... how come they are just all of the sudden bad ass thug-like dudes who talk about their penitentiary? Dean Ambrose ... this one's easy -- why is he a lunatic and could we see him act like one? Randy Ortan ... why is he just a dick to everyone? Nakamara ... is he musician, what is his "art?" The Ascension ... Cult guys ... I get it but apparently no one cares anyway. Rollins ... What's he burning down? And if he's going to be a dude that does that, he should be a bit darker in character -- or I'm likely just reading too much into that. Recently, Allister Black and Richochet ... these guys have an awesome look and style but what makes them that way? They talk about Black as if he's this dark guy. Why, because he has metal entrance music and tattoos? Do more, do better than that. And Richochet is so slick in the ring but I feel like that will get stale after a while without any storyline or direction.
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Post by Gorilla on Mar 24, 2019 12:23:28 GMT -5
Gone are the good nicknames.
Bret the Hitman Hart Jim the Anvil Neidhart Macho Man Randy Savage The Million Dollar Man Ted DiBiase Ravishing Rick Rude Jake the Snake Roberts Hacksaw Jim Duggan Jimmy Superfly Snuka King Kong Bundy Brutus the Barber Beefcake Outlaw Ron Bass
Then full on gimmicks like: Akeem/One Man Gang Big Boss Man Mr Perfect Warlord Barbarian Ax Smash Hercules Earthquake Tugboat The Honky Tonk Man The Genius
There were guys with regular names, but they had a personality/gimmick that was identifiable. They also didn't flip between face and heel so much.
Dusty Rhodes was a face and a working class hero. Harley Race was a clear heel in the WWF Greg Valentine was a heel that wanted to break your leg Ronnie Garvin was a face and didn't need a nickname, he just wanted to Garvin stomp you to oblivion.
When someone like Jake Roberts turned heel, it was a big deal. Dean Ambrose turning heel? Who cares. He flips every other week.
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Post by TheSystem 1.5 on Mar 24, 2019 12:33:53 GMT -5
Gone are the good nicknames. Bret the Hitman Hart Jim the Anvil Neidhart Macho Man Randy Savage The Million Dollar Man Ted DiBiase Ravishing Rick Rude Jake the Snake Roberts Hacksaw Jim Duggan Jimmy Superfly Snuka King Kong Bundy Brutus the Barber Beefcake Outlaw Ron Bass Then full on gimmicks like: Akeem/One Man Gang Big Boss Man Mr Perfect Warlord Barbarian Ax Smash Hercules Earthquake Tugboat The Honky Tonk Man The Genius There were guys with regular names, but they had a personality/gimmick that was identifiable. They also didn't flip between face and heel so much. Dusty Rhodes was a face and a working class hero. Harley Race was a clear heel in the WWF Greg Valentine was a heel that wanted to break your leg Ronnie Garvin was a face and didn't need a nickname, he just wanted to Garvin stomp you to oblivion. When someone like Jake Roberts turned heel, it was a big deal. Dean Ambrose turning heel? Who cares. He flips every other week. Psst, Ronnie G had two nicknames
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Post by JC Motors on Mar 24, 2019 17:55:17 GMT -5
I miss the occupational gimmicks
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Post by Hulkster2001 on Mar 26, 2019 13:54:40 GMT -5
Because they're worried Meltzer won't give them 5 stars. Meltzer can kiss my @$$
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Post by HandsomeHollywood on Mar 26, 2019 18:10:51 GMT -5
I don't need too many gimmicks. Those days have passed. When we do get them, fans usually trash them anyway and the gimmick falls flat within weeks/months. But I would like to see some more talent get their characters flushed out a bit more. What motivates them? Are they in it for money? Are they in it to avenge a friend? Why does Randy Orton have a problem with AJ? Why does Drew want to end the Shield? Why does Braun hate other people's property? What makes Dean a lunatic? Give the fans a reason to care and they will. Give them talent coming to the ring for sh*ts and giggles, and don't be surprised if nobody knows how to react. Yes on this. As an avid fan that only got back into Wrestling a few years ago (after not watching really at all since 2002) -- I see some wrestlers with pretty good characters and loose gimmicks that are subtle but they are never ever really given anything creative to sell it, like a vignette or a steady storyline. Here's a few examples: The Shield ... What are they motivated by? They apparently used to be a big deal but I wasn't around to see it. I'd have liked to be filled in on what makes them the Shield. The Usos ... how come they are just all of the sudden bad ass thug-like dudes who talk about their penitentiary? Dean Ambrose ... this one's easy -- why is he a lunatic and could we see him act like one? Randy Ortan ... why is he just a dick to everyone? Nakamara ... is he musician, what is his "art?" The Ascension ... Cult guys ... I get it but apparently no one cares anyway. Rollins ... What's he burning down? And if he's going to be a dude that does that, he should be a bit darker in character -- or I'm likely just reading too much into that. Recently, Allister Black and Richochet ... these guys have an awesome look and style but what makes them that way? They talk about Black as if he's this dark guy. Why, because he has metal entrance music and tattoos? Do more, do better than that. And Richochet is so slick in the ring but I feel like that will get stale after a while without any storyline or direction. The Shield was not a bad idea at first. They generally stood for "injustice", which is something that would have had different implications depending on heel or face. As heels, when champion Punk would have the deck albeit justly stacked against him, The Shield would interfere seemingly to even the odds. They were eventually shown to be taken payment from Heyman though, so that kind of put the kybash on their whole thing. That's my main complaint. They have halfway decent ideas and don't go all the way with it. Seth Rollins is the pinnacle of what a lack of gimmicks or attention to character work can do. Rollins seemingly has no motivation or real character other than smiling Babyface. He's been "made" so many different times now it's hard to buy. Winning MITB after being the breakout of The Shield. Winning the damn title. Turning babyface on, then defeating Triple H. Proving himself a workhorse with the Intercontinental title. Winning the Royal Rumble. How many times is this guy going to be booked to "finally" grab the brass ring? That's enough push starting points to cover a few guys' breakouts. His babyface turn is a prime example of the lack of logic involved in WWE's writing. He didn't really turn babyface, was mad that Triple H just handed Owens the Universal title...the same thing he was willing to accept in the same damn match. Where is the point that I'm supposed to care at, besides t-shirt designs, monikers and catch phrases?
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Post by Codyverse: Tag Team Champion on Mar 27, 2019 8:58:31 GMT -5
Becky Lynch is a man... so..
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