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Post by 5th Horsewoman on Apr 2, 2019 8:51:28 GMT -5
Spot on. WWE is one of the most disgusting corporations around, honestly. I bet you'll continue to support it though.
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Post by k5 on Apr 2, 2019 8:52:18 GMT -5
I’d say though my only gripe with the segment was when he used that old clip of Bret he then brought up Owen’s death as something Bret was bitter about the business for but to my knowledge Bret doesn’t blame WWE for Owen’s death. Bret sided with Martha Hart during her lawsuit and settlement with WWE, so he certainly did blame them.
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Gargano
Mid-Carder
Joined on: Feb 1, 2019 14:49:55 GMT -5
Posts: 470
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Post by Gargano on Apr 2, 2019 8:58:30 GMT -5
Spot on. WWE is one of the most disgusting corporations around, honestly. I bet you'll continue to support it though. If by supporting it, you mean going to sites that WWE doesn't own to watch it, yes, yes I will.
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Post by 5th Horsewoman on Apr 2, 2019 10:47:53 GMT -5
I bet you'll continue to support it though. If by supporting it, you mean going to sites that WWE doesn't own to watch it, yes, yes I will. If you stream shows on those sites that means Vince shouldn't care what you think.
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Post by FLUX '97 on Apr 2, 2019 11:12:16 GMT -5
Twitter responses coming in... Notice how all of these people are former employees who are pissy and bitter about their time in WWE...and Vampiro. lmfao.
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Post by Angel Beast on Apr 2, 2019 11:27:02 GMT -5
I’d say though my only gripe with the segment was when he used that old clip of Bret he then brought up Owen’s death as something Bret was bitter about the business for but to my knowledge Bret doesn’t blame WWE for Owen’s death. Bret sided with Martha Hart during her lawsuit and settlement with WWE, so he certainly did blame them. Well I’ll rephrase it to no longer blames them then cause I saw and interview with him saying it was an accident.
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Thunder Chunky
Main Eventer
Joined on: Aug 1, 2010 21:57:30 GMT -5
Posts: 4,494
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Post by Thunder Chunky on Apr 2, 2019 12:03:19 GMT -5
Twitter responses coming in... Notice how all of these people are former employees who are pissy and bitter about their time in WWE...and Vampiro. lmfao. Well a current employee wouldnt say anything because they would risk losing their job.
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Post by theMOESIAH on Apr 2, 2019 13:31:43 GMT -5
Twitter responses coming in... Notice how all of these people are former employees who are pissy and bitter about their time in WWE...and Vampiro. lmfao. Are all of them pissy and bitter? That's funny, I don't recall hearing any complaints from Lance Storm, Barrio, Colt Cabana or Vito. Nothing pubic from Big Vito anyway. And while WWE out the only major player *now* you know that wasn't always the case, right? They aren't the only ones who use wrestlers as independent contractors.
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Post by FLUX '97 on Apr 2, 2019 13:57:04 GMT -5
Notice how all of these people are former employees who are pissy and bitter about their time in WWE...and Vampiro. lmfao. Are all of them pissy and bitter? That's funny, I don't recall hearing any complaints from Lance Storm, Barrio, Colt Cabana or Vito. Nothing pubic from Big Vito anyway. And while WWE out the only major player *now* you know that wasn't always the case, right? They aren't the only ones who use wrestlers as independent contractors. Storm's probably the only one besides Vampiro who has a neutral stance on the matter. Barrio and Rich Brennan were both upset because they were fired instead of Tom Phillips. We all know the situation with Punk and Cabana. Vito was part of the concussion lawsuit against WWE that got thrown out late last year.
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Post by theMOESIAH on Apr 2, 2019 17:10:22 GMT -5
Are all of them pissy and bitter? That's funny, I don't recall hearing any complaints from Lance Storm, Barrio, Colt Cabana or Vito. Nothing pubic from Big Vito anyway. And while WWE out the only major player *now* you know that wasn't always the case, right? They aren't the only ones who use wrestlers as independent contractors. Storm's probably the only one besides Vampiro who has a neutral stance on the matter. Barrio and Rich Brennan were both upset because they were fired instead of Tom Phillips. We all know the situation with Punk and Cabana. Vito was part of the concussion lawsuit against WWE that got thrown out late last year. I'm not too familiar with the situation with Barrio and Rich Brennan so I'll leave that one alone. And I forgot about Vito being a part of the concussion suit. Depending on when he suffered his concussion he may or may not have a valid point. If he never had any before signing with WWE I think he's justified. But I have no idea what how medical history is. As far as Colt Cabana goes, all he did was offer Punk a platform to tell his story. I'm not aware of him every badmouthing the company.
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Post by marino13 on Apr 2, 2019 18:29:38 GMT -5
Do we have to keep quoting the wall of tweets?
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Post by Cassa Nova Kid on Apr 2, 2019 18:48:53 GMT -5
Do we have to keep quoting the wall of tweets? Only if there is a Spider-Man meme that says to stop lol
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Post by bababooey on Apr 2, 2019 21:10:45 GMT -5
I didn’t watch he segment but from reading reactions I’m assuming it was fairly well done at least. I’m an accountant but tax and labor laws have always been a minefield of confusion for me.
Based on my limited understanding of the matter, I’d argue that WWE talent would meet the criteria of being legally considered employees. They are told what to do, when to do it, where to do it, and how to do it. They are provided the materials/equipment to do their jobs, and WWE retains the intellectual property to their work. Also, in most cases, WWE talent are exclusive to WWE.
I worked at a job very early in my career, and was under the impression I was an employee but the next year I received a 1099 in the mail. They guy I had been working for listed me as a contractor. I ended having to pay self-employment taxes, and since I didn’t have any expenses to write off I ended up having to pay a big chunk of money I didn’t really have at the time.
I mention that story because it kinda relates to the talents’ tax situation. Since they are “contractors” they likely have to pay self-employment taxes. I’m not sure if that’s a thing in every state, but I have heard a lot of wrestlers live in Florida for favorable tax laws. Writing off the expenses would require them to keep good records of all their receipts and amounts. It would also require them to actually file their taxes (many wrestlers have had tax troubles).
I’m sure at the end of the day wrestlers are considered contractors through some kind of loophole. I think where WWE ends up winning the argument is that as far as I know every promotion considers the talent contractors. It’s an industry standard, so there isn’t a strong argument to hold WWE to a different standard. Also, if something were to really happen, it would require all the talent to get on the same page and get organized. That’s usually where the whole fight falls apart. Too many different views.
In WWE’s defense, I will say that they probably do provide the talent with more perks and benefits than most in not all other promotions. Who else is paying for talent’s rehab? The catering is probably better than anywhere else. They have trainers, a performance center, global marketing exposure, outside opportunities, and if they leave they can get more money where the move on to.
The other big thing working against wrestlers is that everyone knows they’d happily do the same work outside of WWE for a fraction of the money, or for free.
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banthafett
Mid-Carder
Joined on: Jan 15, 2012 13:20:21 GMT -5
Posts: 413
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Post by banthafett on Apr 3, 2019 10:58:06 GMT -5
Current roster wont say anything public, but Romans hair was sure DRY this week.
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Post by rowdy1971 on Apr 3, 2019 15:45:54 GMT -5
Finally watched this and it was both funny and sad. Wish Oliver would have known that Savage and Roddy didn't die because of drugs and whatnot because in a way that's what it seemed to insinuate. But a solid piece. But all these workers that work for other companies like Impact and whatnot. Aren't they considered independent contractors as well? Didn't WCW, ECW, and doesn't ROH and whatnot consider them CIs as well? How come they aren't being called to the table on this? Just because it's the big, bad WWE?
This is a big problem and again, a real solid piece and will it make a change? Probably not. But let's point the fingers at everyone and not just Vince.
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Post by k5 on Apr 4, 2019 1:14:16 GMT -5
Finally watched this and it was both funny and sad. Wish Oliver would have known that Savage and Roddy didn't die because of drugs and whatnot because in a way that's what it seemed to insinuate. But a solid piece. But all these workers that work for other companies like Impact and whatnot. Aren't they considered independent contractors as well? Didn't WCW, ECW, and doesn't ROH and whatnot consider them CIs as well? How come they aren't being called to the table on this? Just because it's the big, bad WWE? This is a big problem and again, a real solid piece and will it make a change? Probably not. But let's point the fingers at everyone and not just Vince. you think that piper and savage’s deaths weren’t drug related? considering Piper did mountains of cocaine at one time and both guys used gear, I can’t agree.
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Post by rowdy1971 on Apr 4, 2019 10:10:10 GMT -5
Finally watched this and it was both funny and sad. Wish Oliver would have known that Savage and Roddy didn't die because of drugs and whatnot because in a way that's what it seemed to insinuate. But a solid piece. But all these workers that work for other companies like Impact and whatnot. Aren't they considered independent contractors as well? Didn't WCW, ECW, and doesn't ROH and whatnot consider them CIs as well? How come they aren't being called to the table on this? Just because it's the big, bad WWE? This is a big problem and again, a real solid piece and will it make a change? Probably not. But let's point the fingers at everyone and not just Vince. you think that piper and savage’s deaths weren’t drug related? considering Piper did mountains of cocaine at one time and both guys used gear, I can’t agree. No, drugs had nothing to do with Pipers death. The official cause on the death certificate is: "heart attack triggered by a pulmonary embolism in his lungs". Basically it was due to blood clots. It had nothing to do with drugs no matter what he use to do. As for Savage. The official cause of his death was: "the actual cause of death was ruled to be a result of heart disease – essentially, Savage’s heart quit." Sometimes the heart just quits. There were no illegal drugs found in Randy's system. In those two cases drugs were ruled out. So agree or not. That's why they died. Now I'm sure that previous stuff they did surly didn't help out any. But any of these deaths can happen to any of us no matter what previous drug use that was done.
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Post by k5 on Apr 4, 2019 11:27:52 GMT -5
you think that piper and savage’s deaths weren’t drug related? considering Piper did mountains of cocaine at one time and both guys used gear, I can’t agree. No, drugs had nothing to do with Pipers death. The official cause on the death certificate is: "heart attack triggered by a pulmonary embolism in his lungs". Basically it was due to blood clots. It had nothing to do with drugs no matter what he use to do. As for Savage. The official cause of his death was: "the actual cause of death was ruled to be a result of heart disease – essentially, Savage’s heart quit." Sometimes the heart just quits. There were no illegal drugs found in Randy's system. In those two cases drugs were ruled out. So agree or not. That's why they died. Now I'm sure that previous stuff they did surly didn't help out any. But any of these deaths can happen to any of us no matter what previous drug use that was done. I suppose we’re splitting hairs here. If you were a drug addict for years and developed a bad heart, and then quit but from a heart attack years later - it’s like sure, the toxicology report is going to rule out drugs in the system at the time, but cocaine and steroids are both toxic to the heart. also cocaine promotes blood clotting. so I think to not include those deaths as premature deaths as a result of a wrestling lifestyle would be incorrect. I get what you’re saying, correlation is not causation, but they are nevertheless wrestlers who died young from their bodies giving out.
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Post by rowdy1971 on Apr 4, 2019 11:39:02 GMT -5
No, drugs had nothing to do with Pipers death. The official cause on the death certificate is: "heart attack triggered by a pulmonary embolism in his lungs". Basically it was due to blood clots. It had nothing to do with drugs no matter what he use to do. As for Savage. The official cause of his death was: "the actual cause of death was ruled to be a result of heart disease – essentially, Savage’s heart quit." Sometimes the heart just quits. There were no illegal drugs found in Randy's system. In those two cases drugs were ruled out. So agree or not. That's why they died. Now I'm sure that previous stuff they did surly didn't help out any. But any of these deaths can happen to any of us no matter what previous drug use that was done. I suppose we’re splitting hairs here. If you were a drug addict for years and developed a bad heart, and then quit but from a heart attack years later - it’s like sure, the toxicology report is going to rule out drugs in the system at the time, but cocaine and steroids are both toxic to the heart. also cocaine promotes blood clotting. so I think to not include those deaths as premature deaths as a result of a wrestling lifestyle would be incorrect. I get what you’re saying, correlation is not causation, but they are nevertheless wrestlers who died young from their bodies giving out. I totally agree but then again I just want to believe that Piper and Savage passed away naturally. I'm just happy that they didn't go the way Mr. Perfect did if that makes any sense.
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Post by PJ on Apr 4, 2019 17:44:22 GMT -5
Bret sided with Martha Hart during her lawsuit and settlement with WWE, so he certainly did blame them. Well I’ll rephrase it to no longer blames them then cause I saw and interview with him saying it was an accident. Just because Bret said it was an accident doesn’t mean he can’t still be bitter and blame them for it. Things like that happen in the world all the time.
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