mmondrag96
Main Eventer
43 refs and counting
Joined on: Apr 10, 2010 12:35:28 GMT -5
Posts: 2,917
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Post by mmondrag96 on Jul 11, 2019 18:02:13 GMT -5
Empty shelves
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Deleted
Joined on: Mar 29, 2024 10:41:34 GMT -5
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jul 11, 2019 20:00:01 GMT -5
And for the love of everything holy, look at my sig and please tell me why one of the most requested flashbacks of the last 10 years has never been made...
McMahon/WWE that is why.
He is not even listed on the WWE Alumni page, that IMO indicates they don't care too much for Hercules.
If Jakks, who were signing deals directly with talent, never made a figure of him then I doubt Mattel will. Mattel are at the mercy of WWE, they only make whomever is signed to a legends deal and it doesn't look like WWE have any interest in signing a deal with Herc's estate.
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Post by CM Poor: DeepFigureValue on Jul 12, 2019 8:57:35 GMT -5
And for the love of everything holy, look at my sig and please tell me why one of the most requested flashbacks of the last 10 years has never been made...McMahon/WWE that is why. He is not even listed on the WWE Alumni page, that IMO indicates they don't care too much for Hercules.
If Jakks, who were signing deals directly with talent, never made a figure of him then I doubt Mattel will. Mattel are at the mercy of WWE, they only make whomever is signed to a legends deal and it doesn't look like WWE have any interest in signing a deal with Herc's estate.
I was waiting for somebody to finally say this. I always thought it had been pretty well established that whatever outlet Jakks had in place to sign likeness deals with legends or alumni not currently contracted in some fashion with the WWE system is something that, for whatever reason, isn't available to Mattel. Harping on Mattel for failing to produce anywhere near the depth of legends Jakks produced, given the difference in their respective abilities to do so, is about as productive as beating the skeletal remains of a dead horse. That's not to say anything for the names on some of those lists (the one that jumped out at me, for whatever reason, was Disco Inferno) that are currently working, in some capacity or another, with competing organizations.
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Post by stc13 on Jul 12, 2019 9:25:05 GMT -5
McMahon/WWE that is why. He is not even listed on the WWE Alumni page, that IMO indicates they don't care too much for Hercules.
If Jakks, who were signing deals directly with talent, never made a figure of him then I doubt Mattel will. Mattel are at the mercy of WWE, they only make whomever is signed to a legends deal and it doesn't look like WWE have any interest in signing a deal with Herc's estate.
I was waiting for somebody to finally say this. I always thought it had been pretty well established that whatever outlet Jakks had in place to sign likeness deals with legends or alumni not currently contracted in some fashion with the WWE system is something that, for whatever reason, isn't available to Mattel. Harping on Mattel for failing to produce anywhere near the depth of legends Jakks produced, given the difference in their respective abilities to do so, is about as productive as beating the skeletal remains of a dead horse. That's not to say anything for the names on some of those lists (the one that jumped out at me, for whatever reason, was Disco Inferno) that are currently working, in some capacity or another, with competing organizations. There has never been anything stated that Mattel can't sign legends directly. Simply that they don't. Mattel initially signed direct deals with talent (I believe Bruno, Bret Hart, Crush, Martel, and Savage were all on direct deals initially). After the Legends line was cancelled, they eventually worked some of those guys into the Elite line as Flashbacks (Bruno, Crush) before their contracts expired to recoup some costs, but it was implied that those deals didn't work out well financially. A few years later, Mattel said that only use talent signed to Legends deals. A lot of it comes down to money. Wrestlers under Legends deals are paid from WWE's cut of the profits. Anyone Mattel signs would come out of Mattel's cut. Maybe something did change with WWE and they prevent direct contracts, but that seems unlikely since 2K still does direct deals with some talent. Ultimately it is what it is, and I don't expect anything to change at this point. But there is a huge difference between CAN'T and WON'T. If Mattel simply keeps pumping out the same repaints year after year because some corporate exec decided it's cheaper than signing wrestlers directly, then collectors have every right to be frustrated.
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Post by CM Poor: DeepFigureValue on Jul 12, 2019 10:14:55 GMT -5
I was waiting for somebody to finally say this. I always thought it had been pretty well established that whatever outlet Jakks had in place to sign likeness deals with legends or alumni not currently contracted in some fashion with the WWE system is something that, for whatever reason, isn't available to Mattel. Harping on Mattel for failing to produce anywhere near the depth of legends Jakks produced, given the difference in their respective abilities to do so, is about as productive as beating the skeletal remains of a dead horse. That's not to say anything for the names on some of those lists (the one that jumped out at me, for whatever reason, was Disco Inferno) that are currently working, in some capacity or another, with competing organizations. There has never been anything stated that Mattel can't sign legends directly. Simply that they don't. Mattel initially signed direct deals with talent (I believe Bruno, Bret Hart, Crush, Martel, and Savage were all on direct deals initially). After the Legends line was cancelled, they eventually worked some of those guys into the Elite line as Flashbacks (Bruno, Crush) before their contracts expired to recoup some costs, but it was implied that those deals didn't work out well financially. A few years later, Mattel said that only use talent signed to Legends deals.A lot of it comes down to money. Wrestlers under Legends deals are paid from WWE's cut of the profits. Anyone Mattel signs would come out of Mattel's cut. Maybe something did change with WWE and they prevent direct contracts, but that seems unlikely since 2K still does direct deals with some talent. Ultimately it is what it is, and I don't expect anything to change at this point. But there is a huge difference between CAN'T and WON'T. If Mattel simply keeps pumping out the same repaints year after year because some corporate exec decided it's cheaper than signing wrestlers directly, then collectors have every right to be frustrated. Ah, ok. That makes a bit more sense. I'd have missed that initial run, as I didn't hop on board with Mattel 'til way, way late in the game. Without seeing any documentation or getting a firm, detailed response one way or the other, I suppose it's all up to speculation. Nevertheless, I wouldn't be surprised if there were some sort of language in Mattel's agreement that prevented them from doing direct deals, at least as it stands today. WWE seems much more invested in the marketing strategy of the 2K games, so while they do direct deals from time to time, I'd imagine there's a bit of final say in that regard that they may exert to ensure that any names or faces that pop up in the game are ones that corporate would be comfortable promoting. Where their involvement in the action figure line seems significantly lower, I could at least envision some sort of fail safe in place to prevent the WWE brand being associated with talents Mattel could presumably sign that there may be less than amicable relationships with. All speculation, of course.
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Post by theicwguy on Jul 12, 2019 11:23:06 GMT -5
Some sort of scale
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Deleted
Joined on: Mar 29, 2024 10:41:34 GMT -5
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2019 13:25:25 GMT -5
I was waiting for somebody to finally say this. I always thought it had been pretty well established that whatever outlet Jakks had in place to sign likeness deals with legends or alumni not currently contracted in some fashion with the WWE system is something that, for whatever reason, isn't available to Mattel. Harping on Mattel for failing to produce anywhere near the depth of legends Jakks produced, given the difference in their respective abilities to do so, is about as productive as beating the skeletal remains of a dead horse. That's not to say anything for the names on some of those lists (the one that jumped out at me, for whatever reason, was Disco Inferno) that are currently working, in some capacity or another, with competing organizations. There has never been anything stated that Mattel can't sign legends directly. Simply that they don't. Mattel initially signed direct deals with talent (I believe Bruno, Bret Hart, Crush, Martel, and Savage were all on direct deals initially). After the Legends line was cancelled, they eventually worked some of those guys into the Elite line as Flashbacks (Bruno, Crush) before their contracts expired to recoup some costs, but it was implied that those deals didn't work out well financially. A few years later, Mattel said that only use talent signed to Legends deals. A lot of it comes down to money. Wrestlers under Legends deals are paid from WWE's cut of the profits. Anyone Mattel signs would come out of Mattel's cut. Maybe something did change with WWE and they prevent direct contracts, but that seems unlikely since 2K still does direct deals with some talent. Ultimately it is what it is, and I don't expect anything to change at this point. But there is a huge difference between CAN'T and WON'T. If Mattel simply keeps pumping out the same repaints year after year because some corporate exec decided it's cheaper than signing wrestlers directly, then collectors have every right to be frustrated.
We will never have official confirmation but Bill did state a while back that WWE has final approval. This presumably was regarding designs of figures and which versions of a character can be made but it may also extend to which wrestlers can be made and which ones cannot. Bill also mentioned in some Q & A that most of his requests (regarding which wrestlers he wanted them to sign so he can make figs of them) were approved, while a few were not. It would be interesting to know which wrestlers WWE would not allow Mattel to make figures of but with all their secrecy that will never happen. Regardless of whether they can sign legends to deals or not, there are not many 'big' names left to be signed that would be worth it for them- Dynamite Kid & the Steiners are two that are fairly popular and would be worth it to sign.
You can add Bundy, Demolition & Warrior to your list, they also signed directly with Mattel. Interesting that Bruno signed a deal with Mattel even though he agreed to be induced into the HOF. It looks like most legends do not like these restrictive legends deals that WWE offers.
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Post by stc13 on Jul 12, 2019 15:38:44 GMT -5
There has never been anything stated that Mattel can't sign legends directly. Simply that they don't. Mattel initially signed direct deals with talent (I believe Bruno, Bret Hart, Crush, Martel, and Savage were all on direct deals initially). After the Legends line was cancelled, they eventually worked some of those guys into the Elite line as Flashbacks (Bruno, Crush) before their contracts expired to recoup some costs, but it was implied that those deals didn't work out well financially. A few years later, Mattel said that only use talent signed to Legends deals. A lot of it comes down to money. Wrestlers under Legends deals are paid from WWE's cut of the profits. Anyone Mattel signs would come out of Mattel's cut. Maybe something did change with WWE and they prevent direct contracts, but that seems unlikely since 2K still does direct deals with some talent. Ultimately it is what it is, and I don't expect anything to change at this point. But there is a huge difference between CAN'T and WON'T. If Mattel simply keeps pumping out the same repaints year after year because some corporate exec decided it's cheaper than signing wrestlers directly, then collectors have every right to be frustrated.
We will never have official confirmation but Bill did state a while back that WWE has final approval. This presumably was regarding designs of figures and which versions of a character can be made but it may also extend to which wrestlers can be made and which ones cannot. Bill also mentioned in some Q & A that most of his requests (regarding which wrestlers he wanted them to sign so he can make figs of them) were approved, while a few were not. It would be interesting to know which wrestlers WWE would not allow Mattel to make figures of but with all their secrecy that will never happen. Regardless of whether they can sign legends to deals or not, there are not many 'big' names left to be signed that would be worth it for them- Dynamite Kid & the Steiners are two that are fairly popular and would be worth it to sign.
You can add Bundy, Demolition & Warrior to your list, they also signed directly with Mattel. Interesting that Bruno signed a deal with Mattel even though he agreed to be induced into the HOF. It looks like most legends do not like these restrictive legends deals that WWE offers.
Scott Steiner has been quoted a few times basically saying the Legends deals are trash. I assumed it was him being his hyperbolic self, and then I actually read the the contract language. It's not a good deal for most living wrestlers. At this point there's a pretty long list of HoF'ers who don't seem to have signed licensing deals. Some of the bigger names (Dynamite, Steiner, Ventura) left may or may not want to sign. But I think it could be a worthwhile investment to sign some lower card guys just to keep fresh names cycling. Collector engagement has to be near an all-time low, and you can only pump out the same names over and over for so long before you lose your audience.
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FUSamBaker
Main Eventer
Biggest crush on Sami Zayn.
Joined on: Sept 6, 2005 19:25:20 GMT -5
Posts: 3,107
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Post by FUSamBaker on Jul 12, 2019 15:42:56 GMT -5
Dang I’ve gotten like 50 likes on my “unproduced figures and one per case store exclusives” comment 😂 We all know what’s up
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Post by theoutlaw1999 on Jul 12, 2019 15:45:13 GMT -5
So many of Mattel's are exclusives so they're much harder to find than Jakks.
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Post by PJ on Jul 13, 2019 4:39:06 GMT -5
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Post by ~*Young $ Money*~ on Jul 13, 2019 6:53:51 GMT -5
We will never have official confirmation but Bill did state a while back that WWE has final approval. This presumably was regarding designs of figures and which versions of a character can be made but it may also extend to which wrestlers can be made and which ones cannot. Bill also mentioned in some Q & A that most of his requests (regarding which wrestlers he wanted them to sign so he can make figs of them) were approved, while a few were not. It would be interesting to know which wrestlers WWE would not allow Mattel to make figures of but with all their secrecy that will never happen. Regardless of whether they can sign legends to deals or not, there are not many 'big' names left to be signed that would be worth it for them- Dynamite Kid & the Steiners are two that are fairly popular and would be worth it to sign. You can add Bundy, Demolition & Warrior to your list, they also signed directly with Mattel. Interesting that Bruno signed a deal with Mattel even though he agreed to be induced into the HOF. It looks like most legends do not like these restrictive legends deals that WWE offers.
Scott Steiner has been quoted a few times basically saying the Legends deals are trash. I assumed it was him being his hyperbolic self, and then I actually read the the contract language. It's not a good deal for most living wrestlers. At this point there's a pretty long list of HoF'ers who don't seem to have signed licensing deals. Some of the bigger names (Dynamite, Steiner, Ventura) left may or may not want to sign. But I think it could be a worthwhile investment to sign some lower card guys just to keep fresh names cycling. Collector engagement has to be near an all-time low, and you can only pump out the same names over and over for so long before you lose your audience. 100% agree. I’m so tired of the same Warrior,Macho man and Undertaker. I know they had a ton of gear and looks but enough is enough already. I want obscurity in my collection. They gave us one flashback Mark Henry which should have had 2. Sexual Chocolate and Nation. Hall is the same thing also. How many NWO Halls do we need? Razor got one release and that was it. He should have gotten at least one more. I just like and need variety. No collection looks good without it.
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Post by BoJack Hogan on Jul 13, 2019 8:53:56 GMT -5
Randy Savage Liz Rick Steamboat Animal in Road Warrior attire Kamala without ridiculous calf straps or Yoko foot supporters A non-obese Typhoon/Vader/Earthquake Von Erichs Realistic scale Non-baffling accessories (minus the surf board that came with that Uso battle pack and the Luke Harper with not one but 2 Steamboat dragons!) The Bunny Razor Ramon in Miami hustler vignette attire Slaughter and Snuka attires that nobody asked for or wanted George Steele that was spit on and rolled in cigarette ash Blue shorts Hogan BEFORE Hollywood and Hulk Still Rules The worst distribution in the history of wrestling figures Harley Race unicorn figure And enough frustration that I completely quit collecting wrestling figures and moved on to Marvel Legends
So a bit of a mixed bag.
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Post by Angel Beast on Jul 13, 2019 17:48:55 GMT -5
No “Chinese New Year”.
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Post by rKoNomad316 on Jul 13, 2019 20:16:06 GMT -5
Actual figure related accessories/better accessories. Mattel belts are way better looking then Jakks. Also how many times did Jakks repack that same tire or lead pipe?
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Deleted
Joined on: Mar 29, 2024 10:41:34 GMT -5
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jul 14, 2019 1:22:03 GMT -5
I'm definitely in the minority here but I love the fact that Mattel released a Ringmaster figure.
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tmorris686
Mid-Carder
Joined on: Dec 2, 2017 20:02:23 GMT -5
Posts: 403
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Post by tmorris686 on Jul 14, 2019 6:55:12 GMT -5
I'm definitely in the minority here but I love the fact that Mattel released a Ringmaster figure. Make that two of us! I love the figure.
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Post by LA Times on Jul 14, 2019 7:05:40 GMT -5
I'm definitely in the minority here but I love the fact that Mattel released a Ringmaster figure. Make that two of us! I love the figure. Me three. The figure was released with no announcement or previews whatsoever and I remember rushing to my toys r us to buy it when a member here reported the finding. Pleasant surprise
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Post by TheHitmanKid on Jul 14, 2019 9:20:12 GMT -5
Mattel offered us more accurate parts and height than Jakks has.
A Paul Bearer figure taller than Undertaker. C'mon Jakks lol
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Post by micco on Jul 14, 2019 10:50:18 GMT -5
Jakks gave us a couple of great Stings.
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