DrakeParker
Superstar
WF 10+ Year Member
If you dislike Vince McMahon, Hulk Hogan, or THE DISCO INFERNO, You are a WHINER BABA BOOEY PRAG!
Joined on: Apr 3, 2011 9:04:57 GMT -5
Posts: 847
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Post by DrakeParker on Aug 1, 2021 10:23:44 GMT -5
The problem I have with all of the rhetoric I've seen about what "we" have to do so that "we" can get this project backed is that, however selfish it may come off, I don't collect for other people. I collect for me. I don't need Diesel. I don't need Doink. I don't need the entrance stage, and I have no room for a ring. There's exactly no ROI on my $250 without having to put in the legwork to turn around and flip it. That game was fun for a while at the start of the store exclusives campaign, but I simply don't have the energy to put into that sort of endeavor nowadays. I hate to tell you, but this isn't a team effort. If 5,000 can't see the value for their $250, then exactly none of that falls on me. Exactly! Not only do we not "Have to do it", the people that are being a BABA BOOEY and putting the blame on us or fellow collectors are only putting a worse taste in our mouths to future similar promotions. |
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Post by Chip on Aug 1, 2021 10:25:37 GMT -5
I think you listened to a different MajorPod than I did, because frankly the only one of them who dissented a bit was Mark. Brian and Matt basically were in the “we understand people’s issues, but it should still be backed” camp. As for value, I really don’t think that’s the issue. At retail by themselves, that ring goes for between $100 and $120, Diesel is $30-$35, and the entrance stage would be between $90 and $100. Even if you take the low-end prices (which they wouldn’t sell for) that’s about $220-$230. The bigger issue is that not enough people display/buy rings to justify buying one that size. That’s a big factor in my decision-making. Brian and Mark both said it wasn’t worth $250, Brian said $170-200 max…Matt also agreed before he and he said they know about production costs, also said the ring skirts aren’t value or enough of an incentive, he also said Mattel need to add more products/figures to this to make it value. Matt back tracked a little bit because he’s desperate for this to be successful to open the door to more opportunities. They just backed it anyway because they feel like they have to (Mark did it during the recording even though he said he didn’t think it was worth it) - these guys have to buy it and let’s face it, money is no issue to them. Matt bought 4 didn’t he?! Lol. If you’re a regular listener, you know when they’re hyped on something, they struggled to sell this set to the listener. They want this to get backed because they want the possibles in the future, they don’t want this product. Backing it for that reason is a gamble, what if the next one sucks? Again, it’s fine for those guys but your average collector might end up ‘needing’ to spend $1000 on products before they get the one they really want. Those guys aren’t the bible, they get loads wrong all the time for so called experts, they didn’t even realise the Undertaker UE head sucks and the others are incorrect until it was pointed out to them…but they’re entertaining and good at what they do, they couldn’t sell this item, they didn’t even sound excited, Matt was just desperate for people to spend money on this so he gets more stuff down the road. Certainly at 5k level this is not worth $250, no way. IMO it’s still not at 8K but at least with doink it feels slightly better. It’s not getting to 8K though. i havent gotten to this episode yet, but that kinda bums me out that they are so negative on it, those guys are HUGE influencers in this hobby and i feel like if anyone could have swayed more people it's them. i hope collectors realize that if this doesnt get backed, we'll most likely never see another scale ring for our WWE figures mattel execs wont see the value in producing it with no retailers on board, and walmart/target are never going to give that much shelf space to that kind of an item |
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Post by Cammi Oh on Aug 1, 2021 10:29:33 GMT -5
I respectfully disagree. I am not buying it to vote "NO" with my dollars.
I WILL back something that I find worthy to me. Not worthy to me is subjective, yes, but it is my money and my opinion. Don't fall for scare tactics that if you don't buy this they will never try again.
These are toys and collectibles, if they make it so we cannot access all of them (countless exclusives that sell out immediately or are only offered in specific stores that cannot stock enough for the average collector), then we don't need this either.
If they read any of this, they can see why it is not funded already. A LOT of people do NOT want another giant ring. They don't seem too interested in Diesel. It it GOOD for Mattel to see that we are not sheep who will just throw money down for anything.
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wrestlingfan0815
Main Eventer
Joined on: Mar 28, 2018 15:26:43 GMT -5
Posts: 3,908
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Post by wrestlingfan0815 on Aug 1, 2021 10:42:28 GMT -5
For that price i wouldn’t be surprised if it doesn’t go over.
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carsonalt
Mid-Carder
Joined on: Mar 17, 2021 5:50:10 GMT -5
Posts: 81 
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Post by carsonalt on Aug 1, 2021 10:59:39 GMT -5
This. We don’t *need* to back anything. Mattel *needs* to create a better product. I already see the writing on the wall. When this fails, they’ll start pulling back on flashback names in the line, offering less unique pieces and obscure names, and they’ll blame it on this. “Well consumer interest isn’t there.” No, the interest just isn’t there in what you specifically offered. Bill makes oddball decisions based on his own opinions, not consumer wants. This in a nutshell. Bill designs for his wants, not so much anything else. Time to stop enabling him. This crowdfunding blowing up in his face is a start. I doubt they make decisions on their wants. I’d bet an Ultimate Diesel they made this based on data driven decisions. Some set of data or consumer trends made them think this was the set to sell. Either new generation fans hitting a sweet spot in age to buy higher end stuff or that the new generation hasn’t had as much product. There is no way the WWE Mattel decision makers are willing to look bad or waste money on a product because they are a Diesel or Doink mark. |
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isloth
Main Eventer
Joined on: Feb 14, 2019 14:55:52 GMT -5
Posts: 1,066
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Post by isloth on Aug 1, 2021 11:02:11 GMT -5
Agree with most of the comments here. I hope it gets backed, but it’s not something I want myself.
The ring is neat and easily the best one made to date, but I already own one. I’d use it, but I’d have to throw away or sell my current one due to space. I also have zero interest in that era so none of the ring skirts do anything for me. If it was just the ring I might’ve ordered one if the price was right, though.
Diesel is by far the lowest cost/deco Ultimate to date which doesn’t help. An alternate head and a vest with an all black attire isn’t much compared to what other Ultimates get. Doink however is really cool but he’s not super popular and probably not the best incentive.
Zero interest in the entrance set up. It’s just not something I want, and I have no interest in that era.
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VinMan
Main Eventer
Joined on: Aug 7, 2002 20:09:36 GMT -5
Posts: 1,404
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Post by VinMan on Aug 1, 2021 11:12:22 GMT -5
I backed it right away because I know even if you aren't fully interested in this one, all future projects likely depend on this being successful. Plus if you don't want this, you will probably be able to sell the stuff you don't want after the fact for more money. Could they have done more absolutely. But this is what it is and anything else isn't happening without a good response here.
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Post by Mongo Bears on Aug 1, 2021 11:18:26 GMT -5
“THEY” need to announce what the next project will be now.
If they don’t…..it’s their own fault I didn’t buy this one
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Post by newgenandy on Aug 1, 2021 11:20:26 GMT -5
I backed it right away because I know even if you aren't fully interested in this one, all future projects likely depend on this being successful. Plus if you don't want this, you will probably be able to sell the stuff you don't want after the fact for more money. Could they have done more absolutely. But this is what it is and anything else isn't happening without a good response here. So genuine question, if the next isn’t what you are interested in would you still back it to get more or not? Guess what I’m wondering is if we support things we don’t want in the hope of getting things we do want that sends the wrong message. |
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Deleted
Joined on: Nov 29, 2024 3:24:41 GMT -5
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2021 11:20:54 GMT -5
It would be an absolute tragedy if this doesn't get funded. We not only lose the opportunity to get an amazing set we would never get elsewhere, but we would also probably squander any chance in the future of a "too big for retail" set as well. Plus, it's the first crowdsourcing project for the WWE line. What a bad look it would be for all parties if it were to fail. I love you. Oh well. |
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Deleted
Joined on: Nov 29, 2024 3:24:41 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2021 11:28:01 GMT -5
I backed it right away because I know even if you aren't fully interested in this one, all future projects likely depend on this being successful. Plus if you don't want this, you will probably be able to sell the stuff you don't want after the fact for more money. Could they have done more absolutely. But this is what it is and anything else isn't happening without a good response here. So now I should buy something I don’t want and re-sell it? Why don’t I just… ya know… not buy the thing I don’t want? I don’t buy to sell, I buy to collect. |
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Post by AttitudeLegendCollector on Aug 1, 2021 11:28:18 GMT -5
Brian and Mark both said it wasn’t worth $250, Brian said $170-200 max…Matt also agreed before he and he said they know about production costs, also said the ring skirts aren’t value or enough of an incentive, he also said Mattel need to add more products/figures to this to make it value. Matt back tracked a little bit because he’s desperate for this to be successful to open the door to more opportunities. They just backed it anyway because they feel like they have to (Mark did it during the recording even though he said he didn’t think it was worth it) - these guys have to buy it and let’s face it, money is no issue to them. Matt bought 4 didn’t he?! Lol. If you’re a regular listener, you know when they’re hyped on something, they struggled to sell this set to the listener. They want this to get backed because they want the possibles in the future, they don’t want this product. Backing it for that reason is a gamble, what if the next one sucks? Again, it’s fine for those guys but your average collector might end up ‘needing’ to spend $1000 on products before they get the one they really want. Those guys aren’t the bible, they get loads wrong all the time for so called experts, they didn’t even realise the Undertaker UE head sucks and the others are incorrect until it was pointed out to them…but they’re entertaining and good at what they do, they couldn’t sell this item, they didn’t even sound excited, Matt was just desperate for people to spend money on this so he gets more stuff down the road. Certainly at 5k level this is not worth $250, no way. IMO it’s still not at 8K but at least with doink it feels slightly better. It’s not getting to 8K though. i havent gotten to this episode yet, but that kinda bums me out that they are so negative on it, those guys are HUGE influencers in this hobby and i feel like if anyone could have swayed more people it's them. i hope collectors realize that if this doesnt get backed, we'll most likely never see another scale ring for our WWE figures mattel execs wont see the value in producing it with no retailers on board, and walmart/target are never going to give that much shelf space to that kind of an item That’s not on ‘us’ though, it’s on Mattel’s offering. If it can’t even get 8k people that tells you they got it wrong. What if the next one isn’t something we want either? Do we just keep backing until Mattel produce something a lot of people want? That theory could cost people a fortune before they have a product th actually want. |
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Post by rkmo: Autonomous Meat Shield on Aug 1, 2021 11:28:52 GMT -5
Mattel has the crowdfunding to tell if there is demand for these types of things. That's the purpose. We don't need multiple threads expressing EVERY SINGLE complaint, critique, excuse, and armchair QB scenario there is. If the New Gen set flat fails, they could possibly revise a new strategy if the corporate heads have an appetite for it. With all the negativity surrounding this on full display, why should the designers push for something else if the end result is their wasted time and their own dedicated fanbase dunking on them at every turn?
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Post by GreyHaze:Big Bad Booty Daddy on Aug 1, 2021 11:33:45 GMT -5
It’s not something I want or care about to be honest since this period of wrestling was before my time. I do think the concept and overall look is awesome though, which is why I want it to succeed. I’d like to get other items down the road and I feel like Mattel will hold it against us if it doesn’t do well. I however, agree with the majority of users here and will say that we don’t have to buy it. I do find it weird that a lot of people here like that generation of wrestling, but it hasn’t been backed up fully. I know a lot of us wanted a Nitro or Attitude era stage, but Steve said they wanted to start off with something small. In my head the attitude era stage would be massive, have to include a ramp, a tron and some other features which might make it expensive as well. Also, this particular ring is smaller right?
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Warriah'
Main Eventer
Joined on: Dec 22, 2019 19:46:02 GMT -5
Posts: 3,261
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Post by Warriah' on Aug 1, 2021 11:45:31 GMT -5
I'm kinda waiting to see if anyone at Mattel has the audacity to blame the fans for this not succeeding, after how much they  ed this up |
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Deleted
Joined on: Nov 29, 2024 3:24:41 GMT -5
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2021 11:48:02 GMT -5
Mattel has the crowdfunding to tell if there is demand for these types of things. That's the purpose. We don't need multiple threads expressing EVERY SINGLE complaint, critique, excuse, and armchair QB scenario there is. If the New Gen set flat fails, they could possibly revise a new strategy if the corporate heads have an appetite for it. With all the negativity surrounding this on full display, why should the designers push for something else if the end result is their wasted time and their own dedicated fanbase dunking on them at every turn? You know anything and everything somebodu does, you’re gonna have complaints, you can’t please everybody, if that bothers you, then you’re in the wrong business |
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Post by Xæro #FakeCollector on Aug 1, 2021 12:04:39 GMT -5
 I hope it's a success for those who want it, but other than the Diesel ultimate I have no interest in any of it despite growing up during the New Gen era and being very nostalgic about it. |
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Deleted
Joined on: Nov 29, 2024 3:24:41 GMT -5
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2021 12:04:42 GMT -5
Has there been any official statement about the reversal on the charging policy? I'm honestly stunned at the number of people who rejected this because they didn't want to be charged upfront. I mean, obviously it's a real thing because when they changed their stance on it, there was a small rush of backers. But still, I don't see why it's such a big deal. If the funding fails, you get 100% of your money back. I love you. For non US collectors that need to do a currency conversion a refund would actually mean losing money due to time and a difference in the exchange rate. On $250 + taxes + shipping that could be a large loss if that money sits for almost a month only to be refunded (USD $262.95 total to Canada, although I don't see how shipping this heavy item would only cost $13 to Canada). Sometimes yeah. CAD is up from 75 cents to 80 cents over the past year to USD, but in the past month its been static at 80 cents. I'm included in this, I backed the thing day 1 fully expecting to pay up front. Partially cuz I never actually noticed kickstarter didn't charge and refund, they charge at the end of the campaign so it didn't and still doesn't seem weird to me. The only reason I'll lose any money will be from b.s. banking fees on currency conversions. That means my gripe is with our corrupt banking systems, not with Mattel. It's probably gonna be something like 10 or 20 bucks I'll lose. |
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Post by mrhoss on Aug 1, 2021 12:05:12 GMT -5
Maybe a store that specializes in wrestling figures can back the remaining amount to reach the Doink level.
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secondwhiteline
Main Eventer
Joined on: Nov 18, 2015 13:06:39 GMT -5
Posts: 1,543
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Post by secondwhiteline on Aug 1, 2021 12:06:48 GMT -5
This in a nutshell. Bill designs for his wants, not so much anything else. Time to stop enabling him. This crowdfunding blowing up in his face is a start. I doubt they make decisions on their wants. I’d bet an Ultimate Diesel they made this based on data driven decisions. Some set of data or consumer trends made them think this was the set to sell. Either new generation fans hitting a sweet spot in age to buy higher end stuff or that the new generation hasn’t had as much product. There is no way the WWE Mattel decision makers are willing to look bad or waste money on a product because they are a Diesel or Doink mark. Speaking as someone who grew up in the New Gen era and is almost 35, I would agree that they're looking at demos of their collector audience and deciding my age is the sweet spot between money and nostalgia, yeah. I think they're probably better off looking at the Attitude Era, but I get it. Especially because Raw honestly doesn't look that much different visually in 2021 than it did in 1999. The New Gen is at least distinct on that level.
One of the things that surprises me is that they've said New Gen figures sell well. Which...what New Gen figures are we talking about? Bret, Shawn, Diesel, Razor, Luger, Taker, HHH, X-Pac? All legitimate legends with heavy influence in multiple eras. Do their New Gen looks sell notably better than their other eras? I would expect most of their sales are pretty even across their different figures. At that point, what New Gen midcarders have they released? Alundra, Mabel, and Tatanka (and the previous Doink releases) come to mind. Were they really good sellers? I don't know, they've got the sales data. But just given the popularity of the era in its time, I'd be surprised if the products were that much more successful than other eras.
Also, I think the New Gen kinda stands out for how many figures they haven't been able to release. Most of the midcard is missing, really. I can't imagine that helps.
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