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Post by Triple S on Sept 7, 2021 15:58:26 GMT -5
Sir, there is only 24 hours in a day.
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Post by LK3 on Sept 7, 2021 16:16:49 GMT -5
You’re right, Rusev sucked before and Miro sucks now.
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Post by Darkhawk on Sept 7, 2021 17:43:45 GMT -5
Look at whats happening to NXT, they're losing all their stars and changing the brand completely. I honestly stopped watching WWE for about 2 years, I only watch some PPV here and there.
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Post by FLUX '97 on Sept 7, 2021 18:28:48 GMT -5
First things first, I'm howling at all the "This you?" replies to Chip in this thread. Tremendous.
But to keep with the topic, if I had a year to take control of all three of the major WWE programs (Sorry 205 Live and NXT Beans On Toast, y'all sitting this one out), here's what I'd do.
Priority One: Raw DESPERATELY needs to be two hours.
The shorter PPVs in the Thunderdome Era showcased that less is more. Two nights of 'Mania has absolutely been a breath of fresh air for WWE fans. Eight hour PPVs are just absolutely ridiculous. With a three hour TV program, you're asking your creative team to come up with essentially a major blockbuster film's worth of content for TV every single week. That's taxing on both the writing team and the fans. With how repetitive Raw has been lately, it's like going to the movie theater every week and instead of seeing a brand new movie, you're forced to see The Lord of The Rings every single week with repeated commercials for Liberty Mutual, various fast food joints and Progressive every few minutes. It's exhausting. I know USA Network wants Raw to be three hours, but considering you've made over $2 Billion in deals with Fox and Peacock respectively and you're making record profits in a pandemic while shedding over 100 talent from your payroll, you can afford to lose that extra third hour revenue.
Priority Two: Return NXT to being a developmental TV program.
This seems to be what they're actually doing if various dirty sheets are to be believed, and honestly it's for the best. I know NXT talent are petrified that they'll become as goofy and exposed as Karrion Kross is these days, but at some point, you gotta go. Cole was absolutely stagnating after he lost the NXT Championship to Keith Lee before he dipped to AEW. Gargano and/or Ciampa should've been called up after that abysmal One Final Beat cinematic match that went way too goddamn long. At least Gargano has made his heel run work while Ciampa has been as stagnant as Cole was in a seemingly going nowhere tag team with Timothy Thatcher, which is a shame, because both of them are really, really good. I know the language barrier will probably make it difficult for her to truly get going on a main roster where your promo skills will probably be the top thing that helps you, but Io needs to be called up as well after she and Zoey lose the NXT Women's Tag Titles, which leads me to my next point. You can keep these guys on NXT, sure, but use them mainly to help further elevate the new personalities that you're trying to get over enough to get them called up to Raw or Smackdown. Also, I'd personally pull NXT out of Full Sail/The CWC because good lord, those crowds are absolutely atrocious. Putting your new characters in front of a small crowd that's only interested in getting themselves over isn't good for your talent.
Priority Three: Put actual creative investment in the tag team divisions.
Enough with the "CAN THEY CO-EXIST!?!?!?" tag teams. Good lord. Pretty much every new team they've put together in the past year for both the men and women except Shotzi & Nox have started as the same "They're rivals turned partners but they still don't like each other...until they finally do for...some reason!" story and it's just lazy storytelling. It's even found its way into NXT with the Io/Zoey story. They'll most likely find a way to do the same with Gargano and Lumis after Lumis marries Indi Hartwell. I know Vince has said he's not a fan of tag team wrestling, but give them some actual creative, unique storyline progression. Give us a reason to care about these teams other than "CAN THEY CO-EXIST!?!?" (Also don't stick some of your best teams as lackeys for over-the-hill, past their prime veterans like AEW have done with LAX and Private Party, that helps too.)
Priority Four: Build up main event talent.
Let's be honest with each other. There's absolutely zero credible threats to either Bobby Lashley or Roman Reigns right now. You can hope that a Cesaro or Finn Balor will dethrone one of those guys, but neither of those guys are probably going to realistically sniff a world title with the current regime. (And honestly, I don't think Cesaro should, sorry.) With them seemingly cooling Drew off, the guys I would focus on building up as credible threats to the current champions are Finn Balor, Damian Priest, Big E, Keith Lee, Mustafa Ali, Baron Corbin and Sami Zayn. Guys who are both talented in the ring and can hold a crowd in the palm of their hand on the microphone (Balor's probably the weakest of the names I listed in the mic department but he's proven he can carry a brand.) Big E has the MITB briefcase and Priest has the US title and both of those are great launching pads to get up the card, but those and the others would have the next 6-9 months spent building them up as legit threats to become credible World Champions. Yes, even Baron Corbin. WWE has arguably the best roster from an in-ring talent perspective it's ever had. Utilize that to its full potential and showcase just how talented these dudes are!
Priority Five: More focus on your women's divisions.
Yes, I know most of you think women need to go back to two minute matches, snapmares, hair pulling, catfights, lingerie and bikini Playboy pillow fights, but please, stop talking and go touch grass. Women's wrestling, much like WWE's current talent pool as a whole, is its most bountiful its ever been. Showcase that. Let these girls go all out and give them good creative direction to do so. No, I'm not saying run another Evolution or give the women their own TV show, but give them more focus on your weekly shows. I'm admittedly no fan of Sasha, but I couldn't deny that she and Bayley were extremely entertaining together in that pre-Thunderdome era as the Golden Role Models because they actually gave them creative effort and time to let their personalities shine. The women's division right now is pretty much either a revolving door of "Oh, I guess this woman can have a title shot this month." or "Let's repeat the same match over and over and over again until fans get sick of seeing these people wrestle each other." Yes, Charlotte Flair is great. Yes, Becky Lynch is great. Alexa Bliss is fantastic on the microphone. But you don't need to focus solely on them because it puts a glass ceiling on the Rheas and Biancas and Tonis and others who also deserve their chances to shine as well. Do we really need to invest twenty minutes in Jaxson Ryker or Matt Riddle? No, no we do not.
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Post by hitmancmedge on Sept 7, 2021 19:45:23 GMT -5
I had this debate with a buddy of mine and I told him they have a lot of problems right now and all you need to do is watch Raw.
The only two people in the entire company right now that seem “cool” at all are Riddle and Reigns. No one else feels fun to like, or doesn’t seem cheesy to get behind.
The storylines move forward at a snails pace. I mean literally nothing happens week to week. You could stop watching for two to three weeks and you really wouldn’t miss anything. It’s not must see TV.
Vince and Bruce just don’t get what wrestling fans tuning into their show are looking to see. The exact reasons that Vince and Bruce don’t think people will cheer and get behind Ruby, Black, Miro are the exact reasons why people get behind them in 2021.
They don’t let guys climb the ladder anymore, no one starts at the bottom and works their way up. You don’t get a Hart Foundation Bret Hart, Rockers Shawn Michaels, or the Hardy’s anymore. Everyone comes in at a level and stays there. Damien Preist came in the upper mid card and still there. Morrison firmly in the mid card upon return, still there today. One of the reasons people loved Main Event Jey Uso was it was something different, it was a guy who came in on a lower card team and climbed all the way to main event, only to be put back in the tag division.
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johnnyhanson21
Superstar
Joined on: Oct 10, 2019 17:01:41 GMT -5
Posts: 995
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Post by johnnyhanson21 on Sept 7, 2021 19:49:13 GMT -5
Think theirs a few really easy step to make.First end the brand split as you don't have the depth of a roster to carry two different shows.Stop have "Champion Contender" match ups and running the same match over and over again.Now days you see two guys face off once,twice,three times before they even have their first PPV match up.Obviously higher better writers and writers that are actually fans and who truly care about the product.Also move away from using the older legend so much and when using them use them in a smaller role i.e. shouldn't always be brought back in title bouts and main events of the biggest shows every year.
Those steps would help and I would also take and more extreme route that would be a step back or two but I think something that most be done if you truly want to grow the company and take it to new heights.I would cut most of the talent that is 40 plus,yes I am talking about the likes of Sheamus,Morrison,Nakamura,Roode,Ziggler,Cesaro...ect and only would keep 2-4 talents around those ages in Orton,Styles,Hardy & Mysterio.
The new main event picture and upper card I would build the entire company around would be Big E,Dunne,Dragnouv,Ford,Lee,McIntrye,Orton,Priest,Reigns,Riddle,Rollins & Styles.I would also focus NXT on building up Stevenson,Steiner,Boudreaux,Bate...ect as the guys to take over in a few years as the main eventers.
Shake things up in the announce booths by have both RAW & Smackdown back to two man both one having Miz and the other having McAfee and find a new lead commentator and finally replacing Michael Cole(who's basically been the voice of WWE to some degree for nearly 25 years which is longer then anyone)
Cut back on the number of titles as having so many makes them meaningless.Probably would just have the WWE,Tag Team,Womens and two new titles created one mid card title for both the men and women's.
Again lots of ideas to make the product better.
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kinnikuman
Main Eventer
Joined on: Feb 6, 2020 21:42:25 GMT -5
Posts: 4,674
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Post by kinnikuman on Sept 7, 2021 20:38:48 GMT -5
The problem is that "wrestling fans" don't want to watch "sports entertainment" ... and vice versa. Just stick to watching what you like, as the other option will not change.
Simple as that.
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👑🇵🇭⭐️
Main Eventer
WF 10 Year Member
King Of The Ring 2007 - Team Undisputed
Joined on: Feb 4, 2013 13:46:47 GMT -5
Posts: 4,675
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Post by 👑🇵🇭⭐️ on Sept 7, 2021 21:38:52 GMT -5
Keep in mind, this is coming from a Championship Title Belt collector. Storylines and work rate, although important, are just not my focus as a fan. I have 2 reasons why I love Professional Sports Wrestling Entertainment. Championship Title Belts are the number one reason why I'm even on this site typing right now. My collection started, because the WWE decided to put nameplates on every active Championship Title Belt in 2002. When they switched to the SuperStar logo side plate gimmick, my interest faded and my Expedition of Gold became a bad habit / addiction to "Gold" and "Leather", regardless of how it looked. How many Big Ws can I have in my collection!? I believe the majority of fans prefer the previous designs of the Intercontinental and United States Championship Title Belts. I can't wait to see the next set of Red and Blue Tag Team Championship Title Belts, if they ever get around to changing them. Even the Yellow, I mean Gold, I mean Rainbow brand's Championship Title Belts are not as good as the original set. I did like the NXT United Kingdom Championship Title Belt ... when it was the WWE United Kingdom Championship Title Belt. Coincidentally, when the WWE switched from custom nameplates to custom side plates, their storylines became as bland as the prizes the SuperStars were trying to win. AEW, on the other hand, uses the nameplate gimmick on all of their Championship Title Belts. Its refreshing to see actual Championship Title Belt designs, and not just an upside down M. With having wins and loses matter, Championship Title matches really feel like it's the Champion vs. the number 1 contender. Just by the idea alone, makes every match important, on every show, important. You won't see surprise debuts having their first match in the promotion as a World Championship match. You also won't see actors come in and just get a Title shot. You can suspend disbelief in a logical way. Stables are the number two reason. WWE had great Stables, there is no need to list DX, Evolution, the Shield, etc. They just don't make them like they used to. When they do, they destroy what they created and inject poison into their Factions, and Hurt their Business. AEW, on the other hand, should have Championship Title Belts for 3-man, 4-man, or even 5-man Teams. I'd go with 4, since 3 has been done in the past, and 5 is too much. Championship Stables. WWE should, no, nevermind. This would just be yet another complaint, that doesn't need to be made. AEW, on the other hand, has Thee Elite!! Thee Thee Elite!! I just love Being The Elite so much. Its the only show I watch regularly, as well as BTE Dark. TL:DR (like everyone else's ideas on this topic) WWE was the standard that became just standard. AEW is continually changing the World of Wrestling and Entertainment, to not only the way it was, but a better version of what it will be. I didn't even mention the Forbidden Door. Bad example.
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Post by k5 on Sept 7, 2021 21:46:33 GMT -5
this thread sucks
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Deleted
Joined on: May 9, 2024 17:12:47 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2021 22:52:04 GMT -5
The problem is that "wrestling fans" don't want to watch "sports entertainment" ... and vice versa. Just stick to watching what you like, as the other option will not change. Simple as that. Underrated comment. There's nothing wrong with preferring the "sports entertainment" side of things, or liking both things. But expecting one to be the other is just asking to be continually disappointed.
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Post by rkmo: 9 Month Warning on Sept 8, 2021 4:24:53 GMT -5
Had to break out the keyboard for this one lol.
First off, to address some small points that I found to be a bit petty. The post opens by saying no one offers constructive criticism and that most come off as whiny complainers. Fair assessment, as today's society no longer puts value in providing reasons for your rationale and only requires headline or Twitter-friendly statements, and offers no accountability for beliefs easily proven to be hyperbolic or misleading after the fact. But then in other parts are statements like "why bother watching if you don't enjoy it" and "booking for dummy books need to be put away". Are displeased fans meant to analyze the shows and voice better, more intriguing storylines or not? Comes off like a "love it or leave it" stance, something that is only beneficial to those only interested in silencing critics. Also, using terms such as "indie mark bullcrap" betrays any intention of this being approached as an open and honest discussion.
WWE has lost its good will with a vocal portion of fans, but it isn't like that was out of their control. Is it fair for Vince to be the butt of jokes about every callup being doomed to fail, or a guy or gal being sunk with a terrible gimmick? Perhaps not, but there is justification for that skepticism. Time and again we have witnessed those very situations happen, far more than true success stories. Constantly due to a lack of faith from management, not seeing their star potential or from them not fitting in the set mold of "Superstardom" the big boss has in his mind. And if an act or gimmick does catch on, it is common to see those very elements removed from the character or ran into the ground. One burdens the talent with a constant struggle of reinvention. The other limits their growth until it's decided the gimmick has run its course. And WWE has let go of a number of popular talents, those popular with certain segments of the fanbse. Is that not due to WWE's lack of vision? A vocal audience has had their dedication and love for the industry used against them for years. Why shouldn't WWE be made to own up? If viewers have to think out their own reasonings and alternative solutions, why isn't WWE responsible for explaining their last-minute, "get us by tonight and think up the rest next week" decision making?
Defending WWE's current status of repeated matchups, stagnant roster development, and stale, unimaginative storytelling with "nobody will remember it anyway" is not a strong one. Trading wins is commonplace in a wrestling feud, but it is best served when stretched out over many months, not in a span of two months. And as is often the case, stars are constantly treading water in the company's pecking order with their feuds today. Very rarely does winning a certain feud actually improves a talent's standing, or momentum is soon ended from losing the very next one or "plans being changed". As plenty have said before, WWE currently has the most athletically-gifted roster they have ever had, and I do appreciate the more competitive matches lately. However, seeing the same guys and gals fight week after week leads to massive burnout. I would argue less great matches, not more, would help certain elements of shows be memorable. Like the debate over gimmick PPVs, too much exposure desensitizes the audience and ruins the special qualities the rivalry may have offered.
A decidedly pointed remark was made about the former Rusev in an attempted way to put people's bias and fickleness on display. While the current God's Favorite Champion/Redeemer gimmick hits a lot of points seen in his previous iteration (dominating heel champion), it is disingenuous to assign credit to WWE without mentioning the rest of Rusev's tenure in WWE. The fact his undefeated streak and title reign was ended not by any up-and-comer nor any talent needing a hefty boost, but John Cena. The subtle turn into a chauvinist jerk to initiate an on-screen split with Lana (the first of two such occasions, the other a tasteless exercise). The complete overlooking during the "Rusev Day" run, when he enjoyed a resurgence in natural popularity. Being placed in the second most ineffective and inconsequential stable in pro wrestling history. We have the advantage of complete hindsight for his WWE run and again, AEW doesn't carry any baggage of past missteps. But talent having real input with their craft should always be admired over them being micromanaged and following dictums about what to do and say, the way I see it.
In the end, the control that Vince McMahon wants to exert over the entire spectrum of a publicly consumed product is at fault. Not allowing personalities to shine, not utilizing them to the best of their abilities, having specific physical and character traits for certain roles within the company and writing off anyone who doesn't check all the boxes. A wide audience demands a wide variety. No ice cream store can be successful by only selling vanilla, especially if their recipe is seen as flawed by customers. If they can open their minds and let other varied voices get some of the spotlight, there would be more positivity around the product. And contrary to the thinking of some, granting one portion of the audience something to enjoy won't ruin the enjoyment of others.
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Post by Next Man’s Knowing Rock on Sept 8, 2021 4:45:47 GMT -5
WTF a Chip babyface turn? That’s a swerve I did not see coming. Completely denouncing everything his character has stood for for over a decade, at that. It’s gonna be hard to buy into, but I’ll keep an open mind and see how it plays out.
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Rocky Balboa
Main Eventer
Down bad for Rhea Ripley
Joined on: Jan 1, 2021 6:00:02 GMT -5
Posts: 2,381
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Post by Rocky Balboa on Sept 8, 2021 5:36:27 GMT -5
The presenation, the storylines, the writing, the characters, the wrestlers, the camera work, the commentary, the lighting... I could go on. There is not one thing about WWE that I think is "good" right now. NXT was the closest with their setup back around 2017. That was almost all that I wanted from a wrestling show. Now AEW gives me exactly what I want instead.
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Post by Yambag Jones on Sept 8, 2021 11:39:49 GMT -5
The person in charge needs to love pro wrestling, have a creative mind, and respect their fans.
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Deleted
Joined on: May 9, 2024 17:12:47 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Sept 8, 2021 11:47:07 GMT -5
The person in charge needs to love pro wrestling, have a creative mind, and respect their fans. Now this is constructive criticism they won’t take!
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Deleted
Joined on: May 9, 2024 17:12:47 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Sept 8, 2021 11:50:51 GMT -5
I believe we've fallen victim to a 'bait and bail'. A totally legitimate term I most certainly didn't make up right now.
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kinnikuman
Main Eventer
Joined on: Feb 6, 2020 21:42:25 GMT -5
Posts: 4,674
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Post by kinnikuman on Sept 8, 2021 12:17:46 GMT -5
The person in charge needs to love pro wrestling, have a creative mind, and respect their fans. Too bad Tony doesn't run RAW!
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Post by Yambag Jones on Sept 8, 2021 12:25:31 GMT -5
The person in charge needs to love pro wrestling, have a creative mind, and respect their fans. Too bad Tony doesn't run RAW! Too bad VKM does
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The Real Chillary
Main Eventer
Chillary since day one ish
Joined on: Aug 23, 2016 15:32:38 GMT -5
Posts: 1,184
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Post by The Real Chillary on Sept 8, 2021 13:49:15 GMT -5
I believe we've fallen victim to a 'bait and bail'. A totally legitimate term I most certainly didn't make up right now. I'm sure I'll get reported for saying this, but obviously ChipOnHisShoulder didn't expect the backlash, and has since tucked his tail and decided to avoid the consequences.
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Post by rkmo: 9 Month Warning on Sept 8, 2021 14:24:53 GMT -5
I believe we've fallen victim to a 'bait and bail'. A totally legitimate term I most certainly didn't make up right now.
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