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Post by Kliquid on Feb 19, 2009 2:25:40 GMT -5
GSP doesn't have an asterisk, as far as I'm concerned... He legitimately dominated BJ.
I just don't understand why he did greased in the first place.
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Post by James Hetfield on Feb 19, 2009 13:37:53 GMT -5
To get an advantage?
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Post by Kliquid on Feb 19, 2009 14:42:20 GMT -5
Sure, but is it really a significant advantage? I mean, he overpowers any of the guys he goes up against, and BJ is the only one who I can really think of as being a guy who could legitimately submit him from his guard... And he's been greasing, supposedly, for quite awhile now.
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Post by James Hetfield on Feb 19, 2009 14:52:52 GMT -5
Significant? Hmmmmm. Maybe. There were certainly instances where the greasing could have worked for GSP quite a lot. No one really knows if it was a big or small advantage.
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Sandy
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Post by Sandy on Feb 19, 2009 16:02:30 GMT -5
now I feel like going back and looking at all GSP fights just to see if there is any truth to this at all.
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Post by James Hetfield on Feb 19, 2009 16:04:15 GMT -5
Well Matt Hughes has said GSP felt slippery in his fights with him.
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Post by Kliquid on Feb 19, 2009 16:18:05 GMT -5
Well Matt Hughes has said GSP felt slippery in his fights with him. As did Sean Sherk, and a few other fighters.
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Sandy
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Post by Sandy on Feb 19, 2009 17:12:08 GMT -5
for some reason I don't believe Matt Hughes...I know the guy is a great fighter and everything but he just seems like a guy who makes mistakes for when he loses like a BJ Penn or a Tito Ortiz(I'm one of the biggest Ortiz fans here..so I'm not knocking any of the fighters I mentioned)..but if Sherk and others said it then that is truly sad. I don't want to believe that GSP had anything to do with this at all..but the longer this sh** drags out it gets harder and harder to take the side of GSP.
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Post by Mr. Old School™ on Feb 19, 2009 18:43:23 GMT -5
now I feel like going back and looking at all GSP fights just to see if there is any truth to this at all. Save your time. There isn't.
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Post by Kliquid on Feb 19, 2009 18:47:52 GMT -5
now I feel like going back and looking at all GSP fights just to see if there is any truth to this at all. Save your time. There isn't. It's gotten to the point where I really question if you have any sense of reality. Just because he did something doesn't mean it is THE reason he won... But there's video evidence of him doing it. There's no way around the fact that he did it.
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Post by Mr. Old School™ on Feb 19, 2009 19:09:22 GMT -5
If you couldn't sense the sarcasm in the way I said that, then wow...LOL. Just too much.
I know he did it, but it wasn't his doing, it was his stupid cornermen or cornerman that did it. They are in the wrong here, not GSP. I blame them since they are the ones that applied it in the first place. They are at fault, not GSP.
GSP was probably too caught up in the fight to even think what his cornerman was doing, so he just brushed it off and didn't pay it much attention.
GSP is NOT a cheater and did not cheat in that fight. He defeated B.J. Penn clean and that's all there is to it. GSP - 2, B.J. Penn - 0. End of story.
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Bruiser Brody
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Post by Bruiser Brody on Feb 19, 2009 22:57:08 GMT -5
While I agree that he dominated the 2nd fight (greasing helping or not), there was no domination in that 1st fight. As a matter of fact I still think BJ won that fight.
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Post by Kliquid on Feb 20, 2009 0:47:24 GMT -5
... GSP knew they were doing it.
I love GSP, but come on right now...
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Fury
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Post by Fury on Feb 20, 2009 3:18:11 GMT -5
And if you look at the tapes you'll see that everytime BJ threw a punch the vasoline caused BJ's fists to slide off of GSP's body without any damage caused.
The Vasoline had no outcome on that fight or any other fights, I'm just sick of this bullcrap, GSP is just a better fighter than all these guys and whilst yes it was wrong, there is no way it affected the outcome of this fight at all.
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Post by Boquest on Feb 20, 2009 14:00:03 GMT -5
Okay, thats enough of this. Did GSP have vaseline on him? Yes. Did it change the fight? Hard to say. The fight is over with, GSP won. I hate how this has become absolute bullcrap. Tons of fighters have greased before without anyone saying anything. That doesn't make it right, but still, there fights didnt get blown out of the water, so why does this one?
Dont believe me? Here:
Rich's corner greases him up, even more obviously then GSP's corner did, in a WAY larger area too. Hell, they even leave vaseline on his arm still! Did anyone say anything? No, because Silva won. How fair is that? Anyone care to explain that? People are trying to look deep and hard into this fight because it was made out to be a war, and turned into a dominating fight, which people were upset about. Let's move on...
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Post by James Hetfield on Feb 20, 2009 14:05:14 GMT -5
The Vaseline there had no real disadvantage because Anderson pretty much killed Franklin standing up.
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Post by Kliquid on Feb 20, 2009 14:16:14 GMT -5
Well, you said it yourself... No one's upset about it because Franklin lost. I bet if Franklin had won, people would've been all over him.
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PdW2kX
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Post by PdW2kX on Feb 20, 2009 14:47:10 GMT -5
Okay, thats enough of this. Did GSP have vaseline on him? Yes. Did it change the fight? Hard to say. The fight is over with, GSP won. I hate how this has become absolute bull ****. Tons of fighters have greased before without anyone saying anything. That doesn't make it right, but still, there fights didnt get blown out of the water, so why does this one? Dont believe me? Here: Rich's corner greases him up, even more obviously then GSP's corner did, in a WAY larger area too. Hell, they even leave vaseline on his arm still! Did anyone say anything? No, because Silva won. How fair is that? Anyone care to explain that? People are trying to look deep and hard into this fight because it was made out to be a war, and turned into a dominating fight, which people were upset about. Let's move on... Wow, I actually had never seen that before. Odds are the Vaseline was meant to try and prevent Anderson from using the super-effective clinch work that obliterated Franklin in the first fight, since the cornermen were applying it to his shoulders and the back of his head. Even a greased-up Franklin was no match for Silva...ouch.
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Sandy
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Post by Sandy on Feb 20, 2009 15:53:15 GMT -5
Okay, thats enough of this. Did GSP have vaseline on him? Yes. Did it change the fight? Hard to say. The fight is over with, GSP won. I hate how this has become absolute bull ****. Tons of fighters have greased before without anyone saying anything. That doesn't make it right, but still, there fights didnt get blown out of the water, so why does this one? Dont believe me? Here: Rich's corner greases him up, even more obviously then GSP's corner did, in a WAY larger area too. Hell, they even leave vaseline on his arm still! Did anyone say anything? No, because Silva won. How fair is that? Anyone care to explain that? People are trying to look deep and hard into this fight because it was made out to be a war, and turned into a dominating fight, which people were upset about. Let's move on... Wow, I actually had never seen that before. Odds are the Vaseline was meant to try and prevent Anderson from using the super-effective clinch work that obliterated Franklin in the first fight, since the cornermen were applying it to his shoulders and the back of his head. Even a greased-up Franklin was no match for Silva...ouch.haha....I am a big fan of Franklin...but damn that is sad. I agree that GSP isn't the first to do it. But some reason he gets the blame for it. He shouldn't have done it...I want to say he had no idea what was going on but that is almost impossible to say with a straight face. Could he have been THAT ignorant and simply thought it was his cornermen rubbing his chest and back because of a traditional muay thai breathing technique? Maybe. But looking back at all other GSP fights...Matt Hughes especially..it is hard to believe that Hughes Gorilla grip couldn't take GSP down. I still think that vaseline or no vaseline GSP would beat everyone he has beat before. But if he was greasing for all his other fights maybe he wouldn't have won in such a dominating fashion. Bottomline though, GSP won against BJ Penn and I think he had a lot more to do with BJ not taking the fight as serious as he should have rather than GSP's greasing..
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Post by Kliquid on Feb 20, 2009 17:49:30 GMT -5
This whole thing reminds me of the New England Patriots "spygate" situation.
Yeah, the Patriots were doing it, and yeah, they got caught... But it's not like they were the first ones ever to do it, yet they were the only ones to get in any trouble.
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