Devilkiller
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Post by Devilkiller on May 27, 2014 22:34:48 GMT -5
Not the typical thread. This is from the Bret/HBK rivalry documentary.
So apparently, according to Bret Hart, they were meant to face eachother at Wrestlemania 14, and Bret Hart stated he was going to put Michaels over. Now my question is would the Austin Era had begun or not at all?
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Post by Hendrix83 on May 27, 2014 22:47:23 GMT -5
Not the typical thread. This is from the Bret/HBK rivalry documentary. So apparently, according to Bret Hart, they were meant to face eachother at Wrestlemania 14, and Bret Hart stated he was going to put Michaels over. Now my question is would the Austin Era had begun or not at all? Well they were originally supposed to fight at Wrestlemania 13 but Shawn didn't want to put Bret over. So he 'lost his smile.' I don't see anyway those two could have coexisted in the WWF at the time. Austin was too hot, I say no matter what Austin wins the belt at Wrestlemania 14. Shawn would've probably still been injured in '98. Which would've left us with some incredible Bret Hart/Stone Cold matches throughout the year of 1998. Austin would've still had to leave in late '99. Bret would've gotten injured before then probably. I think the people who really suffer if Bret stayed would have been Undertaker and Triple H. But Triple H moreso because he would've been pushed back into the 2000's for his first reigns with the WWF title. |
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Post by Captain Charisma on May 27, 2014 22:48:49 GMT -5
Stone Cold was too hot to ignore then. If Bret stayed, maybe WWF would have continued the Rocky Maivia vs Austin IC title feud.
Austin loses, and moves on to the bigger picture and defeats HBK by Summerslam. I can see DX screwing Austin's first few chances at the title.
to conclude, the Austin era was always gonna happen, just a matter of time.
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Post by bad guy™ on May 27, 2014 22:50:05 GMT -5
I do not believe Hart for a second. I know Hart put him over once before, but had he decided to stay there would have been so much animosity on both sides there is no way in hell he would have put Michaels over again. Plus, Hart's ego is massive.
And yes, I think Austin would have started up his run. That was a freight train that no one was gonna stop. Austin was the best foil there was, and they knew it.
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Post by hbkbigdaddycool on May 27, 2014 23:23:10 GMT -5
There is so much that you have to consider with that situation.
For example, HBK didn't wanna put Bret over at WM 13 so he fakes a knee injury?? Yet, on the Thursday Raw Thursday that he gave up the title, he was supposed to face Sid in a rematch from the Royal Rumble. Was Sid gonna beat HBK that night for the WWE Title to face Taker at Mania??
And if Bret did face HBK at WM 13, what would Steve Austin had done?? No way was the Bret Hart vs. Steve Austin feud over with, I still gotta believe that Bret vs. Austin at WM 13 was gonna happen no matter what.
As for WM 14 if Bret stayed, I still don't see Bret vs. HBK in the main event. Vince wanted to launch the "Attitude Era" and seeing Bret vs. HBK just screamed "New Generation" to me.
I think if Bret stayed, I could see WM 14 having Bret vs. Shamrock in a high profile match. But no way was Bret vs. HBK gonna happen at WM 14.
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Post by Deleted on May 28, 2014 6:15:50 GMT -5
There is so much that you have to consider with that situation. For example, HBK didn't wanna put Bret over at WM 13 so he fakes a knee injury?? Yet, on the Thursday Raw Thursday that he gave up the title, he was supposed to face Sid in a rematch from the Royal Rumble. Was Sid gonna beat HBK that night for the WWE Title to face Taker at Mania?? And if Bret did face HBK at WM 13, what would Steve Austin had done?? No way was the Bret Hart vs. Steve Austin feud over with, I still gotta believe that Bret vs. Austin at WM 13 was gonna happen no matter what. As for WM 14 if Bret stayed, I still don't see Bret vs. HBK in the main event. Vince wanted to launch the "Attitude Era" and seeing Bret vs. HBK just screamed "New Generation" to me. I think if Bret stayed, I could see WM 14 having Bret vs. Shamrock in a high profile match. But no way was Bret vs. HBK gonna happen at WM 14. HBK was going to retain against Sid and defend against Bret at Wrestlemania 13. Steve Austin was going to face Undertaker at WM 13 if HBK vs. Bret happened. They had been building it since Austin screwed Taker at the Rumble and Final Four. I'm not sure where that would've left Sid though. Bret/Austin were done as they didn't announce the submission match until a couple weeks prior to WM 13 and both guys were surprised as they thought their program was over. Austin was getting the belt at WM 14 no matter what. Maybe a triple threat with Bret and HBK? Not sure. In fact, since HBK got legit injured at the Rumble, he could've dropped the belt to Bret who then drops it to Austin at WM 14. |
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Post by Deleted on May 28, 2014 6:32:21 GMT -5
I actually believe the plan was for Austin vs. Bret at WM14 with Austin finally getting his big win. That would have been the passing of the torch to the Austin era. Shawn/Bret was scheduled for WM13, but Shawn faked an injury to avoid putting Bret over.
I assume following WM14, we would have seen a DX/Hart Foundation feud as the Outlaws and X-Pac would have still joined. Austin may have feuded with Undertaker I'm guessing.
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Post by Deleted on May 28, 2014 6:39:29 GMT -5
 For me, personally. |
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Post by Deleted on May 28, 2014 6:41:02 GMT -5
I actually believe the plan was for Austin vs. Bret at WM14 with Austin finally getting his big win. That would have been the passing of the torch to the Austin era. Shawn/Bret was scheduled for WM13, but Shawn faked an injury to avoid putting Bret over. I assume following WM14, we would have seen a DX/Hart Foundation feud as the Outlaws and X-Pac would have still joined. Austin may have feuded with Undertaker I'm guessing. I would've loved to see Bret vs. Austin at WM 14 instead of the HBK vs. Austin match we got which, of course, HBK bitched and cried about because he had to drop the belt. After what I consider the greatest feud of all time and the one that got me into wrestling, having Austin FINALLY get his big win over Bret would've been a great final chapter in their feud and would've been a classic rematch from the year before. I'm pissed at Bret for leaving. He should've just taken a paycut or worked harder with Vince to figure out a new contract instead of leaving at the peak of his career in 1997. Money is just money. Why you would go from being the top heel in WWF to go be just another guy in WCW amazes me. It's not like WWF was paying him in Hershey kisses. HBK would've been out of Bret's way in January 1998 after getting hurt in the casket match anyway. |
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Devilkiller
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Post by Devilkiller on May 28, 2014 6:43:52 GMT -5
I actually believe the plan was for Austin vs. Bret at WM14 with Austin finally getting his big win. That would have been the passing of the torch to the Austin era. Shawn/Bret was scheduled for WM13, but Shawn faked an injury to avoid putting Bret over. I assume following WM14, we would have seen a DX/Hart Foundation feud as the Outlaws and X-Pac would have still joined. Austin may have feuded with Undertaker I'm guessing. I would've loved to see Bret vs. Austin at WM 14 instead of the HBK vs. Austin match we got which, of course, HBK bitched and cried about because he had to drop the belt. After what I consider the greatest feud of all time and the one that got me into wrestling, having Austin FINALLY get his big win over Bret would've been a great final chapter in their feud and would've been a classic rematch from the year before. I'm pissed at Bret for leaving. He should've just taken a paycut or worked harder with Vince to figure out a new contract instead of leaving at the peak of his career in 1997. Money is just money. Why you would go from being the top heel in WWF to go be just another guy in WCW amazes me. It's not like WWF was paying him in Hershey kisses. HBK would've been out of Bret's way in January 1998 after getting hurt in the casket match anyway. But there's the other factor. Would there even be a casket match? Because if Bret stayed it may have throw the feud into January, and HBK would've never gotten injured. Just some fruit for thought. |
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Post by Deleted on May 28, 2014 6:49:40 GMT -5
I would've loved to see Bret vs. Austin at WM 14 instead of the HBK vs. Austin match we got which, of course, HBK bitched and cried about because he had to drop the belt. After what I consider the greatest feud of all time and the one that got me into wrestling, having Austin FINALLY get his big win over Bret would've been a great final chapter in their feud and would've been a classic rematch from the year before. I'm pissed at Bret for leaving. He should've just taken a paycut or worked harder with Vince to figure out a new contract instead of leaving at the peak of his career in 1997. Money is just money. Why you would go from being the top heel in WWF to go be just another guy in WCW amazes me. It's not like WWF was paying him in Hershey kisses. HBK would've been out of Bret's way in January 1998 after getting hurt in the casket match anyway. But there's the other factor. Would there even be a casket match? Because if Bret stayed it may have throw the feud into January, and HBK would've never gotten injured. Just some fruit for thought. It's more than possible. If Bret dropped the belt to HBK in Montreal the he could've been in the actual Royal Rumble match while HBK still defended against Undertaker in the casket match. Undertaker was seemingly going to get a rematch against HBK regardless after Kane cost him the Hell in a Cell match at Badd Blood. The biggest question is how the booking of Montreal would've changed if Bret was going to stay. I assume it would've ended in a big double DQ finish after DX/Hart Foundation interference since neither guy wanted to put the other one over. |
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Post by Deleted on May 28, 2014 7:06:29 GMT -5
I actually believe the plan was for Austin vs. Bret at WM14 with Austin finally getting his big win. That would have been the passing of the torch to the Austin era. Shawn/Bret was scheduled for WM13, but Shawn faked an injury to avoid putting Bret over. I assume following WM14, we would have seen a DX/Hart Foundation feud as the Outlaws and X-Pac would have still joined. Austin may have feuded with Undertaker I'm guessing. I would've loved to see Bret vs. Austin at WM 14 instead of the HBK vs. Austin match we got which, of course, HBK bitched and cried about because he had to drop the belt. After what I consider the greatest feud of all time and the one that got me into wrestling, having Austin FINALLY get his big win over Bret would've been a great final chapter in their feud and would've been a classic rematch from the year before. I'm pissed at Bret for leaving. He should've just taken a paycut or worked harder with Vince to figure out a new contract instead of leaving at the peak of his career in 1997. Money is just money. Why you would go from being the top heel in WWF to go be just another guy in WCW amazes me. It's not like WWF was paying him in Hershey kisses. HBK would've been out of Bret's way in January 1998 after getting hurt in the casket match anyway. Bret agreed to take a pay cut, but Vince wanted to send him to WCW. He knew they weren't going to use Bret so it didn't matter to him. |
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Devilkiller
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Joined on: Mar 17, 2012 16:49:19 GMT -5
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Post by Devilkiller on May 28, 2014 7:27:38 GMT -5
I would've loved to see Bret vs. Austin at WM 14 instead of the HBK vs. Austin match we got which, of course, HBK bitched and cried about because he had to drop the belt. After what I consider the greatest feud of all time and the one that got me into wrestling, having Austin FINALLY get his big win over Bret would've been a great final chapter in their feud and would've been a classic rematch from the year before. I'm pissed at Bret for leaving. He should've just taken a paycut or worked harder with Vince to figure out a new contract instead of leaving at the peak of his career in 1997. Money is just money. Why you would go from being the top heel in WWF to go be just another guy in WCW amazes me. It's not like WWF was paying him in Hershey kisses. HBK would've been out of Bret's way in January 1998 after getting hurt in the casket match anyway. Bret agreed to take a pay cut, but Vince wanted to send him to WCW. He knew they weren't going to use Bret so it didn't matter to him. Now I have to respectfully disagree. Things got heated between those two, hence Bret basically attacking Vince while he was on commentary. Vince wanted Bret to stay. Even Vince admits he did everything he could to keep him, but this was during the time WWF became #2, and WCW had more money. |
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Post by Deleted on May 28, 2014 8:39:57 GMT -5
Bret agreed to take a pay cut, but Vince wanted to send him to WCW. He knew they weren't going to use Bret so it didn't matter to him. Now I have to respectfully disagree. Things got heated between those two, hence Bret basically attacking Vince while he was on commentary. Vince wanted Bret to stay. Even Vince admits he did everything he could to keep him, but this was during the time WWF became #2, and WCW had more money. I think you need to see Wrestling With Shadows/read Bret's book. |
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Post by Deleted on May 28, 2014 9:07:09 GMT -5
If Bret stays then he would've likely known that before Montreal, and the Montreal Screw Job would've never happened. Bret would get to beat HBK that night because there'd be no fear of him leaving the company while he was champion, which I think in reality he would've done no matter what happened.
Imagine if Bret and Vince sign their agreement before Montreal. What if Vince is never made out to be the bad guy? How does that change things?
Also, Bret claims that if he had stayed then he wouldn't have let Owen do the rafter stuff. Maybe that's wishful/hindsight thinking. But what if Owen never dies because big brother is there to save him?
What if, huh?
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Devilkiller
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Post by Devilkiller on May 28, 2014 11:13:55 GMT -5
Now I have to respectfully disagree. Things got heated between those two, hence Bret basically attacking Vince while he was on commentary. Vince wanted Bret to stay. Even Vince admits he did everything he could to keep him, but this was during the time WWF became #2, and WCW had more money. I think you need to see Wrestling With Shadows/read Bret's book. If you give me his book I will  |
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Post by Deleted on May 28, 2014 11:27:09 GMT -5
I think you need to see Wrestling With Shadows/read Bret's book. If you give me his book I will You can get it for a fiver. I'd recommend it. Even if you're not a fan, the book is amazing. |
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Post by Deleted on May 28, 2014 11:32:34 GMT -5
I actually believe the plan was for Austin vs. Bret at WM14 with Austin finally getting his big win. That would have been the passing of the torch to the Austin era. Shawn/Bret was scheduled for WM13, but Shawn faked an injury to avoid putting Bret over. I assume following WM14, we would have seen a DX/Hart Foundation feud as the Outlaws and X-Pac would have still joined. Austin may have feuded with Undertaker I'm guessing. Bingo AF!! HBK wanted The Outlaws in DX from RR time onwards....BUT Vince convinced him after WM was better because Tyson was in DX and them joining wouldn't have been such a big deal. But they kept the onscreen alliance going wisely. X-Pac was ALWAYS gonna be in DX when he returned. Hell HBK practically demanded it when he found out Waltman was returning. I always thought HBKs character as a face in DX after WM14 would have been a riot... Heres what I would have LIKED to see happen. You must factor in backstage tensions/egos being removed. having been got over etc etc. HBK doesn't get injured at RR Austin eliminates Hart AND Rocky last to win the RR. WM14 looks like this Austin beats HBK for the WWF title(change nothing here its too important) Shamrock still faces Rocky for the IC title Bret,Owen & Davey beat Vader & the Headbangers to wrap up the Canada vs USA stuff(throwaway basically this is just to keep the Harts @ WM so they can start the DX feud) Cactus & Chainsaw defeat the NAO. right after the match the Harts hammer the living crap outta the NAO...... UT vs Kane etc etc etc. Raw after WM remains unchanged EXCEPT the Hart foundation cut a stinging promo on Waltman,HHH & HBK as they stand in the ring reunited. NAO defeat C&C but get attacked again afterwards. Austin STILL gets the Dude Love feud its too good to pass up. Vince begins to court the Harts and their "family values" line to be his guys DX feuds with Harts and Nation all through the summer. Austin defeats Hart & UT @ Summerslam. Austin loses belt in same manner...... Rock continues his rise as a babyface HHH turns on DX @ Deadly games tournament by costing HBK his match against Bret hart in a reversal of the previous SSeries outcome. Bret wins deadly games tourney by defeating Rock. Austin gets screwed the same way. Team Corperate forms with Bret as the main guy,Bulldog/Owen as tag champs,HHH as rising guy Shamrock as IC and Bossman as muscle. we head to 1999 with everything looking like this Austin & DX feuding with Corperate team. Joygasm for JokerFC. |
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Post by Next Man’s Knowing Rock on May 28, 2014 11:57:06 GMT -5
The best thing to ever happen to WWE was the Montreal screwjob and the Shawn Michaels injury. Without the screwjob, Mr McMahon would never have been created, and without that nemesis, Austin wouldn't have risen to the level he did. And if Bret and Shawn were around, their politicking and crybabying would have had negative effects on The Rock, Triple H and Mick Foley.
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Dr. Mantis Toboggan MD
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Post by Dr. Mantis Toboggan MD on May 28, 2014 12:11:03 GMT -5
I actually believe the plan was for Austin vs. Bret at WM14 with Austin finally getting his big win. That would have been the passing of the torch to the Austin era. Shawn/Bret was scheduled for WM13, but Shawn faked an injury to avoid putting Bret over. I assume following WM14, we would have seen a DX/Hart Foundation feud as the Outlaws and X-Pac would have still joined. Austin may have feuded with Undertaker I'm guessing. I would've loved to see Bret vs. Austin at WM 14 instead of the HBK vs. Austin match we got which, of course, HBK bitched and cried about because he had to drop the belt. After what I consider the greatest feud of all time and the one that got me into wrestling, having Austin FINALLY get his big win over Bret would've been a great final chapter in their feud and would've been a classic rematch from the year before. I'm pissed at Bret for leaving. He should've just taken a paycut or worked harder with Vince to figure out a new contract instead of leaving at the peak of his career in 1997. Money is just money. Why you would go from being the top heel in WWF to go be just another guy in WCW amazes me. It's not like WWF was paying him in Hershey kisses. HBK would've been out of Bret's way in January 1998 after getting hurt in the casket match anyway. In Wrestling with Shadows, Hart did at one point say he would have stayed if Vince could offer him the position of either the top face or heel, but at that point Stone Cold and HBK had both taken those roles respectively. Had he stayed past the Royal Rumble he could have taken the position of the top heel. |
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