hbkowns
Main Eventer
Joined on: Aug 15, 2011 23:33:52 GMT -5
Posts: 4,249
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Post by hbkowns on Feb 27, 2021 8:40:30 GMT -5
No and it’s not even a debate. They realized that putting the strap on him a decade ago was a mistake and that’s why he’s been nowhere close to it until now. And even now it’s just a transitional title reign.
While I don’t find him as annoying and absolutely unbearable like I used to, he’s still not my cup of tea and never will be.
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Post by FLUX '97 on Feb 27, 2021 15:56:33 GMT -5
If it was a current era Mount Rushmore, absolutely.
If it's an all-time Mount Rushmore, not even half.
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Post by CM Tusk on Feb 27, 2021 18:29:43 GMT -5
Seeing how bent out of shape people here get over Miz is kind of funny. You know him saying stuff like this is part of his gimmick right? People here that sh** on his ring work and then talk about how great guys like Warrior and Lex were are also hilarious. Anyways, the Mt Rushmore gimmick is just like wrestling, objective and purely opinion based. Rushmore to me is Bruno, Hogan, Austin, and Cena. Those four were the biggest names of their time in the biggest wrestling promotion of all time. Roman is as close to them as we’ve gotten since Cena. Guys like HBK, Taker, Bret, and Rock were big but they were never on the level of those four.
Miz is really good at the heel bit though.
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CymruX2
Mid-Carder
Joined on: Sept 5, 2020 9:35:33 GMT -5
Posts: 312
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Post by CymruX2 on Feb 27, 2021 21:03:06 GMT -5
If there was a mount rushmore of "most improved talent" yes for sure. Over the last nearly 15 years? Miz has come a long way and sure as crap deserves the gold imo
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Post by Next Man’s Knowing Rock on Feb 27, 2021 21:09:24 GMT -5
Seeing how bent out of shape people here get over Miz is kind of funny. You know him saying stuff like this is part of his gimmick right? It's more than kind of funny, it's hilarious. Miz is one of the few wrestlers that can still play the "smart" fans like fiddles. Two Time Slammy Award Winner Owen Hart would be proud.
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👑🇵🇭⭐️
Main Eventer
WF 10 Year Member
King Of The Ring 2007 - Team Undisputed
Joined on: Feb 4, 2013 13:46:47 GMT -5
Posts: 4,674
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Post by 👑🇵🇭⭐️ on Feb 28, 2021 12:19:07 GMT -5
The Miz is awesome!! The Miz has cracked my Top 10, and has gained my respect, much like the respect I gained for Tom Brady recently. To me, Mount Rushmore isn't your 4 favorites of all time. It isn't even the greatest in only your time. Mount Rushmore has to be the greatest of all times, the greatest of each era, but its even more than that.
My top 4 of all time Chris Jericho Stone Cold Steve Austin / The Rock Kurt Angle Ric Flair / Hulk Hogan This will never change.
My Mount Rushmore Stone Cold Steve Austin The Rock Ric Flair Hulk Hogan These 4 are the Faces (and Heels) of this industry in my lifetime.
The Mount Rushmore of Professional Sports Wrestling Entertainment Bruno Sammartino Hulk Hogan Stone Cold Steve Austin John Cena Sammartino was my Dad's Champion, and Cena was my Son's Champion. There's no denying the fact that these 4 Legends are the greatest of each of their times. These are the 4 faces on Mount McMahon.
When I received my Spinner Belt in 2008, I flipped the W ceterplate into an M. When I received my Big Scratch Belt in 2013, I flipped the W side plates into Ms. When I received my Big Network Belts (World and Universal) in 2020, I flipped the W side plates into Ms. My last name starts with an M. I did it first Miz!!
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Post by cordless2016 on Feb 28, 2021 14:19:32 GMT -5
Seeing how bent out of shape people here get over Miz is kind of funny. You know him saying stuff like this is part of his gimmick right? People here that sh** on his ring work and then talk about how great guys like Warrior and Lex were are also hilarious. Anyways, the Mt Rushmore gimmick is just like wrestling, objective and purely opinion based. Rushmore to me is Bruno, Hogan, Austin, and Cena. Those four were the biggest names of their time in the biggest wrestling promotion of all time. Roman is as close to them as we’ve gotten since Cena. Guys like HBK, Taker, Bret, and Rock were big but they were never on the level of those four. Miz is really good at the heel bit though. Warrior and Lex may have been “sloppy” but they knew how to pop a crowd and the sloppiness always seemed to help give their matches a bit more realism. Miz’s ring work has always come off as super scripted like he’s following crib-notes on his hand.
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Post by CM Tusk on Feb 28, 2021 15:37:45 GMT -5
Seeing how bent out of shape people here get over Miz is kind of funny. You know him saying stuff like this is part of his gimmick right? People here that sh** on his ring work and then talk about how great guys like Warrior and Lex were are also hilarious. Anyways, the Mt Rushmore gimmick is just like wrestling, objective and purely opinion based. Rushmore to me is Bruno, Hogan, Austin, and Cena. Those four were the biggest names of their time in the biggest wrestling promotion of all time. Roman is as close to them as we’ve gotten since Cena. Guys like HBK, Taker, Bret, and Rock were big but they were never on the level of those four. Miz is really good at the heel bit though. Warrior and Lex may have been “sloppy” but they knew how to pop a crowd and the sloppiness always seemed to help give their matches a bit more realism. Miz’s ring work has always come off as super scripted like he’s following crib-notes on his hand. And Miz has always been able to get heel heat and have a crowd eating out of his hand. One of the better heels of the last decade.
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Post by cordless2016 on Feb 28, 2021 17:34:33 GMT -5
Warrior and Lex may have been “sloppy” but they knew how to pop a crowd and the sloppiness always seemed to help give their matches a bit more realism. Miz’s ring work has always come off as super scripted like he’s following crib-notes on his hand. And Miz has always been able to get heel heat and have a crowd eating out of his hand. One of the better heels of the last decade. On the mic, sure. In the ring, hardly. I can’t think of one Miz match during his whole career where I go “yeah, that’s his career defining match” or “that’s a 5* match.”
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Post by CM Tusk on Feb 28, 2021 17:46:52 GMT -5
And Miz has always been able to get heel heat and have a crowd eating out of his hand. One of the better heels of the last decade. On the mic, sure. In the ring, hardly. I can’t think of one Miz match during his whole career where I go “yeah, that’s his career defining match” or “that’s a 5* match.” Wrestling is subjective. Just because you can’t, doesn’t mean everyone everyone can’t. I personally can name several Miz matches I’d rather watch than a Luger match or Warrior match where he didn’t have Savage to work it.
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Post by TKO Propagandist on Feb 28, 2021 17:49:30 GMT -5
When I think shining stars of the PG Era I think Miz. His 2011 & 2017 especially. MUST SEE
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Post by k5 on Feb 28, 2021 18:12:19 GMT -5
On the mic, sure. In the ring, hardly. I can’t think of one Miz match during his whole career where I go “yeah, that’s his career defining match” or “that’s a 5* match.” Wrestling is subjective. Just because you can’t, doesn’t mean everyone everyone can’t. I personally can name several Miz matches I’d rather watch than a Luger match or Warrior match where he didn’t have Savage to work it. yes but chicken crap isn't chicken salad. you can like eating chicken crap, but you're in the minority. same with being a miz fan.
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Post by CM Tusk on Feb 28, 2021 19:01:09 GMT -5
Wrestling is subjective. Just because you can’t, doesn’t mean everyone everyone can’t. I personally can name several Miz matches I’d rather watch than a Luger match or Warrior match where he didn’t have Savage to work it. yes but chicken crap isn't chicken salad. you can like eating chicken crap, but you're in the minority. same with being a miz fan. Again, confusing opinion with fact.
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Post by k5 on Feb 28, 2021 19:33:58 GMT -5
yes but chicken crap isn't chicken salad. you can like eating chicken crap, but you're in the minority. same with being a miz fan. Again, confusing opinion with fact. the opinion of a vast amount of the wrestling fan populace.
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Post by cordless2016 on Feb 28, 2021 19:44:36 GMT -5
On the mic, sure. In the ring, hardly. I can’t think of one Miz match during his whole career where I go “yeah, that’s his career defining match” or “that’s a 5* match.” Wrestling is subjective. Just because you can’t, doesn’t mean everyone everyone can’t. I personally can name several Miz matches I’d rather watch than a Luger match or Warrior match where he didn’t have Savage to work it. You’re right that it’s all subjective. I’m just willing to bet that the majority of wrestling fans would rank Luger and Warrior far above Miz on their all time lists.
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Post by CM Tusk on Feb 28, 2021 20:03:37 GMT -5
And yet, I’m willing to bet most actual workers would rank Miz’s in ring work higher than either Luger or Warrior. Hmm.
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Post by cordless2016 on Feb 28, 2021 21:43:32 GMT -5
And yet, I’m willing to bet most actual workers would rank Miz’s in ring work higher than either Luger or Warrior. Hmm. Like you said, it’s all subjective but I’m pretty sure youre still in the minority there. I’ve never seen anyone (fans or performers) come out and say “Miz is a great worker” or “you gotta see this Miz match.” Warrior and Luger both have multiple in this case (Warrior/Hogan, Warrior/Rude, Warrior/Macho, Warrior/ Honky Tonk, Luger/Hogan, Luger/Yoko, Luger/Sting, Luger/Flair).
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Post by FLUX '97 on Feb 28, 2021 22:36:38 GMT -5
And yet, I’m willing to bet most actual workers would rank Miz’s in ring work higher than either Luger or Warrior. Hmm. Like you said, it’s all subjective but I’m pretty sure youre still in the minority there. I’ve never seen anyone (fans or performers) come out and say “Miz is a great worker” or “you gotta see this Miz match.” Warrior and Luger both have multiple in this case (Warrior/Hogan, Warrior/Rude, Warrior/Macho, Warrior/ Honky Tonk, Luger/Hogan, Luger/Yoko, Luger/Sting, Luger/Flair). And other than Hogan and Honky (and objectively Yoko), you’re talking about them working with some of the best workers to ever do it. (Warrior/Hogan and Warrior/Honky were far more about the spectacle than the match, while we’re at it.) Don’t get me wrong, Miz is obviously no Flair or Macho Man in the ring, but he’s had some pretty good ing matches with guys like Bryan, Rollins, Balor, Morrison, Ziggler, Reigns, the list goes on and on.
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Post by cordless2016 on Feb 28, 2021 22:58:24 GMT -5
Like you said, it’s all subjective but I’m pretty sure youre still in the minority there. I’ve never seen anyone (fans or performers) come out and say “Miz is a great worker” or “you gotta see this Miz match.” Warrior and Luger both have multiple in this case (Warrior/Hogan, Warrior/Rude, Warrior/Macho, Warrior/ Honky Tonk, Luger/Hogan, Luger/Yoko, Luger/Sting, Luger/Flair). And other than Hogan and Honky (and objectively Yoko), you’re talking about them working with some of the best workers to ever do it. (Warrior/Hogan and Warrior/Honky were far more about the spectacle than the match, while we’re at it.) Don’t get me wrong, Miz is obviously no Flair or Macho Man in the ring, but he’s had some pretty good ing matches with guys like Bryan, Rollins, Balor, Morrison, Ziggler, Reigns, the list goes on and on. A match doesn’t need to be a technical masterpiece to be memorable or great. This is what made me jump into this thread as someone said Miz was a better in-ring worker than Warrior and Luger, but I’d argue against that as they were great at creating moments rather than being great technicians. Like you mentioned, matches like Warrior/Hogan and Warrior/Honkey are remembered for being spectacles. Same with Luger/Yoko. Miz may have benefitted from being in the ring with some of the best in-ring performers of the past decade (as did Luger and Warrior), but Miz’s matches arent remembered like the other two. Some may argue this is due to the influence of the “indy style” in recent years where we see a lot of the same high-spot matches over and over, but I’d argue Miz is just too “scripted” and “safe,” even when with guys like Bryan, Balor, Rollins, etc...this isn’t to say Miz isn’t the better technical wrestler between him, Warrior, and Luger, as he is IMO, but he lacks the little things that help give his matches more realism. As for moments, I’d argue Miz’s most memorable moment was cashing in the MITB back in 2010, yet even that seems to have become a footnote of the past decade while moments like the Hogan/Warrior stare down, Luger slamming Yoko, and Luger defeating Hogan on Nitro are still remembered fondly today.
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Post by TheSystem 1.5 on Mar 1, 2021 6:55:24 GMT -5
And yet, I’m willing to bet most actual workers would rank Miz’s in ring work higher than either Luger or Warrior. Hmm. Like you said, it’s all subjective but I’m pretty sure youre still in the minority there. I’ve never seen anyone (fans or performers) come out and say “Miz is a great worker” or “you gotta see this Miz match.” Warrior and Luger both have multiple in this case (Warrior/Hogan, Warrior/Rude, Warrior/Macho, Warrior/ Honky Tonk, Luger/Hogan, Luger/Yoko, Luger/Sting, Luger/Flair). He had two with Dolph Ziggler in 2016
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