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Post by Turnbuckle Zealot(Phil) on Jun 30, 2022 1:07:58 GMT -5
I love linguistics and Have a bachelors in English, and I’m low key so lonely I wanna unalive myself so it’s time for a silly thread discussing the nature of speaking/writing the nicknames of wrestlers in the right position of the sentence. Also as a bonus topic, I wanted to talk about wrestlers whose monikers were essentially as much a part of their name as their proper first and last name.
If you listen to enough old announcers and commentary teams like I have, you’ll hear people mess up the placement of nicknames with surprising regularity. For example, when people say Randy “Macho Man” Savage, that’s wrong.
I guess for the sake of simplicity and whimsy, I want to introduce two terms. The first is the term “Pre-Cursor” that I’ll be using to describe monikers that must precede the proper name of the wrestler(i.e. The Nature Boy “Ric Flair”) and I don’t really have one for middle names other than middle names 😂
One kind of unwritten rule I’ve noticed is that if your name is a generic noun, like Animal or Dragon, that needs to be said after the first name of the wrestler. If your main moniker refers to a human like Macho Man or Nature Boy, it needs to precede the full name when the wrestler is addressed on commentary/introduced before the match. There are exceptions like Batista had only one name so “The Animal” made sense as a precursor whereas when someone said “The Animal, George Steele” it doesn’t have a good ring to it.
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JimRiga
Superstar
Joined on: Feb 15, 2017 16:46:49 GMT -5
Posts: 841 
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Post by JimRiga on Jun 30, 2022 3:47:54 GMT -5
Yes, it annoys me when they are named incorrectly on alphabetical lists!!
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nibs92
Main Eventer
Joined on: May 29, 2008 5:47:21 GMT -5
Posts: 2,240
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Post by nibs92 on Jun 30, 2022 7:41:56 GMT -5
Where do you sit with Bret Hart and Davey Boy Smith?
“The Hitman” Bret Hart and Bret “The Hitman” Hart both work for me.
I’m guessing Davey Boy is an exception to the rule as well. Davey Boy “British Bulldog” Smith sounds a bit clunky to me
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Post by MKSavage on Jun 30, 2022 7:47:16 GMT -5
Where do you sit with Bret Hart and Davey Boy Smith? “The Hitman” Bret Hart and Bret “The Hitman” Hart both work for me. I’m guessing Davey Boy is an exception to the rule as well. Davey Boy “British Bulldog” Smith sounds a bit clunky to me Interesting, when they put the nickname first it is always "The Hitman" Bret Hart. But, when they put the nickname in the middle it is always Bret "Hitman" Hart, they leave out the "The" part. |
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nibs92
Main Eventer
Joined on: May 29, 2008 5:47:21 GMT -5
Posts: 2,240
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Post by nibs92 on Jun 30, 2022 8:18:25 GMT -5
Where do you sit with Bret Hart and Davey Boy Smith? “The Hitman” Bret Hart and Bret “The Hitman” Hart both work for me. I’m guessing Davey Boy is an exception to the rule as well. Davey Boy “British Bulldog” Smith sounds a bit clunky to me Interesting, when they put the nickname first it is always "The Hitman" Bret Hart. But, when they put the nickname in the middle it is always Bret "Hitman" Hart, they leave out the "The" part. I may be wrong but I’m sure I’ve seen the “the” in the middle before. Or I may be thinking of when someone says it. |
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TheXtremisT
Main Eventer
10 Year Member
This is the way
Joined on: May 3, 2008 8:03:15 GMT -5
Posts: 3,875
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Post by TheXtremisT on Jun 30, 2022 8:51:58 GMT -5
Where do you sit with Bret Hart and Davey Boy Smith? “The Hitman” Bret Hart and Bret “The Hitman” Hart both work for me. I’m guessing Davey Boy is an exception to the rule as well. Davey Boy “British Bulldog” Smith sounds a bit clunky to me Interesting, when they put the nickname first it is always "The Hitman" Bret Hart. But, when they put the nickname in the middle it is always Bret "Hitman" Hart, they leave out the "The" part. I think you'll find it is much more common to hear Bret "The Hitman" Hart than Bret "Hitman" Hart. And referring to the above BB one, it is and should always be "The British Bulldog, Davey Boy Smith". But more common without mentioning his real name. |
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Post by MKSavage on Jun 30, 2022 12:47:55 GMT -5
Interesting, when they put the nickname first it is always "The Hitman" Bret Hart. But, when they put the nickname in the middle it is always Bret "Hitman" Hart, they leave out the "The" part. I may be wrong but I’m sure I’ve seen the “the” in the middle before. Or I may be thinking of when someone says it. Interesting, when they put the nickname first it is always "The Hitman" Bret Hart. But, when they put the nickname in the middle it is always Bret "Hitman" Hart, they leave out the "The" part. I think you'll find it is much more common to hear Bret "The Hitman" Hart than Bret "Hitman" Hart. And referring to the above BB one, it is and should always be "The British Bulldog, Davey Boy Smith". But more common without mentioning his real name. Not that I recall, it is almost always Bret "Hitman" Hart. Sometimes it's "The Hitman" Bret Hart. I can't recall hearing Bret "The Hitman" Hart. Maybe my memory is going... EDIT: I just went back and watched the intros for a few of his matches, and each time Howard Finkel announces him as Bret "Hitman" Hart. Though, I did hear Vince in one of them (against the Undertaker at RR96) refer to him as Bret "The Hitman" Hart. |
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Post by Artie Kendall on Jun 30, 2022 13:14:38 GMT -5
Vince says Bret The Hitman Hart on commentary but he is the only one I know of. It was always Bret Hitman Hart. I know his figures from LJN up to Jakks say Bret "Hit Man" Hart with the space.
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nibs92
Main Eventer
Joined on: May 29, 2008 5:47:21 GMT -5
Posts: 2,240
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Post by nibs92 on Jun 30, 2022 15:06:40 GMT -5
I may be wrong but I’m sure I’ve seen the “the” in the middle before. Or I may be thinking of when someone says it. I think you'll find it is much more common to hear Bret "The Hitman" Hart than Bret "Hitman" Hart. And referring to the above BB one, it is and should always be "The British Bulldog, Davey Boy Smith". But more common without mentioning his real name. Not that I recall, it is almost always Bret "Hitman" Hart. Sometimes it's "The Hitman" Bret Hart. I can't recall hearing Bret "The Hitman" Hart. Maybe my memory is going... EDIT: I just went back and watched the intros for a few of his matches, and each time Howard Finkel announces him as Bret "Hitman" Hart. Though, I did hear Vince in one of them (against the Undertaker at RR96) refer to him as Bret "The Hitman" Hart. Yeah I’m possibly thinking of Vince. He maybe puts the “the” in as he likes the sound of his own voice ha ha! I know what you mean about the memory thing, I’m the wrong side of 40 and have noticed a massive difference in what I can recall! |
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Post by Turnbuckle Zealot(Phil) on Jul 1, 2022 2:30:00 GMT -5
Where do you sit with Bret Hart and Davey Boy Smith? “The Hitman” Bret Hart and Bret “The Hitman” Hart both work for me. I’m guessing Davey Boy is an exception to the rule as well. Davey Boy “British Bulldog” Smith sounds a bit clunky to me Dear god, putting British bulldog between that long a name feels like a popcorn kernel on my teeth but it’s on fire. 🫣 I know Howard Finkel always left off “the” and just said “Bret “Hitman” Hart.” During introduction. I feel like both Bret and Davey sort of grew to be bigger than their moniker to where their name alone sufficed and you could say their nickname for added flavor or to break up the monotony of proper nouns when calling a match. This is why I mentioned both announcing the introduction of the wrestler and commentary because both have their own nuances. Also Davey Boy does not register to my American sensibilities as like a real name so I tended to just call him Bulldog or Davey Boy in passing because it never felt like I was addressing a person by their name, but by a gimmick or a friendly nickname |
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