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Post by Hawks_NFC West Champions on Aug 12, 2010 2:30:34 GMT -5
Alright, so after Georges St. Pierre/Josh Koscheck, who is gonna be the number one contender? Hughes looked very impressive in his last fight, and I could see the contendership list going:
1) Josh Koscheck
2) Jon Fitch
3) Matt Hughes
HOWEVER, since Hughes is taking time off for the fall, is there any possibility we could see Fitch/Hughes for contendership in January/February? Then it could be St. Pierre/Fitch or Hughes in May or June.
Once again, just a thought.
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Post by James Hetfield on Aug 12, 2010 2:53:04 GMT -5
It should go:
Koscheck
Shields/Kampmann
Fitch
Fitch has showed NO improvement in his game. If Shields gets passed Kampmann, he deserves the next shot. Hughes will be gone for awhile.
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Post by sean™ on Aug 12, 2010 9:04:59 GMT -5
I don't think Fitch did anything in his last fight to put him in a title fight. I'm fully for the winner of Sheilds/Kampmann vs Fitch. Perhaps that fight will motivate Fitch to actually do something.
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Post by Mr. Orange on Aug 12, 2010 14:36:43 GMT -5
I say Fitch vs the Shields/Kampmann winner for #1 Contender. Fitch has done NOTHING to show that a rematch with GSP will be any different.
God help us if it's Shields vs. Fitch....... Shields is boring... Fitch is even more boring......
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PrideFcF
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Post by PrideFcF on Aug 12, 2010 14:57:42 GMT -5
God help us if it's Shields vs. Fitch....... Shields is boring... Fitch is even more boring...... God forgive me, but I absolutely agree. Shields is certainly a skilled fighter, but the guy bores the hell out of me. Same goes for Fitch. Though if I had to pick, I'd take GSP-vs-Shields over GSP-vs-Fitch 2 any day. |
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Post by CH Punk™ on Aug 12, 2010 15:05:22 GMT -5
How the hell is Shields boring? I mean I can understand Fitch.
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DWright
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Post by DWright on Aug 12, 2010 16:36:04 GMT -5
How the hell is Shields boring? I mean I can understand Fitch. ...have you watched his fights? garbage stand-up and being content with holding top position for 3-5 rounds does not make a fighter exciting. That's for sure. |
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Post by Lk™ on Aug 12, 2010 17:44:24 GMT -5
i'm really pulling for kampmann.
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Post by CH Punk™ on Aug 12, 2010 18:01:40 GMT -5
How the hell is Shields boring? I mean I can understand Fitch. ...have you watched his fights? garbage stand-up and being content with holding top position for 3-5 rounds does not make a fighter exciting. That's for sure. Have you? Seriously forums are full of people who can't appreciate anything besides guys who "stand and bang". |
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PrideFcF
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Post by PrideFcF on Aug 12, 2010 18:41:56 GMT -5
...have you watched his fights? garbage stand-up and being content with holding top position for 3-5 rounds does not make a fighter exciting. That's for sure. Have you? Seriously forums are full of people who can't appreciate anything besides guys who "stand and bang". I really hate when this assumption is made so quickly. I don't see where he said anything about fighters needing to stand and bang in order to be exciting. I certainly don't believe in that myself, despite me calling Shields boring. It is possible to enjoy MMA as a whole, but be bored to tears by certain fighters style. Just because you fully love, or appreciate, a certain style, it doesn't make anyone more or less of a fan if another person doesn't find it to be very exciting. I'm all for watching a fight boil down to a grappling match. No real problem to me, to be honest. Ends up looking a lot better than two gassed guys winging hay makers at each other. But Shields is often content to stop seeking out a submission in favor of doing minor busy work on the ground to avoid being stood up by the ref. I'm no one to tell the man how to fight, and all the power to him for beating the types of fighters he has in his career. Still, I just don't personally enjoy watching the man fight. |
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Post by James Hetfield on Aug 12, 2010 18:50:23 GMT -5
Shields will finish Fitch if they fight.
I find it funny how people call Shields "boring" just after those couple fights with Mayhem and Henderson went to a decision. Please find me someone who has been able to decisively finish both guys lately.
Shields has probably the worst standup ever, but he is a very good grappler who does try to finish on the ground.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2010 21:36:12 GMT -5
Seeing Kampmann's name in there would be good, as long as he improves markedly.
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DWright
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Post by DWright on Aug 12, 2010 22:46:18 GMT -5
...have you watched his fights? garbage stand-up and being content with holding top position for 3-5 rounds does not make a fighter exciting. That's for sure. Have you? Seriously forums are full of people who can't appreciate anything besides guys who "stand and bang". I love a great grapple match. How about you go ahead and tell me the last time Jake Shields had one against a true opponent, I'll wait. (and no, you can't use Nick Thompson or Robbie "Groundgame??" Lawler) He hasn't shown a true grapple game since his fight with Condit. Even there, both fighters showed that a ground game can be fun. Submitting Robbie Lawler and Paul Daley isn't exactly a difficult task. I usually tend to agree with a lot of what you say, but Shields really never tried to finish either. In his 2 biggest TV spots of his career, he laid on top of both. He put weight on Miller to win the fight from top position, and did the same with Henderson. Shields has been VERY boring lately. Regardless of how good on the ground he is, there's no real reason to be there if you're not going to try to improve your position and you're content with scoring points by being in the more dominant position while not taking any damage, and not allowing your opponent to get up. |
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Post by James Hetfield on Aug 12, 2010 22:56:26 GMT -5
There were multiple submission attempts on Henderson, how is that not trying to finish?
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Post by CH Punk™ on Aug 13, 2010 11:19:42 GMT -5
Shields attempted to finish Mayhem and Henderson. Yes at a certain point he was intent on just winning rounds but neither are easy to submit. GSP has finished 1 of his 4 last opponents does that make him boring (the one being a freaking lightweight)? Also don't forget Shields unlike GSP has moved up in weight!
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DWright
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Post by DWright on Aug 13, 2010 12:50:42 GMT -5
There were multiple submission attempts on Henderson, how is that not trying to finish? Come on, you're really going to call Shield's feeble attempts, trying to finish? Minus one arm bar attempt, the rest were to show that he was "working" on the ground so the fight wouldn't get stood back up. I'm not going to discredit Henderson or his submission defense at all, but Shields attempted some very half-assed submissions and gave up on nearly all of them without much of an effort put up. Shields was content with scoring points. Which is perfectly fine. A win is a win. But it was a very boring fight. Where did Shields try to finish Mayhem? The most entertaining part of that fight was Mayhem on his back being hugged, throwing his hands up basically telling the ref that nothing is happening and it needs to be stood up. Again with the Henderson...those attempts were clearly to keep the fight on the ground. You score points with it and you show the ref that you're working towards something. Shields didn't want the fight back on the feet at all. What does GSP have to do with this? We're talking about Jake Shields. I'm not comparing him to anyone at all. I'm simply saying Jake Shields has been incredibly boring of late. He had 2 chances on primetime with a large crowd to show what he can do. In both of those chances, he won yes, but he didn't show he can finish. Haha, what? Shields HAD to move up in weight. Who else was he going to fight? There is absolutely no reason for St. Pierre to move to MW, outside of a dream fight against Anderson Silva. Shields won't move up in the UFC. There are far too many people for him to fight. |
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PrideFcF
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Post by PrideFcF on Aug 13, 2010 12:55:38 GMT -5
Shields attempted to finish Mayhem and Henderson. Yes at a certain point he was intent on just winning rounds but neither are easy to submit. GSP has finished 1 of his 4 last opponents does that make him boring (the one being a freaking lightweight)? Also don't forget Shields unlike GSP has moved up in weight! Nobody was really talking about GSP,but yea he has become a bit boring as well. Both he and Rashad switched it up to safer styles after experiencing their first humbling (T)KO losses. I'm not doubting Shields in any way,or claiming he doesn't deserve the admiration he recieves. I just personally haven't enjoyed watching him perform. I'm sure everyone has felt that at some point with certain fighters. |
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Post by CH Punk™ on Aug 13, 2010 16:50:55 GMT -5
There were multiple submission attempts on Henderson, how is that not trying to finish? Come on, you're really going to call Shield's feeble attempts, trying to finish? Minus one arm bar attempt, the rest were to show that he was "working" on the ground so the fight wouldn't get stood back up. I'm not going to discredit Henderson or his submission defense at all, but Shields attempted some very half-assed submissions and gave up on nearly all of them without much of an effort put up. Shields was content with scoring points. Which is perfectly fine. A win is a win. But it was a very boring fight. Where did Shields try to finish Mayhem? The most entertaining part of that fight was Mayhem on his back being hugged, throwing his hands up basically telling the ref that nothing is happening and it needs to be stood up. Again with the Henderson...those attempts were clearly to keep the fight on the ground. You score points with it and you show the ref that you're working towards something. Shields didn't want the fight back on the feet at all. What does GSP have to do with this? We're talking about Jake Shields. I'm not comparing him to anyone at all. I'm simply saying Jake Shields has been incredibly boring of late. He had 2 chances on primetime with a large crowd to show what he can do. In both of those chances, he won yes, but he didn't show he can finish. Haha, what? Shields HAD to move up in weight. Who else was he going to fight? There is absolutely no reason for St. Pierre to move to MW, outside of a dream fight against Anderson Silva. Shields won't move up in the UFC. There are far too many people for him to fight. You're criticizing a guy who moved up in weight because he couldn't finish 2 guys who are known to be hard to finish. Rewatch the fights if you must there was some attempts in each. Don't forget he had 8 straight finishes before he fought Mayhem. Jesus the crapShields gets is atrocious. Oh and yes GSP does have a reason to move up, he's already decimated everyone in his weight class which is why he's having rematches with everyone. |
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DWright
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Post by DWright on Aug 13, 2010 19:19:00 GMT -5
Come on, you're really going to call Shield's feeble attempts, trying to finish? Minus one arm bar attempt, the rest were to show that he was "working" on the ground so the fight wouldn't get stood back up. I'm not going to discredit Henderson or his submission defense at all, but Shields attempted some very half-assed submissions and gave up on nearly all of them without much of an effort put up. Shields was content with scoring points. Which is perfectly fine. A win is a win. But it was a very boring fight. Where did Shields try to finish Mayhem? The most entertaining part of that fight was Mayhem on his back being hugged, throwing his hands up basically telling the ref that nothing is happening and it needs to be stood up. Again with the Henderson...those attempts were clearly to keep the fight on the ground. You score points with it and you show the ref that you're working towards something. Shields didn't want the fight back on the feet at all. What does GSP have to do with this? We're talking about Jake Shields. I'm not comparing him to anyone at all. I'm simply saying Jake Shields has been incredibly boring of late. He had 2 chances on primetime with a large crowd to show what he can do. In both of those chances, he won yes, but he didn't show he can finish. Haha, what? Shields HAD to move up in weight. Who else was he going to fight? There is absolutely no reason for St. Pierre to move to MW, outside of a dream fight against Anderson Silva. Shields won't move up in the UFC. There are far too many people for him to fight. You're criticizing a guy who moved up in weight because he couldn't finish 2 guys who are known to be hard to finish. Rewatch the fights if you must there was some attempts in each. Don't forget he had 8 straight finishes before he fought Mayhem. Jesus the poop Shields gets is atrocious. He beat Robbie Lawler (no ground game), Paul Daley (even less ground game), Nick Thompson (your typical middle of the road fighter) and Mike Pyle (couldn't even make a name for himself in what was a very thin WEC WW division) and those are the most noteable names. Other than that, he beat absolutely no one in that stretch, and really didn't put on any impressive performances. I'm not even attacking Shields for not finishing Miller or Henderson. I'm attacking him for the lack of really trying. One TRUE attempt on Hendo and zero attempts on Miller isn't trying to finish the fight. It's fighting safe and being content with a decision. Up until this point (and not even true anymore WITH Shields coming in and fighters improving their game enough to at least warrant another shot) St. Pierre has not needed to move up. The UFC Welterweight division is that deep. As is the UFC Middleweight division, to the point where they didn't NEED St. Pierre to move up to have at the very least a viable opponent for Silva. Shields moved up because Strike Force had no MW or WW. The same reason Nick Diaz has moved back and forth on occasion. GSP is fine at WW. Shields won't be moving up and down. In the UFC, he's strictly a Welterweight. |
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BROSKI
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Post by BROSKI on Aug 13, 2010 19:25:24 GMT -5
I think Fitch could, NOT beat gsp BUT come very close. I'm a fan of both fighters and idk who would win if Fitch DID improve his game.
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