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Post by James Hetfield on Aug 13, 2010 21:05:13 GMT -5
Nick Thomson was on a 12 fight win streak before he faced Shields, and one of those wins was a win over Eddie Alvarez.
Shields had full mount on Henderson during the end of Round 2 and was raining down punches. I guess that wasn't trying either. Not to mention the footlock attempt later on in the fight.
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Post by CH Punk™ on Aug 13, 2010 22:34:40 GMT -5
You're criticizing a guy who moved up in weight because he couldn't finish 2 guys who are known to be hard to finish. Rewatch the fights if you must there was some attempts in each. Don't forget he had 8 straight finishes before he fought Mayhem. Jesus the poop Shields gets is atrocious. He beat Robbie Lawler (no ground game), Paul Daley (even less ground game), Nick Thompson (your typical middle of the road fighter) and Mike Pyle (couldn't even make a name for himself in what was a very thin WEC WW division) and those are the most noteable names. Other than that, he beat absolutely no one in that stretch, and really didn't put on any impressive performances. I'm not even attacking Shields for not finishing Miller or Henderson. I'm attacking him for the lack of really trying. One TRUE attempt on Hendo and zero attempts on Miller isn't trying to finish the fight. It's fighting safe and being content with a decision. Up until this point (and not even true anymore WITH Shields coming in and fighters improving their game enough to at least warrant another shot) St. Pierre has not needed to move up. The UFC Welterweight division is that deep. As is the UFC Middleweight division, to the point where they didn't NEED St. Pierre to move up to have at the very least a viable opponent for Silva. Shields moved up because Strike Force had no MW or WW. The same reason Nick Diaz has moved back and forth on occasion. GSP is fine at WW. Shields won't be moving up and down. In the UFC, he's strictly a Welterweight. Really? Because there was 8 sub attempts on Hendo . |
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DWright
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Post by DWright on Aug 13, 2010 23:08:43 GMT -5
Nick Thomson was on a 12 fight win streak before he faced Shields, and one of those wins was a win over Eddie Alvarez. Shields had full mount on Henderson during the end of Round 2 and was raining down punches. I guess that wasn't trying either. Not to mention the footlock attempt later on in the fight. The foot attempt he let go of with very little effort? The mount that was attempted once, and far too late to really finish a fight? The same Eddie Alvarez who is clearly a LW and shouldn't be fighting anyone that's a MW/WW? Sorry, Nick Thompson is not a bonafide stud. 1 of which had actual substance. The rest scored points. |
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Post by James Hetfield on Aug 13, 2010 23:33:23 GMT -5
So I guess Henderson's sub defense is sub-par.
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DWright
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Post by DWright on Aug 14, 2010 2:06:13 GMT -5
So I guess Henderson's sub defense is sub-par. As I said earlier on page 1, I'm not discrediting Hendo's submission defense, I'm saying that Shields showed no real effort in finishing Henderson, outside of 1 true submission that Henderson obviously defended quite well. Anything after that, was very weak attempts that really had no intention of finishing a fight. Either: Henderson quickly recognized the situation he was in and defended; or Shields was attempting a half-assed attempt. (both of which happened) but in both cases Jake Shields showed VERY little effort in truly finishing Henderson. I'm not going to take away from Shields's win. I didn't think he could beat Henderson to be honest. But to say to say on 2 grand stages than he wasn't extremely stale and boring is just ridiculous, and that was my entire point. Shields vs Fitch would be an extremely boring fight. That's the bottom line here. That has a decision written all over it, if that fight were to happen. I don't see either one going for anything to really end the fight. I think both fighters would play it safe in hoping to squeak out a victory. I don't need 2 fighters to "stand and bang" as it's been said. I just want to see them both work on the ground. I personally don't want to see chest-to-chest for three and a half minutes. I like to watch a guy work on the ground. That's what I want to see more from Shields. |
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Post by James Hetfield on Aug 14, 2010 3:14:04 GMT -5
Shields shows way more depth with his takedowns than Fitch does. Fitch by all accounts is probably the most boring fighter ever.
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Post by CH Punk™ on Aug 14, 2010 10:14:24 GMT -5
Shields shows way more depth with his takedowns than Fitch does. Fitch by all accounts is probably the most boring fighter ever. I have to ask do you know much about grappling? Getting mount at will is  ing working. You make it sound like he just held in guard. |
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Post by James Hetfield on Aug 14, 2010 10:29:40 GMT -5
Shields shows way more depth with his takedowns than Fitch does. Fitch by all accounts is probably the most boring fighter ever. I have to ask do you know much about grappling? Getting mount at will is ing working. You make it sound like he just held in guard. I've been doing jiu-jitsu for close to 6 years now so I would like to think I know alot. Renzo Gracie and Ricardo Almeida are my teachers. Getting mount is a very dominant position that you can do a LOT with. Fitch seems to do transitions well, but he never does anything. He hasn't finished anyone of relevance since 2006. I think he is probably capable of finishing guys, but I honestly believe now he just plays it safe. This isn't a grappling competition, this is MMA. |
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Post by CH Punk™ on Aug 14, 2010 13:41:40 GMT -5
I have to ask do you know much about grappling? Getting mount at will is ing working. You make it sound like he just held in guard. I've been doing jiu-jitsu for close to 6 years now so I would like to think I know alot. Renzo Gracie and Ricardo Almeida are my teachers. Getting mount is a very dominant position that you can do a LOT with. Fitch seems to do transitions well, but he never does anything. He hasn't finished anyone of relevance since 2006. I think he is probably capable of finishing guys, but I honestly believe now he just plays it safe. This isn't a grappling competition, this is MMA. Blame my gf for that quoted the wrong thing  . I actually think we're on the same side here.  |
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DWright
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Post by DWright on Aug 14, 2010 16:32:03 GMT -5
And what did Shields accomplish from mount? Again, nothing. What's the point of getting dominant position if you're going to spoil it? There is none. Hence why Jake Shields was content with what he was given the ENTIRE fight. Which was a win via scoring points and no urgency to finish.
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