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Post by Kliquid on Apr 2, 2012 3:53:28 GMT -5
............... And now it's time for some people to eat crow. It is a sad sad sad day in America when the leader of the free world needs to lower himself to do this to prove people wrong and get them to stop making a mockery of him. They still won't believe it's real. I don't think it was proven empirically wrong until today. That was the entire point of releasing it today. I personally never believed it but until today there was not 100% proof which is why he released it. But given the document that was provided, when it's brought into Illustrator (which is THE BEST vector image editing tool), it's very obvious to see that this document was not simply scanned and uploaded. Again, all I'm saying is that it's edited. Why it's edited is a completely different subject. It's not edited. ***growls*** Do you really want to make me angry by denying empirical facts? I will turn green and throw cars around if I have to. [Who says it's edited? Alex Jones in a video posted before the certificate was posted? Why in the world would the White House post an edited birth certificate knowing that it would be found out in about 30 minutes on the Internet? And what about Hawaiian officials who signed affidavits about this document WAY BACK DURING THE CAMPAIGN? Why would there be a mass conspiracy to cover this up. The guy's mother was born in Wichita, KS. That alone makes him a citizen. Again, someone tell me that if this was a white guy this would be an issue. No other President or Presidential candidate before him has been called upon to release this many records. People are now asking for his school records. If he releases those tomorrow, they'll ask for something else. Nothing will satisfy these birther idiots and their desire to cling to a belief that has been empirically proven to be false. I encourage people to look at this with open minds and think about how THIS file could have possibly been produced by simply scanning a document. I've been told that when you OCR a file it produces the same layers. Which is potentially plausible (but it would again be a hilariously rookie mistake -- to the point where I almost have to think it'd be intentional) if the characters on the layers were more consistent. But there's a different gray value, a different boldness on the text it picked up from layer to layer... Not to mention, the layers contain more than just text. OCR will try to find what it believes to be TEXT, and split it... These layers contain both text, lines, and other various artifacts. But the biggest thing that they contain is HANDWRITTEN text, which OCR will not pickup. #debunkfail I can take screenshots if you'd like. img585.imageshack.us/g/obama3.jpg/ - Here are a few I took of the layers and then the weird font differences. The font difference thing is particularly odd to me because of the blue box formed around it. This happens when Illustrator reads something as a separate element. So let me get this straight: There has been tremendous controversy over the legitimacy of President Obama's citizenship. Idiot after idiot after idiot called for him to release his birth certificate. The biggest idiot of them all, Donald Trump, recently makes a call for the birth certificate to be released. It's finally released and, with the United States government knowing how much of a big deal this has become, releases an edited version? A version that someone with graphic design training can instantly spot? Okay then. I can't honestly believe that people are NOW trying to say his birth certificate was edited. God damn, what do you guys want in order for you to believe him? I myself don't like Obama, but it's so ridiculous that now his BC was "edited." Whatever, people love conspiracy theories I guess.
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Post by The Dude on Apr 2, 2012 5:08:09 GMT -5
What is with the argument? If Obama wasn't a US citizen then he would have NEVER been able to run for President. I honestly think a lot of it has to do with his Muslim background and that he is black. No one has ever double checked the validity of any of the white president's birth certificates. Get over it people.
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Post by Thick Justice on Apr 2, 2012 5:35:24 GMT -5
What is with the argument? If Obama wasn't a US citizen then he would have NEVER been able to run for President. I honestly think a lot of it has to do with his Muslim background and that he is black. No one has ever double checked the validity of any of the white president's birth certificates. Get over it people. Someone who obviously didn't watch the video. They did a pretty good job on that video explaining how its impossible that the documents are real. Comparing the documents to other documents from the same postal office and finding that what should be a 4 digit year is instead a 2 digit. Compared it to 16 others all had 4 digits. Talked to retired postal workers who also said that it was suspicious.
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Post by Mole on Apr 2, 2012 5:38:34 GMT -5
Here's my issue: regardless of legitimacy of the document, doesn't Obama's mother being American make Barrack American, assuming (of course) he has not declared citizenship for another country?
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Post by Thick Justice on Apr 2, 2012 5:39:46 GMT -5
Here's my issue: regardless of legitimacy of the document, doesn't Obama's mother being American make Barrack American, assuming (of course) he has not declared citizenship for another country? His father is a Kenyan. Obama has dual citizenship which according to the US constitution forbid his running in the first place.
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Post by Mole on Apr 2, 2012 5:52:13 GMT -5
Here's my issue: regardless of legitimacy of the document, doesn't Obama's mother being American make Barrack American, assuming (of course) he has not declared citizenship for another country? His father is a Kenyan. Obama has dual citizenship which according to the US constitution forbid his running in the first place. Wouldn't that depend on the citizenship laws for Kenya?
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Post by Hulkamaniac on Apr 2, 2012 8:16:12 GMT -5
Here's my issue: regardless of legitimacy of the document, doesn't Obama's mother being American make Barrack American, assuming (of course) he has not declared citizenship for another country? His father is a Kenyan. Obama has dual citizenship which according to the US constitution forbid his running in the first place. Where does the Constitution forbid anyone who has dual citizenship from running? Citation please. Anyway, This story from Sheriff Joe came out months ago. Any birthers who are still around are blooming idiots. Kliq, my respect for you just dropped a million points unless you're trolling here.
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Post by "The Visionary" Eldniw on Apr 2, 2012 8:31:19 GMT -5
This country would not just turn a blind eye to things that would make it illegal for someone to run for President! If that were truly the case, you know The Governator would have tried his luck. But he cannot, as he has allegiances to the Austrian armed forces and as President, you cannot have allegiances to any other military but the United States.
I cannot believe that this is still being argued about. The man was born in Hawaii to an American woman. Born in a US state to an American citizen = American!!! Is it that hard to grasp?!
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Post by MacReady on Apr 2, 2012 9:02:35 GMT -5
I think it's really pathetic that you dug up posts that were a year old just so you could make a bunch of people on an internet forum board "eat crow".
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Post by Cammi Oh on Apr 2, 2012 9:25:50 GMT -5
Meh...
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Post by Hulkamaniac on Apr 2, 2012 12:03:06 GMT -5
I think it's really pathetic that you dug up posts that were a year old just so you could make a bunch of people on an internet forum board "eat crow". Yeah, I had respect for Kliq until now. Didn't agree with him the vast majority of the time, but had respect for him nonetheless. Advocating this stuff is just ridiculous. Let's lay aside for a minute the fact that this entire report from Arpaio was funded by the Tea Party. Let's put that aside. Let's also put aside that even Glenn Beck (who we all know is certifiably nuts) thinks he's crazy. Let's put that aside as well. Let's also lay aside the fact that the McCain campaign didn't even bring this up even when they knew they were losing. (Why not bring up every bit of dirt you've got?). And let's lay aside the fact that Arpaio is from Arizona and is investigating events that allegedly happened in Hawaii where he has no jurisdiction whatsoever and no more knowledge of what's going on than you or I. Let's also lay aside the fact that Arpaio is being investigated by a federal grand jury and facing election problems of his own. Why in the world would Obama release his certificate if it was such an obvious fake? Let's assume it is a fake. Are we supposed to believe someone knew at the time Obama was born that he was going to be President of the United States one day and therefore forged the certificate and it has sat around for 50 years? Who is this person who is such an expert forger and who can predict the future? Have you seen the "evidence" that the Selective Service card is forged? It's ludicrous. The "evidence" is that the date is entered as "80" when postal regulations require it to be "1980". Really? That's it? Laughable. Birthers need to crawl back under the rock they came out of and go the away. Your arguments have been thoroughly and completely disproved. Either come up with some hard evidence instead of grasping at straws or shut the up. When someone like Glen Beck thinks you're crazy you know you've gone too far.
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Post by Kliquid on Apr 2, 2012 12:14:37 GMT -5
You guys have to know that I'm trolling by bringing up the old posts........... Come on now.
But really, like I said before, the document was indeed forged. Whether Obama is an American or not, I don't know, but that document is not legit.
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Post by Oskanowski on Apr 2, 2012 12:15:09 GMT -5
I don't even care anymore to be honest. He's already been President and that's that. The Government is corrupt as can be and that won't change.
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Post by Hulkamaniac on Apr 2, 2012 13:15:21 GMT -5
You guys have to know that I'm trolling by bringing up the old posts........... Come on now. But really, like I said before, the document was indeed forged. Whether Obama is an American or not, I don't know, but that document is not legit.Gotta cut it out dude. Your street cred is majorly slipping.
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Post by Kliquid on Apr 2, 2012 13:17:20 GMT -5
You tell me what makes you think it wasn't forged.\
Not from a, "Well why would they do it?" standpoint --- From a purely technical standpoint, explain how it's NOT forged.
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Post by Hulkamaniac on Apr 2, 2012 13:31:07 GMT -5
The null hypothesis here is that nothing is going on. In another words, the certificate is completely legit and the guy was born to an American mother in Hawaii as reported. That's the null hypothesis. Anyone making any claim of any sort must disprove that hypothesis. That evidence just isn't there unless you grasp for straws or you come to the conclusion that it's fake from the start and then try to build your case. Both are the wrong way to seek after the truth.
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Post by chillax on Apr 2, 2012 13:34:32 GMT -5
You proved something, alright.
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Post by Kliquid on Apr 2, 2012 13:39:39 GMT -5
It's not grasping at straws when you know how Illustrator works.
Regardless of what angle you come at it from, the fact is that the PDF document that was released was tampered with.
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Post by Hulkamaniac on Apr 2, 2012 13:44:33 GMT -5
It's not grasping at straws when you know how Illustrator works. Regardless of what angle you come at it from, the fact is that the PDF document that was released was tampered with. So your argument is that his short form is legit and his long form is faked?? That makes no sense.
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Post by Tim of thee on Apr 2, 2012 13:46:38 GMT -5
man nick, you sure are getting shat on
but I can see where you are coming from.. the people here aren't getting you're argument.. but I can see it because you and I both work in pretty similar fields
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