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Post by Deleted on Jul 18, 2014 3:21:38 GMT -5
I used to LOVE Elgin, I just cant get behind him the last year or so :/ I'm in the same boat as you. 2011-2012 when he was doing the power stuff and was actually using his size properly, he was phenomenal. Then like...late 2012 after he went to PWG it all went downhill. It's sad that he's the one guy from the start of the SBG run that I wanted to see with the ROH Title and now that he's got it, it's like "cool that he won it but I wish he was still the same guy he was two years ago." |
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Post by Slim on Jul 18, 2014 4:13:54 GMT -5
I loved Adam Cole's match with Michael Elgin at Best in the World though.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 18, 2014 7:12:48 GMT -5
Oh god, that match. Real good match but that finishing run can suck it. Cole works Elgin's leg with three moves, but Elgin can't stand up anymore but 30 seconds later his legs are fine enough to do two deadlift powerbombs and a revolution powerbomb? Stuff like that is completely stupid and ruins otherwise really solid matches for me. If you're going to take the time to sell like you can't walk, you shouldn't be doing powerbombs immediately after. To that point, he made Cole's figure four look pretty much useless going forward. If they would have done the limb work earlier, it would have been a bit better but that whole sequence in the last two minutes of the match completely crapped all over the really good match they had prior to the finish, IMO.
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Post by Jack on Jul 18, 2014 10:18:19 GMT -5
I mean....that match was OK....it wasn't anything amazing. Underwhelming for the main event honestly.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 18, 2014 17:38:29 GMT -5
That whole show was just okay. Nothing was really bad, but there wasn't anything amazing... for their very first Pay-Per-View event.
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Post by CMPUNKISGOOD on Jul 18, 2014 18:34:40 GMT -5
That whole show was just okay. Nothing was really bad, but there wasn't anything amazing... for their very first Pay-Per-View event. Their first ppv should have been War of Worlds. But I agree with you on BITW. |
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Post by Jack on Jul 19, 2014 1:44:13 GMT -5
That whole show was just okay. Nothing was really bad, but there wasn't anything amazing... for their very first Pay-Per-View event. Agreed 100% with this mate. There was some good stuff, just nothing that blew everyones socks off. Underwhelming I would put it. |
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Post by Jonathan Karate on Jul 19, 2014 1:49:40 GMT -5
That whole show was just okay. Nothing was really bad, but there wasn't anything amazing... for their very first Pay-Per-View event. Their first ppv should have been War of Worlds. But I agree with you on BITW. I've been saying that since BITW. War of the Worlds would have amazed new fans. Nothing on BITW was mind blowing enough to make you an instant ROH fan. It was simply an OK wrestling show. I'm not sure how a PPV would have worked with the cross promotion though honestly. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2014 5:06:20 GMT -5
They couldn't do WOTW on PPV because the deal was for the June 22nd show and Final Battle and if both shows hit a certain number, they'll get to do more PPVs.
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Post by Jonathan Karate on Jul 19, 2014 6:31:39 GMT -5
They couldn't do WOTW on PPV because the deal was for the June 22nd show and Final Battle and if both shows hit a certain number, they'll get to do more PPVs. Were not saying that we just saying that they SHOULD have booked War of the Worlds for the PPV slot. It was worlds better then Best in the World. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2014 7:09:12 GMT -5
They couldn't do WOTW on PPV because the deal was for the June 22nd show and Final Battle and if both shows hit a certain number, they'll get to do more PPVs. Were not saying that we just saying that they SHOULD have booked War of the Worlds for the PPV slot. It was worlds better then Best in the World. And I'm not saying WOTW wasn't better than BITW, because it was miles better. I'm just saying that even if ROH wanted to, that show on PPV was not gonna be possible. I'm hoping we get some NJ stars for Final Battle since NJ won't be running any major shows until probably a couple weeks after FB. |
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Post by Jonathan Karate on Jul 19, 2014 8:03:01 GMT -5
Were not saying that we just saying that they SHOULD have booked War of the Worlds for the PPV slot. It was worlds better then Best in the World. And I'm not saying WOTW wasn't better than BITW, because it was miles better. I'm just saying that even if ROH wanted to, that show on PPV was not gonna be possible. I'm hoping we get some NJ stars for Final Battle since NJ won't be running any major shows until probably a couple weeks after FB. Hopefully the Okada rumors are true. Although I'd rather see Okada vs. Hero, Strong, or Cole it seems that they want Elgin vs. Okada. I'd assume we see Styles vs. Elgin again but I don't see Styles losing as long as he has the IWGP strap. Maybe a champion vs. Champion with neither title on the line? I really have no ideas for this reign. Ring of Honor is seriously lacking some star power aagain in my opinion. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2014 8:12:35 GMT -5
And I'm not saying WOTW wasn't better than BITW, because it was miles better. I'm just saying that even if ROH wanted to, that show on PPV was not gonna be possible. I'm hoping we get some NJ stars for Final Battle since NJ won't be running any major shows until probably a couple weeks after FB. Hopefully the Okada rumors are true. Although I'd rather see Okada vs. Hero, Strong, or Cole it seems that they want Elgin vs. Okada. I'd assume we see Styles vs. Elgin again but I don't see Styles losing as long as he has the IWGP strap. Maybe a champion vs. Champion with neither title on the line? I really have no ideas for this reign. Ring of Honor is seriously lacking some star power aagain in my opinion. Isn't Hero done with ROH? Last show he worked for them was the one in Dayton (I was there!) against AJ, I think. Elgin vs. Okada would be...something. Not something I'd want to see, but it'd be something. AJ/Elgin is probably best held off until after the Tokyo Dome when AJ's not the IWGP Champion anymore. Or maybe a double title match, AJ wins the ROH Title, drops the IWGP strap and sticks around ROH when his deal is up next year. ROH are in a real bad spot right now, especially if reDRagon end up being regulars in New Japan. That leaves their roster bare of arguably the most consistent performers they have and who do you slot in their place? The Young Bucks' appeal will wear off after a while if they're regulars and War Machine, while I love those guys, aren't going to tear it up every night without the right opponents. They've got such a...stagnant roster right now. Guess it matches the product, eh? |
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Post by Boy Wonder on Jul 19, 2014 8:23:28 GMT -5
Went to the show in Cincy last night. Good time as always. This was my first time at this venue and I loved it. Perfect set up. Very unique.
Pretty sure some dude got thrown out for not keeping his hands to himself around Veda Scott.
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Post by Jonathan Karate on Jul 19, 2014 8:30:12 GMT -5
Hopefully the Okada rumors are true. Although I'd rather see Okada vs. Hero, Strong, or Cole it seems that they want Elgin vs. Okada. I'd assume we see Styles vs. Elgin again but I don't see Styles losing as long as he has the IWGP strap. Maybe a champion vs. Champion with neither title on the line? I really have no ideas for this reign. Ring of Honor is seriously lacking some star power aagain in my opinion. Isn't Hero done with ROH? Last show he worked for them was the one in Dayton (I was there!) against AJ, I think. Elgin vs. Okada would be...something. Not something I'd want to see, but it'd be something. AJ/Elgin is probably best held off until after the Tokyo Dome when AJ's not the IWGP Champion anymore. Or maybe a double title match, AJ wins the ROH Title, drops the IWGP strap and sticks around ROH when his deal is up next year. ROH are in a real bad spot right now, especially if reDRagon end up being regulars in New Japan. That leaves their roster bare of arguably the most consistent performers they have and who do you slot in their place? The Young Bucks' appeal will wear off after a while if they're regulars and War Machine, while I love those guys, aren't going to tear it up every night without the right opponents. They've got such a...stagnant roster right now. Guess it matches the product, eh? Hero and Styles are on pay per appearance deals. I don't see AJ leaving New Japan for a VERY long time. I don't know why ROH isn't booking him more because he's not working a full schedule in New Japan. At least not yet. Booking and contracts are really hurting ROH in my opinion. My dream scenario for Ring of Honor would be the roster PWG uses (plus The Briscoe Brothers, Bobby Fish, Jacobs, etc) with the exposure and schedule they already have. |
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Post by Jonathan Karate on Jul 19, 2014 8:32:23 GMT -5
75% of the best Indy guys don't want to commit to a contract. That's why PWG, Beyond, and other companies are putting out MUCH better products right now.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2014 8:38:24 GMT -5
Isn't Hero done with ROH? Last show he worked for them was the one in Dayton (I was there!) against AJ, I think. Elgin vs. Okada would be...something. Not something I'd want to see, but it'd be something. AJ/Elgin is probably best held off until after the Tokyo Dome when AJ's not the IWGP Champion anymore. Or maybe a double title match, AJ wins the ROH Title, drops the IWGP strap and sticks around ROH when his deal is up next year. ROH are in a real bad spot right now, especially if reDRagon end up being regulars in New Japan. That leaves their roster bare of arguably the most consistent performers they have and who do you slot in their place? The Young Bucks' appeal will wear off after a while if they're regulars and War Machine, while I love those guys, aren't going to tear it up every night without the right opponents. They've got such a...stagnant roster right now. Guess it matches the product, eh? Hero and Styles are on pay per appearance deals. I don't see AJ leaving New Japan for a VERY long time. I don't know why ROH isn't booking him more because he's not working a full schedule in New Japan. At least not yet. Booking and contracts are really hurting ROH in my opinion. My dream scenario for Ring of Honor would be the roster PWG uses (plus The Briscoe Brothers, Bobby Fish, Jacobs, etc) with the exposure and schedule they already have. AJ's deal with them is up next April and there's actually a pretty good shot he signs with Global Force Wrestling and just works NJ sporadically since they have a working agreement...which would be another huge kick in the balls to ROH. |
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Post by Jonathan Karate on Jul 19, 2014 9:15:47 GMT -5
Hero and Styles are on pay per appearance deals. I don't see AJ leaving New Japan for a VERY long time. I don't know why ROH isn't booking him more because he's not working a full schedule in New Japan. At least not yet. Booking and contracts are really hurting ROH in my opinion. My dream scenario for Ring of Honor would be the roster PWG uses (plus The Briscoe Brothers, Bobby Fish, Jacobs, etc) with the exposure and schedule they already have. AJ's deal with them is up next April and there's actually a pretty good shot he signs with Global Force Wrestling and just works NJ sporadically since they have a working agreement...which would be another huge kick in the balls to ROH. But NJPW pays extremely well and is the number two promotion in the world. Unless Bullet Club is done after WrestleKingdom this year (which i doubt because they're over as  and NJPW doesnt just throw away stables) there's no way he's leaving. He can still work for Jeff with the NJPW/GFW partnership. Back to the topic of ROH. The entire title scene has been a mess since Steen dropped the title. The loss of Richards and Edwards just furthered the issues ROH had once they lost Dragon, Aries, Claudio, Generico, etc. And now Steens departure is going to make it even worse. Elgin Cole Briscoes ReDRagon Not much star power at all past those 6. They should really look into bringing in/back alot of the guys Gabe and PWG book. I would start with Gulak and Bussick. I'd bring in Chris Dickinson too. I would love some Ricochet, Gargano, and Swann in ROH. This is why i say contracts are hurting ROH. Guys like Ricochet are not going to pass up Dragon Gate and other companies that pay them and get them exposure. |
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Post by Jack on Jul 19, 2014 9:51:28 GMT -5
Dickinson, Busick and Gulak are awesome, they really deserve a chance to show them what they can do.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2014 9:52:43 GMT -5
AJ's deal with them is up next April and there's actually a pretty good shot he signs with Global Force Wrestling and just works NJ sporadically since they have a working agreement...which would be another huge kick in the balls to ROH. But NJPW pays extremely well and is the number two promotion in the world. Unless Bullet Club is done after WrestleKingdom this year (which i doubt because they're over as and NJPW doesnt just throw away stables) there's no way he's leaving. He can still work for Jeff with the NJPW/GFW partnership. Back to the topic of ROH. The entire title scene has been a mess since Steen dropped the title. The loss of Richards and Edwards just furthered the issues ROH had once they lost Dragon, Aries, Claudio, Generico, etc. And now Steens departure is going to make it even worse. Elgin Cole Briscoes ReDRagon Not much star power at all past those 6. They should really look into bringing in/back alot of the guys Gabe and PWG book. I would start with Gulak and Bussick. I'd bring in Chris Dickinson too. I would love some Ricochet, Gargano, and Swann in ROH. This is why i say contracts are hurting ROH. Guys like Ricochet are not going to pass up Dragon Gate and other companies that pay them and get them exposure. Yeah, but AJ has at least some loyalty to Jeff Jarrett and GFW's apparently being bankrolled by some deep pockets. The indie contracts are stupid. Mike Quackenbush said it best: if you don't pay the wrestlers a living wage (a lot of guys don't or else they wouldn't have to take as many non-contract bookings), why offer them a contract restricting where they can work and make a living? I get it with ROH, I guess since they're a TV/PPV company now but that doesn't make it any less awful for the fans and the wrestlers. Think of how thin that roster of stars is gonna get if New Japan decides they want reDRagon. I'd also like Busick and Gulak in ROH. Also, Bullet Club aren't "over as " with anyone but the internet/foreign fans who like them because it's a group of guys they're familiar with in New Japan winning matches and it's the cool thing to like right now. The Japanese fans aren't as into them as a lot of people would like to believe. Hell, AJ's title win got a decidedly "meh" reaction because a lot of fans had no real idea who he was despite AJ being presented as a star from TNA in New Japan years ago. Bullet Club are probably not going to be broken up or anything, but Wrestle Kingdom 9 is likely the beginning of the stable to get shoved down the card since it's looking like they're going to have every title going into that show. It wouldn't make any sense for them to enter the Dome with the titles and then not lose all of them plus, the all gaijin stable dominating the company can only run for so long before it just doesn't work anymore. |
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