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Post by King Bálor (CM)™ on Oct 21, 2013 0:26:51 GMT -5
Let me start by saying that on a scale of 1-10, I was running about a 7 in the desire to see this PPV. The card itself was really good. The development of story was an absolute abomination. AJ/Bully was completely mishandled. Ultimate X needed more back story....like why would Mannik allow all these other dudes to put his title on the line in an Ultimate X match, Angle/Roode was just rushed, etc. But I wasnt going to let the mishandled stories determine the quality of the PPV. HOWEVER, the quality of the PPV was even below par of the stories. What TNA has thrived at was putting on entertaining matches, telling a story in the ring, great spots and an athletic spectacle. What I got was a hot turd sizzling on a warm summer day. My final grade for this PPV.....D-! It doesnt get the full on F, cuz there were a few bring spots. The PPV had an ominous feel when the BROmans won the preshow gauntlet. WHAT?!?!?! They won on Impact to be the last team in. It gave them a little credibility to even be in the match. This was designed for Bad Influence and instead we were treated to this garbage. In fact, Bad Influence was eliminated by the jobber team?!?!?! I am tired of seeing EY and Park getting wins. They are JOBBERS!!!! Them winning or losing doesnt change it. Remember guys like Koko B Ware, Hacksaw Jim Duggan, Doink, etc?! They were loved by the crowd. They made us laugh. They were colorful. They appeared to be a credible cuz they had a name and were on tv. But they LOST! They were used for the sole purpose of putting someone over. That is what EY and Park are. They are enhancement guys. Guys that the crowd are into. They are recognized, but they should NOT be winning. Hell...BROMans are very much the same. Then the opening match was the Ultimate X. This should be logistically placed in the middle. But I understand WHY they made it the opening match for having to deconstruct it. I still think they probably could have done that if they had the HOF segment follow Ultimate X and then maybe a backstage interview. But ok. I would give the Ultimate X match a 7/10. Some good spots. A little slow paced....but there were 5 guys in there. The ending was stellar. We got a story, a new champ and an original finish. The tag match was horrid! I fully believed GunStorm was gonna lose and I was down with that....TO BAD INFLUENCE! Now the jobbers have belts. This made no sense. 2/10. The ladies match was ok. I would have much rather seen ODB go over clean and then Tapa to come out to destroy everyone, take the Knockouts Title....setup a feud with ODB. Instead we did get the AJ/Tamina ripoff. Gail doesnt need Tapa and Tapa most certainly DOES NOT need Gail. Poor booking ruins this match. 4/10 Angle/Roode was predictable, minus the finish. For whatever reason, Roode seems to fail in big matches....the only exception might be DX against Aries. I cant put my finger on it, but I find Roode to be incredibly BORING as an in ring performer. On the mic and telling the story from that point, good. As a tag team partner....solid. As a secondary figure.....very good. But when he is under the spotlight, I find he just doesnt show up. Tonight was no different. I found the match to go incredibly too long and too predictable with the spots. I give it a 5/10. Derrik Bateman vs. Peter Avalon?! Are you kidding me?!?!?! No problems with Bateman debuting. But why not against one of those enhancement guys.....EY, Park or even a returning Rob Terry. Waste of ![](http://www.wrestlingfigs.com/images/wfcensored.gif) ing time! I like the character.....but was never a Bateman fan. 1/10 Magnus/Sting was ok at best. Magnus continues to live up to his average self. Never stepping his game up and just going through the motions. I dont get what TNA sees in him. Sting went out there and told a great story. I hated the finish....but it could be saved if Sting admits to trying to help put Magnus on the map. He did it for AJ when he let AJ get the pin to win the TNA Title some years back. The inevitable heel turn was cemented tonight for Magnus as well. I think this will suit him better. Still say Sting did the job for the wrong guy. 5/10 AJ/Bully. It had a couple good spots in it. Obviously the table spot and spiral tap were great. The flying forearm to the chair was good. But it was a complete debacle from jump street. All the interference and from Bisch and Knux only?!?!?! Earlier in the night we saw Bully talking like he was talking to Devon and Doc. Subterfuge?! I guess. But it was never put over by the announcers. Tenay and Taz should have been commenting on the fact that A & 8s have regrouped and are back at full strength. They didnt and this became a weird and out of place segment. No one came down to help AJ. No Hogan appearance. We got the predictable Dixie interference, but it was baffling. She threatened Earl Hebner afte rthe springboard, yet alowed him to count the final 3 count. The match itself was very similar to Sabin/Bully from DX earlier this year the way it started. Then it turned into an utter cluster ![](http://www.wrestlingfigs.com/images/wfcensored.gif) . AJ started heeling in the match with Bully babyfacing back up, which made no sense. The finish was AWFUL, minus the spiral tap. Going into the crowd was a great touch...but would have been better to steal the Punk/MITB finishing sequence. Have Dixie and security go after him and him heading off into the crowd to celebrate. 4/10. Too many misfires. Too many unentertaining segments met with poor story development and an announce team that seemed to have cue cards. I love TNA. But I cant very well try and sell this off for anything more than what it was....disappointment combined with a stinky crap. I expected better. At least with WWE and WM, I KNOW how much of a snooze fest that show will be. I know that there will be 1 or 2 decent matches, 1 or 2 entertaining segments and the rest I can just snooze through. TNA doesnt normally do that to me. Tonight....they took a page from Raw.....train wreck.
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Post by Ian from 616Entertainment. on Oct 21, 2013 0:37:47 GMT -5
I actually really enjoyed Angle and Roode to the point that I thought it was great. Sting and Magnus was good, but it wasn't as good as Roode/Angle.
Stealing the MITB finish would have been horrible. It's been done. It's over. We'd all be saying "Way to steal the MITB finish, TNA, way to go." Earlier on you said a positive on the Ultimate X match was an original finish.. But you want a blatant rip off for the main event?
I do agree about Bully vs. AJ being a mess, though. I have no idea how you can see AJ playing the heel early, but whatever.
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Post by BCizzle on Oct 21, 2013 0:38:22 GMT -5
I know you love TNA, so your review is worth reading. I'm a big fan myself, and though I didn't watch this PPV (or any PPVs anymore except the ones on WWE Classics on Demand 6 months later), from what I've read of this show it just sounded underwhelming. With only 4 PPVs a year, if this is all the can put together with that much time to build, they really need a kick in the ass of the creative team.
I guess we can hope for the best and prepare for the worst, which would be TNA going out of business. We are in a big down time as pro wrestling fans. But hey, John Cena will be back soon to save the business!
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Post by Brad on Oct 21, 2013 0:43:38 GMT -5
I completely disagree with you on Roode/Angle
That was a dang good match
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Post by Falconsinclair on Oct 21, 2013 0:57:09 GMT -5
First off I didn't see the PPV, but after reading the results on here and the TNA website, this show almost feels like TNA tried to hit the reset button.
All four "active" championships changed hands on the show. I use the term active because the TNA site still lists Abyss as the Television Champion.
If you look at the current champions (AJ, Sabin & Gail Kim), with the exception of the Bro-Mans most were a big part of TNA before Hogan and Bischoff ever got there. Hopefully TNA will build on this show and not hit another reset in a couple of weeks.
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Post by King Silva on Oct 21, 2013 1:25:40 GMT -5
I thought the Roode/Angle match was the best of the night. The most surprisingly good match for me was the tag title match. I was not expecting much but they impressed me. I'm happy for Jesse. ![:P](http://www.wrestlingfigs.com/images/tongue.gif) I was also pleasantly surprised by the KO Title match. After BroMans won I knew all the belts were going to switch so Gail winning was awesome since I love her! Tapa helping her doesn't make too much sense but at least Gail is the champion and NOT Tapa because she is green as ![](http://www.wrestlingfigs.com/images/wfcensored.gif) .. A couple of the matches (X Division/Sting v Magnus) had some bad endings. I just didn't care for the way they ended. I really couldn't get into Sting/Magnus but maybe I was preoccupied so I might re-watch it later.. The X Division match should have been much better imo. Derrick Bateman's TNA debut was wow...who was that? I have no idea why he faced that jobbed and didn't just beat him in < 30 seconds. They should have gave him a legit opponent. The main event for me was okay. It had way too many run ins and such but it did have some great spots. AJ's 450 through the table was sick! Predictable that he was going to win however I like him so I'm not going to be upset he is champ. ![;)](http://www.wrestlingfigs.com/images/wink.gif)
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Post by "Living Legend" Duttanized on Oct 21, 2013 5:14:09 GMT -5
I loved the Roode/Angle and AJ/Bully matches. Ultimate X wasn't as fun as I'd hoped tbh. I too would've liked Bad Influence to win the tag team championships but whatever at least GunStorm doesn't have them now.
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Post by y2josh on Oct 21, 2013 9:04:10 GMT -5
I am not going to lie...I loved the whole show. It was a last minute decision for me to order it...I watched it alone...and I don't regret forking out the money at all. I popped for quite a few spots, and overall was pleased with the show. The ending of the Sting/Magnus match was my only complaint. It seemed to have no build.
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Post by King Bálor (CM)™ on Oct 21, 2013 14:12:37 GMT -5
I actually really enjoyed Angle and Roode to the point that I thought it was great. Sting and Magnus was good, but it wasn't as good as Roode/Angle. Stealing the MITB finish would have been horrible. It's been done. It's over. We'd all be saying "Way to steal the MITB finish, TNA, way to go." Earlier on you said a positive on the Ultimate X match was an original finish.. But you want a blatant rip off for the main event? I do agree about Bully vs. AJ being a mess, though. I have no idea how you can see AJ playing the heel early, but whatever. I wanted a blatant rip off so it could have been done right. WWE screwed that up by rushing Punk back to TV and on the roster. I posted before a more detailed perspective on exactly what I would do to capitalize on it. TNA has just completed ![](http://www.wrestlingfigs.com/images/wfcensored.gif) ed that story up. AJ was heeling when he was hitting Bully over and over and then Bully was absorbing it. AJ got frustrated and then Bully babyfaced up, fought back, knocking AJ to the ground. That is a classic heel reaction and babyface reaction. It should have been Bully nailing AJ and AJ taking the beating, fighting back and knocking Bully down. First off I didn't see the PPV, but after reading the results on here and the TNA website, this show almost feels like TNA tried to hit the reset button. All four "active" championships changed hands on the show. I use the term active because the TNA site still lists Abyss as the Television Champion. If you look at the current champions (AJ, Sabin & Gail Kim), with the exception of the Bro-Mans most were a big part of TNA before Hogan and Bischoff ever got there. Hopefully TNA will build on this show and not hit another reset in a couple of weeks. I was thinking about the "reset button" too. Not a complete reset, but it does seem to be a big change of the guard and I think them leaving the road is a big reason for it. I am not going to lie...I loved the whole show. It was a last minute decision for me to order it...I watched it alone...and I don't regret forking out the money at all. I popped for quite a few spots, and overall was pleased with the show. The ending of the Sting/Magnus match was my only complaint. It seemed to have no build. I am uterrly shocked. But then again you did go in with no expectations so its not like you could really be let down. I am also shocked over the out pour of praise for Roode/Angle. I see wrestling very differently....probably more old school for psychology. Its why I despise the HHH/UT WM HIAC and agreed with Bret Hart 4/10. Kicking out of each other's finishers constantly doesnt make you strong...it makes your finishers weak. Not only that but with them, they do it every freaking WM. You aint building drama, you are discrediting yourself. There is a time you can do it and a way. But when you do it so constantly it becomes predictable and boring. Want to build drama and keep your crowd on the edge of their seat....watch Joe/Punk 2 ROH. It was executed flawlessly.
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Post by Darkhawk on Oct 21, 2013 14:41:06 GMT -5
This PPV was way more entertaining than Wrestlemania 29. Also the fact that TNA had the top 3 trends on twitter beating NFL and Walking Dead shows a lot of fans watched this PPV. I actually enjoyed every minute, because it was a great PPV with great matches. I actually thought the Bro-Mans vs. Gunstorm was going to suck, but it was actually really good. Bobby Roode vs. Kurt Angle was the best match of the night for me and many people agree that match was better than there BFG 2011 match. And as for you complaining about AJ heeling it's a freaking NODQ match. AJ can very well take a chair and smack Bully Ray with it. AJ was NOT heeling it's just the concept of the match and nothing else. AJ actually did take beating from Bully Ray with all the chair shots and interference. Overall I 100% disagree with you.
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Post by mrassbillygunn on Oct 21, 2013 14:45:22 GMT -5
I am also shocked over the out pour of praise for Roode/Angle. I see wrestling very differently....probably more old school for psychology. Its why I despise the HHH/UT WM HIAC and agreed with Bret Hart 4/10. Kicking out of each other's finishers constantly doesnt make you strong...it makes your finishers weak. Not only that but with them, they do it every freaking WM. You aint building drama, you are discrediting yourself. There is a time you can do it and a way. But when you do it so constantly it becomes predictable and boring. Want to build drama and keep your crowd on the edge of their seat....watch Joe/Punk 2 ROH. It was executed flawlessly. Great point. Thats been the case with Undertakers matches at WM for the last 5 years or so, possibly longer.
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Post by Darkhawk on Oct 21, 2013 14:46:32 GMT -5
Great point. I made a long thread about this a few months back relating to Undertakers matches at WM. Ever since his first match with HBK he has been using that same formula in order to excite the crowd, lol i guess its been working going by the fans reactions but for me its became very predictable and i get frustrated because it affects me enjoying his matches now. Only they weren't kicking out of finisher's, because they were submissions there's a big difference. And they weren't kicking out of it either it was simple counter and counter which is again different. Roode was working on Angle's neck throughout the match and trying to make him tap out which was the point of the cross face after cross face. Angle did an Angle Slam on Roode off the top rope and got knocked out because of his damaged neck which made him lose. Totally different process from what CM Showstopper is failing to explain. It was nothing like the HBK vs. Undertaker match.
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Post by King Bálor (CM)™ on Oct 21, 2013 16:17:49 GMT -5
Great point. I made a long thread about this a few months back relating to Undertakers matches at WM. Ever since his first match with HBK he has been using that same formula in order to excite the crowd, lol i guess its been working going by the fans reactions but for me its became very predictable and i get frustrated because it affects me enjoying his matches now. Only they weren't kicking out of finisher's, because they were submissions there's a big difference. And they weren't kicking out of it either it was simple counter and counter which is again different. Roode was working on Angle's neck throughout the match and trying to make him tap out which was the point of the cross face after cross face. Angle did an Angle Slam on Roode off the top rope and got knocked out because of his damaged neck which made him lose. Totally different process from what CM Showstopper is failing to explain. It was nothing like the HBK vs. Undertaker match. The point is they are finishers. Yes....its a slight difference in the fact that they are finishers. But the idea is they are used as spots in the match where its used to make the crowd believe the match is moments from being over. Then it was countered and you think now the other guy might win and then again and then again. Its an over used spot that discredits the finisher. Otherwise wrestlers shouldnt bother having finishers.
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Post by Darkhawk on Oct 21, 2013 16:39:02 GMT -5
Only they weren't kicking out of finisher's, because they were submissions there's a big difference. And they weren't kicking out of it either it was simple counter and counter which is again different. Roode was working on Angle's neck throughout the match and trying to make him tap out which was the point of the cross face after cross face. Angle did an Angle Slam on Roode off the top rope and got knocked out because of his damaged neck which made him lose. Totally different process from what CM Showstopper is failing to explain. It was nothing like the HBK vs. Undertaker match. The point is they are finishers. Yes....its a slight difference in the fact that they are finishers. But the idea is they are used as spots in the match where its used to make the crowd believe the match is moments from being over. Then it was countered and you think now the other guy might win and then again and then again. Its an over used spot that discredits the finisher. Otherwise wrestlers shouldnt bother having finishers. It was different then finisher after finisher process though. Bobby Roode was out there to make Angle tap out which was why he was doing cross face after cross face. Almost making Angle tap out and got countered into and Ankle Lock and Roode almost tapped out himself and passed out a bit. Angle used and Angle Slam to get out of the Cross Face and that's about it. Roode really didn't use any other finisher he had. He was just out there trying to make Kurt Angle tap out which was the storyline. It didn't discredit the finisher, especially when they used the rope to break it on two occasions and Angle countered two cross faces with an Angle Slam and Ankle Lock.
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Post by Juba on Oct 21, 2013 16:40:13 GMT -5
Ultimate X was a huge let down. Lets call it what it is, Ultimate X is a spotfest...You didn't have any spots! Jeff looked pretty out of it the entire match where at points he looked confused. Joe should have never been added.
Everything was just boring. Roode/Angle was good but that ending was horrid. I can't believe what this company has become. I put on bound for glory 2007 after I watched this one and just felt destroyed.
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Post by Grumpyoldman on Oct 21, 2013 16:43:37 GMT -5
I was surprised to read how disappointed you were, seeing how much of a fan of TNA you are. I appreciate your honesty.
Can we all agree that AJ Styles needs a hair cut?
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Post by Darkhawk on Oct 21, 2013 17:29:49 GMT -5
I was surprised to read how disappointed you were, seeing how much of a fan of TNA you are. I appreciate your honesty. Can we all agree that AJ Styles needs a hair cut? Defiantly needs a haircut.
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Post by sharpshooter on Oct 21, 2013 17:43:54 GMT -5
What's everybody's opinion on Kurt Angle's reaction to the HOF induction? In the UK we don't get to see the PPV until Wednesday, so I'm just interested to hear people's thoughts on it.
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Post by Epic Z on Oct 21, 2013 18:36:32 GMT -5
I respectfully disagree with you. BroMans established themselves as a legit tag team by putting on a great match to capture the gold, UX was decent I agree you on that,but Roode vs Angle was a fantastic match besides the ending,and AJ and Bully was AMAZING!! It had the drama, the story telling and great wrestling with cool spots like forearm to the chair, 360 through the table, and the spiral tap.
I respect your opinion though since your not just another WWE smart ass fan acting like the know everything even though they don't even keep up with the actual show.
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Post by King Bálor (CM)™ on Oct 21, 2013 19:53:43 GMT -5
I was surprised to read how disappointed you were, seeing how much of a fan of TNA you are. I appreciate your honesty. Can we all agree that AJ Styles needs a hair cut? I always call it like I see it or at the very least caution my post admitting my bias. And yes...AJ needs a hair cut, b/c the lone wolf story and not knowing what side he is on is over. Keep the beard though. I respectfully disagree with you. BroMans established themselves as a legit tag team by putting on a great match to capture the gold, UX was decent I agree you on that,but Roode vs Angle was a fantastic match besides the ending,and AJ and Bully was AMAZING!! It had the drama, the story telling and great wrestling with cool spots like forearm to the chair, 360 through the table, and the spiral tap. I respect your opinion though since your not just another WWE smart ass fan acting like the know everything even though they don't even keep up with the actual show. Robbie E when he first came to TNA was a decent character. But he has become a comedy act alone. Just b/c he has a partner, doesnt change that for me. I dont like him as Tag Team Champion. If they wanted to make Robbie a serious character....then repackage him and stop with the comedy. I am still shocked at how many people have posted how much they loved Roode/Angle. Perhaps I shouldnt be considering how many people tell me I am crazy when I say 4/10 for HIAC HHH vs. Taker WM was. Also shocked at your love of the main event. I LOVE that AJ is champ. But the match was a cluster ![](http://www.wrestlingfigs.com/images/wfcensored.gif) as far as I am concerned.
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