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Post by johnnyb on Dec 5, 2014 22:25:01 GMT -5
LOL, it's pretty obvious that you weren't paying any attention. He gets a pop when he does the move, okay sure. How's his reaction when he enters? When he ISN'T doing that move? Silent, low pop at best. He isn't over, the spot is over. Simple concept, no? Because when he was doing the move, he was part of a team that wasn't really over... Cesaro himself was, but Swagger definitely wasn't when they were heels. And of course, as soon as the team broke up and Cesaro looked to be on the verge of a huge, organic push, they turn him heel and he gets buried. That's what he gets for getting over. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 5, 2014 22:27:26 GMT -5
He gets a pop when he does the move, okay sure. How's his reaction when he enters? When he ISN'T doing that move? Silent, low pop at best. He isn't over, the spot is over. Simple concept, no? Because when he was doing the move, he was part of a team that wasn't really over... Cesaro himself was, but Swagger definitely wasn't when they were heels. And of course, as soon as the team broke up and Cesaro looked to be on the verge of a huge, organic push, they turn him heel and he gets buried. That's what he gets for getting over. No, he wasn't. The only time he was over -by himself- was around WM time when every indy darling is over. Cesaro has zero personality, zero charisma and despite having a chance to show he has any at all each and every week, he fails to do so every single time. I love his in-ring work, he's a great wrestler, he just doesn't have what it takes to be a main eventer is all. |
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Post by LostHawk05 on Dec 5, 2014 22:33:45 GMT -5
Finally had a chance to watch it. Very well done. Wish the Network would do more specials like this.
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Post by johnnyb on Dec 5, 2014 22:34:33 GMT -5
Jesus Christ, I give up.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 6, 2014 5:07:51 GMT -5
Just caught this the 2nd time.....it was very interesting. Just WTF happened with Savage.......
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Post by Deleted on Dec 6, 2014 6:29:09 GMT -5
Im pretty sure it has to do with the Slim Jim deal.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 6, 2014 6:30:29 GMT -5
Because when he was doing the move, he was part of a team that wasn't really over... Cesaro himself was, but Swagger definitely wasn't when they were heels. And of course, as soon as the team broke up and Cesaro looked to be on the verge of a huge, organic push, they turn him heel and he gets buried. That's what he gets for getting over. No, he wasn't. The only time he was over -by himself- was around WM time when every indy darling is over. Cesaro has zero personality, zero charisma and despite having a chance to show he has any at all each and every week, he fails to do so every single time. I love his in-ring work, he's a great wrestler, he just doesn't have what it takes to be a main eventer is all. You're dislike for Cesaro is sad. He had everything it takes to be a main event guy. Vince just wont give him the opportunity. |
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Post by Next Manufactured’s Sweater on Dec 6, 2014 7:15:49 GMT -5
He had everything it takes to be a main event guy. Yes, on an independent show in a high school gym where the audience is 200 people who discuss wrestling on forums like us. In an arena, it's clear that based on his current ability, he should never be anywhere near the main event -- unless it's to fill out an Elimination Chamber, or maybe a Smackdown main event during a European tour when half the roster is working a house show the same night. Palmer likes Cesaro. And from his signature, you can see the kind of wrestling he's into. He just understands the difference between "guy I like who is popular on the Internet" and "guy who should be headlining WWE PPVs" -- a distinction that many are unable to make. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 6, 2014 10:50:38 GMT -5
No, he wasn't. The only time he was over -by himself- was around WM time when every indy darling is over. Cesaro has zero personality, zero charisma and despite having a chance to show he has any at all each and every week, he fails to do so every single time. I love his in-ring work, he's a great wrestler, he just doesn't have what it takes to be a main eventer is all. You're dislike for Cesaro is sad. He had everything it takes to be a main event guy. Vince just wont give him the opportunity. Can't read? |
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Tyler Black
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Post by Tyler Black on Dec 6, 2014 11:05:38 GMT -5
He had everything it takes to be a main event guy. Yes, on an independent show in a high school gym where the audience is 200 people who discuss wrestling on forums like us. In an arena, it's clear that based on his current ability, he should never be anywhere near the main event -- unless it's to fill out an Elimination Chamber, or maybe a Smackdown main event during a European tour when half the roster is working a house show the same night. Palmer likes Cesaro. And from his signature, you can see the kind of wrestling he's into. He just understands the difference between "guy I like who is popular on the Internet" and "guy who should be headlining WWE PPVs" -- a distinction that many are unable to make.Yes. This exactly this. I love indy wrestling and I love Cesaro, but Cesaro wasn't over because of his charisma or because of talking ability or anything like that. Cesaro was over for his ridiculous feats of strength, power spots. You can only do big impactful moves for so long because this is the WWE, not ROH or Chikara. I feel that too many fans can't differentiate between wrestling from a business perspective, and wrestling from a fans perspective. |
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Post by Next Manufactured’s Sweater on Dec 6, 2014 11:24:14 GMT -5
I feel that too many fans can't differentiate between wrestling from a business perspective, and wrestling from a fans perspective. That's basically it. People aren't fans anymore, they're armchair bookers/promoters armed with too little knowledge and perspective. The Internet makes us think we all know wrestling better than Vince McMahon, so we convince ourselves that our favourite guys are the best business choices for the world champions. Same thing with the Mattel toys, people fantasy book the Mattel line with absurdly unrealistic expectations. I guess sports fans do the same thing with their teams too. |
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Post by Chip on Dec 6, 2014 11:58:01 GMT -5
how do we know Cesaro has no charisma when he's never been given a true opportunity to show any? the closest they came was with his US title run, and even that was mostly done through youtube and after show stuff. how do we know Dolph Ziggler has charisma? he cuts promos....he's put in actual feuds with people, he's GIVEN all the tools he needs by the people who write the shows. and lets be perfectly honest here.....why do people love Dolph Ziggler? it's not because of his promos. (he's not bad, but he's not the best either) it's because of his IN RING WORK and HIS GIMMICK/CHARACTER HE'S BEEN GIVEN BY THE COMPANY ffs it's not that difficult to understand this crap. Roman Reigns has ZERO charisma. He's just a big tan guy with long hair. But the WWE BOOKS HIM TO WIN MATCHES WITH POWER MOVES ALL THE TIME so even the kiddies are like "ohhh he's cool!" Roman Reigns' entire presense is based on a spear and his superman punch. 2 moves. That are OVER. Literally every big name wrestler in history has been helped by his signature move if  ing Stone Cold Steve Austin is going to bat for Cesaro (why did he single HIM out in the podcast) I think it's a little more than just "indy darling armchair booking" |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 6, 2014 12:05:41 GMT -5
how do we know Cesaro has no charisma when he's never been given a true opportunity to show any? the closest they came was with his US title run, and even that was mostly done through youtube and after show stuff. how do we know Dolph Ziggler has charisma? he cuts promos....he's put in actual feuds with people, he's GIVEN all the tools he needs by the people who write the shows. and lets be perfectly honest here.....why do people love Dolph Ziggler? it's not because of his promos. (he's not bad, but he's not the best either) it's because of his IN RING WORK and HIS GIMMICK/CHARACTER HE'S BEEN GIVEN BY THE COMPANY ffs it's not that difficult to understand this crap. Roman Reigns has ZERO charisma. He's just a big tan guy with long hair. But the WWE BOOKS HIM TO WIN MATCHES WITH POWER MOVES ALL THE TIME so even the kiddies are like "ohhh he's cool!" Roman Reigns' entire presense is based on a spear and his superman punch. 2 moves. That are OVER. Literally every big name wrestler in history has been helped by his signature move if ing Stone Cold Steve Austin is going to bat for Cesaro (why did he single HIM out in the podcast) I think it's a little more than just "indy darling armchair booking" He has a chance to show charisma literally every chance he's in the ring. He doesn't. Ziggler can connect with a crowd in the ring and out, Cesaro cannot. Roman Reigns, again, can connect with the crowd. He has a presence in the ring, that's part of it. He's just as bad as Cesaro on the mic (we'll see if acting classes helped, I'm assuming no), but he can CONNECT WITH THE CROWD. The only time Cesaro does is when he's swinging somebody. Cesaro, as stated in another thread, is a great wrestler with some flashy moves but zero personality. It's really not hard to understand. When a wrestler gets into the ring, he has the chance to show charisma and to show personality. Cesaro has failed to do so just about every time he gets in the ring. And yes, Austin liked him when the crowd did, around WM season, which ing got Fandango's old song to Top 40 in some places. You cannot judge how over somebody is by using three-four weeks out of the year when the crowds are generally the hottest. |
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Tyler Black
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Post by Tyler Black on Dec 6, 2014 12:19:40 GMT -5
Exactly, and im not saying Cesaro isn't main event quality, he just isn't main event quality right now. It is possible that he will develop more charisma but right now he has none. I mean look at Tyson Kidd. Guy has no charisma at all when he first comes up, flounders gets sent to NXT, and now he's excelling with his "douchebag, hides behind wife, fact" gimmick
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Post by Deleted on Dec 6, 2014 12:50:39 GMT -5
Exactly, and im not saying Cesaro isn't main event quality, he just isn't main event quality right now. It is possible that he will develop more charisma but right now he has none. I mean look at Tyson Kidd. Guy has no charisma at all when he first comes up, flounders gets sent to NXT, and now he's excelling with his "douchebag, hides behind wife, fact" gimmick Don't forget the cats! |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 7, 2014 11:19:50 GMT -5
Vince is so out of touch
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Post by Deleted on Dec 7, 2014 11:35:25 GMT -5
how do we know Cesaro has no charisma when he's never been given a true opportunity to show any? the closest they came was with his US title run, and even that was mostly done through youtube and after show stuff. how do we know Dolph Ziggler has charisma? he cuts promos....he's put in actual feuds with people, he's GIVEN all the tools he needs by the people who write the shows. and lets be perfectly honest here.....why do people love Dolph Ziggler? it's not because of his promos. (he's not bad, but he's not the best either) it's because of his IN RING WORK and HIS GIMMICK/CHARACTER HE'S BEEN GIVEN BY THE COMPANY ffs it's not that difficult to understand this crap. Roman Reigns has ZERO charisma. He's just a big tan guy with long hair. But the WWE BOOKS HIM TO WIN MATCHES WITH POWER MOVES ALL THE TIME so even the kiddies are like "ohhh he's cool!" Roman Reigns' entire presense is based on a spear and his superman punch. 2 moves. That are OVER. Literally every big name wrestler in history has been helped by his signature move if ing Stone Cold Steve Austin is going to bat for Cesaro (why did he single HIM out in the podcast) I think it's a little more than just "indy darling armchair booking" This. But some will always argue otherwise |
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Post by Last Trent Barreta Fan on Dec 7, 2014 15:05:55 GMT -5
This thread was more entertaining than the podcast.
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Post by Chip on Dec 7, 2014 15:50:30 GMT -5
how do we know Cesaro has no charisma when he's never been given a true opportunity to show any? the closest they came was with his US title run, and even that was mostly done through youtube and after show stuff. how do we know Dolph Ziggler has charisma? he cuts promos....he's put in actual feuds with people, he's GIVEN all the tools he needs by the people who write the shows. and lets be perfectly honest here.....why do people love Dolph Ziggler? it's not because of his promos. (he's not bad, but he's not the best either) it's because of his IN RING WORK and HIS GIMMICK/CHARACTER HE'S BEEN GIVEN BY THE COMPANY ffs it's not that difficult to understand this crap. Roman Reigns has ZERO charisma. He's just a big tan guy with long hair. But the WWE BOOKS HIM TO WIN MATCHES WITH POWER MOVES ALL THE TIME so even the kiddies are like "ohhh he's cool!" Roman Reigns' entire presense is based on a spear and his superman punch. 2 moves. That are OVER. Literally every big name wrestler in history has been helped by his signature move if ing Stone Cold Steve Austin is going to bat for Cesaro (why did he single HIM out in the podcast) I think it's a little more than just "indy darling armchair booking" He has a chance to show charisma literally every chance he's in the ring. He doesn't. Ziggler can connect with a crowd in the ring and out, Cesaro cannot. Roman Reigns, again, can connect with the crowd. He has a presence in the ring, that's part of it. He's just as bad as Cesaro on the mic (we'll see if acting classes helped, I'm assuming no), but he can CONNECT WITH THE CROWD. The only time Cesaro does is when he's swinging somebody. Cesaro, as stated in another thread, is a great wrestler with some flashy moves but zero personality. It's really not hard to understand. When a wrestler gets into the ring, he has the chance to show charisma and to show personality. Cesaro has failed to do so just about every time he gets in the ring. And yes, Austin liked him when the crowd did, around WM season, which ing got Fandango's old song to Top 40 in some places. You cannot judge how over somebody is by using three-four weeks out of the year when the crowds are generally the hottest. Cesaro "connecting" with the audience. Besides that.... THEY....being the WWE....haven't given or let Cesaro do ANYTHING that will actually let him "connect with the audience" And you keep saying the Swing.... Yeah. That's connecting with the audience. And they aren't having him do it because he's a heel. It's also hard for the audience to connect with a guy who LOSES ALL THE TIME. If Cesaro was being booked & used the way Roman Reigns was he would have zero problems "connecting with the audience" and 50,000 people losing their crap when he threw Big Show over the top rope at Wrestlemania wasnt a bunch of internet marks on a marky mark crowd of marks night. Cesaro "connects" with plenty of people. But even myself am starting to not care as much because every time he comes out he just loses. No one wants to support a loser. No matter how many things he does. And if you really need something to "connect with the audience" than Cesaro should be doing the HEY! gimmick...because everyone loves to chant/cheer along with a wrestler |
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Post by rustyy on Dec 7, 2014 15:51:36 GMT -5
how do we know Cesaro has no charisma when he's never been given a true opportunity to show any? the closest they came was with his US title run, and even that was mostly done through youtube and after show stuff. how do we know Dolph Ziggler has charisma? he cuts promos....he's put in actual feuds with people, he's GIVEN all the tools he needs by the people who write the shows. and lets be perfectly honest here.....why do people love Dolph Ziggler? it's not because of his promos. (he's not bad, but he's not the best either) it's because of his IN RING WORK and HIS GIMMICK/CHARACTER HE'S BEEN GIVEN BY THE COMPANY ffs it's not that difficult to understand this crap. Roman Reigns has ZERO charisma. He's just a big tan guy with long hair. But the WWE BOOKS HIM TO WIN MATCHES WITH POWER MOVES ALL THE TIME so even the kiddies are like "ohhh he's cool!" Roman Reigns' entire presense is based on a spear and his superman punch. 2 moves. That are OVER. Literally every big name wrestler in history has been helped by his signature move if ing Stone Cold Steve Austin is going to bat for Cesaro (why did he single HIM out in the podcast) I think it's a little more than just "indy darling armchair booking" This. But some will always argue otherwise Because he has matches just as Ziggler does and he has yet to get over like he has. Other than that 3 week period, Ziggler is over constantly and consistently. Using Randy Orton, Cena and Daniel Bryan matches doesn't help your cause, they make people interested in everything they do more or less. This thread was more entertaining than the podcast. I agree lol. |
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