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Post by Kliquid on May 7, 2008 17:00:34 GMT -5
I'll take Steve Young & Joe Montana over Brad Johnson, Randall Cunningham, Gus Frerotte, Jeff George, Daunte Culpepper, Kerry Collins, and Andrew Walter. Randy Moss has had the luxury of working with ONE premier quarterback over his entire career and we saw the result of that last season. I'll take Moss. Don't get me wrong, Jerry Rice was unbelievably great -- the best ever... But his raw talent cannot touch what Randy Moss has. Valid point. BUT....Moss' best season was with the QB that I consider to be the best of all time, Tom Brady. His rookie season was with Randall Cunningham, who was damn good that season and surely it didnt hurt having a hall of fame WR on the opposite end. That Vikings Squad was loaded with talent. Culpepper was more than sufficient for a couple of years and might have put up HOF numbers, had it not been for his injury. And Jeff George of course was "Mr. Air It Out." Not tough to put up stats with a QB that throws down field all the time. And as far as Randy's days in Oakland.....well, even by his own admission he wasnt playing hard and his stats proved that. I think Rice had more class and dignity and he also had better footwork. I'll give Moss his due.......I would put him 2nd, just slightly under Rice. And perhaps when its all said and done, I might even put him above Rice. But at this point......I need to see more and I need to see more class. I guess I don't see what "class" has to do with being a good receiver. On top of that, Moss's supposed lack of class is 99% bullshit. Moss is, for the most part, very respectful. He listens to his coaching staff even if they are thick-headed and dumb as rocks like Mike Tice, he generally gets along with most of his teammates, and the whole 'mooning' incident in Green Bay was perhaps the most overplayed thing I have ever seen. New England knew what they were getting in Randy Moss and they laughed all the way to the bank when they got him. In response to the quarterbacks you named.... Randall Cunningham - This is a guy who had the best season of his professional career in his 13th NFL season... Cris Carter, Jake Reed, and most importantly Randy Moss MADE him that year. Please don't try to act like Randall Cunningham "still had it." He was the BEST he ever was in the late 80's, but had his best statistical season almost 10 years after that... The guy was basically out of the league after that season. Jeff George - Really? You think it's "not hard to score" with Jeff George throwing you the ball? Yeah, he has a rocket arm -- but I think you can count on one hand the number of receivers in NFL history who could have a pro bowl season with Jeff George as their quarterback. The guy was trash and you know it. You can paint a turd gold, but it still stinks. The Oakland Days - Yeah, he wasn't playing his hardest at all... Incredibly, he still had a 1000+ yard, 8 touchdown season. Most NFL receivers will NEVER sniff even those numbers. No one was trying on those Oakland teams -- why should he try? Tom Brady - Of course Tom Brady can be placed into the same class as Steve Young and Joe Montana. But the question is, would Tom Brady have even come close to what he did last year WITHOUT Randy Moss? I tend to think not. |
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Post by King Bálor (CM)™ on May 7, 2008 17:52:56 GMT -5
Valid point. BUT....Moss' best season was with the QB that I consider to be the best of all time, Tom Brady. His rookie season was with Randall Cunningham, who was damn good that season and surely it didnt hurt having a hall of fame WR on the opposite end. That Vikings Squad was loaded with talent. Culpepper was more than sufficient for a couple of years and might have put up HOF numbers, had it not been for his injury. And Jeff George of course was "Mr. Air It Out." Not tough to put up stats with a QB that throws down field all the time. And as far as Randy's days in Oakland.....well, even by his own admission he wasnt playing hard and his stats proved that. I think Rice had more class and dignity and he also had better footwork. I'll give Moss his due.......I would put him 2nd, just slightly under Rice. And perhaps when its all said and done, I might even put him above Rice. But at this point......I need to see more and I need to see more class. I guess I don't see what "class" has to do with being a good receiver. On top of that, Moss's supposed lack of class is 99% bull ****. Moss is, for the most part, very respectful. He listens to his coaching staff even if they are thick-headed and dumb as rocks like Mike Tice, he generally gets along with most of his teammates, and the whole 'mooning' incident in Green Bay was perhaps the most overplayed thing I have ever seen. New England knew what they were getting in Randy Moss and they laughed all the way to the bank when they got him. In response to the quarterbacks you named.... Randall Cunningham - This is a guy who had the best season of his professional career in his 13th NFL season... Cris Carter, Jake Reed, and most importantly Randy Moss MADE him that year. Please don't try to act like Randall Cunningham "still had it." He was the BEST he ever was in the late 80's, but had his best statistical season almost 10 years after that... The guy was basically out of the league after that season. Jeff George - Really? You think it's "not hard to score" with Jeff George throwing you the ball? Yeah, he has a rocket arm -- but I think you can count on one hand the number of receivers in NFL history who could have a pro bowl season with Jeff George as their quarterback. The guy was trash and you know it. You can paint a turd gold, but it still stinks. The Oakland Days - Yeah, he wasn't playing his hardest at all... Incredibly, he still had a 1000+ yard, 8 touchdown season. Most NFL receivers will NEVER sniff even those numbers. No one was trying on those Oakland teams -- why should he try? Tom Brady - Of course Tom Brady can be placed into the same class as Steve Young and Joe Montana. But the question is, would Tom Brady have even come close to what he did last year WITHOUT Randy Moss? I tend to think not. Dont know what class has to do with it? I cite T.O. Athletically, this guy is the most gifted wide receiver to ever play the game. HE, if anyone, should be the best of all time. And yet.......I dont even have him in my top 5. As far as Moss being "classy" and you saying its 99% BS. Lets see......a moaning incident in Minnesota, bitching and moaning in Oakland albeit valid, admitting he doesnt play hard on every play....shall I go on? These are not examples of class acts. And why does every discussion on here have to turn into rants? I was simply making my point with my opinion, while still giving creedance to what you said. |
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Post by jordanstaal on May 7, 2008 18:28:48 GMT -5
I guess I don't see what "class" has to do with being a good receiver. On top of that, Moss's supposed lack of class is 99% bull ****. Moss is, for the most part, very respectful. He listens to his coaching staff even if they are thick-headed and dumb as rocks like Mike Tice, he generally gets along with most of his teammates, and the whole 'mooning' incident in Green Bay was perhaps the most overplayed thing I have ever seen. New England knew what they were getting in Randy Moss and they laughed all the way to the bank when they got him. In response to the quarterbacks you named.... Randall Cunningham - This is a guy who had the best season of his professional career in his 13th NFL season... Cris Carter, Jake Reed, and most importantly Randy Moss MADE him that year. Please don't try to act like Randall Cunningham "still had it." He was the BEST he ever was in the late 80's, but had his best statistical season almost 10 years after that... The guy was basically out of the league after that season. Jeff George - Really? You think it's "not hard to score" with Jeff George throwing you the ball? Yeah, he has a rocket arm -- but I think you can count on one hand the number of receivers in NFL history who could have a pro bowl season with Jeff George as their quarterback. The guy was trash and you know it. You can paint a turd gold, but it still stinks. The Oakland Days - Yeah, he wasn't playing his hardest at all... Incredibly, he still had a 1000+ yard, 8 touchdown season. Most NFL receivers will NEVER sniff even those numbers. No one was trying on those Oakland teams -- why should he try? Tom Brady - Of course Tom Brady can be placed into the same class as Steve Young and Joe Montana. But the question is, would Tom Brady have even come close to what he did last year WITHOUT Randy Moss? I tend to think not. Dont know what class has to do with it? I cite T.O. Athletically, this guy is the most gifted wide receiver to ever play the game. HE, if anyone, should be the best of all time. And yet.......I dont even have him in my top 5. As far as Moss being "classy" and you saying its 99% BS. Lets see......a moaning incident in Minnesota, bitching and moaning in Oakland albeit valid, admitting he doesnt play hard on every play....shall I go on? These are not examples of class acts. And why does every discussion on here have to turn into rants? I was simply making my point with my opinion, while still giving creedance to what you said. being a class act has nothing to do with the talent level that Randy Moss has. Stop being a jackass. no one cares about your opinion on whether he has a good attitude or not. His attitude has no effect on how he burns corners down field for touchdowns on a weekly basis Moss is the best receiver to grace this game. He's faster than Rice, has better hands than Rice. The only reason he doesn't have the records is because he still has years left in him as well as the horrible teams and QB's he's played with. and you pretty much proved you know absolutely nothing about football.. outside of being a jets fan.. you just said that owens is the best WR in the nfl lol |
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Post by Jean-Ralphio on May 7, 2008 18:29:35 GMT -5
I just think its funny that Rice was such a cock to Moss when he broke his record.
Regardless, I will stay out of this argument
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Post by King Bálor (CM)™ on May 7, 2008 18:31:20 GMT -5
Dont know what class has to do with it? I cite T.O. Athletically, this guy is the most gifted wide receiver to ever play the game. HE, if anyone, should be the best of all time. And yet.......I dont even have him in my top 5. As far as Moss being "classy" and you saying its 99% BS. Lets see......a moaning incident in Minnesota, bitching and moaning in Oakland albeit valid, admitting he doesnt play hard on every play....shall I go on? These are not examples of class acts. And why does every discussion on here have to turn into rants? I was simply making my point with my opinion, while still giving creedance to what you said. being a class act has nothing to do with the talent level that Randy Moss has. Stop being a jackass. no one cares about your opinion on whether he has a good attitude or not. His attitude has no effect on how he burns corners down field for touchdowns on a weekly basis Moss is the best receiver to grace this game. He's faster than Rice, has better hands than Rice. The only reason he doesn't have the records is because he still has years left in him as well as the horrible teams and QB's he's played with. and you pretty much proved you know absolutely nothing about football.. outside of being a jets fan.. you just said that owens is the best WR in the nfl lol Name calling is not necessary. And I never said that TO was the best. I said he should be. But he is not. |
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Post by jordanstaal on May 7, 2008 18:34:57 GMT -5
being a class act has nothing to do with the talent level that Randy Moss has. Stop being a jackass. no one cares about your opinion on whether he has a good attitude or not. His attitude has no effect on how he burns corners down field for touchdowns on a weekly basis Moss is the best receiver to grace this game. He's faster than Rice, has better hands than Rice. The only reason he doesn't have the records is because he still has years left in him as well as the horrible teams and QB's he's played with. and you pretty much proved you know absolutely nothing about football.. outside of being a jets fan.. you just said that owens is the best WR in the nfl lol Name calling is not necessary. And I never said that TO was the best. I said he should be. But he is not. how should he be the best? if he was the best, he would be the best. His hands are like rocks and he really isn't all the athletic. He's like a  ing linebacker at WR |
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Post by King Bálor (CM)™ on May 7, 2008 19:14:39 GMT -5
Name calling is not necessary. And I never said that TO was the best. I said he should be. But he is not. how should he be the best? if he was the best, he would be the best. His hands are like rocks and he really isn't all the athletic. He's like a ing linebacker at WR I agree his hands are the best in the NFL. But his power is unmatched at his position. He is cannot be single covered and SHOULD be the best WR. But the fact that he is lazy and has a ME first attitude is and will always be his downfall. Some will say that he works out real hard. But thats not enough. He is too busy during camps and preseason showing off his physique, instead of working with his team mates. |
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Post by jordanstaal on May 7, 2008 19:16:45 GMT -5
how should he be the best? if he was the best, he would be the best. His hands are like rocks and he really isn't all the athletic. He's like a ing linebacker at WR I agree his hands are the best in the NFL. But his power is unmatched at his position. He is cannot be single covered and SHOULD be the best WR. But the fact that he is lazy and has a ME first attitude is and will always be his downfall. Some will say that he works out real hard. But thats not enough. He is too busy during camps and preseason showing off his physique, instead of working with his team mates. or maybe the fact that he leads the nfl in dropped balls.. probably a good reason he doesn't get double covered like moss does |
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Post by Kliquid on May 7, 2008 23:38:45 GMT -5
Dont know what class has to do with it? I cite T.O. Athletically, this guy is the most gifted wide receiver to ever play the game. HE, if anyone, should be the best of all time. And yet.......I dont even have him in my top 5. What does T.O.'s off-field incidents have to do with how he plays on the field? The guy works his ass off and produces big numbers every year. I'm confused. Are we fielding a football team or a Church choir? The Cowboys are my favorite team... But Terrell Owens has never been and will never be as good as Randy Moss. Moss is by FAR the most talented/gifted receiver ever. It's not even close. Sorry. As far as Moss being "classy" and you saying its 99% BS. Lets see......a moaning incident in Minnesota, bitching and moaning in Oakland albeit valid, admitting he doesnt play hard on every play....shall I go on? These are not examples of class acts. A "moaning" incident in Minnesota? What? Are you talking about the 'mooning' during the Green Bay game? If so, let me sit back and laugh, because as I already said, that was the most ridiculously over-played thing that I have ever seen in the NFL. It was nothing. If Joe Buck wouldn't have been so offended by it, no one would have said a damn thing. But because he's the kind of guy who'd be offended and shocked to hear that his parents had sexual intercourse to create him, he made a huge deal out of it. It was nothing. Please go on with your stories of how Moss is such a horrible person. I guarantee I can find you other players who have done MUCH worse and yet are still somehow 'forgiven'. It's because Moss is so ridiculously dominant that people have to try to find these little bullcrapflaws in him. Moss was recently 'busted' for supposedly beating up some girl. Everyone was so shocked and appalled by it, but - surprise! It wasn't true! It was someone trying to make a big deal out of ABSOLUTELY NOTHING because he's a famous athlete. Sound familiar? Yeah, it happens all the time... And it won't be the last time it happens to Moss. As for him "not trying" when he's on the field, guess what - it's called the truth. Randy Moss speaks the truth. If every athlete had the balls to speak the truth, you'd be shocked to hear how they feel. Believe it or not, every athlete "takes plays off." Every single one of them. Randy Moss just has the balls to admit it. I, for one, commend him on being true to who he is and telling it like it is. This isn't a guy who is going to change himself to impress people who he doesn't give a damn about. Randy Moss at 75% is still one of the best receivers in the NFL. That's how good he is. He proved that in 2004 when he scored 13 touchdowns while playing in about a combined total (if you add all of the 1/2 and 1/4 games he played in) of about 9 games. And why does every discussion on here have to turn into rants? I was simply making my point with my opinion, while still giving creedance to what you said. It doesn't have to do with your "opinion" so much as it has to do with you misrepresenting the facts. I agree his hands are the best in the NFL. But his power is unmatched at his position. He is cannot be single covered and SHOULD be the best WR. But the fact that he is lazy and has a ME first attitude is and will always be his downfall. Some will say that he works out real hard. But thats not enough. He is too busy during camps and preseason showing off his physique, instead of working with his team mates. Terrell Owens is not "lazy." What are you talking about? If you call blocking a linebacker 30 yards down the field "lazy," then yeah, you're right. He's lazy. Owens was "banned" from training camp in Philadelphia and was working out on his own. Owens was in training camp last year for Dallas. Again, what are you talking about? |
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Post by King Bálor (CM)™ on May 8, 2008 13:54:01 GMT -5
Dont know what class has to do with it? I cite T.O. Athletically, this guy is the most gifted wide receiver to ever play the game. HE, if anyone, should be the best of all time. And yet.......I dont even have him in my top 5. What does T.O.'s off-field incidents have to do with how he plays on the field? The guy works his ass off and produces big numbers every year. I'm confused. Are we fielding a football team or a Church choir? The Cowboys are my favorite team... But Terrell Owens has never been and will never be as good as Randy Moss. Moss is by FAR the most talented/gifted receiver ever. It's not even close. Sorry. A "moaning" incident in Minnesota? What? Are you talking about the 'mooning' during the Green Bay game? If so, let me sit back and laugh, because as I already said, that was the most ridiculously over-played thing that I have ever seen in the NFL. It was nothing. If Joe Buck wouldn't have been so offended by it, no one would have said a damn thing. But because he's the kind of guy who'd be offended and shocked to hear that his parents had sexual intercourse to create him, he made a huge deal out of it. It was nothing. Please go on with your stories of how Moss is such a horrible person. I guarantee I can find you other players who have done MUCH worse and yet are still somehow 'forgiven'. It's because Moss is so ridiculously dominant that people have to try to find these little bull **** flaws in him. Moss was recently 'busted' for supposedly beating up some girl. Everyone was so shocked and appalled by it, but - surprise! It wasn't true! It was someone trying to make a big deal out of ABSOLUTELY NOTHING because he's a famous athlete. Sound familiar? Yeah, it happens all the time... And it won't be the last time it happens to Moss. As for him "not trying" when he's on the field, guess what - it's called the truth. Randy Moss speaks the truth. If every athlete had the balls to speak the truth, you'd be shocked to hear how they feel. Believe it or not, every athlete "takes plays off." Every single one of them. Randy Moss just has the balls to admit it. I, for one, commend him on being true to who he is and telling it like it is. This isn't a guy who is going to change himself to impress people who he doesn't give a damn about. Randy Moss at 75% is still one of the best receivers in the NFL. That's how good he is. He proved that in 2004 when he scored 13 touchdowns while playing in about a combined total (if you add all of the 1/2 and 1/4 games he played in) of about 9 games. It doesn't have to do with your "opinion" so much as it has to do with you misrepresenting the facts. I agree his hands are the best in the NFL. But his power is unmatched at his position. He is cannot be single covered and SHOULD be the best WR. But the fact that he is lazy and has a ME first attitude is and will always be his downfall. Some will say that he works out real hard. But thats not enough. He is too busy during camps and preseason showing off his physique, instead of working with his team mates. Terrell Owens is not "lazy." What are you talking about? If you call blocking a linebacker 30 yards down the field "lazy," then yeah, you're right. He's lazy. Owens was "banned" from training camp in Philadelphia and was working out on his own. Owens was in training camp last year for Dallas. Again, what are you talking about? I dont misrepresent facts. I simply state them. |
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Post by justtooratedr on May 8, 2008 14:36:44 GMT -5
"I think that he was the best all time."
"NO ONE CAN HAVE OPINIONS THAT AREN'T MINE!!!!!"
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Post by Kliquid on May 8, 2008 15:00:02 GMT -5
I dont misrepresent facts. I simply state them. Your statements about Terrell Owens' work ethic are flat-out not true. |
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Post by bad guy™ on May 9, 2008 9:29:51 GMT -5
 ^^ My new hero! I know Im gonna get bashed, but I am LOVING this. This man's mission is to kill the Pats, and frankly, I am loving it. More videos came out yesterday, and what do you know, they were of the Steelers! The more dirt, the merrier I say. Puts those Pats back in their place. Sick 'em, Arlen. ;D |
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Post by Jean-Ralphio on May 9, 2008 9:35:41 GMT -5
^^ My new hero! I know Im gonna get bashed, but I am LOVING this. This man's mission is to kill the Pats, and frankly, I am loving it. More videos came out yesterday, and what do you know, they were of the Steelers! The more dirt, the merrier I say. Puts those Pats back in their place. Sick 'em, Arlen. ;D 1. Goddell knew of the videos, Belichick told him what he had been doing since 2000, not jsut of the Steelers. 2. Arlen Spector is a US Senator, he needs to focus on other important things, other than his vendetta against the Patriots because hes a jealous gump bitch GO GET EM ARLEN! Big Ben sucks too, look at Tony Romo, banging hot tail, has a better team too, and doenst crash his motorcycle. |
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Post by bad guy™ on May 9, 2008 9:38:30 GMT -5
^^ My new hero! I know Im gonna get bashed, but I am LOVING this. This man's mission is to kill the Pats, and frankly, I am loving it. More videos came out yesterday, and what do you know, they were of the Steelers! The more dirt, the merrier I say. Puts those Pats back in their place. Sick 'em, Arlen. ;D 1. Goddell knew of the videos, Belichick told him what he had been doing since 2000, not jsut of the Steelers. 2. Arlen Spector is a US Senator, he needs to focus on other important things, other than his vendetta against the Patriots because hes a jealous gump bitch GO GET EM ARLEN! Big Ben sucks too, look at Tony Romo, banging hot tail, has a better team too, and doenst crash his motorcycle. To be fair, Arlen is just doing this to win over the PA voters. I mean, he will need them to beat Chris Matthews come next election. And I never said Ben was great...did I? I hate the guy. Im more of a Rivers fan.  |
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Post by Jean-Ralphio on May 9, 2008 9:40:31 GMT -5
Rivers sucks even more, at least root for your hometown team you fair weather fan.
So Arlen is bashing a team, that has nothing to do with his state, or nothing to do with him AT ALL, to win votes against Hard Ball?
He sucks nad he will lose
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Post by T R W on May 9, 2008 9:40:46 GMT -5
Well, to be serious about it, I actually hate this, because it makes football look bad. I am no Pats fan, BUT, they have been a dynasty who have built remarkable teams and would have won 99% of any game they cheated in without cheating. I actually hate to see their dynasty tainted at all. In the end, it hurts football, and will cause more restrictions and issues for all teams. They will most likely be reprimanded again though.
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Post by bad guy™ on May 9, 2008 9:45:27 GMT -5
Rivers sucks even more, at least root for your hometown team you fair weather fan. So Arlen is bashing a team, that has nothing to do with his state, or nothing to do with him AT ALL, to win votes against Hard Ball? He sucks nad he will lose Just because I dont like a player or two, that does not make me a fair weather fan. TRW, even though you are probably right, there should be more than a reprimand this time.  |
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Post by Jean-Ralphio on May 9, 2008 9:47:28 GMT -5
Rivers sucks even more, at least root for your hometown team you fair weather fan. So Arlen is bashing a team, that has nothing to do with his state, or nothing to do with him AT ALL, to win votes against Hard Ball? He sucks nad he will lose Just because I dont like a player or two, that does not make me a fair weather fan. TRW, even though you are probably right, there should be more than a reprimand this time. No there shouldnt. Belichick told the commissioner what was out there, and there it was....what he said was out there. The punishment was already handed out, nothing new came out with this. Stop rooting for the United States Senate to stop the Patriots because the Steelers are ups and cant. |
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Post by Kliquid on May 9, 2008 10:07:46 GMT -5
YEAH! THOSE PATRIOTS ARE CHEATERS!
JUST LIKE EVERY OTHER TEAM WHO DOES THE SAME THING!
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