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Post by hbkjason on Nov 6, 2019 2:29:56 GMT -5
Wrestling Memories: Bret Hart vs Steve Austin
Now, this is my own personal opinion, but I legit believe that Bret Hart is one of the greatest in ring performers of all time. It did not matter who you put him in the ring with, he got at the very least a decent match out of them. He is one of my top five of all time and so is the other guy I am talking about today, Stone Cold Steve Austin. These two were just so much fun to watch in 1996-1997 and I want to talk about that a bit today. Bret Hart and Shawn Michaels are my number 1 and 2 all time favorites so Bret Hart leaving after WrestleMania XII when he lost to Shawn Michaels sucked for me. I loved the New Generation Era, but Bret Hart was sorely missed during this time. I wondered how he would come back and when Stone Cold called him out on an episode of WWF Superstars I was like, hell yeah… before that was an actual thing. Stone Cold trash-talking Bret Hart in 1996 was great stuff. While I wanted Bret to come back and kick his ass, I was of an age when Austin’s heel antics were cool to me and I would smile more often than not at the things he would say about Bret Hart. Still, when it was announced that the two would be wrestling at the 1996 Survivor Series, I was very excited for it. The match was a ton of fun and the two had a great wrestling match and I liked the way Bret Hart won in the same way that he defeated Roddy Piper a few years earlier. I will be honest and say that I kind of thought this was it and Bret Hart would go back to having an issue with Shawn Michaels. Little did I know that things with him and Austin were going to go to a level I never thought I would see. When I think back about the feud that Bret Hart and Steve Austin had one of the things that always sticks in my mind is when Austin was actually trying to help Bret Hart win the title from Sid in the cage. This is one of the most underrated performances from Austin on an episode of RAW. You felt that him wanting Bret to win so he could take the title off him was 100 percent legit. That is one of the things I loved about Stone Cold, no matter how extreme he was you believed everything that he did. Him calling Bret a loser actually made me laugh and the way this rivalry just got hotter and hotter all the way to WrestleMania 13 was awesome. It was by a mile the real main event of that show not just in terms of the actual match quality, but the build-up as well. Their match at WrestleMania 13 is one of the greatest that the event has ever had. I watched WrestleMania 13 at a strange time in my life. I was 16 years old and my parents had just separated and in a few days I was going to have to move away from all my friends, live somewhere new, start a new high school and in general my life was being turned upside down. When I started watching wrestling it was actually my grandfather who introduced it to me and I decided to go around to his house and see if he wanted to stay up till 3 AM to watch WrestleMania 13 with me. He said yes and it is an awesome memory that I have and it was great as it took my mind of what was going on in my own house at the time. My grandfather always watched wrestling, but he was one of those folks who would “pretend” that he was not super into. The match with Bret Hart and Steve Austin though had him on the edge of his seat the whole time. It was one of the most amazing matches I had ever seen and while it is so easy to focus on the blood. Which by the way does add a lot to the match. I feel that these two told a perfect story in that ring and it took you through every inch of the emotion spectrum. Both guys played their role perfectly, it portrayed Steve Austin as the never say die badass and Bret Hart as the guy who has had enough of the BS and he is just going to do things his way. It was such a clever match in every regard. These two would actually have a solid match the following month at In Your House Revenge of the Taker. It was not as intense as their match at WrestleMania 13, but it was still a really fun match. For me personally, we had moved by this point and we did not have Sky set up in our new house so I was not actually able to watch this match live which kind of drove me nuts. I had to wait until the following day to pick up the tape my grandfather recorded (which I prayed he did not screw up, he didn’t!) and watch the match then. When I went round to get the tape, he asked why I was so excited to get this event, when he heard that Austin and Hart were having a rematch that was all he needed to hear and he said I was watching it there and then and we were getting take out from the local pizza shop. This is another great memory of mine and when I think about this now as an adult. I have no doubt he wanted to watch these two tare the house down again, but I think he also wanted to make sure I was ok and through wrestling was the best way he knew how. People can say it is just a silly wrestling show, or it is not real. However, us fans know just how important this form of entertainment is and how much we connect with the characters we see on TV each week and the rivalry between Bret Hart and Steve Austin is certainly something that I loved sharing with my grandfather. Anyway, after this Bret would get hurt and the feud between the two ended, even though we did get the epic Canadian Stampeded which as great as it was, Steve Austin stuck out like a sore thumb on that team. I often wonder had the Screwjob not happened what would have happened between Bret Hart and Steve Austin. Could they have teamed up to take on DX? Or would they have continued to tear the house down for years to come? Thanks for taking the time to read this. You know I was going to just write about how much I loved these two and how badass their feud was. Then it all came flooding back about the way my life was back when this happened. I would love to hear you guy's thoughts on the feud these two had. Not only that, but what theories do you have for these two had Bret Hart not left for WCW?
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jking1979
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Post by jking1979 on Nov 6, 2019 7:25:28 GMT -5
Bret Hart was the best wrestler in WWE around that time. I would have tried to keep him on the roster if I was Vince McMahon.
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Post by MKSavage on Nov 6, 2019 9:48:25 GMT -5
To me this was the only feud the company had going at the time that was really worth watching, these were some rough days for the WWF - though, Mankind/Undertaker was pretty good too. This would be my second favorite feud in history behind the Jake/Savage feud in 1991/92. I still say that their match at WM13 is the best match in WrestleMania history, the story telling was unbelievable in this match, the moves were crisp, and they made you believe that they really hated one another. Personally, I think it would have been better for Bret to drop the title to Austin at WM14 to launch Austin's run as the top guy, it would have been a good way to end their feud and give Austin his win over Bret (which I don't think he ever got). This also would have set up Shawn to be Austin's first opponent defending the title. Or, you let Undertaker and Kane be the first guys Austin feuds with after winning the belt at WM and Bret and the Hart Foundation could fight DX throughout much of the year, ultimately ending at Survivor Series. After that, Shawn could face Austin. Either way, I kind of wish Bret stayed in the WWF, WCW did not use him like they should have.
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Post by PJ on Nov 6, 2019 10:28:54 GMT -5
You personal opinion on Bret isn’t wrong. He most certainly was one of the greatest in ring performers ever.
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jking1979
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Post by jking1979 on Nov 6, 2019 10:33:15 GMT -5
I get the feeling that Owen Hart would still be here if he stayed in WWE. The feud with Steve Austin was great.
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Post by JokerFC on Nov 6, 2019 11:03:21 GMT -5
Austin vs Hart/Hart Foundation is the feud that saved Vince's ass. also yes indeed Bret was one of Vince's finest performers ever...no doubt there.
As for what happened if there was no Screwjob? Austin vs HBK. Vince wanted the belt on HBK & for him to be top heel. Austin was on a path to the top that wouldn't be stopped.
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Post by hbkjason on Nov 6, 2019 12:07:06 GMT -5
Austin vs Hart/Hart Foundation is the feud that saved Vince's ass. also yes indeed Bret was one of Vince's finest performers ever...no doubt there. As for what happened if there was no Screwjob? Austin vs HBK. Vince wanted the belt on HBK & for him to be top heel. Austin was on a path to the top that wouldn't be stopped. Had he not got hurt, you have to wonder how much of a fit Shawn Michaels would have pitched in order to get that belt back. I know it is easy to say that everyone could see Steve was the future and the cash cow, but Shawn Michaels seemed to have a hold and way with Vince like no one else in history.
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Post by JokerFC on Nov 6, 2019 13:52:50 GMT -5
Austin vs Hart/Hart Foundation is the feud that saved Vince's ass. also yes indeed Bret was one of Vince's finest performers ever...no doubt there. As for what happened if there was no Screwjob? Austin vs HBK. Vince wanted the belt on HBK & for him to be top heel. Austin was on a path to the top that wouldn't be stopped. Had he not got hurt, you have to wonder how much of a fit Shawn Michaels would have pitched in order to get that belt back. I know it is easy to say that everyone could see Steve was the future and the cash cow, but Shawn Michaels seemed to have a hold and way with Vince like no one else in history. He did indeed....but for that time period he wanted to be the top heel and champ and got that 100%. He was also pretty amenable in January with Vince when they talked about the future of DX.... 1)Agreed the faction needed to go face because they weren't getting booed against anyone except Austin. 2) Wanted Waltman and the NAO in as soon as possible....Vince said no-your getting Tyson its too much at once to which he also agreed. 3) Vince also told him that the background feud over the summer would be Vince vs Austin and feature everyone but the thrust of the storylines would feature Vince trying to get the belt off him. So it seemed he was settling down....but his injury at RR turned him into baby mode again LOL
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Post by hbkbigdaddycool on Nov 6, 2019 14:07:29 GMT -5
It's funny how WCW Nitro was beating the then WWF Raw shows in 1997 during the Bret vs. Austin feud, yet if you go on the WWE Network and watch Nitro and Raw from that same era, the Bret vs. Austin feud is much more entertaining still than what WCW was doing. The only advantage WCW had for 75% of the time was that Nitro was live, where Raw was taped.
I still wonder if Vince would have done live Raw shows every week in 1997 would they have actually won a ratings war in 1997?? Raw many times was putting on the better show, just it wasn't live. Bret vs. Austin feud had a helluva lot to do with that too!
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jking1979
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Post by jking1979 on Nov 6, 2019 14:30:05 GMT -5
Yes. WCW was beating WWE in the ratings because of NWO. Hulk Hogan as a bad guy was a big deal.
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Post by The Brain on Nov 6, 2019 16:22:10 GMT -5
LOVED this feud. The only feud to rival it during this time period was Mankind/Taker IMO.
The promos and matches were just amazing. They legit made you think they truly hated each other. Top notch storytelling at its finest.
An iconic shot from an iconic match...
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HandsomeHollywood
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Post by HandsomeHollywood on Nov 6, 2019 16:44:55 GMT -5
My favorite feud of all time, containing my favorite match of all time.
Those who say Austin's greatest rival is The Rock or that Bret's greatest rival is Michaels obviously hasn't seen this feud.
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Post by Gorilla on Nov 6, 2019 19:39:33 GMT -5
I agree. Bret Hart is the best there is the best there was and the best there ever will be.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2019 22:10:05 GMT -5
Their wrestlemania 13 match is in my top 5 of all wrestlemania matches.
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Post by K5 on Nov 7, 2019 9:14:21 GMT -5
It's funny how WCW Nitro was beating the then WWF Raw shows in 1997 during the Bret vs. Austin feud, yet if you go on the WWE Network and watch Nitro and Raw from that same era, the Bret vs. Austin feud is much more entertaining still than what WCW was doing. The only advantage WCW had for 75% of the time was that Nitro was live, where Raw was taped. I still wonder if Vince would have done live Raw shows every week in 1997 would they have actually won a ratings war in 1997?? Raw many times was putting on the better show, just it wasn't live. Bret vs. Austin feud had a helluva lot to do with that too! I think it’s more about the hype than the actual quality of content. wcw had all of those marketed stars that people had grown up with, and a bunch of them were calling themselves their real names and even hulk hogan was a bad guy. so initially it attracted the masses. austin’s hype was still in development at this point.
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Post by MKSavage on Nov 7, 2019 9:53:21 GMT -5
Their wrestlemania 13 match is in my top 5 of all wrestlemania matches. What are the others?
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Post by JokerFC on Nov 7, 2019 11:09:53 GMT -5
WCW had the Sting Storyline in 1997 too and it was sh*t hot. Plus the nWo itself hadn't cooled off. in 1998 WCW were doing a LOT of things wrong but the hype was still carrying them....in 99 it wore off huge after the FOD.
I Ireland it was the "Friday Night Wars". Sky Sports had Raw & TNT had Nitro. So I would tape them both & watch on Saturday mornings if I was out. If I was home? I was watching Raw and taping Nitro from IYH Final Four onwards...Raw was a better show.
I still say The Hart Foundation is a underrated heel clique.
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jking1979
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Post by jking1979 on Nov 7, 2019 15:30:30 GMT -5
WCW had the Sting Storyline in 1997 too and it was sh*t hot. Plus the nWo itself hadn't cooled off. in 1998 WCW were doing a LOT of things wrong but the hype was still carrying them....in 99 it wore off huge after the FOD. I Ireland it was the "Friday Night Wars". Sky Sports had Raw & TNT had Nitro. So I would tape them both & watch on Saturday mornings if I was out. If I was home? I was watching Raw and taping Nitro from IYH Final Four onwards...Raw was a better show. I still say The Hart Foundation is a underrated heel clique. Well atleast Owen Hart was doing alright and would still be here.
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Post by hbkjason on Nov 7, 2019 16:45:46 GMT -5
thanks for the replies guys. In talking about the 1997 Hart foundation what I loved about them was everything they did and said felt real. While they were the heels, their actions were justified and they felt like they were in the right. This is why I feel they were so good, it is crazy to think how memorable the 1997 Hart Foundation is when it was only together for a short time.
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HandsomeHollywood
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Post by HandsomeHollywood on Nov 7, 2019 17:01:24 GMT -5
thanks for the replies guys. In talking about the 1997 Hart foundation what I loved about them was everything they did and said felt real. While they were the heels, their actions were justified and they felt like they were in the right. This is why I feel they were so good, it is crazy to think how memorable the 1997 Hart Foundation is when it was only together for a short time. Adding to this, the time period of 97 wasn't scripted to death. Hart and Michaels were both never great on the mic, but I find the stammering and meandering they do to be natural and real. It only adds to the story for me.
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