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Post by chumped on Jul 19, 2008 11:24:33 GMT -5
I guess if Batman survived the fall, so did Harvey.
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Post by hurricane on Jul 19, 2008 11:26:55 GMT -5
attaboy, doris :-)
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Post by Calcifer Boheme on Jul 19, 2008 11:41:34 GMT -5
It wasn't a funeral. They would've made that more clear. My guess is that he's back in the hospital ACTUALLY Letting his face heal so it wouldn't have to be cgi in the third. The service, as I've said, is Gotham honoring Dent for all he's done while Batman is taking the fall. i doubt they'd do that if he was alive though... it wouldn't make sense to, as he would just be around to screw up the whole plan. While I was hoping he'd be the main villain in the 3rd movie... I don't want to see him in it now. Let him be dead, that made for a great ending. I would love to see the Riddler (preferably played be David Tenant) in the next one... Hugo Strange, Deadshot, Black Mask, or Maxi Zeus (done right) would also make good villains. Also... any thoughts on what they might call the next one?
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Post by Thumper: One Year Later on Jul 19, 2008 11:41:56 GMT -5
I guess if Batman survived the fall, so did Harvey. Batman had on protective armor though.
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Post by Thumper: One Year Later on Jul 19, 2008 11:43:22 GMT -5
It wasn't a funeral. They would've made that more clear. My guess is that he's back in the hospital ACTUALLY Letting his face heal so it wouldn't have to be cgi in the third. The service, as I've said, is Gotham honoring Dent for all he's done while Batman is taking the fall. i doubt they'd do that if he was alive though... it wouldn't make sense to, as he would just be around to screw up the whole plan. While I was hoping he'd be the main villain in the 3rd movie... I don't want to see him in it now. Let him be dead, that made for a great ending. I would love to see the Riddler (preferably played be David Tenant) in the next one... Hugo Strange, Deadshot, Black Mask, or Maxi Zeus (done right) would also make good villains. Also... any thoughts on what they might call the next one? Or, they could be covering harvey's death with the hospital explosion where his body was never recovered due to it being burnt.
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Post by Thumper: One Year Later on Jul 19, 2008 11:50:00 GMT -5
Plus why the hell would batman even care about taking the blame if Harvey was dead. It wouldn't matter. Yeah it would. It would have been what the joker wanted. The joker wanted to make Harvey Dent, a symbol of hope to the city, into a freak like him. If people found out about what Harvey did before his death, it would have ruined his reputation as a symbol of hope. Batman taking the blame makes Harvey a martyr. Anyone catch the possible Catwoman reference? When giving the new armor to Bruce, Lucius says something along the lines of, "it will protect against dogs, not sure about cats."?
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Post by Wantallfigures™ on Jul 19, 2008 11:53:11 GMT -5
Plus why the hell would batman even care about taking the blame if Harvey was dead. It wouldn't matter. The whole point is Gotham finally having a face they could look up to where they wouldn't need Batman anymore. Batman, as it keeps getting said, cannot, at least at this point, be a face of Gotham while behind a mask. Harvey was their face, and as Gordon said, their White Knight. Batman didn't want the people to know Harvey went corrupt, because then the Joker would have won, and the progression of Gotham's fixing would tarnish, as their hero was corrupt, just like 90% of the cops etc.
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Post by chumped on Jul 19, 2008 11:53:41 GMT -5
Plus why the hell would batman even care about taking the blame if Harvey was dead. It wouldn't matter. Yeah it would. It would have been what the joker wanted. The joker wanted to make Harvey Dent, a symbol of hope to the city, into a freak like him. If people found out about what Harvey did before his death, it would have ruined his reputation as a symbol of hope. Batman taking the blame makes Harvey a martyr. Anyone catch the possible Catwoman reference? When giving the new armor to Bruce, Lucius says something along the lines of, "it will protect against dogs, not sure about cats."? Yeah he said it would do well against cats. Total cat woman reference. Now that I think about it, I believe that the coin landing heads up as Dent fell could have been a foreshadowing of him surviving. It didn't land like that for nothing. Nolan probably put it there as a small hint that Dent lived.
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Post by sean™ on Jul 19, 2008 11:58:01 GMT -5
Batman survived the fall because he
A. Wasn't pushed B. Didn't fall as far C. More than likely landed on his feet and then fell to the ground, given the way that he fell.
Dent was pushed backwards and basically forced straight to the ground. Batman was holding on the plank of wood, meaning he was falling a shorter distant. He also didn't fall with the force Harvey did.
Oh, as mentioned before, Batman was wearing protective armor.
Not to mention, why would Gordon constantly use words like "was" in his speech if Harvey wasn't dead?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2008 12:03:58 GMT -5
Saw it for the second time at 12:30am last night (this morning) and this time I was able to pay attention much more to the story/symbolism.
I agree that the coin landing good side up (it's a double headed coin) is indication that Dent lived. Considering he flipped for Batman's fate, then went to flip for his fate. Both in which landed good side up. But at the same time, he could would have lived anyways... but maybe Batman killed Harvey Dent for no reason. Who knows yet.
The "Are we talking pitbulls or chiwawas (sp?)? It'll protect from cats." seems like a symbolism/foreshadowing of Catwoman. Please, please, if they do... do not make it Berry.
If the "E. Nigma" nameplate is true, awesome. I personally think (like I said), they should redo all of the movies, but with the mind and vision of Nolan. Especially "Batman Forever" and "Batman & Robin". Make these movies dark like they should be and do the characters justice. Two-Face lives and forms the duo with the Riddler.
Either way, if we get a 3rd from Nolan... great. If not... thats ok, too. This one has left a good enough taste in everyone's mouth, where we don't NEED another film.
- Triple S
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Post by Quanthor on Jul 19, 2008 12:04:40 GMT -5
Harvey is dead.
Two Face is not.
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Post by chumped on Jul 19, 2008 12:04:58 GMT -5
What Nigma nameplate?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2008 12:07:12 GMT -5
A friend from work said on his second showing he saw one of the Wayne Enterprises employees name badges says "E. Nigma". He said it doesn't show his face you just see his body and his name badge and you have to look really carefully to see it. Of course he could be making that up. Again, i'd take it with a grain of salt at this point. But it'd kinda make sense, makes me wanna see a 3rd time. JUST to look out for it, haha. - Triple S
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Post by Bubba Ray DJ on Jul 19, 2008 12:12:09 GMT -5
Harvey is dead. Two Face is not. They are both dead. Don't you think someone would check for a pulse at the scene of the crime. For god sakes, police were on the scene and Jim Gordon was standing right there. If Dent / Two Face did survive and just got up...he probably would have tried to kill Jim Gordon right then with his bare hands. The fall killed him, case closed. The memorial with Gordon speaking was clearly post-death of the character.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2008 12:18:15 GMT -5
See, thats the funny thing though. Your not the writer, director, producer or ANY of the actors. Your a fan, just like everyone else. You don't know anything that anyone else doesn't, so don't act like you do. Anything is possible, it's a MOVIE.
And if you do know anything that we don't, please... please, tell us. I'd love to answer some of these unanswered questions, with a definitive answer.
- Triple S
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Post by Quanthor on Jul 19, 2008 12:22:31 GMT -5
Harvey is dead. Two Face is not. They are both dead. Don't you think someone would check for a pulse at the scene of the crime. For god sakes, police were on the scene and Jim Gordon was standing right there. If Dent / Two Face did survive and just got up...he probably would have tried to kill Jim Gordon right then with his bare hands. The fall killed him, case closed. The memorial with Gordon speaking was clearly post-death of the character. There was nothing indicating that he died, the reason why Gordon took the stand in front of the public, because they didn't want people to know about what happened to Harvey, this is why Batman took the fall for the crimes he committed, so save the image of a true public hero.
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Post by sasso on Jul 19, 2008 12:23:59 GMT -5
I can't believe there's actually a discussion over this. Dent's dead. They even had a public memorial service for him. Don't you think they would of checked his pulse? Taken his body to the morgue? Did an autopsy? Use logic, guys.
Not to mention in interviews Oldman let it slip that if there's a 3rd the Riddler will be the villain; not Dent.
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Post by Quanthor on Jul 19, 2008 12:26:21 GMT -5
The fact that it's shrouded in mystery, anything could have happened, they could have sent him to a mental institution.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2008 12:28:38 GMT -5
I can't believe there's actually a discussion over this. Dent's dead. They even had a public memorial service for him. Don't you think they would of checked his pulse? Taken his body to the morgue? Did an autopsy? Use logic, guys. Not to mention in interviews Oldman let it slip that if there's a 3rd the Riddler will be the villain; not Dent. And you know that it was a funeral why? Not saying that it wasn't but NOTHING was shown that made it a funeral. No casket/coffin, etc. Just an obnoxiously large picture of Dent, with Gordon at the podium saying good things about Harvey. Also, who's to say Oldman was telling the truth. Riddle as the villian and Two-Face as an accomplist, just like in Forever. Again, anything is possible. With Two-Face knocked out, they could have taken him to a metal facility or hospital, while Gotham knows nothing... except that Harvey Dent, their beloved District Attorney is dead. Where he pretty much is (as far as we know), but Two-Face could still be alive. Keyword being: could. With Gotham knowing Dent is dead and Batman taking the blame, Gotham believes Dent died as a righteous man. Rather than them knowing he allowed himself to become corrupt. - Triple S
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Post by T R W on Jul 19, 2008 12:30:38 GMT -5
Wait...people think he isn't dead? The odds of Heath Ledger coming back are better than Two Face.
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