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Post by SteveHulk on Feb 5, 2012 1:36:13 GMT -5
How do you win a fight moving backwards for five rounds? I'll leave it at that. Hey... Muhammad Ali (and countless others) made a career from it(!). I thought Condit fought to a perfect gameplan, constantly moving and frustrating Diaz - I had Condit winning 49-46... he landed by far the cleaner, crisper shots (including the best 2 shots of the fight) and I'm pretty sure he out-struck Diaz too. Diaz was constantly coming forward - but for the most part, wasn't doing as much or being as effective as Condit. Sad to see Nick be such a sore loser afterwards, but I kind of expected it - especially if he felt he won.
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Fury
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Post by Fury on Feb 5, 2012 1:39:39 GMT -5
First of all, Condit won the fight. But to say Diaz was a sore loser with no class means you know nothing about Diaz or didn't listen to a word he said. He has been doing this sort of stuff for a long time for one, so this is nothing new. What Diaz spoke about tonight was the transition of MMA to a sport more about science and gameplan over just going out and fighting. Within the context of MMA rules I don't think you could argue that Condit won but the reason Diaz said what he said is because he is a guy that wants to FIGHT and he sees tonight as a representation that it has become less about fighting your opponent and more about executing a gameplan to "win." It was clear that while Condit won he didn't really come to a "fight" but only came to win at whatever cost or however he could. This makes me think no less of Condit but I understand Diaz's frustration over the changing of guys wanting to come out and fight one another. People can talk about not wanting to see Diaz anymore because of his talking but don't start crying when Condit and GSP come out and try to "out-gameplan" one another and it ends in a boring snoozefest. As a fan of Condit it pissed me off to see him fight like that and it isn't a style of fighting I enjoy, but Diaz really was a baby here. He basically quit because the fight didn't go his way, even though the sport has evolved to this point for a while now. You don't win a fight by solely moving forward, Nelson moved forward more in his fight as well probably. I don't necessarily disagree with Diaz's point about the fights becoming more boring, it's his "I didn't win I quit, MMA is a joke mentality", I don't expect Condit to just stand and bang and fight Diaz's game, go back to the streets and fight if that's all you want, the sport hasn't been that for a long time, it's been about who's gameplan can be executed better for a long, some gameplans are just more exciting then others and Diaz can't handle that his isn't always going to work and took his ball and ran.
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shenmue
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Post by shenmue on Feb 5, 2012 1:39:59 GMT -5
How do you win a fight moving backwards for five rounds? I'll leave it at that. Hey... Muhammad Ali (and countless others) made a career from it(!). I thought Condit fought to a perfect gameplan, constantly moving and frustrating Diaz - I had Condit winning 49-46... he landed by far the cleaner, crisper shots (including the best 2 shots of the fight) and I'm pretty sure he out-struck Diaz too. Diaz was constantly coming forward - but for the most part, wasn't doing as much or being as effective as Condit. Sad to see Nick be such a sore loser afterwards, but I kind of expected it - especially if he felt he won. Yeah it's like people are acting like Condit never threw any strikes in the entire fight, as if he just ran. I really liked how he never let Diaz be in close range, nice job circling away from Diaz by Condit. I honestly can't see how anybody can give Diaz rounds 3,4 and 5. Out struck in all those rounds.Diaz won round 1 and maybe round 2 but i gave Condit round 2 on second viewing just.
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Fury
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Post by Fury on Feb 5, 2012 2:36:22 GMT -5
I should also add that it enrages me that this was the biggest night of Condit's career and Diaz had to overshadow it with his tantrum and "retirement" and implying that Condit was undeserving and a boring fighter and taking away from that moment, that's just not cool. I don't care how exciting of a fighter he is or how he comes to fight, he's a POS who has forever lost my respect. That's all I'm going to say on the matter. I hope the sport doesn't degenerate into tentative fighters who won't do anything, but I hope that it doesn't have trash like Diaz in it either.
Anyway congrats to Condit on a well deserved victory.
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Rated NC-17
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Post by Rated NC-17 on Feb 5, 2012 3:16:37 GMT -5
Hype Train DERAILED!!!! Bye bye Nick Diaz.
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Post by SteveHulk on Feb 5, 2012 11:26:39 GMT -5
Nick should just take it on the chin and move on... acting like a crybaby isn't going to do him any favors. He's not the first fighter to lose a fight he felt he won, and he won't be the last. At the end of the day, he's still an excellent fighter and one of the very best in the division.
I'd be shocked if he did retire... if Condit isn't fighting again until GSP, they could easily put Diaz in against Koscheck - then have the winner of that fight the GSP/Condit winner... there are still plenty of big fights out there for him.
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Sonnen
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Post by Sonnen on Feb 5, 2012 11:28:24 GMT -5
I'd personally love to see Diaz kill Koscheck.
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Post by James Hetfield on Feb 5, 2012 12:47:34 GMT -5
This is funny... Round 1: I gave it to Nick. Constant pressure, moving forward the whole time, and landing better shots up against the fence. Condit did a lot of backing up. 10-9 Diaz. Round 2: A little bit closer, but once again, I give it to Diaz. Landed better, pressed forward, and had a pretty sweet body attack towards the end of the round. 10-9 Diaz. Round3: Condit landed pretty good shots early. Used better footwork, and moved around more so he could avoid the fence. Better movement was probably the thing he most improved in this round. Diaz lands a good left hand against the fence, followed by a head kick attempt... Condit using his legs more midway in the round. Diaz is controlling the octagon, pushing the pace more, but Condit is starting to get off more with the leg kicks. You can also tell Diaz is very frustrated with Carlos backing up a lot, and that's probably what hurt him. One minute left, Diaz lands a huge left hand against the cage... flying knee attempt by Condit, nice elbows at the end too. This was the closest round so far, I even would give it at 10-10 score, but if I had to choose a winner, I'd actually give it to Condit. 10-9 Condit. Round 4: Diaz starts off hard, trying to get Condit against the fence, but Condit's constant movement is preventing that. Condit almost lands a right hand... Couple nice body punches by Diaz... Diaz trying to close in and get a hold of Condit to take him down...Kind of surprised Diaz isn't trying to put on a harder pace... More strikes in terms of VOLUME have been thrown/landed by Condit.... Condit hits a nice head kick with 1:30 left... Condit is throwing more, like I said, but isn't controlling anything else...One minute left... Diaz lands some kicks at the end... Nothing TOO significant happened in this round.. not really sure who to give it to. I'll give it to Condit due to more volume of strikes though. 10-9 Condit. Round 5: Good combo attempt by Carlos early on. Diaz throwing more leg kicks than before... Diaz lands a left hand, and ducks Condit's back elbow.... Even MORE kicks thrown by Diaz, a few of them landed...1-2 combo landed by Diaz.... Once again, Diaz is controlling the pace, backing Condit up. Nice leg kicks by Condit, with 2:30 left, followed by a nice head kick... Diaz clinches, and they break... Condit isn't really coming forward, he only strikes when Diaz strikes.... Nice right hand by Diaz, with a nice knee returned by Condit. 1:34 left.... Nice combo by Nick.... Diaz takes his back.... Full back mount now.... Diaz going for an armbar.....body triangle, Diaz going for the neck.... pretty okay defense by Condit... Condit can't get out... 15 secs left.... this was the CLOSEST round, but Diaz took the round due to getting him down, and going for subs. VERY close, it would have been a 10-10, but once again, I think Diaz took the round because he got him down. 10-9 Diaz.
MY final verdict: 48-47 for Nick Diaz. Call me a Diaz fanboy, but I have loved Condit since his early WEC days. He's a tremendous fighter, but he fought a lot different than he usually does. He put NO pressure on Nick, didn't land an overt amount of significant shots (Diaz didn't either), and he never really went in for a kill. I think that ALONG with strikes thrown/takedown/clinch work/sub attempts for Diaz won. It was EXTREMELY close, and very highly contested. crap, I'd even like to see a rematch, but the way I see it, and the way I score fights says Diaz won. The 5th round was the closest round, with no guy really one-upping eachother, but Nick taking his back and going for the finish won him the round. And.... you guys who can't accept that.
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hammer
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Post by hammer on Feb 5, 2012 13:14:18 GMT -5
i had work last night so i couldnt watch yet... im getting my prelims in right now. this figueroa/caceres fight is very aggravating... figueroa came off as so whiny. that 1st round was a ball, but figueroa whining after the 2nd low blow "thats the 2nd time... is there gonna be a 3rd"... he just comes off as wanting the fight to go to decision right then and there, without fighting it out. and then herb handed him the fight by taking 2 points away. terrible.
10-9 caceres in the 1st, 9-8 figueroa in the 2nd, 10-9 caceres in the 3rd on my card... still giving leeroy the fight, 28-27
i dont know anything about the main card, so ill ramble about that in another 2 hours or so when im through them.
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hammer
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Post by hammer on Feb 5, 2012 13:20:02 GMT -5
mounted triangle with an armbar... awesome sub by poirier
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ZT
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Post by ZT on Feb 5, 2012 13:31:54 GMT -5
One of the best descriptions I have seen about last night's main event was that Condit led Diaz around the cage "like a dog on a leash." Condit was not "running" in any way. Stick and move. Classic striking strategy, especially against someone like Diaz. All Diaz was doing was following Condit around and taunting, while Condit was throwing, and landing, more meaningful strikes. Condit had a gameplan, stuck to it, and won. Diaz wants to take his ball and go home because he lost? Fine. Let him. The right call was made last night when Condit was awarded the Interim Championship.
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hammer
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Post by hammer on Feb 5, 2012 14:13:50 GMT -5
clifford starks... lol. he looked like he had no idea how to do anything, except be strong and throw a right hand. he did both of those things well, true indeed... but theres alot more to it than that. as evidence by the end of the fight.
and barao looked dominant, jorgensen is awesome too, but barao was just the much better fighter. now onto the 3 big fights.
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hammer
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Post by hammer on Feb 5, 2012 14:34:27 GMT -5
wow that pierce/kos fight was razor close. i had it 29-28 pierce... 1 and 3 to pierce, 2 to kos
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Post by 1992 on Feb 5, 2012 14:50:15 GMT -5
People seen "running/back-peddling" but what I seen was evasiveness. Diaz has made a career out of pushing guys up against the cage and body blowing them out and has done it to pretty much everyone he's fought since his "career revival" in Strikeforce.
Last night reminded me slightly of Edgar/Penn I. Was it some terrifically exciting fight? No. But it had a very technical aspect to it. There was blatantly a game-plan laid out there and you seen it develop beautifully throughout the fight.
Same as last night. I seen Condit doing something nobody has done in years...not buying into Diaz's games. I wholeheartedly admit that it was a razor thin close fight. But ultimately I scored it for Condit and so did the judges. Despite being taunted and called a bitch every 30 seconds, Condit stuck with it and I'm damn proud of him for doing so. He deserves it.
And Nick will be back. Everyone retires after they have that one frustrating loss.
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hammer
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Post by hammer on Feb 5, 2012 14:56:17 GMT -5
30-27 fab werdum... roys chin is still the best in the game though.
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Post by demolitionman on Feb 5, 2012 15:07:45 GMT -5
Well. Than god te way you score fights means crap. Condit won if you can not accept it you too lol This is funny... Round 1: I gave it to Nick. Constant pressure, moving forward the whole time, and landing better shots up against the fence. Condit did a lot of backing up. 10-9 Diaz. Round 2: A little bit closer, but once again, I give it to Diaz. Landed better, pressed forward, and had a pretty sweet body attack towards the end of the round. 10-9 Diaz. Round3: Condit landed pretty good shots early. Used better footwork, and moved around more so he could avoid the fence. Better movement was probably the thing he most improved in this round. Diaz lands a good left hand against the fence, followed by a head kick attempt... Condit using his legs more midway in the round. Diaz is controlling the octagon, pushing the pace more, but Condit is starting to get off more with the leg kicks. You can also tell Diaz is very frustrated with Carlos backing up a lot, and that's probably what hurt him. One minute left, Diaz lands a huge left hand against the cage... flying knee attempt by Condit, nice elbows at the end too. This was the closest round so far, I even would give it at 10-10 score, but if I had to choose a winner, I'd actually give it to Condit. 10-9 Condit. Round 4: Diaz starts off hard, trying to get Condit against the fence, but Condit's constant movement is preventing that. Condit almost lands a right hand... Couple nice body punches by Diaz... Diaz trying to close in and get a hold of Condit to take him down...Kind of surprised Diaz isn't trying to put on a harder pace... More strikes in terms of VOLUME have been thrown/landed by Condit.... Condit hits a nice head kick with 1:30 left... Condit is throwing more, like I said, but isn't controlling anything else...One minute left... Diaz lands some kicks at the end... Nothing TOO significant happened in this round.. not really sure who to give it to. I'll give it to Condit due to more volume of strikes though. 10-9 Condit. Round 5: Good combo attempt by Carlos early on. Diaz throwing more leg kicks than before... Diaz lands a left hand, and ducks Condit's back elbow.... Even MORE kicks thrown by Diaz, a few of them landed...1-2 combo landed by Diaz.... Once again, Diaz is controlling the pace, backing Condit up. Nice leg kicks by Condit, with 2:30 left, followed by a nice head kick... Diaz clinches, and they break... Condit isn't really coming forward, he only strikes when Diaz strikes.... Nice right hand by Diaz, with a nice knee returned by Condit. 1:34 left.... Nice combo by Nick.... Diaz takes his back.... Full back mount now.... Diaz going for an armbar.....body triangle, Diaz going for the neck.... pretty okay defense by Condit... Condit can't get out... 15 secs left.... this was the CLOSEST round, but Diaz took the round due to getting him down, and going for subs. VERY close, it would have been a 10-10, but once again, I think Diaz took the round because he got him down. 10-9 Diaz.
MY final verdict: 48-47 for Nick Diaz. Call me a Diaz fanboy, but I have loved Condit since his early WEC days. He's a tremendous fighter, but he fought a lot different than he usually does. He put NO pressure on Nick, didn't land an overt amount of significant shots (Diaz didn't either), and he never really went in for a kill. I think that ALONG with strikes thrown/takedown/clinch work/sub attempts for Diaz won. It was EXTREMELY close, and very highly contested. poop, I'd even like to see a rematch, but the way I see it, and the way I score fights says Diaz won. The 5th round was the closest round, with no guy really one-upping eachother, but Nick taking his back and going for the finish won him the round. And.... you guys who can't accept that.
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hammer
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Post by hammer on Feb 5, 2012 15:18:28 GMT -5
round 1 to nick... he pushed the pace, i thought his striking was a touch better
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hammer
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Post by hammer on Feb 5, 2012 15:25:26 GMT -5
round 2 to nick... very close, striking was very even, but nick is still pushing the pace. nothing condit gets off, except the leg kicks, is really clean because hes continually backing up.
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Post by 1992 on Feb 5, 2012 15:28:14 GMT -5
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hammer
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Post by hammer on Feb 5, 2012 15:32:43 GMT -5
round 3 to condit, liked his striking more. at about the 3:40 mark, he finally stopped backing up, and his strikes started looking crisp. 29-28 nick diaz
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