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Post by jayrod2009 on Feb 28, 2012 10:15:06 GMT -5
Yes, it is another rant on Mattel's Legends line. I really want Mattel to read this. I have been collecting Mattel now for just shy of a year. I started with the Basics, and fell in love with Elite's. But then I saw my first Legend in person at KMart.... Jimmy Snuka. Someone I remember well from my childhood, and he has boots on? BOOTS? Come on, this line is to represent that classic image of our favorites in their most respected and memoral attires, and you choose boots? Let's travel in time real fast, with a once loved now trashed company called JAKKS. I have no clue sometimes how they got some talents through with Vince, that clearly wouldn't sell as large as others. For example a Hogan will sell, were as a Chief Jay Strongbow is a much older character, and surely a less wanted figure ( IMO). BUT, they kept their fans wanting more, and had their line last for years. But they did one key thing, that let the line live. They hit hard with the first series. Something I really wish your design team had done. JAKKS did flop 2 times 1, with a TTL Undertaker and a R3 Andre.... But Bret and HBK clearly made up for that. Their attires were great choices.... But were JAKKS ran the bases, Mattel should have picked up on and hit home runs... Going with a booted Snuka is different, and yes, the line will need that, but later. Much later. You had the chance to release guys like Bret and Andre in series 1, with a Austin and say, Magnum TA. Giving us a taste of different era's, with characters that are wanted. But you give us the nightmare of Dusty Rhodes in his polka dot onezie instead of his NWA jeans and shirt attire, when he was at his peak. Once again, I could go on and on about the design end of it. But I have more to complain about. Lets move on to the failed 2-packs. Once again, You chose great superstars, But they should have been fillers later on in the line. You should have gone with Legion of Doom red/black, which by reading these forums alone, you should know now how high these are on a want list. Natural Disasters, Rockers, and LOD w/ Tag Titles would have been my first series. 2 packs are designed for tag teams, and feud packs. The formula should usually be 2 teams, 1 feud. But with the first release, you want to hit a range of " Hey, lets get these collectors their dream roster together...."We all know that Legends is a hit or miss catagory. Hoping that they draw to the masses, young and old. Now, lets talk price. Cause IMO-store price of Legends at $12.99 was a perfect price range for me. JAKKS started that series out at $12.99 and ended around th e$16.99 price range. No, for a series to die at such a low cost, is simply on the design teams fault, as well as your distribution. But I will blame KMART for overpricing their stock, so I won't include that 80's dumpster in this, that's a whole different issue. I feel that you guys made a poor executive decision to cut a line because it wasn't selling well, instead of giving it time. We got 6 series, a 2-pack series, and 1 Hall of Fame series, which was solid re-releases. So we could sum this up as a parallel fail like TNA's line? The line wasn't given enough time to shine, and now US, the buyers, have to wait for a bi-monthly release of Legends on Mattycollector, and Flashbacks? Thats bullcrap. I was all for Mattel, and the fact that you guys pay attention to detail, and give us great extras like cloth shirts, But when you guys get the faint feeling that a line may not do as well as say, Basics or Elites you cancel it. Which goes for most other lines from your company. Now on to Flashbacks. How have we gone from 2 per line to 1? Come on... I thought you had finally grasped the concept when you gave renditions of Kane and Shango, then you give us Edge? He isnt really a legend, hell, had he not slept with Lita and made TMZ fill their pants, he'd still be IC champ, or gone.... But for the fans out their who love that choice, you couldn't have thrown a matching Christian in there? Instead of Orton who is overly produced. ( The economy is rough now, Parents won't buy their kids a Orton/Rey/Cena Elite or Basic figure every time they change attires. It adds up after awhile). I will say, after series 2, you guys seemed to pick up speed. Series 3-6 were great. Id say nearly epic! Just when we get excited that the ball got rolling, you announce that you have canceled Defining Moments and Legends.... And now, im sure the future of the line is being judged based off sales from mattycollector , which gets zero, ZERO, publicity from WWE. In closing, I love your work. I love your Elite lines, and the fact that you will still offer Legends, at a slow rate. But please, find a way to release more. Maybe some store exclusives. Anything. Help us as collectors grasp our childhood once again through figures, instead of imagination and old tapes. Rant over- Thank you -Jayrod
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Post by Cammi Oh on Feb 28, 2012 10:34:41 GMT -5
It would be smart for WWE to promote Matty Collector. Having links to the site from their site or something. Announcing when DDP and the rest are going up for sale. That is a good idea!
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Post by jayrod2009 on Feb 28, 2012 10:45:08 GMT -5
It would be smart for WWE to promote Matty Collector. Having links to the site from their site or something. Announcing when DDP and the rest are going up for sale. That is a good idea! Maybe include DDP in the commercial. Like a 90's style Hasbro commercial. This way, you promote Mattycollector, DDP's upcoming figure, aswell as a slew of other figures in the commercial i.e Andre, Rockers, Bundy, Anderson....
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Post by Next Man’s Knowing Rock on Feb 28, 2012 11:43:36 GMT -5
Can we just sticky this and make it the all-purpose "whine about the Legends line" thread?
Also tl;dr
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Post by AlexWestCollects on Feb 28, 2012 12:37:58 GMT -5
Seriously this board gets more repetitive everyday. How many more threads about legends rants, what's your fav figure, what elite flashbacks do you want threads are we gonna have? We c the same 5 threads reposted over and over again.
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Von Hooten
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Post by Von Hooten on Feb 28, 2012 12:57:56 GMT -5
It is a much different world today as far as promotion goes in the marketing world of toys, especially toys that are cleary geared towards adult collectors. I think they should do promotions on RAW and SmackDown, but there is only so much that can be done and after all... we wouldn't want Michael Cole to put his figure away anytime soon Not to mention people don't really feel enthusiastic about paying for a figure that could have been sold in stores at half the price. The think the biggest problem with the Legends line is that Series 1 was widely available, but sold out fast. Even though a couple of peg warmers hung around (Dusty, Sgt. Slaughter) the set overall saw success. Of course this was also due to the nostalgia that these were new and the first "Classic" figures from Mattel so people jumped right on them. More of Series 2 were produced, and wasn't as big of a hit. I think this was due to the characters having obscure attires and again, more of them were made. Series 3 saw a wide release but IMHO had better results because it was a better lineup of Wrestlers, and they weren't in attires that were used in a breif period. Series 4 had it's peg warmers, but again atleast 1/2 the line was successful. Series 5 was hardly available, in my area. I saw 3 Randy Savages once, and it looked like he was going to be the peg warmer. Literally, a day later he died and I never saw another one since. As far as the rest of the set goes, it was hit or miss, and the only store that had them, where I live, was Walmart. Some got Series 6, some didn't and again the only place I know of that had these was TRU. My local TRU didn't, the TRU that did get series was another 30 miles out of my way. Looking back I wish I picked up Eddie and Warrior when I saw them, but the belts turned me off and I had other things I went there for. I know it sounds stupid, but if I am paying $15+ for a figure the freaking accessories should have better quality. The Defining Moments were oddly distibuted. I can still find Series 1 in some spots, and Series 3 is extremely easy to find, but the others were/are very hard to come by. I think this series was a hard sell, because there is only so much you can do, and the theme is either too broad or not broad enough. Quite frankly Triple H's moment to me wasn't Defining enough for the figure that was produced, not to mention the head scan looks awful. I would have thought a DX figure of him when he and DX invaded WCW would be more of a DM but that is just my opinion. Also Mattel knew Macho Man would be a big sell for collectors, but again, they overproduced him, and they overproduced a figure that was featured in attire that Macho Man only wore once. I loved it because WM7 sticks out in my mind, plus I had a feeling that matching Ultimate Warrior wasn't too far behind (Jakks couldn't make him) but most fans would have rather seen a WM 3, or WM 4 version of Savage. I also think this line was produced to give fans better and more accessories hence the higher price point. Still sad to see them go, but the same thing happend with Entrance Greats, so I am not surprised. The point of all this is that I think Mattel had things going great around series 3-5. I really think they thought they were doing the right thing in series 1-2 by giving us figures of wrestlers Jakks never gave us which is why they were in different attires not realizing that they would sell more just being better than Jakks alone. I do not know why the 2 packs did horribly.I bought all 3 and the only dissapointed was Piper looking like Bob Saget (nothing a head swap didn't fix) I personally think that there were simply too many produced. Also again pricing. Jakks Classics were pretty much basic figures, and were lower in price, then they had the Deluxes which were around the price of an Elite. I personally did not care because I prefered Jakks' Deluxes so It was all the same to me except that Mattel did it better. However, Jakks' 2 packs were much cheaper, and I think between that and just having too much inventory people didn't want to buy them. This doesn't explain why The Rockers haven't sold well but then again paying extra for shipping sucks, especially since you can only buy items from Matty via Credit Card. Trust me, we all loved the Legends, and think it sucks that this it what it has come to be. Sadly I think we are seeing better Flashbacks than what Matty has to offer, and that doesn't help matters either. I think Jakks did more because they were simply a younger company that was still growing and had a lot to prove, and still does. Mattel has been around for a long time, and unfortunatley some of their decisions go against us, but nothing is going to be done about it because we are simply a very small percentage of their customer base. On the other hand I also think Mattel has done us a good job by getting us figures that Jakks couldn't or wouldn't produce. Who knows, maybe the economy, at some point, will get better and they just make Legends for the hell of it, but until then we can only take what we can get and speculate on the rest. Tangent over, Peace out.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 28, 2012 15:41:41 GMT -5
Mattel rushed to market with their Legends. They should have waited until they could legally make Andre, Magnum TA, DDP, etc. Instead they jumped with what they had. Poor attire choices in most cases, coupled with poor distribution and a re-release in K-Marts of some figures who weren't that popular to begin with, crippled the line.
By the time the good figures were supposed to start showing up again, Vader, Bam Bam, etc... Most stores still had Seres 1 & 2 in stock or had dropped the line.
It was a combination of problems and oddly enough, advertising wasn't one of the problems.
Unfortunately this ship has sailed.
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Post by marino13 on Feb 28, 2012 15:43:46 GMT -5
Okay, I tried to stay away but.... I think I can sum up in one word why Mattel's Legend line isn't selling as well as Jakks classics used to - standards.
Take Rick "The Model" Martel for example, Jakks threw an outdated Strike Force head on an over sized torso. They had the decency to add a sweater for over his shoulders. Of coarse we bought it. Haven't had a Martel figure in 20 years.
While Mattel made him a new boot mold with extra long laces knowing full well they most likely will never use them again. Most fans wouldn't have even noticed Martel always had long laces, but Mattel did it anyway. Add that to the great head scan that they would never even try to use for a Strike Force version of Martel, a detailed coat with his trademark button, & finally his can of Arrogance. Overall it dominated every thing about the Jakks figure, except they probably spent more to make theirs.
(And yeah, Mattel dropped the ball with Snuka, but even HOF baseball players strike out every now and then.)
Mattel's standards far surpass what we got from Jakks. But at the time we ate up everything Jakks put out because we didn't know how good it could be. And in my opinion those standards cost Mattel money. But if I would guess, they would rather do that then release an inferior and incomplete product.
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Post by qdogg on Feb 28, 2012 15:53:34 GMT -5
We can all whine and complain all we want but no matter who was chosen or what attire, the line was going to fail. The figures are more expensive than Jakks ones, the economy has been terrible and Jakks really sucked the well dry with their Classic Superstars and Deluxe Classic lines, not to mention the unmatched fury figs and all the other ones they did. I still am holding out hope that down the road in maybe late 2013 or early 14 we get another legends type line but we shall see! In the meantime I will continue to buy flashbacks and some mattycollector ones and look for other ways to spend my money!
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Post by swandive on Feb 28, 2012 15:57:14 GMT -5
I will agree with you on some points you made in this statement. Mattel really should have came firing out with better line ups off the bat (HBK early years, Bret Hart, Andre, Stone Cold, The Rock, Undertaker) This would have lifted the line off the ground and proceeded it to where it needs to be. Nextly, Mattel should have given us more iconic attires of the wrestlers. L.O.D red and black I am still hoping to see them made in the next year or 2 as i have no desire to own the road warriors or want to buy them and end up seeing red and black made and end up having 2 of each fig. They could have def planned this out better or took some polls from wrestling fans about superstars and such. Also the over producing of Randy Orton and John Cena and Mysterio does have to stop. I can see them doing a Cena when he has a drastic attire change such as "Rise Above Hate" now or if he changes his T shirt, hat, and arm band colors again. Then its acceptable imo. Or if Randy Orton changes his tights color on TV then ok go for it, but to drop the same Randy Orton and same John Cena in every series that comes out gets really sickening imo and very well could end up killing the line. As far as Dusty Rhodes goes though, I was happy with the polka dot attire because again this is WWE not NWA. So Dusty's biggest name was when he wore that attire in the WWE in the 80's. I don't think everyone wanted Magnum either. Sure there are a few collectors dying to get him but he is one of those guys who much like Terry Funk would have hurt the line to and shelf warmed everywhere. Im 30 years old and I know of TA Magnum but I really have no desire to buy his figure. I would to support the line if i had to but Im not falling all over to get him and a lot of kids probably have no idea who he even is tbh. I wouldn't blame Mattel for prices in retail or online. Mattel sets there prices accordingly (which is dirt cheap.) and retail stores and online outlets buy quantity of this and they then charge there customers what they want. So say Mattel is only charging $5 per Elite figure to retailers, those retailers are the ones charging the extra $10-$20 profit per figure. Its not Mattel's fault. Its hard to blame Mattel souley for anything in a time when WWE ratings are at a low compared to the attitude era. Think of the star power WWE and WCW had back in the day and how high ratings were and fans were pooring in to watch the talent. They had that capability back then with guys like Hulk Hogan, The Rock, Stone cold, Bret Hart, Shawn Michaels, Triple H, Undertaker, LOD, Scott Hall, Kevin Nash, X Pac etc etc the list goes on forever. When Jakks had the line it was such a better time of pro wrestling then it is now. A lot of ppl quit watching because guys like Stone cold, Goldberg etc quit wrestling and its all new comers with not much of a story line at all. Mattel can supply the fans WWE has now but they cant force ppl to watch WWE to buy there products then. Jakks was able to succeed because of the high demand of ppl watching back then compared to now days.
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MattelDesignTeam
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Post by MattelDesignTeam on Feb 28, 2012 16:12:46 GMT -5
Serious question: Why do so many of the people on this forum consider the red and black outfit of the Legion of Doom as the 'iconic' one? They were far more successful and made far much more money for not only themselves but for the company they wreslted in when they wore the black pads with silver spikes. They were always considered main eventers in NWA They were rarely a main event act in WWF/E. So why is that the 'iconic' look?
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Post by swandive on Feb 28, 2012 16:18:27 GMT -5
Because that is how most ppl remember the Legion of Doom. When you say Legion of Doom most ppl think of the red pads with Black spikes and Hawk having the red over one eye and black under the other. They were main eventers in this time to as they held tag team champions numerous times and battled the likes of Money Inc, Natural Disasters, Nasty Boyz, Demolitions, etc Nothing against the Road Warriors i mean that was a good time for them to but making toys and selling to collectors and kids, they want the attires they remember and L.O.D in red and black, this is the attire most of us want and remember. Just make the damn things please and we will line your pockets with our money lol
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Post by jayrod2009 on Feb 28, 2012 16:19:54 GMT -5
Im not trying to come off winey. For the longest time, I was one of the "Anti-Mattel" collectors. I hated the fact WWE went with the "Barbie" company. Then I purchased some Basics, then more, then I had around 25. Then I purchased my first Elite, Actually my first 2....The Hart Dynasty. I was blown away, and even came on here a year ago, and made a public appology on being such a anti mattel d bag.
The thing is, They gave us such a awesome line of Legends. With a future full of endless superstar possibilities. And it was cut from us. Just taken. Not fully, but other than flashbacks, we will never see Legends in-stores again. Its like winning the lotto and the State just giving you the winning card, and no prize. Blue balls essentially.
I feel that if we continue to express our opinion on the line, and help Mattel's team into a direction that could at least spark a online line of say 4-5 figures every 3 to 4 months of those Main Event - Mid Card level legends, that maybe with afew lines it could slowly flood back into the market.
Lastly, I would never compare JAKKS to Mattel. Mattel is light years ahead of anything JAKKS produced. JAKKS just had the formula down, and the notion of sink or float, we will get these guys released.
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Post by cableV on Feb 28, 2012 16:40:44 GMT -5
Seriously this board gets more repetitive everyday. How many more threads about legends rants, what's your fav figure, what elite flashbacks do you want threads are we gonna have? We c the same 5 threads reposted over and over again. This X1000 The MODs need to start locking repetitive threads/topics. The funny part is the same people keep posting the same thing in the threads like they can control themselves. Wait, somebody started a legends thread! I have to hurry up and post the same thing I did in the last 100 Legends thread.
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Post by LaParka on Feb 28, 2012 16:41:57 GMT -5
Serious question: Why do so many of the people on this forum consider the red and black outfit of the Legion of Doom as the 'iconic' one? They were far more successful and made far much more money for not only themselves but for the company they wreslted in when they wore the black pads with silver spikes. They were always considered main eventers in NWA They were rarely a main event act in WWF/E. So why is that the 'iconic' look? Most people started in the 90s watching WWE and thats how they saw the Legion of Doom. They were a popular tag team in the WWE. I actually like that we got matching old school NWA versions of them. You can't please everyone with choices. I'd love for Mattel to take chances on some of the guys that are more lower card legends/gimmicks. I'm all for everyone getting their red Legion of Doom but I'd rather have the Powers of Pain singles and tag,Godwinns, Headbangers, Rock & Roll Express, Midnight Express, British Bulldogs, amongst other tag teams before a 2nd pack of them comes out. Singles theres a huge list and it would be nice if Mattel took the Jakks route and tried to please everyone maybe they go back and start the Legends as basics and start inserting them into the assts by increasing sets to 8 this way there are a few newer faces in the line but start hitting the obscure guys that would make for cool figures Ludvig Borga, Skinner, Hakushi, La Parka hit it on all eras. In some areas as long as its wrestling and new faces people do buy them. In TRU there was a kid asking for Sandman because he was tired of Cena and Rey
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Von Hooten
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Post by Von Hooten on Feb 28, 2012 16:44:27 GMT -5
I read on a firum from a different collecting site and Mattel had stated that they will everything they can to please the collectors and their wishes but it means support from our end. This was a Q & A from Mattel reguarding a figure from a different line but I think Mattel's attitude can be translated the same way for WWE Product
"Regarding the missing scythe for the collect and connect Nekron, why was such a crucial piece not included with the wave and what are your plans to get this important accesory into collector's hands in the near future?
Quote: Cutting this accessory was NOT something we wanted to do and it was painful. It came down to costs issues and we are actively looking for ways to get it out there if we have enough fan support (and by that we mean sales, not just posts on forums)."
If you see there they need sales, not just us wanting one. Sadly to say the best thing to do is to go into whatever stores have and legends left and buy them, and buy what ever you can from MattyCollector. Us posting complaint's or ideas won't do jack. I am not saying that this is a bad thing on Mattel's part, but I can see from a business POV why they may have made decisions they might have not wanted to make.
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Post by PJ on Feb 28, 2012 16:45:36 GMT -5
Personally I'm glad we got the Road Warriors we got as that was the version I liked the most. Sure I liked them in the WWF, but prior to the WWF there were many a Saturday that my father and I would go to my grandfather's house to watch the NWA on TBS. For some reason in the early days of cable it wasn't offerend with our cable package but my grandfather's cable package did include it.
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Von Hooten
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Post by Von Hooten on Feb 28, 2012 16:47:13 GMT -5
Seriously this board gets more repetitive everyday. How many more threads about legends rants, what's your fav figure, what elite flashbacks do you want threads are we gonna have? We c the same 5 threads reposted over and over again. This X1000 The MODs need to start locking repetitive threads/topics. The funny part is the same people keep posting the same thing in the threads like they can control themselves. Wait, somebody started a legends thread! I have to hurry up and post the same thing I did in the last 100 Legends thread. This is true and I am as quilty as they come as far as saying the same stuff over and over again concerning this topic. I guess you can't blame collectors who have passion for this sort of stuff.
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Post by jayrod2009 on Feb 28, 2012 16:58:23 GMT -5
This X1000 The MODs need to start locking repetitive threads/topics. The funny part is the same people keep posting the same thing in the threads like they can control themselves. Wait, somebody started a legends thread! I have to hurry up and post the same thing I did in the last 100 Legends thread. This is true and I am as quilty as they come as far as saying the same stuff over and over again concerning this topic. I guess you can't blame collectors who have passion for this sort of stuff. It is a passion. We are collectors for one reason or another. And truthfully, this is a forum, where people can express their views and opinions. Sometimes those views aren't read cause people will read 3 or 4 and scroll down to reply. We all don't have the same opinion, there for my post is justified. As far as the NWA Road Warriors go. I am pleased with the NWA version, but the Red/Black version IMO is their stand out attire. Yes a nWo Hogan would kick ass, but the Yellow and Red is his memorable attire. But we would be pleased with either of the 2.
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Post by comintogetcha on Feb 28, 2012 18:03:18 GMT -5
Seriously this board gets more repetitive everyday. How many more threads about legends rants, what's your fav figure, what elite flashbacks do you want threads are we gonna have? We c the same 5 threads reposted over and over again. This X1000 The MODs need to start locking repetitive threads/topics. The funny part is the same people keep posting the same thing in the threads like they can control themselves. Wait, somebody started a legends thread! I have to hurry up and post the same thing I did in the last 100 Legends thread. I will take 100 threads like this any day over another stupid "I just got this Randy Orton figure at Wal-Mart today, here's 30 pictures of it I just took" thread. At least we're having a discussion in threads such as these. I'm sick of seeing threads filled with pictures of the same figures we've seen a dozen times already, no one cares, and they're just an excuse for people to increase their post count with stupid posts like "cool pictures". THOSE are the threads that need to be locked instantly.
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