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Post by Halloween King on May 22, 2013 17:23:01 GMT -5
I went to Six Flags yesterday. It was a beautiful day, they had called for rain in the forecast plus it was a weekday so it was nice and empty. It didnt rain, there wasnt many people just lovely. Me and the wife posed for some pictures. And at the end of the day we went to go check out our pictures.
We were interested in purchashing some pictures so I axededed the man how much. He went on to tell me the prices and then something new. You can purchase a flash drive for 40 dollars. The guy went on to tell me that for that price you can bring the flash drive back with you and every picture you take will be 99 cents. I was thinking, that is a cool deal. And then he kept talking and kinda pissed me off.
He went on to say that along with the purchase you get the flash drive and........ the rights to your pictures. Thus giving you the right to upload those pics online. I thought to myself, wait a min can they claim ownership of your likeness? I always thought you had to get me to sign a release if you wanted to use my image? So now how is it that I now have to purchase the right to my own image?
Kinda makes me think someday someone will want to charge you should you look in a mirror and want to see yourself.
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Post by "The Visionary" Eldniw on May 23, 2013 0:34:14 GMT -5
Rights was the wrong word, but if you knowingly allow someone to take your photo, you can't expect a release form. It's kinda an unwritten rule anyway, you go to a giant public place like Six Flags, chances are you're gonna end up in a photo that may be used on, say, a website or something.
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Post by Kliquid on May 23, 2013 0:39:04 GMT -5
If you're on their property, they can take your picture in areas where you don't have a "reasonable expectation of privacy."
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Post by Halloween King on May 23, 2013 1:45:14 GMT -5
If you're on their property, they can take your picture in areas where you don't have a "reasonable expectation of privacy." Well I know in the past I've seen signs at the front of the park that read something like; Filming and photography will be taking place today, if you do not agree with being filmed or photo'ed do not enter the park. I've never had a problem with that. My main issue was with the fact that I paid 15 dollars for a picture of me and my wife from Six Flags. So by me giving them that money I would think I now own that photo and can do what I wish with it, including uploading it to a website. BUT according to the fellow at the photo kiosk I need to buy a flash drive from six flags in order to be able to have the right to upload my own image onto the internet.
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Post by slappy on May 23, 2013 1:48:35 GMT -5
This is why copyright for digital things is stupid.
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PenguinDeluxe
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Post by PenguinDeluxe on May 23, 2013 2:01:22 GMT -5
If you're on their property, they can take your picture in areas where you don't have a "reasonable expectation of privacy." Well I know in the past I've seen signs at the front of the park that read something like; Filming and photography will be taking place today, if you do not agree with being filmed or photo'ed do not enter the park. I've never had a problem with that. My main issue was with the fact that I paid 15 dollars for a picture of me and my wife from Six Flags. So by me giving them that money I would think I now own that photo and can do what I wish with it, including uploading it to a website. BUT according to the fellow at the photo kiosk I need to buy a flash drive from six flags in order to be able to have the right to upload my own image onto the internet. They still created the photo though. It's the same thing if you go to a professional photographer and have photos made. It is still their work.
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Post by Halloween King on May 23, 2013 2:10:18 GMT -5
Well I know in the past I've seen signs at the front of the park that read something like; Filming and photography will be taking place today, if you do not agree with being filmed or photo'ed do not enter the park. I've never had a problem with that. My main issue was with the fact that I paid 15 dollars for a picture of me and my wife from Six Flags. So by me giving them that money I would think I now own that photo and can do what I wish with it, including uploading it to a website. BUT according to the fellow at the photo kiosk I need to buy a flash drive from six flags in order to be able to have the right to upload my own image onto the internet. They still created the photo though. It's the same thing if you go to a professional photographer and have photos made. It is still their work. They created the image? I didnt know the teen girl was my mom? They didnt create me. And I posed for the picture. And then I paid for the picture itself. So I fail to see how I have no right to upload something I paid for. It's kind like you go buy a car. It's yours to do with as you wish, but does that mean since you didnt create it you cant take pictures of it?
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s13driver
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Post by s13driver on May 23, 2013 2:34:26 GMT -5
They still created the photo though. It's the same thing if you go to a professional photographer and have photos made. It is still their work. They created the image? I didnt know the teen girl was my mom? They didnt create me. And I posed for the picture. And then I paid for the picture itself. So I fail to see how I have no right to upload something I paid for. It's kind like you go buy a car. It's yours to do with as you wish, but does that mean since you didnt create it you cant take pictures of it? I don't think you're understanding what he's saying. He's not saying that the girl created YOU, he's saying that the girl created the PHOTO, which means that she (as an employee of Six Flags) owns the right to the picture and you don't have the right to post that picture without their permission, weather it has your image on there or not. It's the same thing for artists. If an artist paints a picture of you, it is HIS painting. Doesn't matter if the painting looks like you because he painted it which makes it his. Since you were on their property, and allowed them to take your picture, you have no authority over the image possession.
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Post by Halloween King on May 23, 2013 3:04:46 GMT -5
They created the image? I didnt know the teen girl was my mom? They didnt create me. And I posed for the picture. And then I paid for the picture itself. So I fail to see how I have no right to upload something I paid for. It's kind like you go buy a car. It's yours to do with as you wish, but does that mean since you didnt create it you cant take pictures of it? I don't think you're understanding what he's saying. He's not saying that the girl created YOU, he's saying that the girl created the PHOTO, which means that she (as an employee of Six Flags) owns the right to the picture and you don't have the right to post that picture without their permission, weather it has your image on there or not. It's the same thing for artists. If an artist paints a picture of you, it is HIS painting. Doesn't matter if the painting looks like you because he painted it which makes it his. Since you were on their property, and allowed them to take your picture, you have no authority over the image possession. I understand the concept of the park taking the picture so therefore the picture belongs to the park. What I dont get is how if I pay for the picture the park still owns it? If someone paints you and you buy the painting the painting is now yours, not the artists. So if money was exchanged how can the seller still claim ownership? I paid for the pitcure so I should be able to do with it as I please. They say buying a flash drive also buys you the rights. So what im hearing is they want to upsell from one picture to a flash drive. I feel once money is exchanged the seller is no longer the owner. But in todays digital age I guess you have to shell out even more money to truely own something? But then that opens flood gates because where does it end? First you buy a picture, then you buy a flash drive to also own the rights, is the next step paying even more money so the park no longer has any rights to your picture? Where does it end? It's just a non stop milking of your wallet. I feel once you start a transaction and pay for something then that item you paid for should fully be yours.
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Post by Kliquid on May 23, 2013 3:12:35 GMT -5
You're paying for a COPY of the picture. Not the exclusive rights to the picture. The devil is in the details
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Post by AdamBomb on May 23, 2013 3:12:58 GMT -5
I don't think you're understanding what he's saying. He's not saying that the girl created YOU, he's saying that the girl created the PHOTO, which means that she (as an employee of Six Flags) owns the right to the picture and you don't have the right to post that picture without their permission, weather it has your image on there or not. It's the same thing for artists. If an artist paints a picture of you, it is HIS painting. Doesn't matter if the painting looks like you because he painted it which makes it his. Since you were on their property, and allowed them to take your picture, you have no authority over the image possession. I understand the concept of the park taking the picture so therefore the picture belongs to the park. What I dont get is how if I pay for the picture the park still owns it? If someone paints you and you buy the painting the painting is now yours, not the artists. So if money was exchanged how can the seller still claim ownership? I paid for the pitcure so I should be able to do with it as I please. They say buying a flash drive also buys you the rights. So what im hearing is they want to upsell from one picture to a flash drive. I feel once money is exchanged the seller is no longer the owner. But in todays digital age I guess you have to shell out even more money to truely own something? But then that opens flood gates because where does it end? First you buy a picture, then you buy a flash drive to also own the rights, is the next step paying even more money so the park no longer has any rights to your picture? Where does it end? It's just a non stop milking of your wallet. I feel once you start a transaction and pay for something then that item you paid for should fully be yours. You're buying the rights to use them, not own them. Same thing with music or movies, you're buying a copy for personal use, you don't actually buy the rights securing that media exclusively to yourself.
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Post by CM Poor on May 23, 2013 6:34:38 GMT -5
How can you claim to be 31 (and married, no less) and not understand the concept of license rights? If you had any sort of traditional wedding, with a professional photographer, you should have learned all about this then.
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Post by Hulkamaniac on May 23, 2013 7:19:38 GMT -5
You're paying for a COPY of the picture. Not the exclusive rights to the picture. The devil is in the details This. Same as if you pose for a family photo with a professional photographer.
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Post by k5 on May 23, 2013 10:36:09 GMT -5
This is why copyright for digital things is stupid. amidst about a 1000 other reasons.
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Post by Hulkamaniac on May 23, 2013 10:44:30 GMT -5
This is why copyright for digital things is stupid. amidst about a 1000 other reasons. Can't really agree with that. If I'm a photographer shouldn't I have copyright protection on my work? Or can someone like Coca-cola (to pick a random brand) find my picture on the Internet use it for a billion dollar ad campaign and not compensate me at all? But let's take it further. If I write a book nowadays it's all digital. It's a file on my computer, goes to my publisher as a file, they format it/edit it as a file and if I go straight for the ebook route it's digital the entire way. Do I have no copyright? Or what if I write a computer program? Do I have no copyright protection on my work? Can you take my code and sell it and not compensate me?
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PenguinDeluxe
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Post by PenguinDeluxe on May 23, 2013 10:51:53 GMT -5
amidst about a 1000 other reasons. Can't really agree with that. If I'm a photographer shouldn't I have copyright protection on my work? Or can someone like Coca-cola (to pick a random brand) find my picture on the Internet use it for a billion dollar ad campaign and not compensate me at all? But let's take it further. If I write a book nowadays it's all digital. It's a file on my computer, goes to my publisher as a file, they format it/edit it as a file and if I go straight for the ebook route it's digital the entire way. Do I have no copyright? Or what if I write a computer program? Do I have no copyright protection on my work? Can you take my code and sell it and not compensate me? As a filmmaker having to deal with such issues, you're dead on. Digital copyrights are complicated, certainly, and the way some of them are enforced are asinine, but they are vital to protecting the creators of the work.
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Post by k5 on May 23, 2013 11:09:34 GMT -5
amidst about a 1000 other reasons. Can't really agree with that. If I'm a photographer shouldn't I have copyright protection on my work? Or can someone like Coca-cola (to pick a random brand) find my picture on the Internet use it for a billion dollar ad campaign and not compensate me at all? But let's take it further. If I write a book nowadays it's all digital. It's a file on my computer, goes to my publisher as a file, they format it/edit it as a file and if I go straight for the ebook route it's digital the entire way. Do I have no copyright? Or what if I write a computer program? Do I have no copyright protection on my work? Can you take my code and sell it and not compensate me? i suppose i should clarify my point. copyrights certainly have their place, and particularly in that last case with the ebook, a creator needs to have some protection of his property to ensure his ownership to his ideas. my real issue is how far we've allowed them to develop so that more often or not they are put in place to secure corporate cash cow's money pulls. a clear example of this occurred in 1976, in what was officially dubbed the Copyright Term Extension Act but most people just considered it the mickey mouse protection act. disney lobbied that year to push the years in which content becomes public domain to something of 100 years - to the point where the content isn't relevant in direct form to society or culture any more. so the issue with this is this: some people consider it "mickey mouse is disney's, no one else ever should have the right to infringe." i feel that these people are fine with the idea of buying what they see and putting it up in their house somewhere. but for many others, we want more. we want the ability to cut, copy, paste and mutilate any content or product sold because we don't just want to be consumers anymore - we want to interact with our culture on all forms, including our icons and our themes. another interesting example of how copyrights attempt to infringe the consumer's ability to interact with the media and world is with the current music state. radiohead made a lot of waves back in 2007 when they made their album available through online cost friendly prices. one radiohead fan was so supportive he took all the tracks from the cd, made a mashup version of them where he added his own effects, and put them all up on youtube. immediately capital records legally went after these tracks and threatened the fan of touching copyright material. do you know what radiohead did when they received this information? as THE MAKERS OF THE CONTENT, they still decided to release all the tracks in their individual take form so that people could take the tracks into their pc recording programs and make all new things with the original takes.they also made sure capital records relieved the fan of any legal ramifications or other complications. basically, radiohead told capital through actions that they can suck it and wouldn't allow their fans to be corporately silenced. it's a very, very important issue to our times as we enter this digital age. there's a documentary called "RIP: remix manifesto" that really gets into all this. the cool thing about it is the movie has been made in 100s of forms, as the original copy was intended to be bootlegged and that people can add what they want to the movie and release it online, making it 'their' version. i really suggest checking it out, it's available all over the internet still.
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Post by Hulkamaniac on May 23, 2013 11:47:53 GMT -5
Can't really agree with that. If I'm a photographer shouldn't I have copyright protection on my work? Or can someone like Coca-cola (to pick a random brand) find my picture on the Internet use it for a billion dollar ad campaign and not compensate me at all? But let's take it further. If I write a book nowadays it's all digital. It's a file on my computer, goes to my publisher as a file, they format it/edit it as a file and if I go straight for the ebook route it's digital the entire way. Do I have no copyright? Or what if I write a computer program? Do I have no copyright protection on my work? Can you take my code and sell it and not compensate me? i suppose i should clarify my point. copyrights certainly have their place, and particularly in that last case with the ebook, a creator needs to have some protection of his property to ensure his ownership to his ideas. my real issue is how far we've allowed them to develop so that more often or not they are put in place to secure corporate cash cow's money pulls. a clear example of this occurred in 1976, in what was officially dubbed the Copyright Term Extension Act but most people just considered it the mickey mouse protection act. disney lobbied that year to push the years in which content becomes public domain to something of 100 years - to the point where the content isn't relevant in direct form to society or culture any more. so the issue with this is this: some people consider it "mickey mouse is disney's, no one else ever should have the right to infringe." i feel that these people are fine with the idea of buying what they see and putting it up in their house somewhere. but for many others, we want more. we want the ability to cut, copy, paste and mutilate any content or product sold because we don't just want to be consumers anymore - we want to interact with our culture on all forms, including our icons and our themes. another interesting example of how copyrights attempt to infringe the consumer's ability to interact with the media and world is with the current music state. radiohead made a lot of waves back in 2007 when they made their album available through online cost friendly prices. one radiohead fan was so supportive he took all the tracks from the cd, made a mashup version of them where he added his own effects, and put them all up on youtube. immediately capital records legally went after these tracks and threatened the fan of touching copyright material. do you know what radiohead did when they received this information? as THE MAKERS OF THE CONTENT, they still decided to release all the tracks in their individual take form so that people could take the tracks into their pc recording programs and make all new things with the original takes.they also made sure capital records relieved the fan of any legal ramifications or other complications. basically, radiohead told capital through actions that they can suck it and wouldn't allow their fans to be corporately silenced. it's a very, very important issue to our times as we enter this digital age. there's a documentary called "RIP: remix manifesto" that really gets into all this. the cool thing about it is the movie has been made in 100s of forms, as the original copy was intended to be bootlegged and that people can add what they want to the movie and release it online, making it 'their' version. i really suggest checking it out, it's available all over the internet still. But in both of your cases, should the content creator not have the ultimate say? Disney doesn't want you taking Minnie and using her to sell your new vibrator. To me they created the character they've got legit interests in protecting the image of said character. They should be able to go after someone who does that if they want to. Same with Radiohead. If they want fans to use their music for mashups, that's fine. That's their content at the end of the day. If they want to put the kibosh on that, that's their perogative too.
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PenguinDeluxe
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Post by PenguinDeluxe on May 23, 2013 12:23:10 GMT -5
i suppose i should clarify my point. copyrights certainly have their place, and particularly in that last case with the ebook, a creator needs to have some protection of his property to ensure his ownership to his ideas. my real issue is how far we've allowed them to develop so that more often or not they are put in place to secure corporate cash cow's money pulls. a clear example of this occurred in 1976, in what was officially dubbed the Copyright Term Extension Act but most people just considered it the mickey mouse protection act. disney lobbied that year to push the years in which content becomes public domain to something of 100 years - to the point where the content isn't relevant in direct form to society or culture any more. so the issue with this is this: some people consider it "mickey mouse is disney's, no one else ever should have the right to infringe." i feel that these people are fine with the idea of buying what they see and putting it up in their house somewhere. but for many others, we want more. we want the ability to cut, copy, paste and mutilate any content or product sold because we don't just want to be consumers anymore - we want to interact with our culture on all forms, including our icons and our themes. another interesting example of how copyrights attempt to infringe the consumer's ability to interact with the media and world is with the current music state. radiohead made a lot of waves back in 2007 when they made their album available through online cost friendly prices. one radiohead fan was so supportive he took all the tracks from the cd, made a mashup version of them where he added his own effects, and put them all up on youtube. immediately capital records legally went after these tracks and threatened the fan of touching copyright material. do you know what radiohead did when they received this information? as THE MAKERS OF THE CONTENT, they still decided to release all the tracks in their individual take form so that people could take the tracks into their pc recording programs and make all new things with the original takes.they also made sure capital records relieved the fan of any legal ramifications or other complications. basically, radiohead told capital through actions that they can suck it and wouldn't allow their fans to be corporately silenced. it's a very, very important issue to our times as we enter this digital age. there's a documentary called "RIP: remix manifesto" that really gets into all this. the cool thing about it is the movie has been made in 100s of forms, as the original copy was intended to be bootlegged and that people can add what they want to the movie and release it online, making it 'their' version. i really suggest checking it out, it's available all over the internet still. But in both of your cases, should the content creator not have the ultimate say? Disney doesn't want you taking Minnie and using her to sell your new vibrator. To me they created the character they've got legit interests in protecting the image of said character. They should be able to go after someone who does that if they want to. Same with Radiohead. If they want fans to use their music for mashups, that's fine. That's their content at the end of the day. If they want to put the kibosh on that, that's their perogative too. The Disney issue is not that the character becomes Public Domain, but the cartoons themselves. Honestly, Disney screwed over those who need and use public domain resources for educational and entertainment endeavors to the point that many great works cannot enter into the public domain in the US for several decades to come, and even then they have given the government the right to pull something from PD even way after the creator is dead and gone.
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Post by mikey1974 on May 23, 2013 12:50:54 GMT -5
They created the image? I didnt know the teen girl was my mom? They didnt create me. And I posed for the picture. And then I paid for the picture itself. So I fail to see how I have no right to upload something I paid for. It's kind like you go buy a car. It's yours to do with as you wish, but does that mean since you didnt create it you cant take pictures of it? I don't think you're understanding what he's saying. He's not saying that the girl created YOU, he's saying that the girl created the PHOTO, which means that she (as an employee of Six Flags) owns the right to the picture and you don't have the right to post that picture without their permission, weather it has your image on there or not. It's the same thing for artists. If an artist paints a picture of you, it is HIS painting. Doesn't matter if the painting looks like you because he painted it which makes it his. Since you were on their property, and allowed them to take your picture, you have no authority over the image possession. exactly. I went to Disney World last summer,and in the Magic Kingdom they had photographers taking your picture everywhere. you got a card that they were scanned on,and you could order copies of them from a website,but you didn't get them for free. you were on their property,with their camera's,so if you wanted those photo's you had to pay for them.
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