Zincdust
Main Eventer
WF 20+ Year Member WF Day 1 Member
Redefining "Old Toy Weirdo"
Joined on: Dec 18, 2001 15:13:21 GMT -5
Posts: 3,477
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Post by Zincdust on Aug 25, 2016 11:50:00 GMT -5
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Post by jayrod2009 on Aug 25, 2016 18:21:24 GMT -5
The FDA is there to help. If their study finds that Vape liquid has toxic chemicals, they'll shut it down. In my opinion, Vape is the dumbest craze. I watch people with them. They hit them like every 3 minutes, and after awhile must do sonething with their hands or they just puff and puff on their sticks.
Point is, don't be a bitch, if you're going to smoke, get something real.
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China Claus
Main Eventer
I can feeel your sensitivity
Joined on: Apr 17, 2012 20:05:15 GMT -5
Posts: 2,737
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Post by China Claus on Aug 25, 2016 18:34:21 GMT -5
I quit smoking for about 4 months using an electronic cigarette, and honestly, that thing was harder on me than cigarettes. I had trouble breathing and was spending just about as much on the vape juice as I was a pack of smokes.
Don't get me wrong, smoking is bad. But vaping is just as bad IMO. If it helps you quit smoking, that's great, but everyone I know that vapes, still smokes or went back to smoking. It's basically trading one addiction for another.
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Post by jayrod2009 on Aug 25, 2016 19:24:34 GMT -5
I quit smoking for about 4 months using an electronic cigarette, and honestly, that thing was harder on me than cigarettes. I had trouble breathing and was spending just about as much on the vape juice as I was a pack of smokes. Don't get me wrong, smoking is bad. But vaping is just as bad IMO. If it helps you quit smoking, that's great, but everyone I know that vapes, still smokes or went back to smoking. It's basically trading one addiction for another. You are also guaranteed popcorn lung. For those who cry "its vapor" need to remember, you are slowly drowning yourself by letting moisture accumulate in your lungs.
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Post by TheLastDude on Aug 25, 2016 19:48:43 GMT -5
Nothing will convince me that vaping is "safer" than just smoking. Is it all bad for you? Yes, of course. But don't give me that "safer" shtick.
Like jayrod said, I've watched people vape. They puff and puff and puff and release enormous clouds of what smells like fog machine smoke.
Even if vaping isn't as bad for you as smoking, it's a mental game. You believe it's safer and/or because you can't see the cigarette being finished...you think you're not smoking as much, but in reality you're smoking a helluva lot more than you would if you just lit up.
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Post by Adam on Aug 25, 2016 20:37:39 GMT -5
Guess I just have to stick to my cigars.
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Post by Jack Specific on Aug 25, 2016 20:59:28 GMT -5
I don't care what it is, just don't do it around me. I don't want to breath in anyone's cancer causing toxic chemicals. Do it in your own home when no one else is around that doesn't do the same crap. No reason I am at a mall, sitting on a park bench, etc and have to inhale someone's toxic poison and nor should anyone else that doesn't do it.
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Post by hbkbigdaddycool on Aug 25, 2016 21:02:12 GMT -5
I never understood the whole concept of this either.
To me, it seems no different than actually smoking a cigarette or pot, or whatever the case may be. But maybe I am just ignorant and enjoy breathing in fresh air (or as fresh as said air can be) as much as I can.
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Nathan from Aus
Main Eventer
Joined on: Jul 3, 2010 19:58:33 GMT -5
Posts: 1,277
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Post by Nathan from Aus on Aug 25, 2016 21:16:10 GMT -5
Breathing out hot air on a cold day > smoking but
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Post by theMOESIAH on Aug 25, 2016 22:21:42 GMT -5
Nevermind cancer. Freedom! Murica!
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Deleted
Joined on: Apr 29, 2024 12:33:39 GMT -5
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Aug 25, 2016 23:37:02 GMT -5
Nicotine is nicotine, should be regulated.
Can't trust some herb that owns a vape shop to tell you his product is bad for you.
75% of vape "juice" contains Diacetyl, a chemical know to cause severe respiratory disease.
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Post by bad guy™ on Aug 25, 2016 23:58:31 GMT -5
I quit smoking through vaping. I've helped friends quit smoking through vaping.
It gets a bad stigma because of people who only vape because it's the cool thing at the moment, of those who build ridiculous mods that are like freaking fog machines.
I'm very courteous about my vaping. I vape in my home, in my car or if I have permission from whoever I'm with. I don't agree with vaping in non smoking sections or public places. It's discourteous. But one of these ordinances being proposed is to ban vaping in vape shops. If I can drink in a bar, or smoke a cigar in a casino I should at least be allowed to vape in a vape shop where only vapors congregate anyways.
I'm still addicted to nicotine, and that's not good. But I'd rather inhale nicotine and exhale water vapor than ensure a cancer diagnosis down the road. And before anyone says "then just quit" ask someone who has quit smoking. Or drinking. Or any kind of addictive habit. It's entirely possible but it's the persons discretion if and when they decide the time is right for them.
The FDA regulations are mostly garbage. Those who say that vaping is just as dangerous to your health as a cig, take a look at the studies done regarding what exactly is being inhaled into your body from a Marlboro Red compared to what's inhaled into your body by a device like what I use, the RX200S. Nicotine aside, there are thousands of carcinogens inhaled through a single Red, compared to needing to vape almost 1,000 times to get remotely close to <.00001% of what's being inhaled by one cig out of a pack of 20 Class A smokes. They might have used a different brand of smoke, and for sure used a different device in their test but that's almost to the T what (I believe it was) the Royal Academy of Science reported late last year.
The FDA wants to make it so every product is not marketable to kids? PERFECT. THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT WE WANT. It's not intended to be marketed to kids. The entire vaping community supports the no underage sale push. Every responsible, respectable shop has been supporting this for years anyways. Hell, my local shop transfers juice shipped to them for retail to plain dropper bottles with bland labels so they don't look flashy or appealing to kids who come into a shop with their mom or dad. But even now with the new policies, anyone under 18 has to remain outside the vape shops now even if their parent is with them. Meanwhile I see more kids going into the local Puff store than adults during the summer when school is out. They're not buying smokes, but they aren't buying Vapes in those shops. Double standard much? I work at a gas station, so I can't say the same about the Special Promotion packs of Marlboros we get in and have to advertise that have the tag line "Be a real cowboy" which could be very appealing in my area considering I'm near the WV border. Stereotyping a bit there, but offense isn't meant. A lot of kids want to be Cowboys if they have ever seen a western.
The FDA wants to say vaping can't be claimed by anyone in the industry as a safe alternative, fine. Disagreeable because of the study mentioned above but it is nicotine, which isn't safe so ok. But what about the juice that includes 0 nicotine? A lot of that on the market. It's literally flavoring and the stuff that makes it vape.
The FDA wants to classify all materials used in vaping as tobacco products, absolutely not. Know what the coils are made out of? Sterile cotton and nickel wire. You can jusy as easily buy that from Walmart as you can from a vape store. Some devices use batteries, like the one I use. Know what else my battery can be used in? Remote control. Does that make my remote a tobacco product? What about VG? You can buy that crap at your local super market. How's that just tobacco? Nicotine, sure. But nicotine, while not healthy, is a naturally occurring substance. Have you had a tomato today? Even an organic one? Congrats. You ingested nicotine as it's not only present in the tobacco leaf, it naturally appears in many products.
Yeah, a bit biased.
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Post by TheLastDude on Aug 26, 2016 0:46:20 GMT -5
I quit smoking through vaping. I've helped friends quit smoking through vaping. It gets a bad stigma because of people who only vape because it's the cool thing at the moment, of those who build ridiculous mods that are like freaking fog machines. I'm very courteous about my vaping. I vape in my home, in my car or if I have permission from whoever I'm with. I don't agree with vaping in non smoking sections or public places. It's discourteous. But one of these ordinances being proposed is to ban vaping in vape shops. If I can drink in a bar, or smoke a cigar in a casino I should at least be allowed to vape in a vape shop where only vapors congregate anyways. I'm still addicted to nicotine, and that's not good. But I'd rather inhale nicotine and exhale water vapor than ensure a cancer diagnosis down the road. And before anyone says "then just quit" ask someone who has quit smoking. Or drinking. Or any kind of addictive habit. It's entirely possible but it's the persons discretion if and when they decide the time is right for them. The FDA regulations are mostly garbage. Those who say that vaping is just as dangerous to your health as a cig, take a look at the studies done regarding what exactly is being inhaled into your body from a Marlboro Red compared to what's inhaled into your body by a device like what I use, the RX200S. Nicotine aside, there are thousands of carcinogens inhaled through a single Red, compared to needing to vape almost 1,000 times to get remotely close to <.00001% of what's being inhaled by one cig out of a pack of 20 Class A smokes. They might have used a different brand of smoke, and for sure used a different device in their test but that's almost to the T what (I believe it was) the Royal Academy of Science reported late last year. The FDA wants to make it so every product is not marketable to kids? PERFECT. THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT WE WANT. It's not intended to be marketed to kids. The entire vaping community supports the no underage sale push. Every responsible, respectable shop has been supporting this for years anyways. Hell, my local shop transfers juice shipped to them for retail to plain dropper bottles with bland labels so they don't look flashy or appealing to kids who come into a shop with their mom or dad. But even now with the new policies, anyone under 18 has to remain outside the vape shops now even if their parent is with them. Meanwhile I see more kids going into the local Puff store than adults during the summer when school is out. They're not buying smokes, but they aren't buying Vapes in those shops. Double standard much? I work at a gas station, so I can't say the same about the Special Promotion packs of Marlboros we get in and have to advertise that have the tag line "Be a real cowboy" which could be very appealing in my area considering I'm near the WV border. Stereotyping a bit there, but offense isn't meant. A lot of kids want to be Cowboys if they have ever seen a western. The FDA wants to say vaping can't be claimed by anyone in the industry as a safe alternative, fine. Disagreeable because of the study mentioned above but it is nicotine, which isn't safe so ok. But what about the juice that includes 0 nicotine? A lot of that on the market. It's literally flavoring and the stuff that makes it vape. The FDA wants to classify all materials used in vaping as tobacco products, absolutely not. Know what the coils are made out of? Sterile cotton and nickel wire. You can jusy as easily buy that from Walmart as you can from a vape store. Some devices use batteries, like the one I use. Know what else my battery can be used in? Remote control. Does that make my remote a tobacco product? What about VG? You can buy that crap at your local super market. How's that just tobacco? Nicotine, sure. But nicotine, while not healthy, is a naturally occurring substance. Have you had a tomato today? Even an organic one? Congrats. You ingested nicotine as it's not only present in the tobacco leaf, it naturally appears in many products. Yeah, a bit biased. Studies can show what you want them to show. There was a time when people thought smoking cigarettes was healthy, too. Just keep that in mind. There's always the chance that we're only about ten years away from seeing commercials on later night TV for attorneys looking to take cases from people who got cancer or other lung diseases from vaping. As for banning vaping in vape shops? Sure. I'm all for that. You have to keep in mind that not everyone who goes into a vape shop is buying for themselves. What if someone is buying a gift for someone? I'm not sure how it is where you live, but here, you can't smoke cigarettes almost anywhere anymore. You can't smoke them in puff shops, bars, or restaurants...there are bans everywhere. You also can't drink openly in beer distributors either. Now, if you're talking about a vape lounge or a testing area in a shop that's separate from the sales floor...then sure, vape away. But why can you vape in a vape shop when I can't smoke in a puff store? I mean, only smokers are going in there anyway...
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Deleted
Joined on: Apr 29, 2024 12:33:39 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Aug 26, 2016 2:55:08 GMT -5
Definitely not been enough research yet in my opinion. I doubt it can be as dangerous as smoking cigarettes though. I'm a believer in banning smoking I houses with kids, you can choose if you want to get lung cancer but kids can't. So if vaping saves kids the horror of forced lung cancer then it's fine with me
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Post by bad guy™ on Aug 26, 2016 2:55:48 GMT -5
I quit smoking through vaping. I've helped friends quit smoking through vaping. It gets a bad stigma because of people who only vape because it's the cool thing at the moment, of those who build ridiculous mods that are like freaking fog machines. I'm very courteous about my vaping. I vape in my home, in my car or if I have permission from whoever I'm with. I don't agree with vaping in non smoking sections or public places. It's discourteous. But one of these ordinances being proposed is to ban vaping in vape shops. If I can drink in a bar, or smoke a cigar in a casino I should at least be allowed to vape in a vape shop where only vapors congregate anyways. I'm still addicted to nicotine, and that's not good. But I'd rather inhale nicotine and exhale water vapor than ensure a cancer diagnosis down the road. And before anyone says "then just quit" ask someone who has quit smoking. Or drinking. Or any kind of addictive habit. It's entirely possible but it's the persons discretion if and when they decide the time is right for them. The FDA regulations are mostly garbage. Those who say that vaping is just as dangerous to your health as a cig, take a look at the studies done regarding what exactly is being inhaled into your body from a Marlboro Red compared to what's inhaled into your body by a device like what I use, the RX200S. Nicotine aside, there are thousands of carcinogens inhaled through a single Red, compared to needing to vape almost 1,000 times to get remotely close to <.00001% of what's being inhaled by one cig out of a pack of 20 Class A smokes. They might have used a different brand of smoke, and for sure used a different device in their test but that's almost to the T what (I believe it was) the Royal Academy of Science reported late last year. The FDA wants to make it so every product is not marketable to kids? PERFECT. THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT WE WANT. It's not intended to be marketed to kids. The entire vaping community supports the no underage sale push. Every responsible, respectable shop has been supporting this for years anyways. Hell, my local shop transfers juice shipped to them for retail to plain dropper bottles with bland labels so they don't look flashy or appealing to kids who come into a shop with their mom or dad. But even now with the new policies, anyone under 18 has to remain outside the vape shops now even if their parent is with them. Meanwhile I see more kids going into the local Puff store than adults during the summer when school is out. They're not buying smokes, but they aren't buying Vapes in those shops. Double standard much? I work at a gas station, so I can't say the same about the Special Promotion packs of Marlboros we get in and have to advertise that have the tag line "Be a real cowboy" which could be very appealing in my area considering I'm near the WV border. Stereotyping a bit there, but offense isn't meant. A lot of kids want to be Cowboys if they have ever seen a western. The FDA wants to say vaping can't be claimed by anyone in the industry as a safe alternative, fine. Disagreeable because of the study mentioned above but it is nicotine, which isn't safe so ok. But what about the juice that includes 0 nicotine? A lot of that on the market. It's literally flavoring and the stuff that makes it vape. The FDA wants to classify all materials used in vaping as tobacco products, absolutely not. Know what the coils are made out of? Sterile cotton and nickel wire. You can jusy as easily buy that from Walmart as you can from a vape store. Some devices use batteries, like the one I use. Know what else my battery can be used in? Remote control. Does that make my remote a tobacco product? What about VG? You can buy that crap at your local super market. How's that just tobacco? Nicotine, sure. But nicotine, while not healthy, is a naturally occurring substance. Have you had a tomato today? Even an organic one? Congrats. You ingested nicotine as it's not only present in the tobacco leaf, it naturally appears in many products. Yeah, a bit biased. Studies can show what you want them to show. There was a time when people thought smoking cigarettes was healthy, too. Just keep that in mind. There's always the chance that we're only about ten years away from seeing commercials on later night TV for attorneys looking to take cases from people who got cancer or other lung diseases from vaping. As for banning vaping in vape shops? Sure. I'm all for that. You have to keep in mind that not everyone who goes into a vape shop is buying for themselves. What if someone is buying a gift for someone? I'm not sure how it is where you live, but here, you can't smoke cigarettes almost anywhere anymore. You can't smoke them in puff shops, bars, or restaurants...there are bans everywhere. You also can't drink openly in beer distributors either. Now, if you're talking about a vape lounge or a testing area in a shop that's separate from the sales floor...then sure, vape away. But why can you vape in a vape shop when I can't smoke in a puff store? I mean, only smokers are going in there anyway... I didn't say drinking in a distributor location. I said a bar. Smoking is also allowed in most bars here too, if you want a bar that's non smoking you have to actually make sure they have the no smoking sign, along with all of the Puff stores I have been to that allow smoking, as long as they're not connected within a complex most do allow it. And for the ban in vape shops, it's the WHOLE shop they're trying to stop vaping in. It's not just the sales floor. They don't want separate sections for taste bars or "smokers lounges" or anything at all. They want to make it so you can only vape in your home. The county I live in is going further, trying to ban it from public in general; meaning even outside if it's not on your physical property. They don't even do that with cigarettes which HAVE known effects of second hand. So why only vaping? Why no vaping in a smokers bar? Or a separate tasting location? It's hypocrisy and an attempt to either get people to quit everything entirely or turn them back to cigarettes which remains one of most states top five single purchase tax cash cows that's lost hundreds of millions if not billions because of the rise of vaping. That way they can either claim they were the generation to end smoking, or they can show off how many millions of tax dollars they've raised because too many states have too big of contracts with Phillip Morris, RJ Reynolds, Winston Salem and others to split the tax money collected off of a pack whereas the vaping community doesn't have any kind of Big Tobacco backing. And once all of these mom and pop stores are forced to close, and the distributors stop manufacturing, guess what? The regulations will be loosened to allow ecigs back on the market and usable freely as a normal cigarette but the only products available? Blu, NJoy, Mark Ten and Vuse; conveniently owned by the Big Tobacco companies, or their subsidiaries. And they'll reword the current regulations so prohibition esque ecigs can't begin to be manufactured and the only choices will be what Phillip Morris and company make thus continuing the monopoly. And as for studies about lung cancer and other health risks, you do know vaping isn't a new thing right? It's one of the fastest growing industries in recent years, but these things have been studied for over a decade. A plethora of reputable research groups wouldn't just publish work on research from a very short period of time. Hell, before this hardcore regulation began the FDA said they were less hazardous than traditional cigarettes. Ecigs have been around for 13+ years. Sure, not as long as cigarettes, but plenty long enough for strong case studies to be completed and early conclusions to be made, even if they're not 100% complete yet. Sure, more effort should go into studying the effects but if these studies are almost all saying "more testing should be done but as of right now it's looking towards a positive trend" then that should say something. Work to still be done; but pockets have been lined, and many have chosen to remain ignorant on the topic so they might as well put an end to it before Big Tobacco actually encounters it's first real threat in decades and causes more trouble. Always best to stick to the status quo, even if it's killing millions every year.
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Deleted
Joined on: Apr 29, 2024 12:33:39 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Aug 26, 2016 5:55:49 GMT -5
I used to smoke cigarettes and have quit many times. I dip currently, but I've tried vaping and hated it. Absolutely hated it. I'd rather have an American Spirit.
IMO, if you start vaping on your own accord and don't use it to quit cigarettes, then I think you need a good throat punch.
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Deleted
Joined on: Apr 29, 2024 12:33:39 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Aug 26, 2016 6:40:58 GMT -5
Vaping is legit the most uncool "thing" to be hip. I used to smoke, one day I felt "Nah. Not about this anymore" put it down and it wasn't harder than that. Haven't smoked since, not experianced this huge "I need to smoke!!!" withdral that everyone talks about. Been smoke free for a good while now, never had the urge to start again. It's quite fun and amazing how different people are. But on topic, vaping is awful, get rid of it.
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WreckerJack
Superstar
Joined on: Jan 8, 2016 2:49:31 GMT -5
Posts: 550
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Post by WreckerJack on Aug 26, 2016 8:16:09 GMT -5
I don't think it is healthy to breathe all that in. Even if it is water vapor it seems to me like it would be like going out on a foggy morning when you get all congested. Plus the stuff they put in the flavors. But if other people want to vape I won't judge. Just please do it outside and not near people who don't want to breathe in the vapors.
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Post by J12 on Aug 26, 2016 12:06:08 GMT -5
I don't have a strong opinion either way (except for the ridiculous fog clouds and vaping competitions - those are endlessly stupid), but I will say that my mom smoked for 25+ years, with nearly countless failed attempts to quit. She switched to a vape pen in October of 2014 and hasn't looked back. At this point, she's down to 1.5% nicotine (she mixes a 3% and a 0%.)
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Post by bad guy™ on Aug 26, 2016 14:11:27 GMT -5
I don't have a strong opinion either way (except for the ridiculous fog clouds and vaping competitions - those are endlessly stupid), but I will say that my mom smoked for 25+ years, with nearly countless failed attempts to quit. She switched to a vape pen in October of 2014 and hasn't looked back. At this point, she's down to 1.5% nicotine (she mixes a 3% and a 0%.) That's fantastic. I do the same, and normally one of the flavors is a menthol because that's what I smoked. The icy taste is good to me. Eventually she'll go to 0 and then can decide if she wants to keep vaping 0 or quit entirely. Part of vaping for former smokers and not the people who just do it because it's "cool" is we require that...feeling. As addicting as the nicotine craving is, the muscle memory of "to lips, inhale, exhale" is sort of ingrained in us, even more so for someone who smoked upwards of 20 years. Some can break it completely, some can't. Everyone is different. And as I said in my first post, it's idiots who have fog machines and are what the community calls "cloud chasers" are what give vaping an even worse rep.
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