Official UFC 90: Silva vs. Cote Thread

hah. I remember I tried getting my friend and my girlfriend into it for at least 6 months. They have finally come around...they understand the moves and what the fighters are doing even when there is no action going on..It is frustrating though..trying to present a quality product to friends and them just dismiss it as boring..

No, that loss is trash. They should have a rematch, but that's neither here nor there.

Anderson's losses to Ryo Chonan and such do matter, though.



I don't think I've ever picked against Anderson Silva in a fight. I could be wrong, but I don't recall it. I might have picked Dan Henderson to beat him, but that's the only one I'd even consider.

What's the big deal with beating Patrick Cote? That's what I don't get. We're not talking about some guy who has a long track record of convincing wins against top-tier talent. We're talking about a guy who has barely scraped together wins against mid-level (UFC-wise) talent.



Probably because most of those guys aren't even that good. Henderson and Franklin are among the elite, absolutely, but the others really aren't. Marquardt could be argued as a top-10 middleweight, but lets face it, middleweight isn't exactly the most 'stacked' division in the world right now.

But the others? Really? Chris Leben, Travis Lutter, and James Irvin are all just decent. Lutter has lost to every upper-tier fighter he's ever faced. The same can pretty much be said for Chris Leben and James Irvin.

I don't think anyone is taking away credit from Anderson Silva. The guy is the single most dominant middleweight fighter in the history of MMA. He's unreal. I love watching him fight - I didn't even dislike this fight. The end sucked, but that's not his fault. Not EVERY fight of Anderson's is going to end in a brutal knockout.

The problem I have is when people give all this credit to Anderson Silva for beating a bunch of cans essentially, while Fedor sits at 28-0 (truly) and has made a career of kicking the absolutely dogcrapout of just about every top heavyweight in the world. The only ones he hasn't beat are in line now with Affliction.

Just because Chris Leben, Travis Lutter, James Irvin, & Nate Marquardt are not among the elite at this point in their careers that soes not make them a can. They are FAR from cans...

I honestly agree with pretty much everything here, but I'd like to clarify one little thing.

On average, when you compare the level of competition that Fedor has fought and that Anderson Silva has fought, that's when you could call some of Anderson's opponents cans.

I think that's the big "lost in translation" thing, at least for me. Completely by themselves, Anderson's opponents are all moderately worthy in some way or another. Each of them possessed at least a chance of beating Silva.

But when you compare guys like Lutter and Leben to the epicness that was PRIDE's heavyweight division, that's when you can conceivably start calling them cans.

Over time I've grown to deal with the fact that, in spite of my absolute unbridled never-flinching unadulterated hero-worship fanboyism of Anderson Silva, Fedor rules the roost.

That barely takes anything away from Silva at all, though. When you're a fan of both, such as myself, which one is better pretty much boils down to semantics. I stopped caring which one was the best a long time ago, even if I realize that the pick is Fedor.

I just enjoy watching them fight so much.

I hate to sound like a broken record, but it really is a great time to be an MMA fan. Anderson Silva playing it cautious for one fight doesn't do anything to tarnish his legacy.

Now, on the whole "No Contest" debate, I see it both ways. A "No Contest" wouldn't have hurt Silva's legacy either, nobody expects to have you or your opponent's knee explode midway through the fight. It could, and possibly should, have been a No Contest.

But it's a finnicky gray area, and maybe that's what bothers all of us so much. On the one hand, we've got to respect the referee's decision. On the other hand, referees have made plenty of stupid decisions in the past.

IMO, if Cote feels it should be a NC then he'll appeal it with the Athletic Commission. If he doesn't, that means that he agrees with the ruling. And if he does agree with the ruling and doesn't file an appeal, I think that pretty much closes that particular case.

If he does decide to file an appeal, it's in the hands of the Athletic Commission.

When you're the best middleweight in the world, guys like Chris Leben really are not that great of competition. It's basically like Matt Lindland and Hong Man Choi for Fedor. Guys who realistically were just put against Fedor to be beat.

Chris Leben is decent, but come on, the guy isn't top-tier. He was a nice victory for Anderson, but there are still plenty of other middleweights in the world who are ranked above Leben who are not currently in the UFC to fight Anderson.

Guys like Robbie Lawler, Paulo Filho, Frank Trigg, Cung Le, Frank Shamrock... I mean, the list is longer than the guys who Fedor hasn't fought (and beat).

Everyone is so quick to talk trash about Fedor for "not fighting top competition," but the same thing can be said about Anderson Silva. I can run down a longgggg list of guys who were perceived top fighters when Fedor fought them -- and all of them got killed.

Cro Cop, Nogueira (2x), Tim Sylvia, Mark Hunt, Mark Coleman (2x), Ogawa, Heath Herring, Randleman, Babalu, Ricardo Arona...

The list goes on and on.

Who else, reasonably, is there for Fedor to fight? Couture, (maybe) Lesnar, Barnett, Arlovski.... That's about it that I can think of. Everyone else would basically be a can.

I agree, that's my whole point. Neither of those guys had a chance. In a similar sense, James Irvin and Patrick Cote were both RIDICULOUS underdogs in their fights with Anderson Silva. Yet, somehow, Anderson Silva's fights are considered more legitimate than Fedor's. It just doesn't make sense.



Let's be completely honest with ourselves right now. Velasquez/Fedor, Carwin/Fedor, Dos Santos/Fedor all hold pretty much no intrigue. These guys haven't even come close to "earning" a fight with Fedor and they would all very likely be destroyed in the first round of a fight with him.

I love Brett Rodgers (he trains with one of my friends), but he's no where near Fedor's caliber, either.

Frank Mir is a crappier version of Noguiera, who Fedor killed twice.

Antonio Silva could be good, but he's an idiot, so that's probably out the door.

The others I named, so I agree, but that's a pretty damn short list. Especially when you consider that he holds wins over guys who have repeatedly beaten both Arlovski and Barnett.



I'm not trying to take things away from Anderson. I just don't understand this whole "Fedor's competition isn't as good as Anderson's" argument, when Fedor has already beaten the hell out of almost every legitimate heavyweight in the world.

It's just ridiculous to me that people will CONTINUE to discredit Fedor, even though he wins EVERY FIGHT in a convincing manner. Did you guys not see how badly he destroyed Tim Sylvia? Sylvia had absolutely no chance. Sylvia, one of the top heavyweights in the world, did ZERO damage.

WHEN Fedor destroys Arlovski, there will still be idiots going, "Nope, Fedor isn't the best because he hasn't beaten Couture." Meanwhile, they'll be nutclinging to Anderson Silva while he defeats another mid-level middleweight or light heavyweight like Jason Lambert or something.

It's just so f'n ridiculous.

If you're going that route, then Fedor beat the guy that KO'd Arlovski in barely half a minute.

Just sayin'.

I understand that Leben is not top tier at this point in his career. But I still dont think he can be labled a can. The lack of top tier MW talent in UFC is not Andersons fault. So him not beating the BEST of the BEST in the world like Fedor did means nothing. It all comes down to UFC nnot signing some of the best fighters..