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Post by Kliquid on Jul 19, 2009 12:15:17 GMT -5
You compared him to Romo. I mean hell Romo isn't an elite QB either. We've had this debate before, but I just find it extremely difficult to say Eli Manning is a better QB than Tony Romo. Romo is better than him in every statistical way other than being on a team that has won. I'm not trying to be a Cowboys homer. I feel the same thing about Philip Rivers being better than Eli or Roethlisberger, too. |
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Post by King Bálor (CM)™ on Jul 19, 2009 14:37:34 GMT -5
You compared him to Romo. I mean hell Romo isn't an elite QB either. We've had this debate before, but I just find it extremely difficult to say Eli Manning is a better QB than Tony Romo. Romo is better than him in every statistical way other than being on a team that has won. I'm not trying to be a Cowboys homer. I feel the same thing about Philip Rivers being better than Eli or Roethlisberger, too. Kliq.....I am with you on the Romo/Eli debate.....no doubt. As far as I am concerned Eli is a second to third tier QB. However, Rivers over Roethlisberger? I have to disagree. Yes, his stats might be better. But its not always stats. What about intangibles? Rivers hasnt had dog crapto work with. He just hasnt had the leadership ability to take them to the next level. Big Ben does. And that is a mark of a good QB too. In Romo vs. Eli....I think Romo is a better leader than Eli. |
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Post by captain master talbot on Jul 19, 2009 15:02:49 GMT -5
We've had this debate before, but I just find it extremely difficult to say Eli Manning is a better QB than Tony Romo. Romo is better than him in every statistical way other than being on a team that has won. I'm not trying to be a Cowboys homer. I feel the same thing about Philip Rivers being better than Eli or Roethlisberger, too. Kliq.....I am with you on the Romo/Eli debate.....no doubt. As far as I am concerned Eli is a second to third tier QB. However, Rivers over Roethlisberger? I have to disagree. Yes, his stats might be better. But its not always stats. What about intangibles? Rivers hasnt had dog poop to work with. He just hasnt had the leadership ability to take them to the next level. Big Ben does. And that is a mark of a good QB too. In Romo vs. Eli....I think Romo is a better leader than Eli. Eli is 100x a better leader than Romo. It's a Quarterbacks job to lead the team on offense, and Romo does a terrible job of that. Eli may not be as athletic as Romo, but to say Romo is a better leader is very asinine. If Romo was a better leader than Eli, he would step it up in situations where he is needed. I don't see Tony Romo driving the Cowboys down the field in the last 3 minutes of the Superbowl to score the winning touchdown. Eli might not be the best statistical quarterback, but in terms of leadership and intangibles, he's way up there. |
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Post by Bubba Ray DJ on Jul 19, 2009 16:05:41 GMT -5
Let's be honest though, Eli is a dropped miraculous catch or completed botched sack away from Super Bowl obscurity. It's not like he threw the whole team on his back like a John Elway or Joe Montana. I think you might have the Giants fanboy blinders on a little about Eli.
I don't think Romo will ever surpass Staubach or even Aikman. I wouldn't put him in the upper echelon of current quarterbacks either. Even I can admit that and I'm one of Romo's biggest fans.
As for Eli having the leadership intangibles...no. I don't effing think so.
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Post by King Bálor (CM)™ on Jul 19, 2009 16:15:08 GMT -5
Let's be honest though, Eli is a dropped miraculous catch or completed botched sack away from Super Bowl obscurity. It's not like he threw the whole team on his back like a John Elway or Joe Montana. I think you might have the Giants fanboy blinders on a little about Eli. Exactly. The Giants had a defense that carried them to the Super Bowl and kept them in the game. And Eli gets miracle after miracle on that last drive to occur. That makes him better? I hate the Cowboys. I absolutely hate them. But Tony Romo is by far the better QB then Eli. |
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Post by captain master talbot on Jul 19, 2009 16:15:33 GMT -5
Let's be honest though, Eli is a dropped miraculous catch or completed botched sack away from Super Bowl obscurity. It's not like he threw the whole team on his back like a John Elway or Joe Montana. I think you might have the Giants fanboy blinders on a little about Eli. I don't think Romo will ever surpass Staubach or even Aikman. I wouldn't put him in the upper echelon of current quarterbacks either. Even I can admit that and I'm one of Romo's biggest fans. As for Eli having the leadership intangibles...no. I don't effing think so. But still, a Superbowl winning drive is a Superbowl winning drive. I can admit that he plays like absolute trash some games, (Eagles playoff game, Browns game), but I think this year is going to be a step up year for Both Romo and Eli. Neither of them have their go to receiver. |
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Post by bad guy™ on Jul 19, 2009 16:34:19 GMT -5
Let's be honest though, Eli is a dropped miraculous catch or completed botched sack away from Super Bowl obscurity. It's not like he threw the whole team on his back like a John Elway or Joe Montana. I think you might have the Giants fanboy blinders on a little about Eli. I don't think Romo will ever surpass Staubach or even Aikman. I wouldn't put him in the upper echelon of current quarterbacks either. Even I can admit that and I'm one of Romo's biggest fans. As for Eli having the leadership intangibles...no. I don't effing think so. But still, a Superbowl winning drive is a Superbowl winning drive. I can admit that he plays like absolute trash some games, (Eagles playoff game, Browns game), but I think this year is going to be a step up year for Both Romo and Eli. Neither of them have their go to receiver. Ok so, if I am reading what you are saying right, a Super Bowl winning drive also makes a QB great also? I mean, if that is the case then Roethlisberger, Theismann, Hostetler, and Eli must be some of the greatest of all time.  |
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Post by Bubba Ray DJ on Jul 19, 2009 16:36:20 GMT -5
Let's be honest though, Eli is a dropped miraculous catch or completed botched sack away from Super Bowl obscurity. It's not like he threw the whole team on his back like a John Elway or Joe Montana. I think you might have the Giants fanboy blinders on a little about Eli. I don't think Romo will ever surpass Staubach or even Aikman. I wouldn't put him in the upper echelon of current quarterbacks either. Even I can admit that and I'm one of Romo's biggest fans. As for Eli having the leadership intangibles...no. I don't effing think so. But still, a Superbowl winning drive is a Superbowl winning drive. I can admit that he plays like absolute trash some games, (Eagles playoff game, Browns game), but I think this year is going to be a step up year for Both Romo and Eli. Neither of them have their go to receiver. With no Plaxico you are going to see Eli have one of the worst seasons of his career. Quote it. It happened late last season and it's going to continue this year. |
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Post by King Bálor (CM)™ on Jul 19, 2009 16:43:01 GMT -5
But still, a Superbowl winning drive is a Superbowl winning drive. I can admit that he plays like absolute trash some games, (Eagles playoff game, Browns game), but I think this year is going to be a step up year for Both Romo and Eli. Neither of them have their go to receiver. With no Plaxico you are going to see Eli have one of the worst seasons of his career. Quote it. It happened late last season and it's going to continue this year. I agree. But the Giants will surround him with talent and eventually his stats will pick back up. |
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Post by sonstuds on Jul 19, 2009 16:43:09 GMT -5
Eli might not be the best statistical quarterback, but in terms of leadership and intangibles, he's way up there. Wasn't it only two years ago Tiki Barber was on TV saying Eli wasn't a team leader? |
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Post by captain master talbot on Jul 19, 2009 18:57:48 GMT -5
Eli might not be the best statistical quarterback, but in terms of leadership and intangibles, he's way up there. Wasn't it only two years ago Tiki Barber was on TV saying Eli wasn't a team leader? Yea then the year after he retired, they won the Super Bowl. Tiki is irrelevant. Alright Bubba, I'm going to quote you. What you're saying is that Eli Manning is going to have: A passer rating under 73.9Less than 3238 yards passingLess than 21 Passing TDsMore than 20 INTsand a completion percentage under 52.8%So his statline will be atleast this: CP: 52.7% 3237 YDS 20 TD 21 INT 73.8 Those are his lowest totals for each full season he's played. If he is going to have his worse statistical season yet, then he is going to be worse in each of those categories. That's what you're saying. I'm going to bookmark this thread, and when the year's over, and Eli has thrown for 3400 yards, 23 TDs, 10 picks and with 65% completion, I'm going to quote this post and mock you for the entire offseason.  |
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Post by The Best on Jul 19, 2009 20:03:10 GMT -5
Oh snap we got ourselves a bet going.
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Post by doogle on Jul 19, 2009 22:34:31 GMT -5
it helps when you can loft airballs to a 7 foot receiver
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Post by Bubba Ray DJ on Jul 19, 2009 22:49:00 GMT -5
I never said he'll have the worst...I just said he'll have ONE of the worst seasons of his career. That being said I wouldn't be surprised if his numbers were somewhere around what you posted.
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Post by captain master talbot on Jul 19, 2009 22:51:44 GMT -5
I never said he'll have the worst...I just said he'll have ONE of the worst seasons of his career. That being said I wouldn't be surprised if his numbers were somewhere around what you posted.  Honestly, I'm not too worried about the offense. The running game should be top 5 again, and our defense will be sick. |
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Post by Kliquid on Jul 20, 2009 0:13:26 GMT -5
Let's put it this way -- Eli's not "there" to 'make those plays' if his defense isn't so good... And by 'making plays', I mean randomly throwing the ball in the air, TERRIBLY and having his WR make a miraculous catch.
It also helps that the Giants have an excellent offensive line and a great running game.
To put it simply, Eli's not a great leader because, well, he's not asked to lead.
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Post by The Best on Jul 20, 2009 8:39:03 GMT -5
I never said he'll have the worst...I just said he'll have ONE of the worst seasons of his career. That being said I wouldn't be surprised if his numbers were somewhere around what you posted. Honestly, I'm not too worried about the offense. The running game should be top 5 again, and our defense will be sick. Exactly my thoughts, barring injuries of course. |
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Post by King Bálor (CM)™ on Jul 20, 2009 14:54:00 GMT -5
Let's put it this way -- Eli's not "there" to 'make those plays' if his defense isn't so good... And by 'making plays', I mean randomly throwing the ball in the air, TERRIBLY and having his WR make a miraculous catch. It also helps that the Giants have an excellent offensive line and a great running game. To put it simply, Eli's not a great leader because, well, he's not asked to lead. But the QB is always needed to lead, unless there is a strong enough presence from another player, which rarely happens. In the offensive huddle, who is leading them? Who is gonna make the change at the line if there is a defensive switch, they find a whole in the secondary, etc? Its Eli. Eli is the one that is charge of making those decisions. |
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wakeman
Superstar
Joined on: Sept 18, 2005 1:47:05 GMT -5
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Post by wakeman on Jul 20, 2009 15:25:25 GMT -5
I have to agree with those on Eli's side. Take away the Super Bowl win, and he's pretty average, but I'd still rather have him on my team than Tony Romo. Remember the year the Giants won the Super Bowl? Forget the Super Bowl itself and even the Packers game in the NFC championship. Think back to the game when the Giants went into Texas Stadium and beat a Cowboys team that on paper, should've won that game. I remember Tony Romo looking like someone who never stepped on a football field at the end of the game when, as bad as they'd played, they still had a chance to win. Then he throws an INT in the end zone to seal the deal. That's Tony Romo. He's always gonna be a guy who has big numbers (probably not as much without TO) but he's never gonna win a thing.
I'll take Eli over Romo any day without even thinking twice.
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Post by bad guy™ on Jul 20, 2009 15:50:23 GMT -5
I think of it this way. It could have been anyone in Eli's place at SB 42. Russell could have been the Giants QB for crying out loud, and the end result would most likely be the same. Why? Because it wasn't the QB of the Giants that won them the game, it was the supporting cast (including the defense).
Just saying.
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