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Post by Planktung on Mar 14, 2015 11:53:02 GMT -5
5 pages of people saying the same thing they said in the last Roman Reigns topic, and the one before that, and the one before that. How many times do we need to hear the same people saying 'I like Roman Reigns but he's not ready for a WrestleMania main event yet'? me, I think that has been established lol. Aside from that, I keep seeing Dolph Ziggler being mentioned and I don't think he's good enough either. I'm a big fan and I'd be fine with him getting an opportunity like Reigns is getting right now (I'd be fine with a lot of guys getting that opportunity in fact), but he's not exactly anything special either. Maybe if fans consistently put more effort into blowing the roof off for Ziggler than crapping on Reigns, he might actually get that push we want him to get. But I've noticed in recent times, these fans focus on the negatives. They'd much rather boo the crap out of stuff they don't like than really get behind stuff they do like, and that's half the problem. They pushed Reigns because he was ing popular over the last year and a half. Simple as. If fans want a Ziggler or an Ambrose to get attention, half-assed attempts at supporting them aren't gonna show that. Reigns became popular because WWE was pushing him. And really, Ziggler and Ambrose get some of the most love from audiences. Even in the Royal Rumble match when it all went to hell halfway through, the crowd made sure to pop for the two of them. When WWE absolutely has their mind made up on something, there's very little that we, the fans, can do about it. It doesn't matter who we boo or support.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 14, 2015 12:07:58 GMT -5
5 pages of people saying the same thing they said in the last Roman Reigns topic, and the one before that, and the one before that. How many times do we need to hear the same people saying 'I like Roman Reigns but he's not ready for a WrestleMania main event yet'? me, I think that has been established lol. Aside from that, I keep seeing Dolph Ziggler being mentioned and I don't think he's good enough either. I'm a big fan and I'd be fine with him getting an opportunity like Reigns is getting right now (I'd be fine with a lot of guys getting that opportunity in fact), but he's not exactly anything special either. Maybe if fans consistently put more effort into blowing the roof off for Ziggler than crapping on Reigns, he might actually get that push we want him to get. But I've noticed in recent times, these fans focus on the negatives. They'd much rather boo the crap out of stuff they don't like than really get behind stuff they do like, and that's half the problem. They pushed Reigns because he was ing popular over the last year and a half. Simple as. If fans want a Ziggler or an Ambrose to get attention, half-assed attempts at supporting them aren't gonna show that. Reigns became popular because WWE was pushing him. And really, Ziggler and Ambrose get some of the most love from audiences. Even in the Royal Rumble match when it all went to hell halfway through, the crowd made sure to pop for the two of them. When WWE absolutely has their mind made up on something, there's very little that we, the fans, can do about it. It doesn't matter who we boo or support. Disagree lol. He's getting a bigger push now and he's less popular. So the conclusion that popularity comes from a push is an odd one in this circumstance. The big singles push has come as a result of his popularity while in the Shield (probably the standout in the Shield in the group's final months, popularity wise). I agree that WWE sticks to their guns but I don't see the problem with it. They'd look stupid if they kept cutting off pushes and scrapping plans constantly because of fickle fan reception. It already happened last year, and they worked it into the plot really well, but this year going the same route wouldn't have came across the same way; it would've been obvious the plans were changed based on a hostile reaction. At the end of the day WWE tell a story, they put out a product and we decide if we like it. That doesn't mean they have to immediately rework the whole thing to suit a fanbase whose tastes are ever-changing and truthfully, hard to keep up with. If fans stuck to getting behind the likes of Ziggler and Ambrose, rather than having a cynical attitude towards their situations and resigning to the fact that their careers are doomed, they'd probably have gotten a big push by now. There's still time, too.
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Post by Planktung on Mar 14, 2015 12:15:46 GMT -5
Reigns became popular because WWE was pushing him. And really, Ziggler and Ambrose get some of the most love from audiences. Even in the Royal Rumble match when it all went to hell halfway through, the crowd made sure to pop for the two of them. When WWE absolutely has their mind made up on something, there's very little that we, the fans, can do about it. It doesn't matter who we boo or support. Disagree lol. He's getting a bigger push now and he's less popular. So the conclusion that popularity comes from a push is an odd one in this circumstance. The big singles push has come as a result of his popularity while in the Shield (probably the standout in the Shield in the group's final months, popularity wise). I agree that WWE sticks to their guns but I don't see the problem with it. They'd look stupid if they kept cutting off pushes and scrapping plans constantly because of fickle fan reception. It already happened last year, and they worked it into the plot really well, but this year going the same route wouldn't have came across the same way; it would've been obvious the plans were changed based on a hostile reaction. At the end of the day WWE tell a story, they put out a product and we decide if we like it. That doesn't mean they have to immediately rework the whole thing to suit a fanbase whose tastes are ever-changing and truthfully, hard to keep up with. If fans stuck to getting behind the likes of Ziggler and Ambrose, rather than having a cynical attitude towards their situations and resigning to the fact that their careers are doomed, they'd probably have gotten a big push by now. There's still time, too. Reigns' popularity has only diminished in the realm of the Internet. Just from observations, I would say that he's still popular with casual viewers. But when he was the one who WWE went out of their way to make stand out in The Shield (Survivor Series 2013 eliminations, only one to beat CM Punk during their rivalry, Royal Rumble 2014 performance, got the winning pinfalls in both matches against Evolution), of course they're going to gravitate towards him.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 14, 2015 12:38:45 GMT -5
Disagree lol. He's getting a bigger push now and he's less popular. So the conclusion that popularity comes from a push is an odd one in this circumstance. The big singles push has come as a result of his popularity while in the Shield (probably the standout in the Shield in the group's final months, popularity wise). I agree that WWE sticks to their guns but I don't see the problem with it. They'd look stupid if they kept cutting off pushes and scrapping plans constantly because of fickle fan reception. It already happened last year, and they worked it into the plot really well, but this year going the same route wouldn't have came across the same way; it would've been obvious the plans were changed based on a hostile reaction. At the end of the day WWE tell a story, they put out a product and we decide if we like it. That doesn't mean they have to immediately rework the whole thing to suit a fanbase whose tastes are ever-changing and truthfully, hard to keep up with. If fans stuck to getting behind the likes of Ziggler and Ambrose, rather than having a cynical attitude towards their situations and resigning to the fact that their careers are doomed, they'd probably have gotten a big push by now. There's still time, too. Reigns' popularity has only diminished in the realm of the Internet. Just from observations, I would say that he's still popular with casual viewers. But when he was the one who WWE went out of their way to make stand out in The Shield (Survivor Series 2013 eliminations, only one to beat CM Punk during their rivalry, Royal Rumble 2014 performance, got the winning pinfalls in both matches against Evolution), of course they're going to gravitate towards him. I guess so. I think it hasn't helped that aspects that fans loved about him during that period don't exist now: the more occasional act of busting out a Superman Punch or the big Basement Dropkick, which he has since used 37,142 times; being a man of few words who lets the slapping-opponents-around do the talking, while over the last few months he's taken to reciting nursery rhymes and being a clown; generally the one-track mind he had, his only focus being tearing s*** up, seems to be gone now. He had an aura about him which I think has been taken away by the nature of his singles push. I don't think it's fair to say that WWE making him break records and win a lot is why he was so popular for a while. As I said before, WWE are, to quote you, still 'going out of their way' to make him stand out now but they have gone about it badly and a good portion of fans have been put off of him because of it. I attribute Reigns' popularity over the last year or two to a combination of good handling on WWE's part and top-drawer perfomances on his part. You can't just say he was popular because WWE went of their way to make him popular, because they've been doing that on an even bigger scale in the last few months and he isn't as popular, simple as that.
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Post by Chip on Mar 14, 2015 14:51:06 GMT -5
Reigns was getting really GREAT crowd reactions a year ago. Hell he broke Kane's rumble elimination record and most people were like "cool!"...But since the WWE went completely "ReignswinsLoL" and turned him into mini-Cena, people starte realizing that instead of a cool badass good guy we're just gonna get 5 signature moves, 1-2-3 ReignswinsLoL. and everyone is just sick of that.
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Post by IRS on Mar 14, 2015 15:09:00 GMT -5
Reigns was over a year ago because WWE did a great job of covering his flaws. Dean and Seth did the heavy-lifting during the matches, Reigns came in and did his big moves, and that got him over.
Once he broke out on his own, he just became more and more exposed. His flaws on the mic, his greenness in the ring; and instead of realizing this, and pumping the breaks on the push, WWE decided to push even harder.
This all could've been easily avoided if they gave Roman the first win over Rusev, and let him develop another year. Hell, if they wanted they could've done Rollins/Reigns at SS if they didn't want to wait that long. Instead, they rushed it, and it's gonna blow up with n their faces.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 14, 2015 16:21:41 GMT -5
Reigns was over a year ago because WWE did a great job of covering his flaws. Dean and Seth did the heavy-lifting during the matches, Reigns came in and did his big moves, and that got him over. Once he broke out on his own, he just became more and more exposed. His flaws on the mic, his greenness in the ring; and instead of realizing this, and pumping the breaks on the push, WWE decided to push even harder. This all could've been easily avoided if they gave Roman the first win over Rusev, and let him develop another year. Hell, if they wanted they could've done Rollins/Reigns at SS if they didn't want to wait that long. Instead, they rushed it, and it's gonna blow up with n their faces. This x100. Thing is, with guys like John Cena, Batista and to a lesser extent Randy Orton, they were built up for a few years before winning the big one. With Reigns, he was covered by Seth Rollins and Dean Ambrose during their run as the Shield, and since they split he somehow won Superstar of the Year after being out for most of the year with an injury, and he's won a grand total of two singles matches on PPV since the Shield split and were supposed to buy him as a guy who can beat Lesnar for the title? If Ziggler or Ambrose won the Rumble there wouldnt nearly be the backlash there is now. They should have spent this year building Reigns up, getting him better at promo's and everything and then have him win it next year.
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Post by IRS on Mar 14, 2015 16:36:34 GMT -5
Reigns was over a year ago because WWE did a great job of covering his flaws. Dean and Seth did the heavy-lifting during the matches, Reigns came in and did his big moves, and that got him over. Once he broke out on his own, he just became more and more exposed. His flaws on the mic, his greenness in the ring; and instead of realizing this, and pumping the breaks on the push, WWE decided to push even harder. This all could've been easily avoided if they gave Roman the first win over Rusev, and let him develop another year. Hell, if they wanted they could've done Rollins/Reigns at SS if they didn't want to wait that long. Instead, they rushed it, and it's gonna blow up with n their faces. This x100. Thing is, with guys like John Cena, Batista and to a lesser extent Randy Orton, they were built up for a few years before winning the big one. With Reigns, he was covered by Seth Rollins and Dean Ambrose during their run as the Shield, and since they split he somehow won Superstar of the Year after being out for most of the year with an injury, and he's won a grand total of two singles matches on PPV since the Shield split and were supposed to buy him as a guy who can beat Lesnar for the title? If Ziggler or Ambrose won the Rumble there wouldnt nearly be the backlash there is now. They should have spent this year building Reigns up, getting him better at promo's and everything and then have him win it next year. For me, it's not only "why should I buy that he can beat Lesnar", but also, why am I supposed to be invested in his story, and WANT him to beat Lesnar. From the second The Shield split, he didn't give a crap about revenge on Seth, and he went straight to the WWE Title picture. Then he had a boring feud with Orton, and he had the hernia. While he's gone Ambrose, Rollins, and Ziggler prove themselves as stars. Roman returns, and Ambrose and Ziggler are immediately shoved aside so he can get a rocket shoved up his ass. All they did is forgotten, and swept under the rug. Now you add Bryan into the equation... a guy who is the most over guy in the company, who never lost the title, and just came back from a near career-ending injury. Everyone is invested on that story, and it writes itself. But even if they felt he needed more time to settle-in after returning, you still had 2 other guys fans were far more attached to, and are far more prepared for that rub. Instead you try to 'Rocky Maivia' Reigns. It was just poor decision making in every aspect.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 15, 2015 6:06:12 GMT -5
Ziggler is a believable threat to Lesnar?
lol
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Post by Deleted on Mar 15, 2015 6:32:11 GMT -5
The thing that annoys me most about Roman hate is the inconsistency on why he sucks, why he shouldn't Main Event etc.
First it's because he's not a believable threat to Brock, then he gets built up and now it's the fact that he's being forced down people's throats. The weird part is that the two ideas on why it's wrong fluctuate at different times. Sometimes excuse #1 is used, other times #2 is used.
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Post by The Kevstaaa on Mar 15, 2015 8:33:31 GMT -5
The thing that annoys me most about Roman hate is the inconsistency on why he sucks, why he shouldn't Main Event etc. First it's because he's not a believable threat to Brock, then he gets built up and now it's the fact that he's being forced down people's throats. The weird part is that the two ideas on why it's wrong fluctuate at different times. Sometimes excuse #1 is used, other times #2 is used. I don't know about who specifically did that, but for me it's kind of both. He's not a believable threat to Brock. You said he's been built up but he hasn't really. He has lost to Big Show and Seth Rollins. Even with some distractions, how are we supposed to believe that's enough to beat the guy who broke the streak and annihilated John Cena? Hell, let's say I'm 100% behind Roman Reigns as the guy to get pushed right now. The WWE has done a pretty piss poor job of making him believable. Even in the Royal Rumble, he basically took a nap in the corner while everyone else did their thing. It has been pretty horribly booked.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 15, 2015 9:04:07 GMT -5
Reigns was over a year ago because WWE did a great job of covering his flaws. Dean and Seth did the heavy-lifting during the matches, Reigns came in and did his big moves, and that got him over. Once he broke out on his own, he just became more and more exposed. His flaws on the mic, his greenness in the ring; and instead of realizing this, and pumping the breaks on the push, WWE decided to push even harder. This all could've been easily avoided if they gave Roman the first win over Rusev, and let him develop another year. Hell, if they wanted they could've done Rollins/Reigns at SS if they didn't want to wait that long. Instead, they rushed it, and it's gonna blow up with n their faces. This x100. Thing is, with guys like John Cena, Batista and to a lesser extent Randy Orton, they were built up for a few years before winning the big one. With Reigns, he was covered by Seth Rollins and Dean Ambrose during their run as the Shield, and since they split he somehow won Superstar of the Year after being out for most of the year with an injury, and he's won a grand total of two singles matches on PPV since the Shield split and were supposed to buy him as a guy who can beat Lesnar for the title? If Ziggler or Ambrose won the Rumble there wouldnt nearly be the backlash there is now. They should have spent this year building Reigns up, getting him better at promo's and everything and then have him win it next year. But take a look at who's there champion back in 2002 it only took lesnar a few months to become WWE Champion and he won no titles before that if anyone was shoved down our throats it was definitely him at that.He may have been build up much better now but I Really don't see the big problem on reigns beating lesnar.
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Post by IRS on Mar 15, 2015 12:57:41 GMT -5
This x100. Thing is, with guys like John Cena, Batista and to a lesser extent Randy Orton, they were built up for a few years before winning the big one. With Reigns, he was covered by Seth Rollins and Dean Ambrose during their run as the Shield, and since they split he somehow won Superstar of the Year after being out for most of the year with an injury, and he's won a grand total of two singles matches on PPV since the Shield split and were supposed to buy him as a guy who can beat Lesnar for the title? If Ziggler or Ambrose won the Rumble there wouldnt nearly be the backlash there is now. They should have spent this year building Reigns up, getting him better at promo's and everything and then have him win it next year. But take a look at who's there champion back in 2002 it only took lesnar a few months to become WWE Champion and he won no titles before that if anyone was shoved down our throats it was definitely him at that.He may have been build up much better now but I Really don't see the big problem on reigns beating lesnar. Brock was built 1000000000x better than Roman, dude. Before he beat Rock, he destroyed everyone he faced - including Hogan, and wasn't cutting crappy promos about nursery rhymes. Brock looked like a legit threat going into that title match; Reigns doesn't.
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Post by The Kevstaaa on Mar 15, 2015 13:02:34 GMT -5
This x100. Thing is, with guys like John Cena, Batista and to a lesser extent Randy Orton, they were built up for a few years before winning the big one. With Reigns, he was covered by Seth Rollins and Dean Ambrose during their run as the Shield, and since they split he somehow won Superstar of the Year after being out for most of the year with an injury, and he's won a grand total of two singles matches on PPV since the Shield split and were supposed to buy him as a guy who can beat Lesnar for the title? If Ziggler or Ambrose won the Rumble there wouldnt nearly be the backlash there is now. They should have spent this year building Reigns up, getting him better at promo's and everything and then have him win it next year. But take a look at who's there champion back in 2002 it only took lesnar a few months to become WWE Champion and he won no titles before that if anyone was shoved down our throats it was definitely him at that.He may have been build up much better now but I Really don't see the big problem on reigns beating lesnar. I've always said that Brock was the only guy that I felt worked for not having won midcard titles. He was already fantastic by the time he got called up and was so dominant that he didn't need to win those other titles.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 15, 2015 13:07:37 GMT -5
Lesnars victory over UT in HIAC totally put him over the top. It was totally credible that he beat UT into paste in that match.
f*ck it I'm off to watch it now
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Post by cordless2016 on Mar 15, 2015 13:08:39 GMT -5
The Shield were over a year ago, no Reigns by himself per say. The WWE did an amazing job hiding his weaknesses by letting Dean do the talking and Seth the in-ring work. Yes fans were into the big "badass" character Reigns gave off but it became apparent after WM30 that the wwe decided to give Reigns the Cena-push. Even before The Shid broke up Roman was beginning to be put front and center of the group and was even talking when Dean had been portrayed as the "leader" of the team.
Had the wwe let the fans naturally get invested in Roman he wouldn't be getting this backlash. Look at Dean. It was clear he was an afterthought in the WWEs booking plans but because he was able to develope his own unique character and was constantly fighting an uphill battle the fans got behind him. Dolph and Bryan are portrayed as the underdogs. This combined with the blatant fact the WWE doesn't want to push them despite the fans backing of them makes the fans invest in them.
And to simply say its the super push that is causing the backlash is only partially true. Seth has received an arguably far bigger push yet the fans love him because he is ready for this spot. It's a combo of the super-push and the fact that Reigns is nowhere near ready for the top spot that fans can't stand him.
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Post by TurboEddie on Mar 15, 2015 17:21:27 GMT -5
Roman Reigns speaks... terribly.
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Post by Planktung on Mar 15, 2015 17:27:31 GMT -5
This x100. Thing is, with guys like John Cena, Batista and to a lesser extent Randy Orton, they were built up for a few years before winning the big one. With Reigns, he was covered by Seth Rollins and Dean Ambrose during their run as the Shield, and since they split he somehow won Superstar of the Year after being out for most of the year with an injury, and he's won a grand total of two singles matches on PPV since the Shield split and were supposed to buy him as a guy who can beat Lesnar for the title? If Ziggler or Ambrose won the Rumble there wouldnt nearly be the backlash there is now. They should have spent this year building Reigns up, getting him better at promo's and everything and then have him win it next year. But take a look at who's there champion back in 2002 it only took lesnar a few months to become WWE Champion and he won no titles before that if anyone was shoved down our throats it was definitely him at that.He may have been build up much better now but I Really don't see the big problem on reigns beating lesnar. If you don't see the problem with Roman Reigns beating Brock Lesnar in two weeks' time, you either haven't been watching the product or just can't overlook your fandom for Mr. OOOAHHH.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 15, 2015 18:19:21 GMT -5
This x100. Thing is, with guys like John Cena, Batista and to a lesser extent Randy Orton, they were built up for a few years before winning the big one. With Reigns, he was covered by Seth Rollins and Dean Ambrose during their run as the Shield, and since they split he somehow won Superstar of the Year after being out for most of the year with an injury, and he's won a grand total of two singles matches on PPV since the Shield split and were supposed to buy him as a guy who can beat Lesnar for the title? If Ziggler or Ambrose won the Rumble there wouldnt nearly be the backlash there is now. They should have spent this year building Reigns up, getting him better at promo's and everything and then have him win it next year. But take a look at who's there champion back in 2002 it only took lesnar a few months to become WWE Champion and he won no titles before that if anyone was shoved down our throats it was definitely him at that.He may have been build up much better now but I Really don't see the big problem on reigns beating lesnar. But take a look at who's there champion back in 2002 it only took lesnar a few months to become WWE Champion and he won no titles before that if anyone was shoved down our throats it was definitely him at that.He may have been build up much better now but I Really don't see the big problem on reigns beating lesnar. Brock was built 1000000000x better than Roman, dude. Before he beat Rock, he destroyed everyone he faced - including Hogan, and wasn't cutting crappy promos about nursery rhymes. Brock looked like a legit threat going into that title match; Reigns doesn't. I couldn't have said it any better to be honest.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 15, 2015 18:34:08 GMT -5
But take a look at who's there champion back in 2002 it only took lesnar a few months to become WWE Champion and he won no titles before that if anyone was shoved down our throats it was definitely him at that.He may have been build up much better now but I Really don't see the big problem on reigns beating lesnar. If you don't see the problem with Roman Reigns beating Brock Lesnar in two weeks' time, you either haven't been watching the product or just can't overlook your fandom for Mr. OOOAHHH. No I actually am watching the product and I think roman is doing fine and this isn't me being a Roman Reigns fan.He hasn't done anything for me to call him out on everything hes done has been passable in my eyes.
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