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Post by The-Rock on Apr 7, 2020 0:23:57 GMT -5
At the time I didn't get the decision, and given how much longer Undertaker has continued to perform...I still don't get how Brock ending the streak was the right decision. I don't think Brock needed that victory to turn into what he ultimately became. It tainted Undertaker's character and legacy more than it elevated Brock in the long run. It's kind of a right of passage to lose to the Undertaker at WrestleMania...and makes subsequent loses by other current stars (Bray, Styles, Shane) of really no importance.
Most probably don't remember, but the streak didn't really become a talked about thing or storyline until WM 21 with randy orton...who at the time (except for being injured) was the type of wrestler who would most benefit from ending the streak.
After that it title vs. streak (both with Batista and Edge) which was fine the first time...but with edge it was really just same thing from the year before with a different character.
Then the next big thing was streak vs. career and all the grudge matches with HBK and HHH.
Wm 29 operated how it's meant to be used, great storytelling with a guy who goes the distance but loses in CM Punk.
I also think if you let Undertaker beat Lesnar at WM 30, have HHH subject sting to face Undertaker...then do Sting vs. Undertaker at WM 31...that keeps Sting in a far better light for his WWE career in that he lost to the Undertaker trying to beat the streak. It still says WWE >>> WCW but in a way that gives the fans something they want.
The shane match would have been a hell of a lot more interesting if it was company vs. streak.
Then at WM 33, have Reigns go the distance and lose.
WM 34 that 10-second novelty match of Undertaker continuing the streak against Cena.
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Post by Joey Cush on Apr 7, 2020 0:53:41 GMT -5
Brock ending the streak could have been a great move if Brock was actually all in with the company. Instead, hes used as a tool to occasionally destroy everyone and then put over Roman and now Drew in the end.
Looking back at Summer Slam 2014, what Brock did to Cena would have made more sense if he lost to Undertaker at Mania. That loss could have set Brock off and thats why he killed Cena when he came back for Summer Slam. Granted, that was supposed to be Bryan that Brock killed so it's irrelevant I suppose.
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Post by hbkjason on Apr 7, 2020 2:39:35 GMT -5
I have always said that the WWE pissed away the streak for the five minutes of shock value that followed. Brock Lesnar looked no better for ending the streak at all! He was already a made man, main event star, a monster. Ending the streak did nothing for his character whatsoever. Also, now we have fans who do a forced look of shock when anything remotely "controversial" happens trying to get on camera!
The streak was one of the last real good things left in wrestling and they ended it for what? While I would have preferred Undertaker be able to ride off into the sunset. In hindsight, letting Randy Orton end it at WrestleMania 21 would have been far better than the way it ended with Brock.
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Post by LK3 on Apr 7, 2020 3:10:39 GMT -5
On one hand Orton beating him at 21 would've been amazing, but who knows what happens with Taker after that. Nothing is going to happen exactly the same way after that. 25, 26, 27, and 28 don't happen the way they did. The streak may not have ended in a good way, but it was probably better regardless that it lasted as long as it did.
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Warriah'
Main Eventer
Joined on: Dec 22, 2019 19:46:02 GMT -5
Posts: 3,256
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Post by Warriah' on Apr 7, 2020 5:43:36 GMT -5
The streak never should have ended. It'd have either gone to someone like Brock who didn't need it, or an unproven guy who may have never amounted to anything.
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Post by shanieomaniac on Apr 7, 2020 6:07:34 GMT -5
Brock didn't need to be the streak-ender to make him a monster. He was already a monster. Having the Deadman beat him would have just been motivation to get meaner.
I fully agree that the past few years of WM matches would have been a world better if the streak was still intact.
That said, if the Streak hadn't ended, there's no way that Roman would have beaten him. No chance in hell, as they say. Actually, even with the streak being over, that still leaves a seriously bitter taste In my mouth, and I honestly like Roman. I think he's a great guy. He's an awesome roll model and inspiration to us all. However, I wouldn't really call him "Face of the Brand" material like they've been trying to make him lately. It all seems rather forced, IMHO. So no, Streak or no streak, Roman never should have beaten Taker. Especially when you realize the implication that with all the people that 'Taker has put down at WM, you are saying Roman is as big a force as Brock, and I don't think anyone would ever believe that.
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Post by keegandimitrijevic01 on Apr 7, 2020 8:07:36 GMT -5
I personally don't think the streak should've ended. I thought it was always the first or second highest drawing point of every WrestleMania, and it still feels weird to have the streak match because there was always so much anticipation leading into the match. I thought it was too significant to end, and Brock didn't need it in general. I still think to this day, Vince only broke the streak to generate buzz for the new WWE Network and have people talk about something else other than Daniel Bryan's win
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Post by LA Times on Apr 7, 2020 8:47:04 GMT -5
The Wrestlemania streak should end, but only if that match was going to be the Undertaker's final match. The 2 wrestlers who shouldve ended it if that was the case would be John Cena (if they were going to go through with a heel turn for him) or Roman Reigns.
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Post by Valbroski on Apr 7, 2020 9:23:07 GMT -5
I’m just glad it wasn’t Shane that ended it. I would of preferred for the streak to never be beaten but at least it was a credible finish.
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Post by K5 on Apr 7, 2020 9:40:43 GMT -5
I’m totally good with it. was hard fought, taker legit got beat up in the match and it was the clear signs of the beginning of the end.
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Post by Back to the Codyverse on Apr 7, 2020 10:12:53 GMT -5
It never should’ve ended. He should be 27-0. He can roll out on the bike answering the call of the challenge. Defending the streak. If it were to end, have it be his final match and be against someone you can get at least 10 years out of.
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Post by ~ Cymru ~ on Apr 7, 2020 10:52:20 GMT -5
I feel the same, the conspiracy theorist in me thinks maybe he was meant to go over Brock but being knocked dopey in the early part of the match he was too out of it to kick out of the pin attempt and lost the match on accident. Hence why brocks music didn't play straight away. This knocked his confidence, and the match with Goldberg didn't do him any favours. The mania 36 match seemed like a way to move on from the dead man gimmick as it had taken a pounding in the last few years and lost some credibility.
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Post by shanieomaniac on Apr 7, 2020 11:24:32 GMT -5
I feel the same, the conspiracy theorist in me thinks maybe he was meant to go over Brock but being knocked dopey in the early part of the match he was too out of it to kick out of the pin attempt and lost the match on accident. Hence why brocks music didn't play straight away. This knocked his confidence, and the match with Goldberg didn't do him any favours. The mania 36 match seemed like a way to move on from the dead man gimmick as it had taken a pounding in the last few years and lost some credibility. I've heard people bring this up on facebook, and my counter point is this. When he lost, they immediately put a graphic up on the trons that read 21-1. It was stylized and obviously pre-designed. If he wasn't meant to lose, they wouldn't have had that ready to go.
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Post by rkmo: Garbage Collector on Apr 7, 2020 11:44:59 GMT -5
My fantasy booking, beginning in 2013 and having the convenience of hindsight:
WM 29: have the Brock Lesnar match here and save us from Trips-Lesnar. Have to sacrifice the Punk match, but perhaps inserting him in the main event doesn't result in such the burnt bridge and can be revisited on a later date (not gonna speculate on when/if that would happen, for brevity). And Brock doesn't win here.
WM 30: Bray Wyatt. Huge mistake not having that match here. Atmosphere was perfect. Wyatt was as hot as he could have been. Could actually have a legit build and let it be more than "how is Taker gonna be?" since the Streak would still be there. Having Harper and Rowan at ringside lends credibility that Bray can get the win as a rookie. I'm gonna project Bray isn't gonna suffer an ankle injury during the walkthrough. Wyatt proves to be legit, but not enough.
WM 31: Plenty of tweaking needed on this card, the bottom of modern Manias for me. Aside from the obligatory Sting matchup, I have always wanted John Cena in this spot. Cena was just being nudged toward the other side of that cliff, so why not. Rusev doesn't get cut off here, and Cena doesn't sully Americans' image by proving true every darn thing Rusev had been saying. More of a match than the actual 2018 squash, but result stays the same.
WM 32: Said it recently on here, swap Brock and Taker. Let Dean Ambrose pull more from the Deadman in the "No Holds Barred" Street Fight, and try to pay Lesnar enough to sell for Shane lmao
WM 33: If Sting was in 2015, squeeze Cena in here to save us from King's insipid commentary and the engagement fiasco. If not, have a good old-fashioned squash with Baron Corbin. Corbin has the mouth to draw heat and get a pop when he gets decimated.
WM 34: Move the Reigns match back a year. Not a fan of their impromptu No Holds Barred stip, but since it is a crutch for both men, it's whatev to me. With the Streak still intact, there's at least no chance in hell Vince lets Da Big Dawg eat the heat here.
WM 35: When does the Streak end? Right here. Who gets the honors? Drew McIntyre. Has the proper shoulders to carry the weight. Has the in-ring ability to shield himself from the heat from smarks. Launches his resurrected career while also having the future ahead of him to make the achievement merely one of many.
*This also assumes Taker had enough respect for his nation's values and ideals to not accept blood money to grant good PR for a despotic ruler.
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Post by TheHitmanKid on Apr 7, 2020 12:01:10 GMT -5
The streak shouldnt have ended. It gave Undertaker such power that fans could believe that he only needed one match a year to prove he still got it.
Now it seems like he's a charity case. We dont need him to wrestle his Wrestlemania matches to prove he can lose. Especially after is second loss to Roman. Nobody is hyped up for Wrestlemania to see Undertaker wrestle anymore.
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Post by Decky on Apr 7, 2020 12:02:42 GMT -5
Taker should have retired at Mania 29. Shawn, Michael and Taker standing on the ramp should have been the last we ever seen of him. 21-0. Perfect.
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Post by greenjack1992 on Apr 7, 2020 13:47:57 GMT -5
People can say what they want about Brock, but when Undertaker was wrestling once a year and smashing through the roster, everyone said it was his mistique, he was a big enough star that it was right for him to do it blah, blah, blah. But, when Brock does exactly the same thing after a combined ten years on the WWE roster, he's thought of as some sort of piece of shit.
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Post by K5 on Apr 7, 2020 15:02:35 GMT -5
People can say what they want about Brock, but when Undertaker was wrestling once a year and smashing through the roster, everyone said it was his mistique, he was a big enough star that it was right for him to do it blah, blah, blah. But, when Brock does exactly the same thing after a combined ten years on the WWE roster, he's thought of as some sort of piece of crap. you’re really going to compare a guy who stayed true to the company for close to 30 years to a guy who took off after the business handed him absolutely everything it could within 2 years? sorry, but there is no room in comparison. if taker was capable of wrestling more he would’ve.
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Post by Rated [R] NinJa on Apr 7, 2020 15:11:47 GMT -5
He should’ve retired at 20-0 after the End of an Era match, end of. That being said I haven’t really been interested in anything he did from 2013-now until the Boneyard match, that was fantastic. Taker should have retired at Mania 29. Shawn, Michael and Taker standing on the ramp should have been the last we ever seen of him. 21-0. Perfect. That was WrestleMania 28 and it was 20-0.
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Post by hbkbigdaddycool on Apr 7, 2020 15:16:49 GMT -5
The Undertaker hasn't really been the same since he got old would also be a good headline for this thread.
The loss to Brock isn't the issue, the loss to Reigns isn't the issue, the problem is that Taker is just old now. His matches in the ring should go no more than 5 minutes.
The reason why the boneyard match worked so good was because it wasn't steady. It was like a movie so they got to stop during a lot of it. If all of Taker's matches were boneyard matches then he could easily do this for a few more years.
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