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Post by slappy on Mar 4, 2014 19:07:25 GMT -5
No. You should be able to leave your job if you want. Yeah, as a fan it may suck but sometimes you have to look at things not through the glasses of being a fan. Their bodies get broken down and for someone like Punk who doesn't get a lot of time off and takes nothing for the agony he must be in, I don't know how he lasted this long. Plus he was leaving in a few months anyway. He is not an "at will employee". He is a contracted independent contractor. He has a contract that requires him to A, B, and C. And one of those things is to appear, barring injury, at all of his appearances. Not doing so can get him sued. He forgoed his right to "leave his job when he wanted to" when he signed that WWE contract. He did not HAVE to sign with WWE. He could have stayed in indy wrestling or become a garbage man, accountant, pilot...whatever. He could have done other jobs that dont require a WWE contract. He signed it and accepted the terms. You and I both know 'independent contractor' is a misnomer. And how do we know he's not injured? He rarely has time off, he doesn't take pills for pain. So he's probably in excruciating pain. But yeah, let's trot out a guy whose body needs a long rest. We don't want Punk turning into a sober Kurt Angle. Wrestlers under contract leave while still under contract. They ask for their release. Do you complain about those who ask for their release? Kaitlyn, MVP and Maryse (among others) asked for their release. I don't see people saying they walked out on the fans. Why is this different than when a wrestler asks to be released?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2014 19:25:18 GMT -5
the mans 35 and he already had hip surgery. He has been working his butt off for people like all of you that misunderstand his abilities. I blame this all to all of you with your little yes movement. #bestmovementintheworld
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hbkowns
Main Eventer
Joined on: Aug 15, 2011 23:33:52 GMT -5
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Post by hbkowns on Mar 4, 2014 19:29:42 GMT -5
the mans 35 and he already had hip surgery. He has been working his butt off for people like all of you that misunderstand his abilities. I blame this all to all of you with your little yes movement. #bestmovementintheworld He really had hip surgery? When was this?
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Post by ICW on Mar 4, 2014 19:33:03 GMT -5
I'm not angry with him. I don't blame him in the slightest for leave this joke of a promotion.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2014 19:34:55 GMT -5
the mans 35 and he already had hip surgery. He has been working his butt off for people like all of you that misunderstand his abilities. I blame this all to all of you with your little yes movement. #bestmovementintheworld He really had hip surgery? When was this? sorry just read that he refused hip surgery and went to rehab. Still the mans been through a lot
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Post by ThugSuperstar on Mar 4, 2014 20:37:28 GMT -5
Not at all. I'm mad at the WWE for them letting things get this far in the first place with him. If I was him, I probably would've done the same thing. I said from day one that I applauded him for being the only guy to make a stand that the way things are being run right now is a total joke.
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Post by King Bálor (CM)™ on Mar 4, 2014 20:53:03 GMT -5
He is not an "at will employee". He is a contracted independent contractor. He has a contract that requires him to A, B, and C. And one of those things is to appear, barring injury, at all of his appearances. Not doing so can get him sued. He forgoed his right to "leave his job when he wanted to" when he signed that WWE contract. He did not HAVE to sign with WWE. He could have stayed in indy wrestling or become a garbage man, accountant, pilot...whatever. He could have done other jobs that dont require a WWE contract. He signed it and accepted the terms. You and I both know 'independent contractor' is a misnomer. And how do we know he's not injured? He rarely has time off, he doesn't take pills for pain. So he's probably in excruciating pain. But yeah, let's trot out a guy whose body needs a long rest. We don't want Punk turning into a sober Kurt Angle. Wrestlers under contract leave while still under contract. They ask for their release. Do you complain about those who ask for their release? Kaitlyn, MVP and Maryse (among others) asked for their release. I don't see people saying they walked out on the fans. Why is this different than when a wrestler asks to be released? Its not a misnomer. Its 100% fact. He is an independent contractor. He might have additional rules and regulations he is required to follow, but he is still an independent contractor. When I first started in the mortgage business, I was as well. But I couldnt do mortgages through another mortgage brokerage. I also had to sign a non compete clause. There are different variations to what is an independent contractor. Could he be battling injury? Absolutely. But he isnt home because he is too injured to wrestle. If he was, WWE would announce that. They dont remove him from the opening video and can him from Axxess and WW sessions cuz he is injured. We might not know all the details. But its pretty safe to say....Punk walked out on WWE. So please dont try and make that out as an excuse. Your next statement makes no sense. Wrestlers dont leave while under contract when they ask for their release. They ask for their release...AND THEN are no longer under contract. WWE has cleared them of their obligation and consider the contract completed. Also, if you notice there seems to be an exit strategy on these releases. Wrestler A doesnt walk into Raw and says I want my release and Vince gives it to them and they go home. Wrestler A makes the request. WWE plans an exit strategy and within a few weeks, that person is finally granted their release. It allows WWE to protect their product and tie up whatever loose ends it needs to with that talent and its internal and external obligations. Can fans be cheated? Yeah....I can see a fan feeling cheated. But the wrestler and the company have both agreed that they will seperate. No different than someone being injured.
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Post by slappy on Mar 4, 2014 21:12:06 GMT -5
You and I both know 'independent contractor' is a misnomer. And how do we know he's not injured? He rarely has time off, he doesn't take pills for pain. So he's probably in excruciating pain. But yeah, let's trot out a guy whose body needs a long rest. We don't want Punk turning into a sober Kurt Angle. Wrestlers under contract leave while still under contract. They ask for their release. Do you complain about those who ask for their release? Kaitlyn, MVP and Maryse (among others) asked for their release. I don't see people saying they walked out on the fans. Why is this different than when a wrestler asks to be released? Its not a misnomer. Its 100% fact. He is an independent contractor. He might have additional rules and regulations he is required to follow, but he is still an independent contractor. When I first started in the mortgage business, I was as well. But I couldnt do mortgages through another mortgage brokerage. I also had to sign a non compete clause. There are different variations to what is an independent contractor. Could he be battling injury? Absolutely. But he isnt home because he is too injured to wrestle. If he was, WWE would announce that. They dont remove him from the opening video and can him from Axxess and WW sessions cuz he is injured. We might not know all the details. But its pretty safe to say....Punk walked out on WWE. So please dont try and make that out as an excuse. Your next statement makes no sense. Wrestlers dont leave while under contract when they ask for their release. They ask for their release...AND THEN are no longer under contract. WWE has cleared them of their obligation and consider the contract completed. Also, if you notice there seems to be an exit strategy on these releases. Wrestler A doesnt walk into Raw and says I want my release and Vince gives it to them and they go home. Wrestler A makes the request. WWE plans an exit strategy and within a few weeks, that person is finally granted their release. It allows WWE to protect their product and tie up whatever loose ends it needs to with that talent and its internal and external obligations. Can fans be cheated? Yeah....I can see a fan feeling cheated. But the wrestler and the company have both agreed that they will seperate. No different than someone being injured. The term is a misnomer. They are not independent. They can't take bookings elsewhere. They are employees of the WWE not independent contractors. Vince said Punk's taking a sabbatical. And do you want someone who is injured but able to wrestle wrestling? That's irresponsible. But they were scheduled for events before they got their release and then WWE would have to change it after they are gone. Those wrestlers walked out on the fans. They should have completed their contract that they originally signed and left when it expired. So when a wrestler says they don't want to continue on, the WWE forces them? Yeah, that's great for morale. That's great for the product having someone who doesn't give a damn anymore. We've heard stories about TNA not giving people their release when they asked for it. It does the company no favors.
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Post by King Bálor (CM)™ on Mar 4, 2014 21:32:57 GMT -5
Its not a misnomer. Its 100% fact. He is an independent contractor. He might have additional rules and regulations he is required to follow, but he is still an independent contractor. When I first started in the mortgage business, I was as well. But I couldnt do mortgages through another mortgage brokerage. I also had to sign a non compete clause. There are different variations to what is an independent contractor. Could he be battling injury? Absolutely. But he isnt home because he is too injured to wrestle. If he was, WWE would announce that. They dont remove him from the opening video and can him from Axxess and WW sessions cuz he is injured. We might not know all the details. But its pretty safe to say....Punk walked out on WWE. So please dont try and make that out as an excuse. Your next statement makes no sense. Wrestlers dont leave while under contract when they ask for their release. They ask for their release...AND THEN are no longer under contract. WWE has cleared them of their obligation and consider the contract completed. Also, if you notice there seems to be an exit strategy on these releases. Wrestler A doesnt walk into Raw and says I want my release and Vince gives it to them and they go home. Wrestler A makes the request. WWE plans an exit strategy and within a few weeks, that person is finally granted their release. It allows WWE to protect their product and tie up whatever loose ends it needs to with that talent and its internal and external obligations. Can fans be cheated? Yeah....I can see a fan feeling cheated. But the wrestler and the company have both agreed that they will seperate. No different than someone being injured. The term is a misnomer. They are not independent. They can't take bookings elsewhere. They are employees of the WWE not independent contractors. Vince said Punk's taking a sabbatical. And do you want someone who is injured but able to wrestle wrestling? That's irresponsible. But they were scheduled for events before they got their release and then WWE would have to change it after they are gone. Those wrestlers walked out on the fans. They should have completed their contract that they originally signed and left when it expired. So when a wrestler says they don't want to continue on, the WWE forces them? Yeah, that's great for morale. That's great for the product having someone who doesn't give a damn anymore. We've heard stories about TNA not giving people their release when they asked for it. It does the company no favors. I understand what a misnomer is. But you are using the term incorrectly. You can be an independent contractor without having the ability to work for multiple companies. Its more for tax purposes. Independent contractor is EXACTLY what Punk is. HE IS NOT INJURED! Please stop trying to make excuses for this guy. This is pure desperation. The guy is cloaked in selfishness and you want to pull something out of left field. Maybe he is on maternity leave too. If you dont want to be made at him for walking out. Thats your right as a fan. I dont understand it...but hey, to each their own. But this is a poor attempt at trying to make him to be some martyr when in reality he's simply being irresponsible. You said it yourself..."leave when it expires." If you request your release and WWE grants it.....your contract is expired. Its no longer valid. Call it what you will. But like I said before.....I dont blame fans if they do feel cheated. I dont. Because WWE puts these wheels in motions and doesnt just spring it on us. Again....I said this already. You say you dont want to continue on? WWE has EVERY right...EVERY right to hold you to your contract. You have every right not to sign it or sign for a long term deal. Also, here is what we dont know......Punk might have asked for his release....he might not have. Thats something we definitely do not know. Guess what....its irrelevant. You are CONTRACTUALLY OBLIGATED, if WWE does not grant your release. These are things in the contract. You dont have to accept these conditions. This isnt Punk's first WWE contract. He knows what is required of him. A company not giving a release to someone who requests it....DOES THEM A TREMENDOUS favor. Its protecting your investment. The time, money and effort that you, as a company, have put into someone is protected. Otherwise, someone from TNA could take their push and head right to WWE tv or vice versa. This can hurt the product and cost the company money. So what the company does is use someone who is exiting by putting over new talent and backing someone else. That way they can recover some of their loss through a new star. Why do you think Bret Hart got crap all over him when he refused to put HBK over at SS? He was exiting. Vince wants HBK to have the belt. You put HBK over and you leave. Thats the right thing to do for the company. Its the right thing to do for HBK. Or, you find another mutually beneficial way of handling the situation. What you dont do is walk out on the show. What you dont do is screw over the fans. And what you dont do is screw over the company that put a lot of time, money and effort into you. Again...let me make it clear. I am still a Punk fan. I still 100% agree with Punk's POV. And I still 100% find WWE to be in the toilet creatively. This debate isnt about that. Its about the way the situation is being handled.
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Post by The Mask of Truth on Mar 4, 2014 22:01:49 GMT -5
I could care less, he's the best in the world in his own mind. Dude walks around like he's some wrestling god. His promo work recently has been average and he couldn't carry the company on his back. His body language displays jealousy for Daniel Bryan during the "YES"chants. Punk is just a big whiny baby.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2014 22:05:31 GMT -5
No!
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Post by k5 on Mar 4, 2014 22:11:27 GMT -5
mixed feelings, but overall i've supported his decisions in the past and i support him now.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2014 22:37:25 GMT -5
Mixed feelings.
I applaud him for standing up for himself but also believe there could have been some sort of compromise.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2014 22:47:37 GMT -5
Iv'e been a fan of Punk's since 09 but he can go himself!! He could careless about his fans and people are still begging for him lol.
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Post by ztj_wwf on Mar 4, 2014 22:50:35 GMT -5
Mad isn't the right word, but I think it was an extremely unprofessional and selfish decision and I think Punk is getting it easy from fans in this situation.
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Post by BCizzle on Mar 4, 2014 22:55:21 GMT -5
I'm actually happy for him.
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Post by ThugSuperstar on Mar 4, 2014 23:34:21 GMT -5
Where does everybody get this idea that Punk is jealous of Daniel Bryan? First of all, Bryan is one of his good friends in the industry who he's put over in promos before. Second of all, what in the hell does he have to be jealous about? Being WWE Champion for 5 minutes? Jobbing to Triple H and Orton every week on RAW? If anything, Bryan and Punk are in the exact same boat. I swear, some of you guys don't even bother to think when you post.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2014 0:22:47 GMT -5
Not mad, not sad.
Only time i've been mad at him was when he was an arrogant little prick on twitter to the people who made him. He can thank them for his countless WWE bimbos. I don't care if I never see another Punk match. When he became big and 'made it' he also became easy to dislike.
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Post by Next Man’s Knowing Rock on Mar 5, 2014 0:40:36 GMT -5
Where does everybody get this idea that Punk is jealous of Daniel Bryan? First of all, Bryan is one of his good friends in the industry who he's put over in promos before. Second of all, what in the hell does he have to be jealous about? Bryan having arenas -- even arenas at basketball games -- doing his chant and celebrating him. Getting some of the greatest crowd responses since the attitude era. Having a ton of momentum and being a featured player in storylines. Main-eventing PPVs, a feat that Punk always struggled to accomplish unless his opponent was a megastar like The Rock or John Cena, or he was on a card that didn't have a megastar like The Rock or John Cena. Daniel Bryan headlined multiple PPVs with Randy Orton, a guy that barely moves the needle... And one of the Bryan-Orton matches main-evented a PPV over a Cena return. Hell, he could even be jealous that Daniel Bryan takes wrestling in his stride and has fun and doesn't get upset at losing a match, or wrestling at 10pm instead of 11pm, or not being the champion all the time, or not drawing as much money as John Cena. He could be jealous that Daniel Bryan's body is still holding up. He could be jealous that Daniel Bryan can talk to fans without being disgusted by them and rude to them. Nobody knows if CM Punk is jealous of Daniel Bryan or not, it's easy to make a case either way. But as it stands, we just don't know. And we probably never will.
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Post by BoJack Hogan on Mar 5, 2014 2:05:36 GMT -5
No, he's gone. I couldn't be happier with his decision. If he had returned for the big Wrestlemania payoff and higher profile spot it would have been even worse, but since he stuck to his guns and didn't return he actually earned (a very small amount of) my respect. Principles have to count for something. Based on how he went about things (unless he was asking for time off based solely on injuries and WWE brass were refusing) I will never see him as any less than 70% wrong, and if the stories are even close to true he's probably 100% wrong, but I don't care. I will never like him as a performer so as long as he stays gone, I am happy camper, and camping season started waaaaay early this year.
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