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Post by mania on Jul 19, 2011 1:15:53 GMT -5
On the surface, it does seem like Raw fell incredibly flat tonight but perhaps that was the whole point. After a spectacular PPV, maybe the only way it could go up further is to drop down like this, make us lose all hope for a moment, and then save the show with that cliffhanger ending. That was the point? You do understand that TV ratings are supremely significant, right? In this day and age you can't gamble like that. More of this and WWE will exclusively be on SyFy
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Post by kazoosandstreamers on Jul 19, 2011 1:17:18 GMT -5
The Vince thing does have me scratching my head, but I am curious to see where this goes next.
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Deleted
Joined on: Sept 30, 2024 0:33:15 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2011 1:20:24 GMT -5
Here's why I didn't much care for Raw, since people are looking for some clarification: - The way the C.M. Punk angle was handled was COMPLETELY anticimactic and made the past five weeks irrelevant. The whole purpose of the angle was that Punk leaving with the belt would be a huge problem for the WWE. Well, I guess not because we can just have a tournament to crown a new champion the next night! Not only that, but we'll just bring out the same exact belt. They treated it as if nothing happened; and if nothing happened, there was no reason for there to have been any tension involving Punk's title shot in the first place. - The tournament was INCREDIBLY predictable. Go back to the start of this thread. EVERYBODY said Mysterio vs. Miz in the final. - The commentary was atrocious on a whole new level. I can't even count on my fingers and toes the number of times things were called "a move" or "a maneuver," or simply called wrong. Cole and King need Josh Mathews back with them because at least he has some knowledge of how to call a WRESTLING match. - Yes, we had a show full of wrestling, but there was no heat for any of them outside of the opener with Miz and Riley. Why should the crowd care about an R-Truth vs. Jack Swagger match -- two guys who have been losing fairly consistently lately? Why did Rey do nothing to retaliate for ADR unmasking him? The whole "flow" of the night made no sense. - If they weren't goign to finish the tournament tonight, and it would seem that they would have known that all along, they likely should have just had four quality opening round matches than six thrown-together matches. Once again, there was no climax to the build-up of the evening. The fans were RIGHT to boo Vince for postponing that match they were promised earlier in the evening. - The ending made no sense whatsoever. Why? What has Vince done in the past few months that was so bad? Not be able to re-sign Punk? THEN SAY THAT'S WHAT IT IS. Kayfabe-wise, there is literally no reason for the Board of Directors to replace Vince because he hasn't done anything in months outside of appearing for the Cena/Punk feud. Other than that, every decision -- good or bad -- has been made by Teddy Long or the Raw GM. If we're going to play it off as it being "shoot," then we DEFINITELY need some reason other than some unknown"questionable decisions" or whatever HHH said. Presidents of companies can get away with a lot. It would take something HUGE for him to be unseated. I'll give them that I'm interested in seeing where it goes from here, but that's mainly because I've been a fan of wrestling for 12 years and been through far worse than this. But coming off the emotional high that was MITB -- one of the best wrestling shows I have watched in a long, long time -- this was a giant letdown. you sir, summed up my thoughts from top to bottom. i applaud you Exactly. I damn near threw my remote at the TV when Mysterio won.
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Post by Controversial Maverick PUNK on Jul 19, 2011 1:43:58 GMT -5
Last night's bore-fest, showed just how valuable Punk is to RAW.
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r44gz96
Main Eventer
WF 10+ Year Member
Joined on: Mar 8, 2009 10:42:07 GMT -5
Posts: 1,783
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Post by r44gz96 on Jul 19, 2011 1:58:31 GMT -5
Is this thing about Triple H running the WWE a work? And is Mcmahon still running it?
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Post by fattic on Jul 19, 2011 2:00:31 GMT -5
rutz where the did you come from??
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Post by mania on Jul 19, 2011 2:16:30 GMT -5
rutz where the did you come from?? titz?! hahah i still dont know. #randomrockreturn
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Post by KrimV on Jul 19, 2011 2:27:14 GMT -5
I enjoyed the show. It wasn't a great show, but I thought it was entertaining (though the tournament was very predictable) and the ending was well done.
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Post by wabarrett on Jul 19, 2011 5:18:49 GMT -5
How the hell was it bad or even near bad? 2 hours of entertaining television, good wrestling, a lot of wrestling and a fantastic ending. Every week people bitch about wanting more wrestling and less promos. Now that it happened, they think it's bad. Christ, you people confuse me. Holy crap, I agree with you. Personally I like promos, I could watch two hours of talking and hyping up the next PPV (where all the wrestling is) if it was good. But last night had tons of wrestling (some very good) and a cliff-hanger ending. Thumbs up. There really is no pleasing some people. My only problem with RAW was the 7-on-7, 1-minute long mess of a divas match. Why do they insist on doing those like every two weeks? p.s. For all the people bitching about Vince just replacing the WWE title with a new one and having a tournament to crown a new Champion... you really didn't see that coming all along? I see it as Vince trying to save face, trying to get on with things now Punk is gone (or is he??), ya know?
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Post by Dan on Jul 19, 2011 6:35:10 GMT -5
So was the ending to last night's Raw more important and historic than everybody is making out right now? Was this the transition from Vince McMahon to Triple H. We could see a whole new Attitude Era take place now, with Triple H as Chairman playing Vince's Role back in the 90's. I have a feeling everything will have come full circle now, and it's only a matter of time before we see the WWE of old come back into play.
I think they have finally acknowledged that the Programming simply isn't good enough and that things finally need shaking up again for good.
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Post by greenjack1992 on Jul 19, 2011 7:41:16 GMT -5
Just watched the end segment back again. I don't understand why everyone's so angry, it's spot on.
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Post by Glorydaysofwrestling on Jul 19, 2011 7:43:29 GMT -5
How the hell was it bad or even near bad? 2 hours of entertaining television, good wrestling, a lot of wrestling and a fantastic ending. Every week people bitch about wanting more wrestling and less promos. Now that it happened, they think it's bad. Christ, you people confuse me. Holy crap, I agree with you. Personally I like promos, I could watch two hours of talking and hyping up the next PPV (where all the wrestling is) if it was good. But last night had tons of wrestling (some very good) and a cliff-hanger ending. Thumbs up. There really is no pleasing some people. My only problem with RAW was the 7-on-7, 1-minute long mess of a divas match. Why do they insist on doing those like every two weeks? p.s. For all the people bitching about Vince just replacing the WWE title with a new one and having a tournament to crown a new Champion... you really didn't see that coming all along? I see it as Vince trying to save face, trying to get on with things now Punk is gone (or is he??), ya know? I agree with you guys...most people on here just complain no matter what. We got a bunch of matches an interesting storyline and THE GOD of pro wrestling potentially retiring(maybe his on air role) last night, and in order for the storyline with CM Punk to seem legit they made the best decsions possible.
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Post by The Future on Jul 19, 2011 8:19:27 GMT -5
I feel like Vince booked the tournament last night to show just how out of touch he is with what today's audience really wants...that it was a ridiculous booking ploy to show that he needs to be replaced. Then, they have the real life mirror scenario of HHH rising up in influence behind the scenes...and as Punk said in his shoot:
"I'd like to believe that this industry would be better off when you're dead...but then the company would be left to the hands of your idiot daughter and son-in-law..."
This just goes to prove that they've had this in mind for a while, but I think now that HHH will come in and try to weasel his way to the highest rank of power. He won't continue the tournament Vince set up, ending with Miz vs. Rey because he knows that the new title Vince was going to introduce doesn't have the history and lineage of the true WWE title. So he'll try to lure Punk back, using Vince being fired as incentive- but then after it all, he'll swerve on him.
I've known Punk wasn't 'walking out' on the WWE...knew Cena wouldn't be fired...but this whole HHH/Vince angle came literally out of nowhere, and it has me very intrigued.
They've been showing for a while now that Vince has absolutely no clue what the WWE fans want, but the product's been noticeably different and improved for the last few weeks(writer and backstage shake ups). So we may just be seeing the dawn of a new era.
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1amgr8ness
Superstar
But you already know that
Joined on: Nov 12, 2003 12:33:59 GMT -5
Posts: 781
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Post by 1amgr8ness on Jul 19, 2011 8:47:04 GMT -5
So like I said in the thread I created last night. The WORST RAW EVER. Off such a tremendous PPV card to this bland garbage. C'MON! I was actually looking forward to them crowning a new champ. EVEN NOW THAT THEY DIDN'T I still don't wanna see this whole "Vince is gone" angle. They tried it before with a car explosion...I guess it's time for someone else to commit another MDK (see Demolition Man).
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Deleted
Joined on: Sept 30, 2024 0:33:16 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2011 9:44:19 GMT -5
If some of you are allowed to say worst Raw ever, I'd like to think I could say some of you are the worst fans ever. Then I think to myself, no, because that would imply that you guys are actually fans who enjoy the product, and don't just show up to bitch every week.
This is exactly like when Christian won the title. It was a huge bitchfest when he lost it 2 days later to Orton. Not once did anyone think, "huh, this is probably the start of something, I'll wait and see where this goes" until your precious Jericho said something on Twitter. Then you guys were all cool with it.
Point is, before you cast something off, watch what happens. McMahon's firing and the whole WWE title tournament DO play into the Punk storyline.
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Post by The Undertaker on Jul 19, 2011 9:47:59 GMT -5
First of all, this wasnt the worst RAW ever. Secondly, it wasn't that good but Jesus if you haven't learned by now that after watching a ing great show, the next one is always going to seem like a let down, then your an idiot. What did you expect? RAW to be incredible? Punk was at the Cubs game, you should have known that. And if that tournament was so predictable then why didn't you all turn it off? Can't anyone just enjoy wrestling anymore?
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Post by Scott! on Jul 19, 2011 9:58:07 GMT -5
whast a snoozfest. admittadly, i didn't see the ending coming but the tournament finals were predictible.
everyone knew it'd be mysterio and miz, everyone said from the start.
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Post by wabarrett on Jul 19, 2011 11:16:43 GMT -5
I feel like Vince booked the tournament last night to show just how out of touch he is with what today's audience really wants...that it was a ridiculous booking ploy to show that he needs to be replaced. Then, they have the real life mirror scenario of HHH rising up in influence behind the scenes...and as Punk said in his shoot: "I'd like to believe that this industry would be better off when you're dead...but then the company would be left to the hands of your idiot daughter and son-in-law..." This just goes to prove that they've had this in mind for a while, but I think now that HHH will come in and try to weasel his way to the highest rank of power. He won't continue the tournament Vince set up, ending with Miz vs. Rey because he knows that the new title Vince was going to introduce doesn't have the history and lineage of the true WWE title. So he'll try to lure Punk back, using Vince being fired as incentive- but then after it all, he'll swerve on him. I've known Punk wasn't 'walking out' on the WWE...knew Cena wouldn't be fired...but this whole HHH/Vince angle came literally out of nowhere, and it has me very intrigued. They've been showing for a while now that Vince has absolutely no clue what the WWE fans want, but the product's been noticeably different and improved for the last few weeks(writer and backstage shake ups). So we may just be seeing the dawn of a new era. Nah I really don't think so... Triple H did say Vince had made some questionable decisions but I think that refers to trying to screw over Punk, trying to fire Cena etc. Really, when the new WWE Champion 'leaves' the company, the logical thing to do is determine a new Champion. As for Vince not knowing what the fans want... meh, half the fans don't even know what they want, as proved last night. There was easily a solid hour or more of wrestling, which is supposedly what people want to see, and look how that's gone down (on here at least). Plus it's not like WWE programming was the worst it's ever been and all of a sudden starting from this past Sunday it's the best it's ever been. We just have a really good story building, something that we haven't seen before, which is positive.
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JedsWorld
Main Eventer
45+ Trading refs on classifieds.
Joined on: Apr 20, 2008 8:57:37 GMT -5
Posts: 4,470
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Post by JedsWorld on Jul 19, 2011 11:26:29 GMT -5
This is what they should of done…
Just replace Monsoon with Triple H and Heenan with Vince:
But seriously… Raw was very entertaining with some solid wrestling matches - The only thing wrong with last night’s Raw was the only thing wrong with the MTIB PPV… In fact it’s probably the only major problem currently in WWE - The Divas.
Something needs to be changed about that scene drastically… the sooner they bring back Kharma the better, Then we can have some decent women’s wrestling between the likes of Kharma, Tamina, Nattie, Beth, Gail Kim etc. (Imagine?) and just save the likes of Kelly, Bellas and the others for on-screen characters (mangers maybe?) but don’t make them disgrace the ring and take away from the show by wrestling.
I kind of expected the Finals to be held off until next week anyway and if the match does go ahead I predict Miz will pick up the win. But now Vince isn’t around and it was Vince’s idea, maybe the tournament will be scrapped altogether - who knows?
And who actually expected John Cena to be fired, Kayfabe or not we all knew he wouldn’t be fired although I did enjoy the “Someone else’s television show - Brother!!” Line from Cena.
I hope that this isn’t WWE’s way of fading out Vince from WWE as I’ve always been a huge fan of his and was getting excited for the prospect of him returning as an on-screen character again.
But this is very interested and I look forward to seeing what they’ll do next week.
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Post by Sleazyness on Jul 19, 2011 13:37:06 GMT -5
Ugh for the love of god. Triple H is awesome for the job. Something tells me with Cena still around this will end up being horrible. And was it me or did that RAW tournament Suck? I say CMPunk returns and starts a all out war with some indy wrestlers.
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