facemeat
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Joined on: Jul 24, 2011 0:38:10 GMT -5
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Post by facemeat on Nov 25, 2013 17:43:28 GMT -5
Wow, truly disgusting display in this thread. Way to give atheists an even worse name, folks.
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Post by Lord Ragnarok on Nov 25, 2013 17:44:43 GMT -5
Nice one, Angola. Let's hope it works out and the rest of the world wakes up and follows suit (covering every religion by the way.) I've always been anti-religion but I've just recently started reading some of Richard Dawkins' books and it's just awesome to see religion being debunked with good reason and logic. It has no place in an educated society and while I do have to say that most religious people are well meaning people, there's no getting away from the fact that it does spawn discrimination, war and so on. Angola has the right idea about trying to cut out the extremist side of it from their country. We could do without idiots who hold banners up saying "Behead those who say Islam is violent." Insanely beautiful irony. Imagine a world with no religion indeed. I'm an atheist but I really can't agree with much of that. First of all, while I agree that tackling extreme elements is necessary, that's not what's happening here. They're pulling down mosques and banning the religion, that's not the same as tackling extremism. You can't go around pulling down mosques/synagogues/churches because of a few psychopaths. And I don't agree that religion causes war/discrimination. These aren't things that would magically go away if you get rid of religion, it's naive to think that religion is the cause of these problems, it's just used to justify war and in some cases discrimination. Most wars are caused by a desire for power/control/wealth/territory and discrimination tends to be a result of fear or because of the need for a scapegoat. Religion is not the main problem here. I never said it was the sole cause for war and discrimination or the main cause. Nationalism and a clash of cultures have also caused numerous wars, deaths and discrimination. I love that people think that banning religion will stop crazy people being violent. Good luck with that. Of course it's not, just like banning guns isn't going to stop people from owning and using them. Religion isnt going away anytime soon. Nobody is asking you to accept it or follow it but stop bitching about it already. I'll stop bitching about once it's completely taken out of schools and the government. You people seem to think that we (Atheists) are just out to get religion for no reason. That is absolutely not the case. All we want is for people to keep it to themselves. I'm an atheist but I really can't agree with much of that. First of all, while I agree that tackling extreme elements is necessary, that's not what's happening here. They're pulling down mosques and banning the religion, that's not the same as tackling extremism. You can't go around pulling down mosques/synagogues/churches because of a few psychopaths. And I don't agree that religion causes war/discrimination. These aren't things that would magically go away if you get rid of religion, it's naive to think that religion is the cause of these problems, it's just used to justify war and in some cases discrimination. Most wars are caused by a desire for power/control/wealth/territory and discrimination tends to be a result of fear or because of the need for a scapegoat. Religion is not the main problem here. Dang. An actual rational atheist on the Internet who I can agree with 100%. Who'd have thunk? I agree with everything said here. If anything, the atheists should be the ones in fear, not the ones gloating. Angola is a Christian society that has now banned Islam and is tearing down their mosques. Who do you think they will come after next? It won't be the Christians. It'll likely be those godless atheists who are corrupting the minds of the youth. Someone must think of the children!! Seriously, where do you think the next logical step is? They could end up going after smaller religions, but once those are gone, who's next? Atheists have been persecuted by Christians for centuries, it's nothing new. The only difference is we're finally fighting back and standing up to the oppressive nature of religion. You think they're going to go after us next? What are they gonna do? Tear down libraries and blow up science labs? And I sincerely hope you're joking about Atheists corrupting the minds of children. Atheists are just as annoying and bigoted as people who try and force religion down your throat. Nothing is funnier than their own preconceived notion of superiority. How exactly are Atheists bigots? And if you think it's annoying for people to uphold the constitution by fighting for complete and total separation of church and state then you really need to get it together. Wow, truly disgusting display in this thread. Way to give atheists an even worse name, folks. Except that it was Christians behind this not Atheists. And Atheists have a bad name? Why? Because we're sick of religion being forced upon the population and are trying to do something about it? Ridiculous.
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facemeat
Main Eventer
Joined on: Jul 24, 2011 0:38:10 GMT -5
Posts: 2,891
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Post by facemeat on Nov 25, 2013 17:49:48 GMT -5
How exactly are Atheists bigots? And if you think it's annoying for people to uphold the constitution by fighting for complete and total separation of church and state then you really need to get it together. So, you wanna uphold that part of the constitution, but all that freedom of religion and speech garbage can just go right out the window?
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Post by Lord Ragnarok on Nov 25, 2013 17:52:48 GMT -5
How exactly are Atheists bigots? And if you think it's annoying for people to uphold the constitution by fighting for complete and total separation of church and state then you really need to get it together. So, you wanna uphold that part of the constitution, but all that freedom of religion and speech garbage can just go right out the window? I made it quite clear that I have no problem with people having a religion. People just need to keep it to themselves.
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facemeat
Main Eventer
Joined on: Jul 24, 2011 0:38:10 GMT -5
Posts: 2,891
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Post by facemeat on Nov 25, 2013 17:55:38 GMT -5
So, you wanna uphold that part of the constitution, but all that freedom of religion and speech garbage can just go right out the window? I made it quite clear that I have no problem with people having a religion. People just need to keep it to themselves. You keep saying they need to "keep it to themselves"; what does that mean exactly? That they should be banned from discussing or mentioning it in public? You don't see how forcing people to "keep it to themselves" just might violate their constitutional rights?
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Post by Lord Ragnarok on Nov 25, 2013 17:59:53 GMT -5
I made it quite clear that I have no problem with people having a religion. People just need to keep it to themselves. You keep saying they need to "keep it to themselves"; what does that mean exactly? That they should be banned from discussing or mentioning it in public? You don't see how forcing people to "keep it to themselves" just might violate their constitutional rights? So what would your solution be then?
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Post by JC Motors on Nov 25, 2013 18:07:05 GMT -5
This thread has derailed quickly
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Post by Markw on Nov 25, 2013 18:07:59 GMT -5
There's no problem with people being taught about religion and there's no problem with people openly practicing their religion. There's also nothing wrong with Atheists questioning religion. It becomes a problem when either is taught as the unquestionable truth.
Teach people about all religions in schools and teach people about why atheists don't agree, that's not a problem if anything it helps you to understand where other people are coming from which can only be beneficial in the long run. But don't force atheism or any religion on people, don't teach kids that any one view is 'right'. I imagine that's what American atheists on here have a problem with.
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Post by Nivro™ on Nov 25, 2013 18:19:34 GMT -5
I made it quite clear that I have no problem with people having a religion. People just need to keep it to themselves. You keep saying they need to "keep it to themselves"; what does that mean exactly? That they should be banned from discussing or mentioning it in public? You don't see how forcing people to "keep it to themselves" just might violate their constitutional rights? It means we're not allowed to speak positively about religion and must put it in a shell and keep it to ourselves while Atheist can keep running around claiming theories like the Big Bang are true. Anyone ever notice you dont see threads posted on this site from Christians preaching and giving sermons talking about how you should follow Christ yadda yadda yadda, yet there's always an Atheist on here posting a thread about why Religion should be banned and how its fake and Jesus/God isnt real......Yet ironic its religious views that are seen as "forced upon"
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Post by Markw on Nov 25, 2013 18:29:11 GMT -5
Anyone ever notice you dont see threads posted on this site from Christians preaching and giving sermons talking about how you should follow Christ yadda yadda yadda, yet there's always an Atheist on here posting a thread about why Religion should be banned and how its fake and Jesus/God isnt real......Yet ironic its religious views that are seen as "forced upon" Ugh this is about a Christian country completely banning another religion, if that isn't forcing something on people I don't know what is.
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Post by slappy on Nov 25, 2013 18:37:14 GMT -5
I wish those homosexuals would just keep it to themselves. Why do we need to see or know what they are doing? It sickens me that they are out their influencing laws. They need to just keep it to themselves.
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Post by Nivro™ on Nov 25, 2013 18:41:02 GMT -5
Anyone ever notice you dont see threads posted on this site from Christians preaching and giving sermons talking about how you should follow Christ yadda yadda yadda, yet there's always an Atheist on here posting a thread about why Religion should be banned and how its fake and Jesus/God isnt real......Yet ironic its religious views that are seen as "forced upon" Ugh this is about a Christian country completely banning another religion, if that isn't forcing something on people I don't know what is. But its only a problem when its a Christian country though. If this was an Islamic country banning Christianity, or Buddhist country banning Judaism.....nobody would care. But its those evil damn Christians forcing their Religion upon people again. They dont realize that most Christians dont give a crap about other religions/non religions. Just let us do what we do and you do what you do and shut the up and leave us alone.
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Post by Hulkamaniac on Nov 25, 2013 18:50:23 GMT -5
I personally love the logic. Christianity is intolerant. The fix? Intolerance from the other side.
Sent from my ADR6350 using proboards
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Deleted
Joined on: Sept 29, 2024 0:18:00 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2013 18:51:24 GMT -5
How anything, which doesn't affect anyone other than that individual person, can be banned in this day in age is sad.
I'm not just talking about religion either. Same sex marriage, drugs, religion, all that BS. No victim=no crime in my eyes.
There are people dieing, starving, and wars around the world, and these "leaders" are too preoccupied with trying to dictate how we live our lives.
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Post by Markw on Nov 25, 2013 18:58:22 GMT -5
Ugh this is about a Christian country completely banning another religion, if that isn't forcing something on people I don't know what is. But its only a problem when its a Christian country though. If this was an Islamic country banning Christianity, or Buddhist country banning Judaism.....nobody would care. But its those evil damn Christians forcing their Religion upon people again. They dont realize that most Christians dont give a crap about other religions/non religions. Just let us do what we do and you do what you do and shut the up and leave us alone. No it's genuinely a problem when any country tries to eradicate an entire religion, I think it's still something we'd be talking about if it wasn't a Christian country doing it and in fact no one has actually attacked Christianity in this thread as far as I can tell. There are Christians who preach that their views are 'right', just as there are atheists and members of all other religions that do the same. Don't pretend that your religion's perfect. Your post was along the lines of 'Christians don't push their views on anyone while Atheists hate all religion and try to force atheism down peoples throats', that is obviously not true. I'm an atheist and I've not said Christianity is wrong, I've not said it shouldn't be taught in schools, but you still seem happy to tar us all with the same brush.
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Post by Nivro™ on Nov 25, 2013 19:13:49 GMT -5
But its only a problem when its a Christian country though. If this was an Islamic country banning Christianity, or Buddhist country banning Judaism.....nobody would care. But its those evil damn Christians forcing their Religion upon people again. They dont realize that most Christians dont give a crap about other religions/non religions. Just let us do what we do and you do what you do and shut the up and leave us alone. No it's genuinely a problem when any country tries to eradicate an entire religion, I think it's still something we'd be talking about if it wasn't a Christian country doing it and in fact no one has actually attacked Christianity in this thread as far as I can tell. There are Christians who preach that their views are 'right', just as there are atheists and members of all other religions that do the same. Don't pretend that your religion's perfect. Your post was along the lines of 'Christians don't push their views on anyone while Atheists hate all religion and try to force atheism down peoples throats', that is obviously not true. I'm an atheist and I've not said Christianity is wrong, I've not said it shouldn't be taught in schools, but you still seem happy to tar us all with the same brush. On this site, can you show me a thread created by a Christian that is forcing their beliefs upon anyone? You can go all the way back to 2001...Ill accept any (that wasnt a troll post like Jesus message to TRW thread a few years ago). I can almost promise you I can find other threads where certain atheist member(s) have made multiple thread where they will try to post a topic/news discussion only to change it to an Anti Christianity deal. While you yourself have not said anything, and I appreciate that, it doesnt mean that some here dont. Most of the "Pro Christian" comments on this site have come after someone has attacked their religion. Sometimes you have to read the context of whats being typed and realize whether "you" is an indirect or direct you. Im a Christian, I believe in God, Heaven/Hell etc...but I dont come on here and tell people they're wrong or right. I dont come here and say "you're going to hell" or "you should believe in God and you're wrong if you dont". Yet I cant post an "Official Christianity Thread" here cause it would get trolled and flammed like hell by certain member(s) to the point TRW would lock it before it got past the first page. Like I said, believe in whatever you want. Believe in any Religion or non religion that you want to. But if its a topic you dont believe in, stop bitching about it, complaining and whining and live your own life. You (direct) being an Atheist has no effect on my life. Whether you want to express your beliefs or non beliefs in public or not. In turn me being a Christian should have no direct effect on your life whether I express myself in public or not. People are just constantly looking for something to bitch about.
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Post by Hulkamaniac on Nov 25, 2013 19:37:38 GMT -5
Do people really think about what they're saying when they say things like they don't want any religion taught in schools at all? Think about it for a second. You've just wiped out pretty much the entire history of the Western world off the books because nearly all of it was influenced by Christianity. Like it or not, Christianity is a huge, gigantic influence on our culture and our history. Let's go back to the turn of the millenia. Currently we would teach about a Jewish carpenter who is running around claiming to be God and getting himself crucified for his troubles. Why is this event significant? Because it sets the stage for so much that is to come. But we don't talk about that any more. Far as we're concerned, this carpenter guy never existed. We also can't really talk about why the Roman empire in the west fell apart at all. I mean, right now, we're taught all about how a large factor was the discord in the Catholic church at the time, but we can't mention that at all.
We could fast forward a few hundred years and now we're talking about various feudal kings and many of them are feuding with not just each other, but also the Church as well which was a very strong political power. But we can't talk about that because that raises questions of where the Church came from, where it draws it's political power from and why people thought these silly superstitions were important. We can't talk about that. The Magna Carter is one of the most important documents in Western history, but we can't talk about it at all as King John was forced to sign it by the Pope Innocent III who we don't talk about.
Then we can fast forward a few hundred years again and the kings of Europe have continued to bicker and fight. Many of their fights are over Protestantism vs Catholicism, but we can't talk about any of this because it again raises the messy question about religion and why people believe and are willing to die for their beliefs. We can't talk about Henry VIII and his split from the church. We can't talk about any of these things because we can't talk about God. I could go on and on, but you get my point.
How in the world would you even teach the history of our country? Thanksgiving is coming up. Why did the Pilgrims come to American originally? We can't teach that it was because they were persecuted for their religious beliefs and wanted to be left alone. Again that brings up the question of religion. Can you see how absurd it is to even propose banning the teaching of religion in a school?
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Post by Tim of thee on Nov 25, 2013 19:37:53 GMT -5
So, you wanna uphold that part of the constitution, but all that freedom of religion and speech garbage can just go right out the window? I made it quite clear that I have no problem with people having a religion. People just need to keep it to themselves. If I'm praying in a public space, would I be arrested under your rules? If I'm handing out religious pamphlets, would I be detained under your rules? I'm curious how this "keep it to yourselves" thing works with the rights of the people.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2013 20:02:25 GMT -5
I think eventually religion will just fade away, you can notice it today in society. Cause it's stupid. Almost everyone I know that isn't old minded doesn't go to Church. I.e. Everyone at my highschool, about 2/3 of the kids don't even go to the church.
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Post by Lord Ragnarok on Nov 25, 2013 20:24:04 GMT -5
Do people really think about what they're saying when they say things like they don't want any religion taught in schools at all? Think about it for a second. You've just wiped out pretty much the entire history of the Western world off the books because nearly all of it was influenced by Christianity. Like it or not, Christianity is a huge, gigantic influence on our culture and our history. Let's go back to the turn of the millenia. Currently we would teach about a Jewish carpenter who is running around claiming to be God and getting himself crucified for his troubles. Why is this event significant? Because it sets the stage for so much that is to come. But we don't talk about that any more. Far as we're concerned, this carpenter guy never existed. We also can't really talk about why the Roman empire in the west fell apart at all. I mean, right now, we're taught all about how a large factor was the discord in the Catholic church at the time, but we can't mention that at all. We could fast forward a few hundred years and now we're talking about various feudal kings and many of them are feuding with not just each other, but also the Church as well which was a very strong political power. But we can't talk about that because that raises questions of where the Church came from, where it draws it's political power from and why people thought these silly superstitions were important. We can't talk about that. The Magna Carter is one of the most important documents in Western history, but we can't talk about it at all as King John was forced to sign it by the Pope Innocent III who we don't talk about. Then we can fast forward a few hundred years again and the kings of Europe have continued to bicker and fight. Many of their fights are over Protestantism vs Catholicism, but we can't talk about any of this because it again raises the messy question about religion and why people believe and are willing to die for their beliefs. We can't talk about Henry VIII and his split from the church. We can't talk about any of these things because we can't talk about God. I could go on and on, but you get my point. How in the world would you even teach the history of our country? Thanksgiving is coming up. Why did the Pilgrims come to American originally? We can't teach that it was because they were persecuted for their religious beliefs and wanted to be left alone. Again that brings up the question of religion. Can you see how absurd it is to even propose banning the teaching of religion in a school? That's not at all what I'm talking about. I'm talking about kids being taught creationism and the like, not rewriting history. I made it quite clear that I have no problem with people having a religion. People just need to keep it to themselves. If I'm praying in a public space, would I be arrested under your rules? If I'm handing out religious pamphlets, would I be detained under your rules? I'm curious how this "keep it to yourselves" thing works with the rights of the people. Praying is fine but not handing out pamphlets.
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