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Post by MKSavage on Jul 30, 2021 0:21:50 GMT -5
even if you liked New Gen, there's just not enough there being offered at that price point. The entrance isn't anything elaborate, the ring is pretty cool but as usual too big, and Diesel isn't exactly must-have. The incentive of a Doink at 8k is poor at best. They could have focused on the golden era, or attitude era, reissue both cages they made before because they've been gone for years, include reissued legends they still have rights to. Top it off with the highest target unlocking a Harley Race. You'd see how fast they'd get to 10k backers lol. I don't know, I think people would still complain. I definitely believe people would go nuts if the only other time they could get a Harley Race figure is paying $250 for things they maybe wouldn't want (ring, skirts, entrance sign that doesn't light up, etc.) and that it would have to hit the highest tier to get him. The amount of complaining from this site would get the whole forum locked up, not just a thread... |
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Post by Professor Sparlin on Jul 30, 2021 0:52:54 GMT -5
Are you trying to convince me that the tech inside the New Gen entrance is more costly than the tech in the RAW entrance stage? I'm just using it as an example the New Gen entrance value, if sold at retail, isn't more than $60... might want to consider the context before commenting.. A foot tall play set scaled to 7-inch action figures isn’t going for less than $80 at retail, and likely would be around the $100 mark in 2021. The K-Mart Raw entrance stage wasn’t to scale, was smaller, had way fewer lights and electronic components, and was released nearly a decade ago. I will concede the argument, based on the cost inflation, as I believe all other points a moot now. $65 in 2012 (year the RAW entrance released) is worth $76.92 today. So: $80 for the entrance, $30 for the figure, $110 for the ring. And now it's looking like $220 with a $30 mark-up. |
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Billy Snorticus
Mid-Carder
Joined on: Jul 23, 2020 15:37:01 GMT -5
Posts: 333
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Post by Billy Snorticus on Jul 30, 2021 6:07:05 GMT -5
Are you trying to convince me that the tech inside the New Gen entrance is more costly than the tech in the RAW entrance stage? I'm just using it as an example the New Gen entrance value, if sold at retail, isn't more than $60... might want to consider the context before commenting.. A foot tall play set scaled to 7-inch action figures isn’t going for less than $80 at retail, and likely would be around the $100 mark in 2021. The K-Mart Raw entrance stage wasn’t to scale, was smaller, had way fewer lights and electronic components, and was released nearly a decade ago. couldn't have put it better myself. i wasn't talking about the wrekkin thing either |
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Post by TheHitmanKid on Jul 30, 2021 7:34:14 GMT -5
What they should have done is release a pair of wrestlers that had a rivalry in an iconic attire in the New generation. So it makes us want the wrestlers more even if people don't want to keep the ring.
Doink and Diesel won't be the biggest want for people in the sets price range.
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Deleted
Joined on: Nov 28, 2024 6:50:10 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2021 7:36:56 GMT -5
What they should have done is release a pair of wrestlers that had a rivalry in an iconic attire in the New generation. So it makes us want the wrestlers more even if people don't want to keep the ring. Doink and Diesel won't be the biggest want for people in the sets price range. That wouldn't have drawn me in. If it were the Steiner Bros then I might do it. Then again, they tried to sell the very first Goldberg with a ring, and all we had to do was be patient and we eventually got plenty of Goldbergs. So yeah. |
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Post by TheHitmanKid on Jul 30, 2021 7:44:31 GMT -5
What they should have done is release a pair of wrestlers that had a rivalry in an iconic attire in the New generation. So it makes us want the wrestlers more even if people don't want to keep the ring. Doink and Diesel won't be the biggest want for people in the sets price range. That wouldn't have drawn me in. If it were the Steiner Bros then I might do it. Then again, they tried to sell the very first Goldberg with a ring, and all we had to do was be patient and we eventually got plenty of Goldbergs. So yeah. Thats how I see those figures being released. If this ring doesn't get made, I feel Doink and Diesel would get released individually like the Goldberg and Jinder that were exclusive to their ring releases. |
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Post by Chip on Jul 30, 2021 7:44:53 GMT -5
once again, constant negativity wins out here. everyone was on board with something like this, until it happened....
and then people started saying "well they should have done....." and it puts different ideas in your head so that the actual thing doesn't seem as good anymore. read these threads on here and its almost completely negative comments, a lot of which are not constructive or helpful, instead just saying unreasonable things like they should have just done the entrance or they should have made jeff jarrett the figure
its unfortunate that this community has to be so toxic. and beyond a reasonable level. ive had a few things to say about this project but both positive AND constructive criticism.
still didnt stop me from backing it because i think OVERALL this is a pretty cool thing, and i want to own it.
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Billy Snorticus
Mid-Carder
Joined on: Jul 23, 2020 15:37:01 GMT -5
Posts: 333
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Post by Billy Snorticus on Jul 30, 2021 8:17:34 GMT -5
once again, constant negativity wins out here. everyone was on board with something like this, until it happened.... and then people started saying "well they should have done....." and it puts different ideas in your head so that the actual thing doesn't seem as good anymore. read these threads on here and its almost completely negative comments, a lot of which are not constructive or helpful, instead just saying unreasonable things like they should have just done the entrance or they should have made jeff jarrett the figure its unfortunate that this community has to be so toxic. and beyond a reasonable level. ive had a few things to say about this project but both positive AND constructive criticism. still didnt stop me from backing it because i think OVERALL this is a pretty cool thing, and i want to own it. they should've made the goal 1k, should've given us bret, shawn, diesel, ramon, jarrett, the steiners, and owen hart! also remove the ring and make it $150 |
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secondwhiteline
Main Eventer
Joined on: Nov 18, 2015 13:06:39 GMT -5
Posts: 1,543
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Post by secondwhiteline on Jul 30, 2021 8:53:05 GMT -5
If the offer was attractive, other collectors would not have to defend the project. The posts on instagram or on the forum to explain that we don't understand anything, that it is an interesting offer are counter productive. I don't buy such an expensive product to please others or hoping that the next made to order will be more interesting. If Mattel is not able to make a success of its first launch I don't see why the next ones would be better or more interesting for me. Either the starting price should be lowered or all the addons should be included. People bitch about the price of elites being higher at Target than Walmart....regardless of what this was priced at people are gonna bitch. Agreed, but a lot of times people will buy something despite their own complaints about the price. I'm sure people weren't thrilled to spend so much on Galactus or the Thundertank, but they did it. I think the question Mattel's going to have to ask is why that's not happening this time? I keep thinking about this in the context of crowdfunded toys from major companies that succeeded, and I keep coming back to the thought that everything in this project is a more expensive version of stuff people already have. I'm wondering if that's the core of it, and if that's the case then upgrades or additional tiers wouldn't have overcome that. You could argue with that about the entrance, but you can get pop-up stuff that has a similar functionality, even if it's nowhere near as nice or elaborate. AEW's even got one coming out. With other projects, you couldn't get a Sail Barge or Thundertank elsewhere, really. Wrestling's tough for projects like this. I'm a huge fan of having playsets and especially backstage environments, but I honestly don't know what you could do with a crowdfunded wrestling toy project that would really have that irreplaceable, special feel that the ML Galactus has. |
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Post by LA Times on Jul 30, 2021 8:55:24 GMT -5
once again, constant negativity wins out here. everyone was on board with something like this, until it happened.... and then people started saying "well they should have done....." and it puts different ideas in your head so that the actual thing doesn't seem as good anymore. read these threads on here and its almost completely negative comments, a lot of which are not constructive or helpful, instead just saying unreasonable things like they should have just done the entrance or they should have made jeff jarrett the figure its unfortunate that this community has to be so toxic. and beyond a reasonable level. ive had a few things to say about this project but both positive AND constructive criticism. still didnt stop me from backing it because i think OVERALL this is a pretty cool thing, and i want to own it. they should've made the goal 1k, should've given us bret, shawn, diesel, ramon, jarrett, the steiners, and owen hart! also remove the ring and make it $150 $150 for 8 UE figures with 4 names who are not even signed? Are you trying to put mattel out of business? |
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Post by jayrod2009 on Jul 30, 2021 8:58:22 GMT -5
If Mattel wants to see numbers, they should add a Jeff Jerrett to this package.
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Thunder Chunky
Main Eventer
Joined on: Aug 1, 2010 21:57:30 GMT -5
Posts: 4,545
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Post by Thunder Chunky on Jul 30, 2021 8:59:11 GMT -5
they should've made the goal 1k, should've given us bret, shawn, diesel, ramon, jarrett, the steiners, and owen hart! also remove the ring and make it $150 $150 for 8 UE figures with 4 names who are not even signed? Are you trying to put mattel out of business? I'm pretty sure he's making fun of the people that say stuff like that. |
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Billy Snorticus
Mid-Carder
Joined on: Jul 23, 2020 15:37:01 GMT -5
Posts: 333
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Post by Billy Snorticus on Jul 30, 2021 9:00:05 GMT -5
$150 for 8 UE figures with 4 names who are not even signed? Are you trying to put mattel out of business? I'm pretty sure he's making fun of the people that say stuff like that. bingo |
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Deleted
Joined on: Nov 28, 2024 6:50:10 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2021 9:01:06 GMT -5
once again, constant negativity wins out here. everyone was on board with something like this, until it happened.... and then people started saying "well they should have done....." and it puts different ideas in your head so that the actual thing doesn't seem as good anymore. read these threads on here and its almost completely negative comments, a lot of which are not constructive or helpful, instead just saying unreasonable things like they should have just done the entrance or they should have made jeff jarrett the figure its unfortunate that this community has to be so toxic. and beyond a reasonable level. ive had a few things to say about this project but both positive AND constructive criticism. still didnt stop me from backing it because i think OVERALL this is a pretty cool thing, and i want to own it. How in the world is that unreasonable?? |
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Post by LA Times on Jul 30, 2021 9:01:53 GMT -5
$150 for 8 UE figures with 4 names who are not even signed? Are you trying to put mattel out of business? I'm pretty sure he's making fun of the people that say stuff like that. In this place, that is serious business to many people 😄 |
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Post by Chip on Jul 30, 2021 9:36:58 GMT -5
once again, constant negativity wins out here. everyone was on board with something like this, until it happened.... and then people started saying "well they should have done....." and it puts different ideas in your head so that the actual thing doesn't seem as good anymore. read these threads on here and its almost completely negative comments, a lot of which are not constructive or helpful, instead just saying unreasonable things like they should have just done the entrance or they should have made jeff jarrett the figure its unfortunate that this community has to be so toxic. and beyond a reasonable level. ive had a few things to say about this project but both positive AND constructive criticism. still didnt stop me from backing it because i think OVERALL this is a pretty cool thing, and i want to own it. How in the world is that unreasonable?? because CROWFUNDING an item that would cost $100 doesnt make any sense at all. they would never do it, in any universe. thats not what crowfunding is about. if they were going to sell an entrance stage piece normally, they would do it. the point of this project was to give you a big setup all at once for a premium price because you wont have a chance to get anything like it anywhere else. |
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secondwhiteline
Main Eventer
Joined on: Nov 18, 2015 13:06:39 GMT -5
Posts: 1,543
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Post by secondwhiteline on Jul 30, 2021 9:44:42 GMT -5
How in the world is that unreasonable?? because CROWFUNDING an item that would cost $100 doesnt make any sense at all. they would never do it, in any universe. thats not what crowfunding is about. if they were going to sell an entrance stage piece normally, they would do it. the point of this project was to give you a big setup all at once for a premium price because you wont have a chance to get anything like it anywhere else. I guess I'm curious about your first statement there. I know Hasbro's set a precedent of extremely expensive crowdfunded items, but historically crowdfunding projects have succeeded at just about every price point you can imagine. A $100 item doesn't seem totally out of the realm of possibility even from a large company. |
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Post by stc13 on Jul 30, 2021 10:00:45 GMT -5
once again, constant negativity wins out here. everyone was on board with something like this, until it happened.... and then people started saying "well they should have done....." and it puts different ideas in your head so that the actual thing doesn't seem as good anymore. read these threads on here and its almost completely negative comments, a lot of which are not constructive or helpful, instead just saying unreasonable things like they should have just done the entrance or they should have made jeff jarrett the figure its unfortunate that this community has to be so toxic. and beyond a reasonable level. ive had a few things to say about this project but both positive AND constructive criticism. still didnt stop me from backing it because i think OVERALL this is a pretty cool thing, and i want to own it. This. This is why we can't have nice things. I'm still backing the project, and ordering multiple sets. But I don't think I'll ever see them. I've been pretty critical of Mattel's offerings in the last few years. But this package is an absolute home run in my eyes. It's the type of item that has been talked about for years as a "if only Mattel would do X." The price points are very reasonable for a limited run collectors item, the stretch goals are cool add ons that, for me, top what we've seen Haslab add in, and I think the collection as a whole makes sense given the success of Ultimates. Mattel definitely made a misstep taking payment up front. And that opened the door for a floor of negativity. People like to back a winner. The response was largely very positive right up until orders started. When it stumbled out of the gate, it was like there was blood in the water. If it's not something people want, fine. If you can't afford it, I get that. But this is the kind of package and price point that they're going to be designing. They aren't going to crowd fund for a $30 figure alone, or release a $70 stage. They bundle items like this because it meets the profit targets and scale that the company needs to make it worth their time. That's just a reality of business. And maybe the reality is that there just isn't a deep enough or affluent enough collector pool to support these kinds of projects in the WWE line. If this doesn't get made, I've made my peace with it. But people need to stop with the fantasy booking of how it should have been released differently, or cheaper, or with characters that they don't have the ability to make. Mattel put out a very fair offering, and the collecting community shot it down hard. That's fine. But it also means that there will be ramifications. The corporate suits aren't going to invest tooling time, research, marketing, etc into projects that don't see a return. And this project failing could very mean they'll stick with "safe" offerings like the Retros moving forward. |
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Post by stc13 on Jul 30, 2021 10:14:13 GMT -5
because CROWFUNDING an item that would cost $100 doesnt make any sense at all. they would never do it, in any universe. thats not what crowfunding is about. if they were going to sell an entrance stage piece normally, they would do it. the point of this project was to give you a big setup all at once for a premium price because you wont have a chance to get anything like it anywhere else. I guess I'm curious about your first statement there. I know Hasbro's set a precedent of extremely expensive crowdfunded items, but historically crowdfunding projects have succeeded at just about every price point you can imagine. A $100 item doesn't seem totally out of the realm of possibility even from a large company. You're absolutely right that crowdfunded projects have been successful at lower price points. But we're also largely talking about much smaller companies, where the profit incentive is greater because it's a much larger chunk of their annual revenues. Mattel and Hasbro are playing in a different sandbox. Mattel generates 4.5 billion dollars in sales. A $100 item at 5k backers generates 500k. It's just not worth the development, labor costs, marketing, etc. for an item that is going to net them what basically amounts to a negligible amount of revenue when they're assuming all the risk/costs if it doesn't get made. At a higher price point, the risk/reward is worth it to generate a few million. But at somewhere around $100? They're far better off investing that time, labor, and capital into traditional retail projects where they have a guaranteed return. For a smaller company, an extra $500k of revenue might be a significant boost in their annual revenue, and done in a way that give them cost and profit certainty. For larger companies, they're working with a different set of factors, and would want to see a higher profit motive. |
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Post by Chip on Jul 30, 2021 10:22:57 GMT -5
because CROWFUNDING an item that would cost $100 doesnt make any sense at all. they would never do it, in any universe. thats not what crowfunding is about. if they were going to sell an entrance stage piece normally, they would do it. the point of this project was to give you a big setup all at once for a premium price because you wont have a chance to get anything like it anywhere else. I guess I'm curious about your first statement there. I know Hasbro's set a precedent of extremely expensive crowdfunded items, but historically crowdfunding projects have succeeded at just about every price point you can imagine. A $100 item doesn't seem totally out of the realm of possibility even from a large company. mattel sold rings for $100 already. they've sold all kinds of other items in that $100 "range" they wouldnt need to crowfund an electronic piece of stage that doesnt go with anything else they have available to buy. other crowfunded projects are done on kickstarter and its usually just a guy who wants to publish a book or something silly. the amounts are WAY lower and the price point is WAY lower. Steve already said they have to make at least 5,000 of these things or the warehouse wont even bother people saying they should have just crowfunded the stage piece are being completely ridiculous with their expectations of how this kind of thing SHOULD work. if you only want the stage piece, back the project and sell the extras, its really that simple. *EDIT* This was my 50,000th post on this site. Wow. |
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