TheXtremisT
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Tajiri
Sept 30, 2021 6:29:40 GMT -5
Post by TheXtremisT on Sept 30, 2021 6:29:40 GMT -5
Only if they give him his iconic 2001 attire. Anything else is just wrong.
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TheXtremisT
Main Eventer
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Joined on: May 3, 2008 8:03:15 GMT -5
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Post by TheXtremisT on Sept 25, 2021 7:51:39 GMT -5
Ahmed Johnson? C'mon
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TheXtremisT
Main Eventer
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Post by TheXtremisT on Sept 24, 2021 13:08:35 GMT -5
I'm glad you guys recognised how over he was in 1996-7, because from the narrative spun by places/channels like Whatculture/Cultaholic etc... they say his reigns were underwhelming and he wasn't getting much reactions at all. And yet it couldn't be further from the truth. I watched all Raws from 1997 and Sid was over HUGE. He always got strong reactions, even when he wasn't doing much and the Undertaker feud was lacking. He still had a great connection with the crowd. I believe his intensity in his mic work was most of the reason. Even though he was literally a giant among men, I think Sid came off as an “everyday guy” with his Sycho gimmick. Similar to Austin, fans seemed to get behind him due to being a badass who broke rules and gave middle fingers to authority figures. His promos weren’t polished, and he didn’t exactly have a gorgeous face either. He just kicked ass and looked cool doing it with how much intensity he had. Plus being a dominant heel that didn’t run from anyone was a breath of fresh air as well. Sid deserves a lot more credit than he gets for helping to get the “cool bad-guy” gimmick over. Hell, fans were going crazy for him before they got behind Austin. 100%, and it was something I noticed a lot back then. Badass tougher guys who aren't booked to look like whiny babies (heels) or weak babyfaces - they get over. Who would have thought? Lol. What I highlighted in bold from what you said, was literally what I noticed in a few guys back then. Especially Ahmed Johnson. Over huge, had power, intensity and was badass. Same as Hawk and Animal to a lesser extent. The way things were going however, with the cocky "cool" heels becoming so much more confident on the mic (DX, NAO, The Rock), those got favoured over say LOD, Ken Shamrock, Ahmed.... hence why we saw babyfaces needing an "edge" to keep up with those heels and hence why Owen Hart's Black Hart gimmick fizzled. He didn't have that edge.
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TheXtremisT
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Post by TheXtremisT on Sept 24, 2021 7:55:35 GMT -5
I'm glad you guys recognised how over he was in 1996-7, because from the narrative spun by places/channels like Whatculture/Cultaholic etc... they say his reigns were underwhelming and he wasn't getting much reactions at all.
And yet it couldn't be further from the truth. I watched all Raws from 1997 and Sid was over HUGE. He always got strong reactions, even when he wasn't doing much and the Undertaker feud was lacking. He still had a great connection with the crowd.
I believe his intensity in his mic work was most of the reason.
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TheXtremisT
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Post by TheXtremisT on Sept 18, 2021 11:05:09 GMT -5
I did mention it. Check the bold. And the whole point of my post was to show that costs are rising, therefore they try to reduce the burden on their budget if they're keeping the same unit price at retail for their profit margin, or they up their prices. That is LITERALLY what I said so you're duplicating my point. My mistake. Do you take every post so personally, or are you just so high above everyone else intellectually that you've lost all your patience? Whatever the reason for your snark, you should probably calm down. Or go join Twitter where you'd fit in. Lol. No, I'm already quite calm. But having someone else try to "disprove" or put words in your mouth, especially when you've already accounted for their points, does get tiring. Either way, I'm just entertained by the fact you clearly didn't read what I put and then are trying to call me out for your mistake.... Your response here tells me that you're the one who took it to heart more than me. So out of the 2 of us, take your own advice, junior.
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TheXtremisT
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Post by TheXtremisT on Sept 18, 2021 3:30:56 GMT -5
Oil is not the deciding factor for figure costs. - New tooling is by far the most expensive, hence why Mattel try to re-use as many parts as possible and if not - they have a budget in a wave to stick to which if eaten by new parts/lots of paint/accessories etc... then they try to cut corners on the other figures. - Paint has gone up in the past 10 years and especially more recently - Worker costs - many factory workers would earn pittance for their labour. They have had their wages increased substantially over the past 20 years - Transport costs - shipping prices and use of shipping containers - these have especially increased this year thanks to the pandemic - Reduced profit margin = higher RRPs. These costs get passed onto retail so they up their prices. They also have to contend with taxes, overheads, rental, shipping costs.... All getting passed onto us. - Licensing costs - eg Disney have increased their licensing for Marvel and especially Star Wars figures, so much so that around 50% of the costs of figures is due to licensing. I don't know what that is for WWE but I bet it's still a considerable factor. There's definitely more, but you get the gist. To only account for oil is pretty short sighted. Not saying you're wrong or that I disagree, just that it's almost like companies shouldn't even bother making figures anymore when they talk about all the costs they incur in doing so. And I'm sure you're aware and just didn't mention it (the 'more' that you pointed out), but profit margins are a factor, too. Costs go up to make the toys, but needing (wanting) to make the same or more profit has them raising prices to account for it. The point of a business is to make money, so it's not surprising, but cost for the manufacturer isn't the only reason consumers pay more. I did mention it. Check the bold. And the whole point of my post was to show that costs are rising, therefore they try to reduce the burden on their budget if they're keeping the same unit price at retail for their profit margin, or they up their prices. That is LITERALLY what I said so you're duplicating my point.
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TheXtremisT
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Post by TheXtremisT on Sept 17, 2021 6:52:37 GMT -5
I took the question as "was Punk as over pre-pipe bomb as he was post-pipe bomb?".
If that is indeed the question. I'd say not quite. He definitely got significant momentum since 2011.
He was over before it, but was on a level similar to Jericho in 2003-2005 I'd say. Whereas post 2011, he was over more than Jericho 1999-2001. If that makes sense.
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TheXtremisT
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Post by TheXtremisT on Sept 17, 2021 4:45:18 GMT -5
That still doesn't invalidate anything I said, but nice try.
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TheXtremisT
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Post by TheXtremisT on Sept 16, 2021 8:14:23 GMT -5
There will come a time where they just price themselves out of the market. Toy companies have already priced me mostly out of the market. Once upon a time I could collect wrestling figures and Marvel Legends and Diamond Select/DC Direct figures. Then the wrestling figures went from $8 ($12 for Classic Superstars) to $20, as did Marvel Legends, while Diamond/DC figures went from $18 to $30! The companies claim it’s the cost of shipping and oil for plastics. The price of oil has not skyrocketed to the levels where an over 100% price hike is necessary. People saw specialty figures like DC Direct and Diamond Select command higher prices and decided their products should too, plain and simple. (Prove me wrong Mattel and Hasbro!) Aside from the occasional “too cool to pass up” or clearance figure, I don’t bother buying anything but wrestling. Even that might change. If prices go to $25 (we aren’t far from that point) it will be only new guys that I buy. Oil is not the deciding factor for figure costs. - New tooling is by far the most expensive, hence why Mattel try to re-use as many parts as possible and if not - they have a budget in a wave to stick to which if eaten by new parts/lots of paint/accessories etc... then they try to cut corners on the other figures. - Paint has gone up in the past 10 years and especially more recently - Worker costs - many factory workers would earn pittance for their labour. They have had their wages increased substantially over the past 20 years - Transport costs - shipping prices and use of shipping containers - these have especially increased this year thanks to the pandemic - Reduced profit margin = higher RRPs. These costs get passed onto retail so they up their prices. They also have to contend with taxes, overheads, rental, shipping costs.... All getting passed onto us. - Licensing costs - eg Disney have increased their licensing for Marvel and especially Star Wars figures, so much so that around 50% of the costs of figures is due to licensing. I don't know what that is for WWE but I bet it's still a considerable factor. There's definitely more, but you get the gist. To only account for oil is pretty short sighted. In the wider discussion: these impacts are not only with Mattel. Hasbro, Lego, Playmates etc.... ALL have been testing ways of reducing their costs. All have worse QC than years past. This also is nothing new for Mattel figures. WWE figures have had these issues going back many years now. So "noticing" them now is just going down the rabbit hole.
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TheXtremisT
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This is the way
Joined on: May 3, 2008 8:03:15 GMT -5
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Post by TheXtremisT on Sept 8, 2021 3:13:52 GMT -5
yes its the same ... Why didn’t they use HBKs body?🤷🏼♂️ Because Jeff isn't that ripped and it's still too broad for Jeff. He is slim and doesn't have any lats.
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TheXtremisT
Main Eventer
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Post by TheXtremisT on Sept 7, 2021 17:25:21 GMT -5
Over 23 years of hurt, just can't be summed up in a 16+ page thread 😂 It’s because the angle was so well done and they botched it at the finish line. And it’s worse because the finish line was the easiest part of the angle to book! Sting beats Hogan….the end. How did they manage to have that result but still butcher it!? And because Sting is an icon and a national treasure and they did him dirty because.... Hogan. That's what gets me the most.
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TheXtremisT
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Post by TheXtremisT on Sept 7, 2021 4:26:13 GMT -5
I created this thread 9 years ago... & its still ticking over 😂😂😂 Over 23 years of hurt, just can't be summed up in a 16+ page thread 😂
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TheXtremisT
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Post by TheXtremisT on Sept 1, 2021 4:02:24 GMT -5
Mine says due august 8 now 2022 I bet Well it's not going to be 2021 is it Action Figure Attack explained these were going back into production at the factory (either to make more, or because there were issues with the first batch) -- so that's the reason for the delays! It doesn't take a year to produce figures and ship them out due to production errors. This is a different thing.
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TheXtremisT
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Post by TheXtremisT on Aug 24, 2021 7:46:50 GMT -5
Jeff Jarrett.
Honestly hated him as a kid in late WCW, thought he had go away heat. But as I have aged, saw him in TNA and appreciated his work as a good villain, he grew on me and I see how good he actually was.
Solid hand in the ring. Underrated even. So polished. Deserved the spot he had in WWF. Probably was the most reliable in TNA for those years to be the biggest heel, so I get his reign of terror. World champion in WCW? Maybe, maybe not but he still played a great heel.
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TheXtremisT
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Post by TheXtremisT on Aug 15, 2021 6:53:17 GMT -5
It’s a factory error. My chase has a crotch logo. My 2002 Scott Hall’s name is double stamped on the ass. My SummerSlam ‘98 Edge’s leg deco is backwards somehow. My King Mable is missing a deco hit on his leg. My Dolph Ziggler’s shirt is missing a letter. Stuff happens. I didn’t notice any of these for weeks after getting the figures. All Edge SS 1998 figures had that. They messed up.
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TheXtremisT
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Post by TheXtremisT on Aug 9, 2021 5:22:23 GMT -5
Lol I just remember Konnan trying to get his new phrase over every show "WE BOUTY BOUTY, YOU ROWDY ROWDY" Ugh, I genuinely hated Konnan. "Yo yo yo let me speak on dis! Orale! Arriba la Raza!” Blah…and whenever me and my brothers would wrestle, all the other submission moves actually hurt and the tequila sunrise didn’t hurt for ****. Lol. You see people on TV using then crippler cross face and that was the murderers finisher, you don’t see anybody using the damn Tequila Sunrise. Yeah and when you compare it to other submission finishers, it just was like "meh". No impact whatsoever. Liontamer, Crippler Crossface, Scorpion Deathlock - all looked badass. Not so much the Texas Cloverleaf, it's more of a lower card finisher. But the Tequila Sunrise I feel should have not been a match ender unless he was facing a lower card opponent. I know this is deviating from the original Sting's misuse topic - so I'll bring it back - Scorpion Deathlock vs the Sharpshooter. They could have built this as a big feud but they squandered any potential against Bret and they had one match together and a tag match and that was it? What a waste.
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TheXtremisT
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Post by TheXtremisT on Aug 8, 2021 4:22:07 GMT -5
It IS odd to watch WCW ‘96 where Luger & Sting are so over fighting off the nWo, to think they eventually join them is weird haha. I guess Wolfpac was kinda like a “good” nWo, it was kinda like joining the enemy to defeat the bigger enemy. But it was whatever. I liked it at the time lol. It’s weird to think that Sting, Luger, Scott Steiner, Dream …all join the nWo They tried to turn nWo Wolfpac into their own version of D-X I always felt. Tried to be "cool" and "hip" rather than trying to take over. Lol I just remember Konnan trying to get his new phrase over every show "WE BOUTY BOUTY, YOU ROWDY ROWDY"
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TheXtremisT
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Post by TheXtremisT on Aug 4, 2021 6:27:14 GMT -5
We all know about Hogan's politics. I just want to discuss - what was the point of the guys other than Hogan holding the belt, if it did nothing for their careers or build to something greater?
Hogan lost it to Luger on Nitro before Road Wild 1997. Luger held it for 6 days and lost it back to him. Luger had been built up over the previous few months, cutting decent promos and having the fans thoroughly behind him, with the Torture Rack over like rover. His title win was an epic, but brief moment. Luger said when reflecting on that period that it was all Bischoff's idea, and he was the master of "giving the fans a little something, taking it away and want them demanding more". Effectively leading to something bigger. But nothing came of this. Luger slipped down the card, feuded with Bagwell and had a brief, forgettable feud with Randy Savage. He went from being mega over to basically no promo time, mediocre entrances with none of the previous character opportunities that he had earlier in 1997. He won the big one, then did practically nothing. What was the point?
Sting was champion for 2 months, but it didn't really feel like it. He was second fiddle to Hogan/Savage. He had help in winning/defending the title. Lost it to Savage. Clearly a vehicle for not having Sting lose it directly to Hogan, however, given the way they booked Sting's character after this - this didn't do a damn thing to protect Sting/Hogan.
Savage won the title for 1 fn night. Savage was mega over, this loose cannon type. He legit seemed like he could snap at any moment, beat anyone up, and was compelling to watch. I bought into the idea of Savage being a mix between Shamrock's dangerous persona and Stone Cold's toughest SOB on the planet persona. Really felt Savage could have destroyed Hogan and been over as the uncontrollable madman. But nope, snuffed out in one night, and then got absolutely no revenge/retribution against Hogan, almost forgetting he lost the title. Went to feud with Piper and then did nothing.
Goldberg won the world title, again on Nitro, and held it till Starrcade. But also played second fiddle to Hogan on the cards. Nothing new there, but it didn't ultimately hurt Goldberg. Losing the streak did however. After this, what did Goldberg do? Basically nothing other than half-arsed upper midcard feuds.
Nash held the title for less than 1 month and threw it away in the fingerpoke incident. Back to Hogan again. To which the title again was just a prop on Hogan's shoulders. What did Nash gain from this? Absolutely nothing.
DDP, Flair, Savage again all had short title reigns in 1999. What did those do for them? Barely anything.
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TheXtremisT
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Post by TheXtremisT on Aug 4, 2021 6:00:45 GMT -5
Been watching WCW in 1997 onwards and am now at July 1998. Wolfpac Sting is in full effect, and his character is basically a more laidback, frat-boy version of surfer Sting. Which feels so out of place for his new crow persona, especially considering he was this mysterious, silent, vengeful guy who had a tangible mystique.
I feel a) becoming almost the exact opposite of his crow character so abruptly and showing none of his previous brooding persona was a step in the wrong direction and made him too humanised too soon.
and b) joining the NWO, yes it was the Wolfpac, but it was still the NWO - went against everything Sting had been fighting for. Enemies with Nash, Macho, Konnan and then all of a sudden embracing the NWO name, logo and "Too Sweet" hand gesture just didn't make sense.
I do believe the Wolfpac would have been more effective without the NWO ties, and just the red shirt with the wolf on it, but they obviously had to keep the NWO going.
Having Sting and Luger join the NWO made no sense from a character aspect.
Although - suspension of disbelief - Sting in the red and black was cool AF and we got to see a different side to him - it may have suffered the character too soon.
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TheXtremisT
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Post by TheXtremisT on Jul 13, 2021 3:35:29 GMT -5
Some terrible examples shown here. But that Jericho - Wanna-bee shirt that shows a WASP, is so amazingly stupid....
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